Downsizing from tower to bookshelf

I have tower speakers retailing from 11K down to 1K and I enjoy my KLH Model 3's @ 15 hundred bucks the best...They are magic!

*Thanks again for all the suggestions!!

Three of the speakers mentioned here, I haven’t heard of, are intriguing. I’ve spent the last couple days conducting internet research to learn more, and plan to order these first. I’ll provide my thoughts once they arrive.

- PS Audio Aspen FR 5

- Proac Tablet 10

- ATC SCM19

Thanks again for all the suggestions?

I would add:

Tyler Acoustics

Ascend, and

Revival (used)

Take a listen to PS Audio FR5

listen in your room and be ready to hear what you ask for. 

If you are considering the Harbeth P3ESR XD why not go a bit further to the Harbeth M30.2 XD? I have a similar size room and the M30 are fantastic. A bit more presence, great holographic and a mid-range that is second to none for any bookshelf under 1000$ . Would be a good combo with the amp you have. You can probably pick up a pair second hand at your price point.

in any case, if you end up getting a Harbeth speaker, I would recommend getting an open bottom stand , like the Ton Trager, to get the full box resonance. I have tried different stands and it makes a huge difference.

Good luck and keep us posted.

@bdp24 , yup, that was it.  My bad.  Anyway, for anyone interested:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/the-criteria-for-loudspeaker-choices?highlight=Eminent%20Technology%20LFT-8%20loudspeaker

@immathewj: You must be thinking of my thread about the Eminent Technology LFT-8 loudspeaker, which like the PS Audio Aspen speakers utilizes planar-magnetic drivers, a major point of discussion in that thread. I haven’t heard any of the PS Audio FR models, but p-m drivers are renown for their neutral sound quality, being neither warm nor cold. Another p-m attribute is their high transparency, which Paul McGowan always mentions in his videos about the Aspen speakers.

Tons of great suggestions mentioned.

Wanted to add my thoughts directly on your choices from experience: the Harbeth and the Warfedale.  Listened with tube gear at a dealer in WA (https://www.gigharboraudio.com/) who I would recommend you call and talk with, as they are VERY in-line with your thoughts and what you are looking for in your space, and carry or have carried most of what you mention, plus others like Audio Note.

I personally think the best bang for what you list are the Harbeths.  They really are exceptional speakers, and have a life and presence and accuracy that at least I liked a lot over the Warfedale option. To me, the Harbeth was extremely accurate at reproducing the metal sound and *feel* of an acoustic guitar string, AND the warm organic wood of the body resonance; meaning they were notably two separate things, where other speakers I tested DIDN'T have that ability.  The only other speaker that was available for audition that did that as well was the Audio Note speaker.
I ended up getting a pair of Legacy Audio's "Studio HD" speakers during Covid just before their prices went up.  They are to me, amazing speakers.  I still listen to a ton of rock and heavier music, but I also like very accurate modern music and acoustic performances.  I added a sub to get the 'power' but I think the Legacy are also extremely accurate and lively...but I think the Harbeths were better at true accuracy and sound staging (dependent on equipment driving).

Best of luck!!!  I'm curious to find what you end up with!

Go to Jay's audio lab for his review of the PS audio FR5 standmounts.  I think he gave a fair review.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fb5RYm3_ApA&t=95s

I will put in a plug for the ATC SCM19’s. No sibilance. Tremendous soundstage. I run SCM7’s in my bedroom on top of a dresser with rubber sandwich isolators and couldn’t be happier. All of the ATC Entry series are easy to drive- I use the original Aegir in my bedroom.

I have two of the speakers mentioned above in two systems, the Proac and the Audio Note. Both are exceptional speakers and give you what you are looking for. I find the audio note for vocals, jazz, and blues is outstanding!

Anyone that states what you have (floorstanding to bookshelf), I always recommend a look at the Van L Speakerworks Quartet: (https://www.stereotimes.com/post/van-l-speakerworks-quartet-loudspeakers/)

Admittedly, I have not heard them, nor do I know anyone who has, but ALL the reviews of the product are sterling, and the company owner has a great reputation in the Chicago area. I spoke to him on the phone once, and he couldn't have been nicer (for what that's worth).

