Take your time. It's a journey, not a destination.
Question: What are some of your best pieces of advise to someone new to the hobby?
I have a friend who is interested in putting together a system and am putting together a little guide for him, compiling information I’ve found over the years, plus some of my own personal tips and tricks. However, I am by no means the end-all-be-all of knowledge and want to incorporate information, tips, and tricks from the community - however basic they may seem - into a nice reference resource.
Without specifically naming any pieces of gear or brands (this isn’t a product recommendation question), what are some of the biggest tips, tricks, important pieces of info to keep in mind, caveats, etc. that you would have for someone new?
*side note - hopefully this post can also serve as a nice reference point for people in the future, as well!
@mmcgill829 - what makes a good cable? Cables are surrounded by a lot of misinformation - e.g. people talk about resistance, capacitance and Inductance as being key, which is in fact far from the entire story! Read this thread for some basic knowledge as to ... The two bands that I recommend to people are...
There are other great brands, but these two will get you a nice sounding system for a reasonble cost. Cables are perhaps the most important part of any system and spending money on the right cables is money well spent. Choose wisely and they will be with you for life. But poor cable selsction will cripple the the very best components e.g.
I would start with good speaker cables and then try interconnect cables and lastly Power cables - why?
If you are "handy" you can build some exceptional cables that rival some of the bst TOTL cables from established brands - see this link I have spent around 17 years developing cables, but only in the last 7 years did I actually discover what makes for a very good cable. Hope that helps - Steve
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Start with inexpensive gear and set it up in a room best fitted for proper acoustics. Then work the room acoustics with all the necessary acoustic treatments until the inexpensive gear sounds best. Only then move up to better gear. If you do it the other way around you will end up wasting a lot of money on gears that will never be fully satisfying. Like building a house, it all starts with a good foundation. |
Try to find a trustworthy dealer with a good selection of equipment. Audition lots of combinations. Make your biggest bet on speakers within reason, if you can't afford what you want, wait until you can. Otherwise, you run the risk of buying something that is unsatisfying from day one don't make lateral moves. If you're upgrading, plan on spending twice what the old component cost. there are components that offer Great value but realize that you generally get what you pay for just like in anything else. There may be components that sound better than others that cost three times as much, but I would suggest that is generally a unicorn. you can learn a lot from a forum such as this, I certainly have, but take the know it alls with a grain of salt. Hearing is subjective. If it sounds good to you, that means it's good. and never start a thread about the merits of high dollar switches |
@shebuskij The worst possible advice! A totally outdated perspective. Speakers are the most flawed component, despite this fact if the electronics and source are not up to the level of the speakers you have a mess on your hands. This is where the upgrading and changing out gear phenomenon was created by print media 40+ years ago. |
Get your information from a wide variety of available sources. Do not think more money necessarily means better results. Start off smart but modest and go from there. Take your time and do your homework.
Or go cut to the chase with one of the many quite excellent integrated solutions available at all price points these days. Study up on "Future Fi" , for example: Is this the future of hi-fi? (I think it might be) | Darko.Audio |
Understand the recordings sound quality of either an analog or digital recording dictates the audio systems potential. Don’t believe loudspeakers are the most important system component, everything matters. A dedicated 20 amp power line or 2 depending on the complexity of your system should be the starting point. Room acoustics have equal importance but should be your last task as you dial in your system. Look for components that have a low noise floor and lack a "mechanical" sound characteristic, even some budget gear can achieve this. Don’t try to integrate a home theater system with your 2 channel system it will almost always degrade the SQ. Lastly know what your biases are and what you like, because there is not one unanimously perfect audio system.
