@misc-audio. Easily the best damn post I’ve ever seen on this forum. Meatloaf? Love meatloaf, even bad meatloaf! IPA’s? Who ever thought of that junk? Hipsters? Well, yeah! Adding crap to beer? Well, then you just don’t like beer! Not to say others can disagree, but what audiophile doesn’t? Comparing meatloaf to audiophilia is a genius touch….the IPA gambit is something else. Highest praises here!
What Meatloaf and Beer Have Taught me about Audiophiles
Recently in life and online I've had some curious observations about human behavior I thought I'd share. To begin with, I have recently discovered that a surprising number of My Fellow Americans do not like meatloaf. As a meatloaf maker and meatloaf cognoscenti I was absolutely astonished at this. Some people who otherwise like burgers and the like hate meatloaf.
If you make meatloaf and love it your immediate reaction to this is "but you haven't tried _my_ meatloaf." That's our natural knee jerk reaction because we just can't imagine. Related to this I have a bartender. We'll call him Calhoun because his name is Calhoun. An otherwise respectable fellow who knows beer and tequila better than most. I would go in to see what the latest rotation of Indian Pale Ales were. About once a month they'd get some new "dessert beer." That is a brew made to taste like a sweet food substance. The least offensive of which were peanut butter and the worst strawberry shortcake beer. Calhoun would proceed to push me to sample these unholy abominations every time he could.
Of course I'd tell him "I don't like flavored beers." Which was partially a lie as a coffee or espresso flavored beer would probably be divine.. but we digress.
Sometimes he was so adamant that the latest beer flavor was the one that would change my mind I'd go ahead and try them. Of course, they were invariably disgusting.
My point to all this is that being on both sides of this argument. It's really hard to accept that our fellow audiophiles don't like something we feel is sublime and we will push our fancies onto them in the hopes of enriching their lives for the better. It's hard for us to respect that someone else can love music and the stereos that play it and yet not have found their happy place the same way we have.
By the way, I use the Betty Crocker meatloaf recipe and add a tablespoon of chipotle powder. Amazing.
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Food for thought. I like meatloaf, but l don’t make a meal if it. This post is just nuts…….. l had to double check l was still on the right site and double check…..yes you read that right, right?
And after reading all this l think l need a drink. Seriously this has been so funny and has made my day.
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I was a bit surprised by your comment. I too make meatloaf , my Mom's receipt and have never seen anyone who doesn't like it. Good with homemade mashed potatoes and scratch gravy. I use french bread crumbs and a bit of bbq sauce along with the ketchup. Makes a great cold sandwich the next day if there's any left over with mayo , horseradish and a slice or red onion. |
Not sure meat loaf related (meatloaf adjacent?) but last week we stayed in a small Arizona town with one restaurant, and it was packed, and no one had even been served so we left. "Lets see what Dollar General has to offer" We got some of their frozen dinners and went back to motel and nuked them. I got Salisbury Steak and mashed potato. If you are old enough you probably ate a lot of them growing up. It was divine, like I was tossed back 55 years into the past. The next night I ate 3 of them. They were on sale a $1 each. My wife got some pasta dishes and she liked her's too. |
Full disclosure- I'm a beer nut. Certain beers are appropriate for special times and different seasons. I don't drink a dessert stout on the beach in summer but in winter in front of a fireplace, yum. Also usually only drink heaver stouts late in a beer session, save them for the finale. Lighter beers like Wits, hefes and blonds taste better in the warmer weather especially after yard work. So match the style to the weather, food or other considerations. I recently was in line buying 3 single craft beers for 30 bucks. The guy in front of me got a 30 pack of Natty Bo for 30 bucks. Occurred to me I had approx the same weight of barley and hops in my 3 as he had in 30. No judgement, horses for courses. |
For me to totally agree with @nonoise and 100% disagree with @ghdprentice is unusual. Confit de canard (no caps required) is something of a French meatloaf, in spirit if not in preparation. Dunking quartered poultry in fat and letting it slowly braise while you do something else isn’t the stuff of Michelin stars. Meatloaf is actually harder to make than confit. I love both, by the way, and now I want to make some meatloaf! I too disliked fruity beers in general, though sometimes a Kriek hit the spot, and breweries like the tragically departed Cascade Brewing made/make excellent fruit sours. But to be honest, the rise of incredibly talented local cidermakers and the fantastic ciders they produce is such that I hardly ever drink beer anymore.
