IMHO, I would not be buying anything that involves moving parts, that is 10 years old. Not unless refurbishing the equipment is part of the plan.
50 responses Add your response
I was of the same mind (hanging it up at 75) but my family has pretty good genes provided they didn't drink and smoke too much as they live well into their 90s. Before all the know it alls come out of the woodwork decrying that your hearing is basically shot (a great example of conventional wisdom proved wrong) by that age, citing their last hearing exam I have this to say: learn to understand your hearing exam and find out if your doctor is up to snuff as well. I recently had my ears examined for issues with constant pressure in them, colds that settle in them, tinitus levels never experinced before (like white noise turned up) balance issues,etc. The first exam was for my hearing. There were dips in the 2K to 8K area which is expected at my age. It doesn't mean I can't hear in those regions at all. The same goes for over 14K. What poeple overlook is that the signals are emtted at the 30db range. That's the level of a soft whisper and at the beginning of being in a library. Levels have to be increased to around 50db for me to hear the ones that dip. That's at the convesational level and where a normal living room measures. I listen at ranges from the low 60s to the mid 80s, well above that 50s level needed to hear what people mistakenly say us older gents can't hear and that we're imagining it. When I told the doctor who did my hearing exam and the ENT specialist I was an audiophile and swear I could hear notes clearly in those ranges they both had the same answer coupled with the same look like of how could I not know it: you just turn the volume up. The hearing exam tech said there are some very good hearing aids I could use but I deferred and he understood. He recommended them not for listening to music but to hear conversations better when in noisier settings that make it harder for me to make out what's being said. In the hearing exam my ability to understand spoken words (in that setting) was great. 100% in my left ear and 96% in my right. That's no small feat at my age of 71. They also did a bone conductive test (nothing in the ears) and it's amazing at how much one can clearly hear and understand so factoring in that helps in hearing music. As for the results from the ENT specialsit, it turns out that even with one cuppa cofflee a day, the caffeine was just too much. Just 3 days after stopping with the coffee, almost everything went back to normal. Not as much as I would like but it's getting better each and every day. I've now learned to enjoy some good old black tea now and again and that seems to satisy my lust for the old ritual. Long story long, don't listen to the naysayers and (unless they're joking) get your hearing checked. You might end up being in the same boat as me and fully able to appreciate your system well into your golden years. All the best, |
The largest issue is parts availability. as the drives and optical sensors age they will die and need replacement. If parts are available no issue. but as many have learned parts are not really that available for disk drives, especially older ones. Good friend has owned a vintage audio shop for 35 years he wont even take them in on trade anymore, he's got a mountain of top quality cd players unusable due to drives. Google tells me only these companies are making drives still and as you can see on the list most of them are computer drives. LG, ASUS, Pioneer, TEAC, and Sony. There is literally a handful of companies still making CD drives and all the others buy from them. So regardless of what CD/SACD player you buy its probably got he same drive in it. Teac/Tascam/Esoteric maybe your safest bet, they still make their own drives and they make some of the best avail. Noting they are all the same company. |
Any Model that is looked at can very easily be looked into for the overhauls that are able to be done to keep the Model in fine fettle. If one is very lucky a Model selected can have a range of info extending to Videotorials showing exactly what is required to add Parts that are modern and are able to be exchanged with Olden Era Parts selected by the Manufacturer. Alternatively the Models shortlisted can be selected only because of the Info that is available to keep them in good order. https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/troubleshooting-cd-players.440522/ |
I knew a repairman able to set vintage gear right at peanuts price... He fixed my first Sansui... But he is old and retired... My vintage Sansui alpha will go till after my death probably without need to repair but i will no more buy old vintage... It is useless now with the offer in the audio market...