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To spend what they are comfortable with but make sure they know that other than us audio-fools they can likely get 10 years out of their investment in listening - if they are careful to put together a system that isn’t strident sounding. |
"I have a friend who is interested in putting together a system" Not knowing much about your friend, it’s difficult to set priorities about what is important to them: Mac/PC? Dog/cat? Internal combustion/EV? Zappa/Hank Sr. Etc. I would start by putting your friend in front of the most amazing system you’ve ever heard (within a reasonable commute from your home). This should create a strong emotional response (or, perhaps even loosing control of basic bodily functions) to illustrate what the the "ultimate system" looks and sounds like when it is finished. If the response is similar to the watching the first 12 minutes of any RomCom, perhaps he/she may want to pursue another hobby? Second, I would make sure they have some "skin in the game." The pursuit of their system has to mean more them than it does to you. The more vested they are in the project, the more they will appreciate it. The more they appreciate it, the more they will enjoy it. And, the more enduring the hobby will be over their lifetime. |
Awesome tips so far everyone! Appreciate everyone who has answered so far. There's quite a few basic tips that are popping up very frequently in the replies, which echo a lot of what I was thinking too, which is great! It can definitely be an overwhelming hobby to jump into with little background knowledge (we've all been there at some point), but having a robust community such as this one to pick the brains of for tips, advice, and guidance is super helpful to eliminate some of the 'noise' and cut through some of the marketing shenanigans. Look forward to reading more! |
*G* Everyone’s dishing good food for thought tonight....the only caveat I can offer is that it’s highly unlikely that his first foray into the fidelity field will find the flawless answer on his shelves....cabinet....’some means of suspension’... But to quote S. Smiley.... "But....it’s OK." One has to have the ’bad experience’ to appreciate the good and the really superlative ones. Don’t believe all that you hear ’once’ somewhere; like science, it needs to be repeatable...by you, in your space. Be willing to accept the difference(s)....much like a relationship....;) (At least, divorce on this plane will be hopefully cheaper...) Don’t let Anyone tell you your taste in music is...’questionable’.... I leave this behind as an example... "...is what I do...." Have fun, make a memory or so.... |
Both @johnread57 @mrdecibel are spot on. Speakers first, and then have him listen to the music he likes and enjoys already. I'll explain why: First, speakers make more of a difference to newbie's then electronics. Second, a good friend of mine (whom I wanted to keep as a good friend), wanted to buy new speakers and said he found these amazing ones (brand not important for the story) and wanted me to listen to them. I agreed they sounded amazing, but they were being demo'd using only classical music, which he never listened too. As soon as we put on his favorite music, they did not sound as good, a bit bland and the soundstage collapsed. He ended up with a different pair that brought life to the the music he listen to. He's still happy with them 6 years later. It also helped him pick up better electronics later. Hope this helps. |
Whew enough to write a book here! Here’s some more: 1. Keep an open mind. 2. Music is a contextual experience, listen in as many different environments as you can 3. Music is an emotional experience, let your ears and heart be connected without losing your head 4. Find what you like and do more of it; the field is changing so there are always more options 5. Buying used is an upgrade option, with experience. 6. Find trustworthy sources of information and be careful of scams in this field.
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The questions worth asking of your friend is how old is he? Does he already have a collection of CD-Vinyl Albums? Which is the main Source the system intending to have? Once this is on the table, the individual can be directed to receiving demo's of differing systems with such a source. This will help them home in on a sonic that has attraction to them, as well understand the costs required and aesthetic that can be had. This is not too bad a place to leave the starter blocks from. |
@mtbiker29 possibly the best advise here. It took me a few years to appreciate how important room treatments are. And you can apply that philosophy to many components of your system. Years ago Linn's message was "a cheap cartridge on a Linn sounds better than a expensive cartridge one on a lesser turntable" In other words understand and learn about each component you are planning to add to your system and the role they play in the sound reproduction! Best of luck in your journey! |
Listen to a wide variety (technology and price), and don’t forget ’bang for the buck’. For example, your friend may fall in love with exotic speakers, but find that he can’t hear much difference between expensive and adequate amplifiers with those speakers. Conclusion, valid for him: "Don’t spend much on amps". That’s exactly where I was when I got started: I couldn’t hear the difference between budget DIY electronics and ARC. A year later, that changed, but in he mean time I had legendary speakers, Magnepan Tympani 1A, immensely suitable as an anchor around which to build.. Now I’m in pretty deep and still can’t hear much difference between interconnects - so my investment in these remains very low. It’s a valid option FOR ME. YMMV. |
