System you failed to mention price
Are there visual and size criteria?
Big Below 15k used that can play loud as heck
I moved into a way larger room, roughly 20x24 and the 802D’s just ain’t cutting the mustard. Looking for good options that can pound out bass in a large room with 500-1000 high end watts (pass or levinson etc)
Currently running 2 JL Fathom F113’s so it’s not low bass, it’s a speaker that can pump concert level music playing rap, hip hop, reggae, rock and classical/audiophile stuff etc. but I need my rig to blast rap and hiphop impressively more than anything.
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I’m surprised those B&Ws can’t play loud enough for you in that room. The B&W does have one of the biggest criterias you need for loud volumes and tight slamming bass which is a very inert cabinet. You need a very inert cabinet if you want that hard tactile bass at loud volumes IMO. my room is roughly 25x18 and both my Focal 836w and my Pioneer S-1ex play louder than I could stand with plenty of bass and I’m currently using subs. Maybe it’s you just don’t like the sound of the B&Ws. I will say at LOUD volumes you can hear the Focal cabinets which takes something away from it. With the Pioneers you never ever hear the cabinet. They have a similar inertness to your B&Ws.
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Cerwin Vegas do play that kind of music very well but again at loud volumes those cabinets start making the music sound hollow because of the cabinets. My Tekton DIs were the same. Sounded amazing on that kind of music but when you really light the wick they cabinets talked and it ruined the experience. |
And +1 to go pro. Be sure to check out JBL and Meyer's sound. Also, consider what the goal is. If you want a club experience you should do multiple speaker arrays instead of 2, distributed and time delayed from a central location. That will give even out the sound quality so that at the back of the house sounds as good as at the front, without needing to increase the volume of the fronts. That's how to do it well. |
For 15K, you can get the JBL speakers with 15 inch woofer and horn mids and tweets. You could also go with the Klipsch Cornwall IV and a couple of SVS SB 3000 Pro subs and still have plenty of money left over. The Klipsch would be on my short list. I am thinking of buying the Cornwall IV in 2022 to try a different flavor in my office system. |
It’s not hard to hit high SPL in HiFi, it’s the cost. One pair of lattice OB Neo 8 planar tower I built will hit 120+ db. 200hz to 21k for over and hour. They were about 800.00 usd per 72-75" of ribbon column. They tripled in price. Very close to 1800.00 per column. Then GSR started producing a better driver for 1/4th the price and still making 300% profit. Now the 9 drivers are 450.00 per column or 900.00 per pair for drivers. "And if you don’t wont be alone, everybody lets get stoned" I bribed um’ with a couple of pole dances from the neighbor lady and cookies. They left with a smile on their face. They liked the goat, the dog not so much..
We call him Tyson, he ain’t retired.. Alabama Banty. Loves the ladies..:-) Happy New Year. Regards |
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Well you already have subs….so you need mid bass slam….nothing does that at concert levels like separate towers of 10” drivers in an inert cabinet, preferably servo. Meyer ain’t close to your budget, i know…i spec them for people who make a living w them. Pro gear good advice, start shopping reverb, etc… |
Wow! I didn’t such a response. To recap alot of responses into one. First off I don’t only listen to rap, but I’m in my 30’s and if it can’t properly blast the music I grew up listening to what’s the point? Also I apologize it was late, I could’ve wrote a better post. I’ll edit it as such current;y Im running them in a semi treated room 9 2x4 panels along back and back corner walls. Just moved in and getting it set up. ‘current rig is Conrad Johnson Premier 16, Am running Parasound JC1’s (That I’m not keeping) which are doing a better job than the levinson 332 that really wasn’t cutting the mustard the problem im running into is the bass just gives out on them and they just sound like their gonna break or start breaking up at least once im hitting an average of 77-80db. I was hitting 87db avg. without an issue ever. I’m listening in the low 70’s. I was getting hit with a solid wave of impact not quite the maxilla guy… previous room was 11x17, 2.5x is a massive jump…. I had been thinking of something like Dunlavy SCVI, JBL K2, PBN’s, TAD, hadn’t thought of Meyer, it’s a great thought. tomic you have great advice sir.