The price is right for you ($2,995), so it might be worth a look/listen.

Thanks for all the great feedback and suggestions. I’ll keep the group posted on my progress and decision.

I did the same thing moving from towers to standmounts. Sibilance was important to me. I’ve tried a lot of speakers and my old guy ears can’t stand any sibilance. I tried the B&W 705 S3, KEF 3 Metas along with others and ended up with the Revel M126Be. I love the beryllium tweeters. I suggest using with subs. I have a pair of SVS SB1000 Pros and the combination sounds as good if not better than towers in my 12 x 12 room that opens up behind my listening seat. Agree with buying, trying and returning if necessary. It’s the only way to know how the setup will sound in your particular room in my experience. Enjoy your new musical journey!

I recently ran into the same situation. my room is 12’ x 11.5’ with 10’ Ceilings with a bass issue at around 100hz.

I attended many shows and went through 11 sets of speakers, driving myself and several sellers and mfgs crazy with home trials, shipments and returns. I’ve got a decent system, not the best but decent, check my system’s details if your’e interested.

Anyway, at the Tampa Show I came across AJ from Soundfield Audio who explained to me how I’d be stuck on this merry go round of trying to get some premade speaker to try to sound good in “my room” and that instead I should have a speaker built to the specific needs of my room and the to the sound characteristics I sought.

I took him up on his offer with him making me a pair of his Custom designed MMW1’s Cardioid Stand Mounts, Featuring SB Acoustics Satori TW-29B Beryllium Tweeters, Crossed over using custom internal crossovers utilizing Air Coil Inductors, Mundorf Resistors & Audyn film caps. Mids & Lows handled by Dayton Epique E180 Woofers < 1,2kHz & SOUNDFIELD 8" top firing Subwoofers <80hz, both driven by Hypex Fusion 250w DSP plate amplifiers DSP tuned to correct room’s acoustic shortcomings.

I have to say, finally the search is over and I can sit back and enjoy the music… And you want to talk about piano… You not only clearly hear the notes as if you were there, at times yo can hear the pedals being pushed and fingers pressing the keys. I can honestly say when fellow audiophile friends stop by, I no longer ask how they think my set up sounds, now I actually boast how great it sounds, so much so I’m showcasing an event at my home this January for the Audiophile Society I belong being I’m that confidant how great my set up sounds.

Not to say at the various audio shows I’ve attended I haven’t been blown away by what I’ve seen & heard from all the brands recommended on this thread, but from my own experience of being on that speaker merry go round, I have to say, I’d never consider buying something premade again only to hope it would sonically work out for me.

I met AJ at the Tampa show and incase your’e interested, AJ and Soundfield Audio again will have a room exhibiting at the Florida International Hifi Expo in Tampa this February, so if you go would certainly be worth your while to check them out or just check out the Soundfield Audio website.

This is not some sales pitch and if it comes off that way I apologize, just honestly blown away by what was able to be achieved by going this route as well as the feeling I contributed to the final outcome of how great these things sound by telling AJ exactly what I wanted out of a speaker and he made it happen.

I would add and research the Neat Petites. Fidelis is the US distributor and Marc was great to deal with. 

I downsized from a 12 x 11 x 9 to even a smaller room. I had the ($1000) Magnepan LRS+ in the bigger room and it was really good. It lacked some details that I was used to in other speakers, but overall, the presentation was so impressive.

In my even smaller room, I have the (used $1000) Magnepan Mini. I use the KEF KEC62 sub with this system and also the LRS+. I am doing near-field listening (see my office2 virtual system). The Mini sound better than the LRS+. The missing detail is there and the soundstage and presentation is the same but in a slightly smaller scale.

You do need power for both Maggies, and I use the Sanders Magtech amp (500 | 900 @ 8 | 4).

BTW - Yesterday I added a barstool to the room and put the KC62 sub on it. It is now at the same height as the Mini panels which are on stands. I think this is going to be my long-term setup. I like the bass this way.

