New Speakers under consideration - but I’m afraid

Your best mode of action is to demo as many speakers as you can. I know it is difficult these days, when many retailers are located only in major cities, but making time and coordinating them in advance will make you an educated buyer. 

You'll get opinions otherwise on this forum, but, as Julia Child used to say-

'you'll be sorry'

Bob 

You've probably been around high end audio long enough to answer your own question.  You simply must audition speakers until you find the ones you like best.  Is there any other way?  Happy listening.

You story has made me afraid very afraid...

I don't have a recommendation, but I can relate to your dilemma. I was considering an upgrade to my Von Schweikert VR-4 speakers (purchased in the late 90's) , but was concerned that I would spend the money and not be happy. I decided to stay with Von Schweikert.  The new speakers are a definite improvement and likely my last pair of speakers. 

@sls883 

Very confusing. You say you stayed with the VS speakers, then you say the new speakers are an improvement. Which is it?

I am also a bit confused, @ozzy62 , but maybe he meant he went with a new set of Von Scheikerts.  

Thanks for the replies.

I guess I’ve been around long enough to know that showroom audition may be an indicator, but once you get them home with different room and electronics, the result will very likely vary.

And home for me is Nassau, Bahamas so returning them, even if an option- is not an option (after shipping and duty etc.)

I guess a more general question might be are  speakers today (>$15k) better than their 25 year old equivalents?

Nothing to fear but fear itself.
… and money. Fear and money!
…and maybe the wife? Fear, money and wife.
Oh snap, then there is the sound…

Fear, money wife and sound. That’s it! 4 things to fear.

Depreciation! 5 things actually. .

Oh well, you only live once. Do it till you’re satisfied!

I would approach it differently. Are you an analytical, impulsive or emotional person?

If you are analytical, you will find and likely appreciate the differences. From your post, you are not though.

The improvements have been significant but it benefitted the lower segment more than the higher tier. (NOBODY WILL AGREE WITH THIS HEHE) That said, you can buy speakers in the 5K neighborhood that beat your current speakers, emotional, impulsive or what not.  Personally none of these speakers on your list get me excited but they must be great. 

@immatthewj I stayed with the Von Schweikert brand, but bought a new pair from their current product line. 

Is the Mac amp you have on top tube or SS?

@ozzy62 Sorry, didn't see your comment. I only meant that I stayed with the Von Schweikert brand.  Poor choice of wording on my part. 

The advances in speaker technology has been very large. Yes you have much to gain. The safest bet will be the B&Ws since you like their speaker sound and they are still very bass heavy. But a trip is still worth the time and expense.

 

I would read avidly about your choices, then make a trip to the states to confirm. With your knowledge of your speakers and auditions you should be able to extrapolate to your audio environment.

Well a 15k speaker today there 15 yo equivalent would be about 4k back then. Better is subjective for sure and you would need to listen. I had BW Matrix 801 vii for a while. With a monster amp pushing them they were just as good as most today. I’m not of the camp that speakers are night and day better especially comparing to totl from 20 years ago. 

Well a 15k speaker today there 15 yo equivalent would be about 4k back then.

That’s adjusted for inflation, but does that also apply to or account for the potential for increased performance due to R&D over 25 years?

If you like the B&W sound you are on the right track with the options you mention but you might like to add Focal to the list. Not my cup of tea but speaker choice is very personal and I prefer the more musical (less analytical ) speakers like Sonus Faber.

Why not stay with what you have? They are excellent speakers

Listening to music in the Bahamas on any of the speakers on your list sounds divine to me.

The 801s were $5.5k in 1999. New.
 

Several years ago I took a fav cd and went and listened to WW Puppies driven by great electronics and thought what’s the big deal. They did not seem to resolve any better and seemed lacking on the bottom. 
 

Now, how many iterations later, I wonder if the Sashas have improved enough- surely they must have, no? I would be looking at used so listening may be an issue.

The new 802s ( I wrote 803s above but meant 802s) share the same B&W DNA so should be an improvement and safer choice (but would still go for a listen). My ears have rolled off on top so B&W brightness may be less of an issue. 
 

I’m a big believer in physics and can’t see (or hear) how the X3s go very deep, but I failed to mention that I have a VMPS Larger sub driven by Crown K2, so deep bass is not an issue. Will try and have listen in Fla.

you need to look at Legacy's way more dynamic then all of the speakers you mentioned and designed to be bi-amped with their wavelet processor

the signature se $9300 depending on finish are an incredible deal

 

very efficient 92db

high power handling 20watts to 300

very deep subwoofer level bass 22hz

can be bi-amplified.

state of the art heil AMT tweeter and midrange for incredible resolution and a huge soundstage.

stunning real wood finishes.