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You receive the Booker Award for Literature in the elegant way the analogy of meatloaf and beer leads to the thesis of showing respect for the music and equipment others appreciate. The appreciation of genre, composition, performance, recording engineering, and playback engineering will always have subjective component based on psycho-acoustic science. Therefore, respect of the opinion of others should be a given. Like meatloaf and beer, we each have our own musical appreciation palette. Well written and entertaining. PS: I am a meatloaf lover. My favorite is made with a beef, pork, veal combination … my Italian-American heritage. I do not care for turkey at all. A must is to be served over Romano/garlic mashed potatoes. We agree IPA, each with its unique palette and finish, is the beverage accompaniment of choice and flavored beer is an “abomination”. |
I think this is a question of semantics. I completely agree that there are all sorts of tastes among people that love music and buy equipment to reproduce it. Just as there are among eaters. However, there are common folks and epicureans. People who love ketchup on eggs and those a carefully prepared Confit de Canard and can tell nuances in it. An audiophile is a person who is passionate about high-fidelity sound reproduction. They strive to achieve the most accurate and enjoyable listening experience possible, focusing on capturing the nuances and subtleties of music. Sounding like the real thing. There is a focus on accuracy... there is a target. Lots of folks have consumer products... they are not audiophiles because the output does not approach sounding like the real thing, and they don’t care. Some folks have very expensive systems with a wall of subwoofers... they are not audiophiles. They love music and systems that plaster you against the rear wall, but nuanced accuracy to the real thing is not there. There are folks that are into vintage gear that is incredibly warm and romantic, but is not approaching the real thing. Yes, you are correct, there are lots of tastes out there. There are also people with incredibly modest system who have spent hundreds and hundreds of hours choosing and tweaking their systems... wires all over the place... who have done incredible things to make their system outperform and sound more like the real thing than folks with a lot more money invested who’s system doesn’t sound real. They are audiophiles. I think I understand the point of the post... audiophiles have different tastes. With that I must respectfully disagree. Audiophiles are crazy fanatics trying to reproduce music that sounds like the real thing, as accurately and nuanced as possible into the home. Most folks and certainly many on this forum are not audiophiles. Not an insult... doesn’t mean they are not passionate about equipment and the sound they like and love music. There are other categories of folks. High end enthusiasts for instance, audio. While I have no doubt that one to the great chiefs of the world, or maybe even the OP could produce a epicurean meatloaf... in modern language meatloaf and beer (as in six pack Joe) allude to simple tastes and big flavors not nuanced, complex and carefully balanced as the audiophile would require in his sound in order to reproduce music well. |
Turkey Meatloaf is a favourite around here. Back in my home brewing days an IPA or Pilsner Urquell like beer was on tap in five gallon soda containers. (I may have become somewhat carried away with home brewing.) Blueberry flavoured beer is gross. |
Love meatloaf; hate flavored beer - all I want is beer in my beer. I don't even like light beer - I want full-flavored: I helped empty countless coolers of Busch Light in college, but now I want quality, not quantity. The parallel to music is an interesting one. We want to share what we like because we genuinely want to spread the joy, as a religious disciple would want to spread the word. But I also know that my own passionate advocacy has rarely landed: "You really like that?" Yes, I do, and I am confident enough in my taste that I am perfectly comfortable being the only person I know who genuinely loves all the obscure 80's underground bands that I enjoy exploring and devouring. So what if nobody I know ever shares my love for Guadalcanal Diary or Naked Prey or Green on Red; my ears are the only ones I really need to please. |
Yes, I think you missed the entire meaning of my post which was focused on human nature and how we promote things we like to others, whether that be food or music or stereo equipment and the difficulties we face when others don’t feel the same way. Maybe in the future I'll write a post on how we filter and re-imagine what we hear and read through our own lenses. |
Maybe I missed something here. Have we some reason to suspect that audiophiles' tastes in food are markedly different from those of the "ask your smart speaker to play X" crowd? I personally am only a "B" level audiophile, but an "A" level gastronome who has not touched conventional American meat loaf in maybe 50 years. On the other hand, I recall a superb minced veal terrine with cornichons in gelée; a langoustine terrine in lime aspic; and likely a squab version that I can't quite recall to mind. |
Great post @erik_squires I am in 100% agreement with you. Thursday night meatloaf was a staple growing up and there’s a restaurant near me that still has it only on Thursday’s. And I to can’t stand fruity beers and the sour crap the sell.