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If you want just a good old rock and roll speaker and are not a critical listener, the Cerwin Vegas will do you well. If you want loud and want refined listening also, go Legacys. Focus SEs with a nice pair of subs and Walla, you got something... and it feels like its Idling when its loud. I know, I own a set and I like what you like .. BTW, there are quite a few recording studios across the globe that are using Focus Se's. And I'll bet they take a beating while in use. |
Back in the 70's, when i was in my 20's, my friends and I used to see who could play loud enough to peel the paint off the wall. My quest ended when I put pieces of capacitors on the ceiling. It was very loud-until that moment. HK ST7 tt, Shure V15, HK Citation 11, ESS 2240{?} xover, ESS tower speaker, Acoustic Research integrated [using the amplifier only], and EPI OpAmp1. The incident filled the room with dead electronics smoke. It was very earschplitten loudenboomer up until then. The wonder and glory of young ears. Everything survived except the AR integrated. Ahh, Springsteen said it best "Glory Days"
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At the volume levels you mention which your stated amps should be loafing at, i suspect you are listening in a deep cancellation standing wave trough…. need to move chair, speakers, sub, all three. …. How far are the B and W from the reinforcing back wall ? Are you low passing the B and W into the subs ? Try running them full range. Best to you. Jim |
Also, very respected agon member here w B and W successfully integrated Tekton Sub driver towers, they are 10” pro / musical instrument divers in a tall array cabinet Tim is not prone to over the top fanboy hyperbole and might be able to provide insight… @boxer12 , IF you go that route, i would definitely reinforce the factory Tekton box as it is much much less inert than your excellent B and W cabinet… Full disclosure, I have not heard Tim’s system, but given his wide ranging exoerience w Wilson to B and W and much more, I trust him. Jim |
(...Jim assumes that, at the levels desired, that one can stand still...*L*) There are less expensive ways to decimate sheetrock, but voting with the 'pro' purposer's... Eriks' down with your concept, but Jim (again, +) is pointing out that the levels targeted begin to turn the space into a larger version of the interior of a really large cabinet.... "Lets' get F'd up and watch the pressure waves blow the dust bunnies airborne!" Cruise the used at the pro outlets....Behringer with a soft spot for Crown amps myself, but If I go big I'm wearing muffs to keep what's left. Sounds like good clean fun to me, tho'....👍 Go forth and froth... @oldhvymec ...when the db's rise, do the neighbors run towards, or away? :)
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You guys keep talkin’ about horns. @systembuilder I think your dB readings are off. You mean 100 dB or above. That is the way to go for sure. The car that goes by and shakes your house is not what you want. I have had subs for 20 years. My son and I used to love it when we could shake the walls with Welcome to the Machine. He came home one time and said I have to play loud rap to get any bass. I said no, listen. I had put some improvements in place since last time he was there. Better streaming but the springs under the subs and speakers cleaned up a lot of problems. Now you can feel the wave of music go by me. I can walk the entire room and the sound is nearly the same. AND the rest of the house doesn’t shake anymore. Talk about standing waves! I was going to buy some more bass traps but the springs fixed a lot of the problems. Anyway, you can spend SO much but you have the subs. Set them at 80-100 HZ crossover point. Klipsch Cornwall, LaScala, Klipschorn, will all play about greater than 115 dB with a not very big amp. I would not put a tube setup in your case. I use a pass XA25 and it will play louder than most want even with a passive preamp. I don’t think it will do 120 dB but I don’t care. If you like to tinker around, buy some used Klipsch and put some nicer parts in the crossover and you will really have something. Even new Klipschorns are in your budget! The subs make the Klipsch sound better. Less load on your main amp. I would not go out any buy a mega amp. A Pass X150.8 would not even sweat. It was the B&W that were robbing your power. I do have a 500W at 4 ohm amp on the subs. Obviously there are other choices besides Klipsch but they are readily available and will take the beating. Volti Rival and the Legacy would be good choices as well(high quality parts and sound) The big Dunlavy are great but are getting old. I don’t know about parts. Have fun! I am in Midwest if you are nearby. I have all the Kanye, Dr. Dre, Kendrick, Drake, Tyler the Creator you could ask for. Zhu can put those people to shame if he puts his mind to it. |
I would suggest experimenting with your listening position. No matter if the system is $10,000 or $500,000, I prefer to be closer to the speakers. I'm not saying to hurt hearing or blast them in your ears but once I get more than 15 feet away, unless the room is very well treated, and the whole system is very capable, I prefer the closer position- 10-15 feet or so away most of the time. There is so much that can go on with sound over distance, so just my advice to experiment with this aspect too. |
Oldhvymec, I don’t think there is 1 group you left out to offend. Happy New Year to you too. :-) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well some call it offensive, WE call it getting along. One of the cops was my nephew. Besides all the cops in this town smoke pot IF they are gonna get loaded. The AA meeting became a little to saturated with local PD, They decided to switch gears. The old cop pubs are NO MORE in this town.. We don’t have coffee shops (LAUGH) but we still have bars (NOT LAUGHING). I watched the drunk neighbor back up and PUSH his bass boat right off the trailer and on to side walk. He didn’t catch any fish, BUT he did manage to get a heck of drunk going on. This was SO wrong in so many ways. Drunk pilot, bass fishing, drunk driving, bringing his boat and 2 guest home. THEN he wrecks his own boat and trailer and pickup. He didn’t hurt a soul, he just did 15-20K in damage and his insurance will pay for it.. There, NOW I’ve offended everyone. MAD can get Happy. I don’t care if you are smashed and drive. You better not wreck and cause damage or harm to others. That’s my moto. I’ll turn you over to the family if I see a idiot. The cops like it better in the long run.. They’re better at car chases and fun stuff like that.. Taking videos for "Cops" to air.. How am I doing guy/gals/??? It’s time to feed the chickens in 2022, WOW. Let me crow!!! I made another one. Now you know WHY the call me "The Organic Fanatic Mechanic" Happy New Year Note to the OP: Get open back head phones TOO, and turn it all UP, the HP at 120-130db and the room speakers at about 140-150 or so. Tape the windows and wear goggles in case your eyes pop out, SO MESSY.. Maybe a bung plug just in case you crap yourself.. Depends is probably better overall. |