American made ,great service and support.

Dave and Troy

Audio Intellect NJ

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Legacy dealer.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It seems like you have enough power so no more versatile and bang-for-the-buck manufacturer as Magnepan.

Let me guess Dave, you no longer sell KEF, Paradigm, or Goldenear? 

@mapman A perfect analysis!

Give yourself permission to change.  I’d bet your taste in ice cream is different than it was 25 years ago - who knew coconut could be so good?  And I’m guessing you’d buy a different suit today, even if the old ones still fit!  So I’d recommend listening to different types of speakers and systems - I’m amazed how great some single driver speakers sound these days.  Florida Audio show is in February.  And Soundlux Audio in Miami has great stuff.  These speakers may be your last, so have fun.

@sls883 

For what it’s worth … I understood what you were saying.  
 

- Had an old pair of VS speakers 

- upgraded to a new pair

-stuck with VS brand

-don’t regret the upgrade 

 

@sls883 

Understood and good choice. I have owned two versions of the VR4. Albert (RIP) made some damn fine speakers.

I have had the X3's for about 4 months now and I would highly recommend them...

Definitely add Rockport speakers to your list to audition! Good luck ! 

I would audition the new Radiant Acoustivs Clarity 6.2. They are fantastic, beats Børresen, Magico and the like. They are small but have a HUGE sound. I heard them Saturday, I was blown away!

The D4 generation of Bowers sound quite different. They would be worth an audition for you. Focal Kanta or Sopra may be a good alternative for you to consider as well.

Boressen X3 are amazing. This company know how make dynamic musical speakers. I am very impress with my x1.

+1 for a trip to hear some different speakers. While not ideal listening, attending a show is also a good way to sample a lot of brands and narrow your search. 

Hi, please send me your email and I'll send a video recording. Thanks 

The sound is great and not a bad price.

 

The new textreme material that speakers are made out of seem to be lighter weight more responsive and have less distortion.i think this is the main difference between old and new.maybe some capiticor upgrade if the manufacture puts that in. So look for speaker made of textreme cones.it has the coefficient  right below berelliym.the is a great review by one of the eminence engineers on u tube about their new horn with that material.enjoy the hunt and the music.paradigm is the only speaker i know of that has a berillium midrange beryllium other than some old yamaha 1000 and pioneere tad there are a few horns with beryllium.

Most high end speakers use beryllium for thier tweeters this is common and they sound great.

Out of those three the Boressen x 3 is the best one you should also consider the monitor audio platinum series which I believe is even better than the Boressen.

The problem with beryllium is is very bright and hard sounding I've listened to the paradigm and I couldn't sit there for more than 2 minutes The voice and symbols were very bright and edgy sounding The monitor audio platinum are much better.

Fear...surprise...and an almost fanatical devotion to B&W.

No surprise, actually. There’s a reason (or many reasons) that B&W have been the standard monitors for DGG and a host of other premiere recording labels for decades. The 801s are going to be hard to beat. But then, as has been said already, taste in speakers is highly personal.

FWIW (which won’t be much), I have never found a speaker I prefer to my Scientific Fidelity Teslas, built in 1992 and restored twice since by Millersound. I’ve had B&Ws in my listening room for a week; own Von Schweikert VR4 Jrs, PSB Synchrony Ones, Revel F208s, a pair of Maggies.... I’ve also auditioned various others, again in my own space. A friend writes reviews for Stereophile, and I’ve heard some amazing things at his place (Vivid Giyas; MBL Radialstrahlers). But I always come back to the Teslas.

Your rig must sound superb. Maybe its time to return to the music; that’s what the tools are for.

I’d keep your current speakers and get another pair that are really different but can be driven by your current amps. If you listen to a lot of acoustic music and jazz, Maggie’s might be interesting. Then you can swap ever once in a while to scratch the itch for something different.

I haven't heard an american-made speaker yet that I like not legacy not Wilson not any the European speakers are much better like monitor audio proac audio vector and Boressen.

Hello ritter06!  If you like your speakers, don't be in a hurry to change them. I do agree that Legacy speakers are excellent, if they will fit in your space. Most of them are on the large side. They do make a smallish one. Here's an easy & cheap way to evaluate your existing speakers. I assume you have serious speaker cables. Get some garden variety 14 gauge zip cord the same length as your speaker cables. (You can make extension cords for your power tools later on.) Play your favorite music on your system without any changes. Turn off the power amps. Now swap your speaker cables for the zip cords. Listen to the same music thru the zip cords. Is the sound noticibly less pleasant with the zip cords in place? If YES, your speakers are detailed enough for you to hear improvements made elsewhere in the system. If the sound is about the same, go ahead and replace your speakers with something nice. Legacy, Golden Ear, etc. I have recently replaced some excellent Linkwitz speakers with the Magnepan LRS+ and given up dynamics for detail and delicacy.  I recommend you use the GR crossover mods and subwoofers from 80 - 100 Hz down. I have the original LRS (modified) also. I listen to a lot of singer/songwriter music and music from different cultural groups. Happy Listening!