|
From what you said, I think I have hearing similar to yours. I'm 72, almost 73. I drink about 10 cups of coffee a day (always black). That's about a third of what I used to drink. Are you telling me that my coffee habit is causing the white noise that I hear? FM. I sure would hate to give up coffee but if the noise would go away, it might be worth it. |
@jl35 and @winoguy17 +10 Mike |
I am using a 43 year old turntable that I managed to do maintenance on and am not a former tech. It's speed is right on. I am using a 25 year old CD player, purchased used, and only needed to clean the laser pickup. Since I stream music about 90% of the time, I can't imagine spending thousands on comparable, new decks. I recently became a septuagenarian and my moving parts are more compromised than the 20+ year old equipment I am using. |
Take a look at used Esoteric SACD/CD players. The transports are built to be indestructible - think the offspring of Patek Philippe and the Sherman tank. I gave my 18 year old X-03 SE to an impecunious friend when I needed a DAC and I upgraded to a K-01. This is now his single source component. The electronic engineering is similarly excellent, the DACs in the K family are first class performers. The SQ is neutral to slightly analytical/revealing, no fake warmth. There are several units listed on eBay but, caution, some are 230/240 volt Japanese market units.
|
PS. Since others have wandered a bit off-topic, I am 81, I play golf almost every day in Summer and ski for a few hours every other day in Winter. Between seasons I play with building electronics and doing paper engineering for my wife who designs holiday cards for MoMA. Year round I am webmaster and treasurer for the local historical society. Age is not "just a number" but one can adjust to its effects. I am hoping for quite a few more years of sports and audiophilia, though I may have to switch to more forgiving irons and softer skis and boots, and hyperacusis makes me very sensitive to hardness in the treble range.
|
Will Streamers in use today remain compatible within a Digital System in 20-40 years time. A Seller will most likely suggest they will, a IT savvy individual may say something that is close to the opposite. Hard Media Live on as long as the embedded data remains readable and a signal is produced. Hard Media and Hard Media Players are a tremendous Bang for Bucks, when longevity is included in the equation. My Youngest TT and the last one bought as a New Item in my collection is 30 Years Old. My Oldest Vinyl LP Album purchased by myself and still in use today is 40+ Years Old. From my understanding, I do not have a Item to support the Analogue Source that in today's market is worth less than the purchase value. The Analogue Source does demand a reasonable proportion of Real Estate to support the care of it. The CD Source depending on size of CD Collection does demand similar Real Estate when the collection is vast in numbers. An individual who I met on a few occasions migrated from their 25000 CD Collection to take up streaming. They stored the CD's in the homes loft space and the weight damaged the timber roof trusses. Stored CD Data as a ripped file is no where near the 2.5 Tonne CD Collection will weigh in at. Stored Data is not my forte, I am not able to be producing a system to be failsafe, some with much more savvy than myself will have methods but exactly how failsafe are they, in comparison to having the hard media at hand to be used when desired. Data can disappear, and not like the best magic trick be brought back for all to see shortly after, for some without all the correct measures in place, when Data is gone, its gone Data. The next question is for those with a safe Data store, how long is it in the near future, before new technologies does not recognise todays stored Data as a readable Data?. I sense but can't say with full conviction, that the devices in use as a Source that are a Streaming System, are to become the most short lived out of all the Audio Sources produced in the past 70 Years. I fail to see how a device used for Streaming in use today, will be a Item that circulates in the Circular Economy and is wanted to be used in 2050, but do see both Vinyl and CD that are healthily being circulated in today's Circular Economy, maintaining its place in this marketplace and be seen used regularly and not be an underground Source in a System in the future. I am always intrigued when Hollywood releases a Film giving an insight into the World in which my descendants are referring to me as a 10 x removed Grandfather or even more. There is in many films a Turntable in use. What is not understood is the need to still use the Cartridge? Or even the TT?Surely a Micro Drone with a Data reading device would be able to track the Groove and Beam the Extracted Modulation Data as a Facsimile of the embedded Data to the microscopic processors used to interpret such Data, which would most likely be processors traced into the Film Material selected to produce air movement and an End Sound I've always considered my interest in Vinyl using present technology as myself being one who has given Vinyl a future. I'm going to miss the future of Vinyl, where there is not need for a Mechanical Interface. Vinyl being dropped into a Linn Chamber and propped on a Rotating Invisible Force controlled to a rotational speed where nano seconds are the fluctuation of Speed and the Koetsu Micro Drome extracts the Data for beaming Down Stream. " What a bummer I'll have to content myself with the Hope one of my owned Albums survives through to the future period to meet such a replay system.