BTW2 - another killer small room setup is the KEF LS50 META + KC62 sub (around $1800 used for both). I had that before the LRS+ and it had more detail than the LRS+ but lacked the wall of sound effect of the Maggies.

@immathewj: You must be thinking of my thread about the Eminent Technology LFT-8 loudspeaker, which like the PS Audio Aspen speakers utilizes planar-magnetic drivers, a major point of discussion in that thread. I haven’t heard any of the PS Audio FR models, but p-m drivers are renown for their neutral sound quality, being neither warm nor cold. Another p-m attribute is their high transparency, which Paul McGowan always mentions in his videos about the Aspen speakers.

My attitude about "bookshelf"-sized loudspeakers is that a bookshelf speaker sitting on a stand may occupy no less floor space than does a tower model of the same dimensions (in terms of width and depth). A tower design may use the floor space occupied by the bookshelf’s stand for an enclosure fitted with woofer(s), the tower speaker therefore providing reproduction of low frequencies that the bookshelf is incapable of. The bass bin of the ET LFT-8b measures 13" wide by 24" deep (including the dedicated Sound Anchor bass). The Aspen FR5 measures 8" wide by 13" deep, excluding stand

The PS Audio FR5 utilizes a p-m driver for only the high frequencies (1750Hz and up), while the ET LFT-8 employs a large p-m driver for frequencies 180Hz up to 10kHz (with no crossover filters in that frequency range), a ribbon tweeter for 10kHz up. My argument in the ET LFT-8 thread was that if you value the sq of a p-m driver, the LFT-8 offers more of that driver’s sq than does the Aspen FR5

The Aspen FR5 retails for $3499 (plus another $500 for the dedicated stands), the ET LFT-8b $3200 (including shipping if bought directly from Eminent Technology). Think about it: the Aspen FR5 utilizes a 6-1/2" dynamic cone woofer to reproduce the critical midrange frequencies (all frequencies up to 1750Hz), the ET LFT-8b a planar-magnetic driver (from 180Hz up to 10kHz). Which loudspeaker seems more likely to out-perform the other?

However, the LFT-8---like all dipole-planars--requires space between it and the wall behind it. More is better, with 3' being the oft-quoted minimum distance. My recommendation is 5'.

Fritz

Honestly if you’re looking for soundstage in a bookshelf, I can 100% recommend GR Research NX-Studios. Not saying this as a GR kool-aid drinker, but just knowing what I’ve heard they are phenomenal at any price point, let alone right in your budget, and fantastic customer service as well. They might lean a little neutral when built with Sonicaps throughout, but toss in something of copper caps for the tweeter circuit and you’ll be sitting pretty for one hell of a nice speaker. You can now get them prefab in your choice of finish for your budget, or go DIY for a couple thousand in savings. But quite literally they are THE best imaging/soundstaging bookshelf I have ever heard, even in my small 12x10 listening room. Side to side pinpoint imaging as well as front to back layering are all easily discernable, but something you won’t get with others is height. Easy example is Bob Marley’s Redemption Song have the acoustic guitar directly in front between the woofers, but Bob’s voice clearly 3ft higher and slightly farther back. Spooky good.

I will say, with good bookshelf speakers should come a (or a couple) good subwoofers. So much of the fundamentals of soundstage come in room acoustics below 50hz that you’ll want some help there. A Rythmik or REL should mate nicely if you didn’t already have something. Used market maybe $500 for something decent.

Demo options are less than others as you’d rely on someone opening their home for a listening session, but a couple posts here or over on Audiocircle and I’m sure you’d find someone within a short drive. Heck, if you’re near Portland, swing on by for an afternoon.

Just my $0.02 as a bookshelf speaker fan.

-Lloyd

Since you were looking at the revel bookshelf speaker, spend a few more $$$ and get the f226be speakers.

MD has a couple of pairs; both are theoretically marked down. One pair is marked down to 4k, and the pair they are calling "B stock" is marked down to about 5800 (which I don’t understand the "b-stocks" being more than the other pair).