I moved from a house with a large listening room to a much smaller condominium ( I think there was a divorce or something in there). The 801’s are in a close if not nearfield position and never sounded better (testament to the great concrete build quality).

Another move to a larger condo and listening room ( 18’ x 20’) is on track by the end of the year.

I will try the 801’s first in the new place first but I like the idea of new speakers in there. WAF not an issue btw.

For something completely different and worthwhile for many check out Ohm Walsh. 

I second the suggestion for Focal speakers.  They are great all-rounds and have the ability reproduce the wide variety of music you like.  With your biamping, they would sound great.  Great deals on the used market.  As others have said, you should go listen alot, but very mindful the the amplification.  IMO, Focal respond to different sources.   

Ohm? I didn't know that they were still around. Who knew.

 

I'll put Focal on the list. Thanks.

To answer your question directly, fear not, for I am confident you will find speaker technology dramatically improved with a proportionate improvement in sound quality over the past 20 years.  While there are many similarities in improvements across brands, the fact remains that each brand has its own signature that may provide you personally with vigor to listen for hours or fatigue within minutes.  It is a personal preference, but also an associated with system synergy.  I try to use a process  (based on my experience in quality engineering - everything is a process) as follows:

1:  While difficult, define you per personal preferences.  Not only musical genera but how you believe a system should sound.  It’s hard to articulate but I will give it an attempt.  Detailed/clarity or romantic warmth are two camps I have read in this forum before.

2: Define the specific improvements you wish to realize.  For example, you current speakers have prominent bass but you desire greater bass detail which I am confident modern designs will provide. Determine if you are willing to sacrifice some prominence for increased detail.  

3:  Do your homework.  Read all the pro reviews of “best” or “choice” speakers.  Match reviews with your preferences.  Look for similarities and differences in opinions between reviews on the same model.

4: Make a top 3-5 list.  Audition for an adequate amount of time to really explore if the sound is for you at a good dealer.  Question the dealer on system synergy.  Determine if they will allow home audition.  Not always feasible with large floor standers. Determine return policies.  

5:  Open your wallet after approval of your significant other. 

Others have made good recommendations.  I will add my personal preference for you to consider - Vivid.  Designed by Laurence Dickey, a name you should be familiar with.  He designed the B&W Nautilus.  Vivid designs are a more modern application of Nautilus technology.   I use the Vivid Giya G3.  Call GTT Audio in NJ.  See article below. Good luck. Sorry if I stated the obvious in the approach to use and if I was pontificating.  The latter is an issue I am working on. 
 

https://twitteringmachines.com/road-tour-gtt-audio-vivid-audio-speakers/

I'm running a pair of Thiel CS6 speakers with a Krell KSA 300S amp. They were about $9000 in the mid 90's. I've been to 3 audio shows and I've found that my system holds up to pretty much anything costing under 6 figures. I've heard speakers that do one thing or another better than my Thiels but I haven't heard anything that would blow them away until the price gets into the stratosphere. A good example of a speaker that is clearly above what I own is the MBL 101E MkII. They are around $90K but if you get a chance you should hear them to see what is possible.

If you can swing it I would recommend going to an audio show to get a broad overview of what is available. The Capital Audio Fest is coming up in November and it would be an excellent way to hear what's available and narrow down the choices.

The speakers that have impressed me the most are from Rockport, Rosso Fiorentino, Dynaudio, Joseph Audio, Sonus Faber, and Paradigm but that's just my taste. These were all speakers under $50k.

About the fear...... If you spend tens of thousands of dollars on new speakers I'm pretty sure you will like them just fine. At least you're not twitterpating about cables.

Jay's Iyagi Review of Arendal 1723 THX

These certainly look intriguing

The older b&w speakers were really nice and filled the room very comfortably. Older speakers have value if they’re in good condition and it sounds like you’ve done some things to yours thank you so much to make them really nice.

New speakers are different these days and require absolute perfection with all the components. I have older b&w speakers and they are comfortable to listen to.

I don’t like all these new creations that seem to say you’ve gotta do all this stuff to make sure they reach their full potential. Thats not how it should be.

The industry is changing and it’s quite impractical for anyone to listen to many speakers. It’s unfortunate they require dealers to buy the speakers before they sell them. The whole means of distributing nice speakers is problematic.