|
Some great responses about I got a few good laughs! Since we are a manufacturer nd a repair service when buying any audio component used you have to determine if the parts are available. Anything can be repaired if the parts are available. As per your question, I would get a used Cary 306 S SACD player. In stock for it has below average sound IMO. But once you upgrade the caps and some resistors in the power supply, the sound changes dramatically and will complete with anything you have heard. The upgrade includes over 100 parts if I remember correctly. We were blown away but the upgrade. Happy Listening. |
I was already old when i designed my System/room acoustically using only my ears/brain as a tool. No it was not perfect for all others ears but perfect for mine (surrounding sound from a stereo system with holographic sound instrument volume). i had 74 in few weeks, i designed my walking stick with a branch given to me by the river and i walk more swiftly with it. We will not die, the body will stay still one day... Music exist eternally as the primes numbers music which contain everything... I will perhaps upgrade my low cost well optimized speakers for my birthday... |
You could always buy 2 new and keep one for when the cd transport breaks. I love cd players. Sometimes they quit and have to unplug and do a hard reboot.sometimes they throw a fit and won't play certain discs.they skip but don't jump rope. I googled favorite cd players yesterday and found a blog with 40 pages of people's opinion about bought a certain used one but many people stated transport problems.that saved me some money. I must have 10 or so of these all currently working.some have tubes,carver ,accuphase musical fidelity, bat, mcintosh mcd 12000 tube or solid stateect. I like that one.some you can turn the tube stage off go solid state. It is known the old phillips cd 1 transports fails often .my marantz sacd 10 is about 4 k on the used market now. It's been kind to me.enjoy the search and for the streamers I have some high end of that with dac but member the cd player had dac in the beginning. |
a year ago i bought a new TEAC VRDS-701T CD ’only’ transport. it has the newest version of the BIG-BOY VRDS transport and is built like a tank. when i bought it the list price was $2799. now it’s $3299. https://teac.jp/int/product/vrds-701t/top most SACD’s have a CD layer, so you can play all the discs. if you buy an SACD player and want the dsd layer, you are limited to the dac inside that transport, or need a proprietary interface that works with your dac so you are limited. i wanted to use my Wadax dac with a modestly priced transport so i could play silver discs. as far as performance, it was just ’ok’ using a SPIDF interface into my dac......until......i hooked up my Esoteric G1X Clock to it and then it came alive and is really quite fine sounding. but it does the job and i can now play my 4000 CD’s and 1000 SACD’s again. and it works sufficiently with my $400k Wadax. no it does not quite match streaming on the Wadax, but then nothing else does either. it’s good enough to not avoid silver discs if i want that particular music, or a friend brings a CD over with them. for around $3k why mess with old transports and worry about it? |
You don't forego listening to your cd's when you move to streaming, rip them to streamer internal drives or NAS. You then back up those files via something like RAID, so two drive NAS, second drive is copy of first drive. And then I have a copy of the copy via usb drive, so three drives would have to fail for me to lose my over 3.5k rips. Another possible advantage of this is cd rips may have better sound quality vs cd's with transport, mine did with the subsequent transports used after my ML No. 37 died. |
Disc drives do wear out over time. I recently went through a lot of effort to replace the pickup in my Sony XA5400ES (w/VSE mods) which is still a great sounding player. It’s hard to tell how much use a previously owned player has had or how much life is left in the pick-up. So, there is a risk buying used. Perhaps keep your search to players manufactured in the last 5 years? Another poster recommended Esoteric which makes highly regarded disc players. If I couldn’t get my Sony fixed I planned to get a Marantz SACD 30N which also supports streaming. |
I'm of a similar age and over the last few years I have been buying my end-stage components. I have a large collection of CDs and SACDs and I can't bear to part with them. I also stream using Qobuz but there is just something more satisfying about playing a silver disc. I recommend something like a Marantz SA KI Ruby SACD player. I have one and I can vouch for it's quality. I have owned 3 different Marantz CD and SACD players over the last few decades and I've never had a drive fail. Several years ago I splurged and bought a PS Audio Perfect Wave Transport it had 3 drives fail in 3 years. Piece of junk. The difference is that PS Audio used a standard $15 computer CD drive which was never designed to spin discs hour after hour. Marantz builds their own transports and they are designed for playing music CDs. Marantz sill makes a SACD player so you could get a brand new one if it makes you feel more comfortable. For