However you go about it ( listening to as much gear / systems as possible, with your favorite music, is the best way, ime ), you will need to determine " what are your listening preferences ", those qualities and characteristics in recorded music, you enjoy the most. Eric_squires, as he states " be true to your own ears ", is great advice. Understand, we all are different and unique in what we like. This, is your journey. Enjoy, and, my best. MrD. |
If possible find a good knowledgeable dealer to work with and who offers you an upgrade path. Looking back at my experiences I probably would have had better sound quicker and for less working with my current dealer. Another thing is realize what you don't know, again looking back I was buying stuff used 15-20 years ago that I had no business owning. Esoteric gear, tubed gear dip your toes gently into that realm until you get some real experience under your belt. |
The problem when people say trust your ears not reviews is that our ears must be TRAINED... Sound is not a taste question , save for those who think that a dac and an amplifier make the sound by themselves instead of the triplets : ears/speakers /room...And even here with this triplet it is more about acoustic in specific small room than taste... A good timbre and spatial sound experience is defined by acoustics not by taste...It is not based on price and gear as much as on acoustic ... There is only 2 ways to train our ears VARIED musical listening and experience and acoustic concepts and experiments... Upgrading dac and amplifier for "our taste" is a way to turn back on the road instead of facing the question : is this sound acoustically right about the timbre factor , listener envelopment and instrument sound volume extent (holography) ...Basically ANY synergetical good dac and amplifier can do the job, why upgrading before knowing what we do just because we obey the hype ? We must learn how to make possible this experience with synergetical components first yes but you must learn how to discern and control these factors too to some degree ideally... it is why nothing replace learning acoustic concepts... Beware , it is more than room treatment...
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Read and learn all that you can but don't substitute what you hear with what some review says is good - your ears are the only criterion for excellence - if you can't hear a difference on a new piece of gear you just spent thousands on based on a third party review, you wasted your money. If it sounds better to you, then the money was well spent. |
"Pay no attention to forums like this." I assume this comment is tongue in cheek, but just in case it isn't, I have a different take on this. I believe there is gold mine of information available on this site, if one is capable of parsing through the comments and gleaning what is truly useful. Comments that are based on educated listening and years of searching for better sound are very valuable as a way of benefiting from the experiences of others, without all the related costs and heartache. I often search the historical database before making a purchase as a way of shortlisting components or getting a sense of what that component offers sonically. One can even get a sense of how components work together by analyzing certain members "virtual systems".
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- Any information lost or distorted at the source cannot be retrieved or “improved” further upstream. - To one degree or another, everything matters. - Try (really hard) to attend at least a couple of live acoustic (or at least minimally amplified) music performances before pulling out the credit card. Good of you to help a friend. Good luck. |
Experiment for fun at no cost... Read about acoustics science... VERY IMPORTANT.... If not you will not know how to recognize all aspects of sound... A dedicated room value is way more than any upgrade... This hobby has nothing to do with "price tag" nor with "upgrades"... This hobby is about embeddings controls ( homemade or at low cost ) of the three working dimensions ,mechanical ( vibrations and resonance), electrical ( signal/noise level) and especially acoustical one ( speakers/ears/room ) for ANY systems at ANY cost... Look for synergy first creating a basically low price system commensurate with your wallet , then learn about all three working dimensions before any upgrade..
At the end the best system in the world in the scale optimal ratio Price/S.Q. will be ours and it will be the best,but why? Because it will be more the result of your own creativity in learnings than the result of a big bank account .. Experiment and dont listen anybody save acousticians and some top designers when they dont spoke about their products.. Users reviews in bulk have greater value than any pro- reviewer opinion...Read between the line and add all opinions details in various columns and analyse... This is especially valuable for low cost good vintage products... Dont fall in the actual dac money upgrade race pit...😁 Human are designed by evolutive habit to recognize speech and musical designed sounds in a time oriented dimension not noise and non musical sounds ... Then learn music from all mankind not only music from your own culture.....
Music is the unspoken and silent speech of the soul.... The sound/body live and die but music is forever ... Beware about the kind of music you will put in your head... music is vastly more powerful than you think and you will became what you will listen to...
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