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Not liking meatloaf is just un-American! That's a tongue in cheek statement for anyone getting ready to blow a gasket. I know lots of people who don't like it, and I'm fine with that. For myself, I love it so much that I had to learn to make my own. BTW, @erik_squires, I like to add a healthy dash of Worcestershire sauce to mine during the mixing. Addressing the issue of beer, another indulgence I partake of, I even went so far as to buy a chiller refrigerator to keep mine slightly below freezing. Though I'm not nearly as adventurous as @erik_squires when it comes to trying new beers. I did recently try a new to me brand with an offering named after an arrogant fellow of questionable birthright. It was absolutely the most horrible tasting ale I have ever drank, and I had no problem sending the five and two thirds remaining cans down the drain, though I did feel guilty for treating my plumbing that way! As to our chosen hobby, I can honestly say that I've never put another enthusiast down because of their choice of equipment or the music they choose to play on it. That type of judgement is rude and uncalled for. Tonal preferences are as individual as birthmarks, and everyone of us has their own idea of what reproduced music should sound like. How we each address that issue with our choice of equipment should never be a cause of dissent amongst us. This is, after all, just a hobby, not a life threatening event. |
@erik_squires you have out done yourself. If I recall correctly on my first post you were the only one who found something nice to say and I’ve always been interested in what you have to say since. This is a seriously well written and thought provoking post. Thanks for taking the time to share. |
I like meatloaf but most, especially restaurant fare, give me mild heartburn. And I'm not even prone to heartburn. My mother's meatloaf did not have that effect on me and although pretty mild, it was what I grew up on, so I liked it. the recipe was from the "old country" and it went to the grave with her.
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When our kids were younger, my wife would make ’feetloaf’ Shape them like feet cut off at the ankles, used sliced onion for toenails and poured the sauce over the ankles to ooze down. They loved it, especially around Halloween. And @yesiam_a_pirate , she too is a Southern Belle, and lord, that woman can cook and bake! |
What a fun and interesting post! Thanks Erik. My mom (who is a woman of excellent character) may well be the worst cook in in the lower 48 and her meatloaf was so bad even the dog wouldn't eat it. Some decades later a little Southern Belle friend of ours made her meatloaf in spite of my best polite persuasion to the contrary. She used garlic ritz crackers in the meat- 50% lamb and 50% fatty prime ground beef. She also added loads of pepper jack cheese, onions, some hot chili powder and smothered it in katsup which backed back into a tomato paste and sealed in the juices. I was in heaven! A big cold Ale made it all the more better. Happy Easter! Eric |
@erik_squires one of the greatest posts ever. I love meatloaf. My wife hates it. I love this audiophile experience and the process of figuring out what I like. She likes Spotify. But we are both happy. To each his own. Just find what you like and move in that direction. |
@mapman "...what Lisa Douglas made for Oliver..." dahlink!! |
Big fan of meatloaf (the food) and a little spice in the sauce makes most things taste better (btw - great pic @nonoise) Big fan of IPAs (singles, doubles, even some triples and quads). They have to be interesting and not bland. (btw - never had an "Indian" pale ale - made from maize?) Generally, do not like flavored beers (although a place over here makes a great tasting berry sour and another one called Fluffsicle that tastes just like a creamsicle) Big fan of listening to my stereo and I hope everyone else is happy listening to whatever system they happen to have.
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I like to cook and I think the above is an excellent analogy. It’s got me scratching my head, wondering what the sonic equivalent of "croutons" might be. Actually, I often think in terms of sonics when adjusting seasonings. Does the dish need more bass? More mids? More highs?
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