less money, a used Marantz 8000 series SACD (8003, 8004, 8005), is also a good candidate. I had an 8004 before I bought the Ruby and it never had a problem. There is a bunch of these from Japan for sale on eBay (I'm not sure why). If you go with Marantz or one of the few other companies that make their own drives (Esoteric for example) the company should have spare drives for the foreseeable future. I seriously doubt you will ever need one assuming that you are not spinning discs constantly throughout the day. If you want to do some research you can try to buy a used SACD player that incorporated one of the later Phillips drives. These are basically bullet proof but if one breaks there are replacements available. I use my KI Ruby to play SACDs and I also have a Jay's Audio CD3 MK III transport plus a Berkeley Audio Alpha Reference II MQA DAC. I have compared the two setups for sound quality and to my ears they are nearly identical. I could easily live with the Marantz player as my only rig except that it won't play HDCDs. I have a few hundred CDs in this format and I want something that will play them to their fullest potential. |
I have a 15 year old Luxman D-06 SACD player in a second system that I bought new and it still sounds very good and functions flawlessly. It is built like a tank. It only has optical out (not coax), and plugging it into a Chord DAC did not really improve significantly on the sound of the internal DAC. I have a current production Luxman D-10x SACD player in my main system that I bought new last year and plan to keep for years to come. It is an overbuilt engineering marvel. Esoteric, Accuphase and Luxman all make wonderful sounding and robust SACD players that should keep going for many years. CDs are still more popular than streaming in Japan, hence the continued market for high end cd players. |
Whatever disadvantage my age gives me, it also gives me an advantage: having had to take music courses and classes in school back in the ’60s, so I actually know what the instruments of the orchestra sound like, something the younger set is woefully oblivious about. So far, from what I’ve heard from younger guys who play in bands, their friends know NOTHING about an instrument. They can’t even identify it by sight. One guy who plays in a band told me that not one of his friends could identify an instrument. NOT ONE. It is not surprising that one is lectured by someone with half their knowledge (if that much). I did not initially pay attention to the fact that the younger people seem to have no idea what acoustic instruments sound like (aside from guitar - if that!). I asked my niece one time, while we were listening to solo saxophone, what she thought the instrument was. She guessed a clarinet. I suspect the further one starts from actuallyt knowing what instruments sound like, the harder it is to tell what is better and what is just different when buying components. How would one evaluate a speaker, unless it’s a case of this-sounds-good-to-me-so-that-means-it’s-great. Fine. If that’s all someone knows, then that’s their thing. It sure isn’t mine. I play flute, so I can listen to any recording while using a flute (or piano) recording and being able to tell which flute sounds like a Yamaha (flute or piano). How others decide which component is better without any knowledge of acoustic instruments is beyond me. I have one friend who minored in music in college, and we have great talks about classical pieces. He knows more than I do, so he’s the one who will get the DCS system when I die (my spouse would likely throw all the audio components away.) I suppose one could just buy what one likes (and should), but when I have people telling me I have this thing they call ’confirmation bias,’ I usually ask what instruments they play, and the answer (if they bother) is usually: "none." At that point, I stop taking anything they write seriously. It is not ’confirmation bias’ when one OWNS an instrument(s) and knows what it sounds like. Any recording that I know the flutist used a certain brand of flute can be used (if it is a good recording) to determine accurate tonality. I don’t need the "blind test/A-B" rigamarole. I already know what the flute (and piano and cello) sound like. So, my age hasn’t affected my knowledge, which includes 60+ years of classes, band practice, symphonies, operas, and the like. When I cannot identify a Yamaha piano from a Steinway - in ANY room that exists - THEN, I will know. But given how little others know of acoustic instruments? Baby, I got NOTHING to worry about. They can’t advise me about my "delusions" when they hardly known the objective reality. Easier just to say inside my head, "Bless their hearts," and keep on with my own life. |
If you're looking to reduce your caffeine intake, consider experimenting with teas. In approximate order from most to least caffeine/drink: expresso The first 2 of these get their caffeine from coffee beans; the last 3 from tea plant leaves. Mate and tereré are produced from yerba mate leaves. It's a good time of our life for less ambitious explorations. You might try a variety of these beverages for both flavor & kick. The further down the list you go, the more you can drink!