ON EDIT:  I just looked and saw that Uncle Kevin AND Crutchfield are selling them for 4k a pair.  They are not huge floor standing speakers--41" H is all.

But anyway, OP, if it makes any difference to you, Revel did farm out the manufacture of the M126be to Indonesia. I am NOT saying that it should or should not make a difference, I am just putting that out there because I was under the impression when I ordered mine that they were USA made and the salesman I spoke to on the phone "kind of" gave me that impression as he said I would be impressed with the "American sound" as opposed to the "British sound" of my B&Ws. I am still not sure what the difference is that I was supposed to hear.

So I did exactly what you are doing. I have a nice pair of usher mini-X with the DMD tweeters. They sounded pretty good in my smaller room but something was missing. So I started looking at smaller floorstanding speakers and went with the revel f226be. I have a 15.5’ x 13’ room and hear revels sound so much more full and produce enough bass so no need for a subwoofer. Since you were looking at the revel bookshelf speaker, spend a few more $$$ and get the f226be speakers.

If you want to go with a bookshelf, look at the ps audio fr5, sounds bigger than it should.

I want to recommend a speaker I haven’t heard myself, but I use the company’s products, and like them. Plus they get great reviews. The speaker is the PS Audio Aspen FR 5. Apparently they are warm, rich and have surprisingly powerful bass. 

Early last summer, I think it might of been @bdp24 , posted a thread about the pre-release of those speakers.  They certainly sounded interesting.  I wasn't sure about the specs, low sensitivity and 6 ohm load, but the impedance apparently doesn't dip too low, so I guess that mitigates the sensitivity.  As I typed, I thought they sounded like what I was looking for, but I was auditioning the Revels at the time.

I heard the bigger studio electrics at a local enthusiasts house when I was buying some speaker cables off him. They seemed to be very musical and do everything well. The owner and maker of Studio Electric lives 30 minutes from me. I’ve been meaning to take a trip and check out the lineup. 

I want to recommend a speaker I haven’t heard myself, but I use the company’s products, and like them. Plus they get great reviews. The speaker is the PS Audio Aspen FR 5. Apparently they are warm, rich and have surprisingly powerful bass. 
 

The best part is they give you 30 days in your own space to try them out and decide.

The Proac Tablette and Studio Electric m4 are interesting in that both are sealed boxes similar to Harbeth. I can’t seem to find a dealer for either so I may have to contact them direct for return policy.

immatthewj - thank you for your insight on the Revel’s, it’s very helpful.

I’ve heard the Kef r3 metas and wasn’t a big fan. They sounded thin and potentially fatiguing to my ears.

I second the KEF R3, Meta version. Really nice speaker and well under your limit.

My preference is neutral to slightly warm sound with heavy emphasis on holographic soundstage. Price point is maxed at $3,500.

You listed the Revel M126be and I recently replaced a pair of B&W 805 (Matrix) with the Revels.  With my equipment (Sa10 and Cary tube preamp and amp) I would NOT call the presentation warm.  Perhaps neutral.  As far as holographic?  I get a decent sound stage in my room (which is smaller than yours) and detail stands out, which may not be your thing.

I got mine from MD (they were listing them as "B stock" and selling them for 3k and I think some change) but I see that Uncle Kevin also sells them, and for a while he had them listed  for 3k (and not "B stock").  I don't know his policy, but it is probably similar to MD's--60 days to try them for yourself and make up your mind.

I would add ProAc Tablette 10 to your list. I find them exceptional. They would love your amp.

I've also been intrigued by MoFi's new Sourcepoint speakers lately. I've heard good things.

@vette5451--I think that your 3 choices are great. The only other speaker that I would add, the KEF R3, is probably too neutral for you..

these are just below your budget in USD. I don't think you'll find a better speaker for a small room like yours, other then a really small stand mount with zero bass. the AudioNotes AN k-J are made to be placed in a corner so it opens up the room size quit a bit, hard to find in your budget but these are stellar speakers right in your sound signature. Used ov course as they are well abover your budget new. 

Audionote UK AN/JD hemp speakers with stands For Sale - Canuck Audio Mart