|
Ah, and your question was, I realize, about the equipment, not us, but it was fun answering anyway. I have DCS gear which will be approaching 2 decades in a few years. It plays fantastically well. No complaints. And I have an Arcam FMJ CD23 as well. Still plays great. I think any gear that is well-cared for will be fine, but CD players have the most (continually)moving parts, so perhaps be careful with those. Cartridges, too. Amps? No. I still have my Antique Sound Lab Hurricanes, 22 years later, and no complaints about them either. So amps should be fine, so should preamps. The only things you bay want to know about used is: 1) are they the original owner and 2) has the unit been modified in any way. |
We ALL see things we’d love to have- that’s what endangers our wallets. Bottom line, it’s your money- what would please YOU more:
If you buy now, should you spend additional time, resources, effort to assure it’s in good working condition now? Yes- so can use when asap when needed If you wait, there will likely be better offerings at reduced prices as digital audio technology quickly advances. This is the more practical budgetary choice. BUT if you LOVE the vintage component, well…it’s your money. |
Happy Pre-Birthday, @mahgister .....You're just that later in the year 'cuz I beat you to it.....;) Not that an additional digit yields much any more...😏 Speakers are such a personal sort of purchase, like getting used to a new pet. It's going to have it's own sort of 'personality' that you either accept or loathe the details of...... Most times hopefully doesn't occur, or strikes like a head-on. At this time I've enough items linked together to amuse for awhile....the only thing that (other than listening to it) is of interest is my Alt Walsh endeavor and keeping an eye/ear open for vintage 'raw' speakers that are 'repurposed' beyond their original intents....but 'rationally' priced. Just because I can, and it amuses me. |
I went thru quite a batch of near keepers before finding my lightly used Sony xa5400es that members here suggested I try. It sounds so good, I am still re-discovering my too many CDs, SACDs, and began buying used CDs (whereas I was only listening to/buying Vinyl) lasers weaken with hours of use, finding the SACD layer can become problematic, so knowing it’s history can help you make a choice. Prices went up during Covid, so that this is actually a decent price, and has proof of renewal check to see if replacement lasers are available, these still are hopping about the site, many discussions of the 5400, I thought this comment fit my experience "bigtee803 posts The Sony sight says they are available.
|
@petaluman I brew my own coffee with an espresso machine. It's wonderful.
|
Personally, I'm not much of a caffeine imbiber, but have had many friends into food & drink. I've consumed everything listed above over the years; these days drink them rarely, and usually at the green tea level. I've got a hankering to explore the whites, though... (Living in the birthtown of Lagunitas means I have lots of connections to music & drink through beer). |
If the risk of failure inherent to a decades-old mechanical device gives you anticipatory anxiety and curtails your enjoyment of the music, then buy new. If on the other hand you’re like, I’ll just buy another one if this one craps out, or if you or someone you know is able to fix it, then buy old. It all goes down to knowing yourself and what makes you happy :) Old Marantz players used Philips transports, back when Philips owned Marantz, and later they did develop their own transports. Personally I would avoid proprietary parts that make you 100% dependent on a single supplier. Major transport makers (Phillips, TEAC, Sony, etc.) usually have major wear parts, or even entire transport units, available to this day. CDM-family Philips transports are very well built and quite reliable.
Power in Japan is 100V And from the senseless nitpicking dept.:
@sns Mark Levinson No. 37 use a CDM12IND transport, not the later CD-PRO. At least, mine does. Wonderful piece of kit indeed. By the time No. 390s came around they may have switched to CD-PRO. |
At 79 and still kickin' real good I find the comments from these young squirts who'll be lucky to make it this far offensive. Not sure what you want to spend but 2 years ago I bought a Denon DVD A-110 SACD player. Retail was $3500 I got a deal on it for a bit less. I've noticed a couple used now for under 2 grand. It is superb in every sense. A 10 on the scale. |
I was unaware of the caffiene syndrome. At 68 years young, it's serious. I have owned the Marantz SA 10 sacd player for 6 months. And I really believe it is the best sound I have ever heard. But I will not recommend it as (1, I am not qualified. (2, I can only compare it with cd players. (3, I will let you know in 10 years. Keep posting. Since joining recently, I've learned so much. THANKS. IAN. |
. 
", I've worked my life towards this as the design to replay my Vinyl Collection. 
