Any Advice for those Listening to Youtube Reviewers?
I’d like to recognize that it takes a great set of self promotional skills to become successful in the Youtube world. That said most of the audio reviewers I’ve seen don’t have the experience to review, or the kind of space that would really allow gear to shine.
Most of them start of with K-Mart like gear, did their formula and got popular, and jumped far up the audio food chain. Of course everything they review is going to be great compared to the Service Merchandise system they sold last year.
Just throwing it out there that people should be careful listening to these guys that are mostly working for the views/money (not that some aren’t passionate).
Anyone else seeing this?
Of course. Even the ones with likeable engaging personalities have vested interests in pleasing the companies who make the gear that they are loaned so that they will continue to have a steady flow of gear and followers. That said, it's entertaining, and you can read between the lines to get some idea of what the piece is like as well as some close-up views of the piece. |
If they give bad products great reviews, they will soon lose many of those views/much of that money as people catch on. I watch a number of them, and maybe I'm naive, but I don't regard any of them as being shills or having started reviewing at K-Mart type of places. Perhaps we watch different reviewers. Hi-Fi magazines, on the other hand..... |
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It seems like the OP is posing a question with the title of the thread: "Any Advice for those Listening to Youtube Reviewers?" The advice I'd offer would include the following: 1. Find credible sources prior to watching influencers. The Complete Guide to High-End Audio by Harley -- even an earlier edition -- is a good start. 2. Try to determine the reviewer's credentials somehow. Biography, other publications, etc. are a good way. One popular YouTube influencer has made a lot of money claiming to talk to dead people. That's a red flag. 3. Does the reviewer like everything? If so, they are not critical and are probably being remunerated for being non-critical. 4. How long has their channel existed and do they answer criticism? Audioholics and PS Audio respond to dialog.
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I follow several reviewers regularly. Most of them indicate their particular interests and seem to tailor their sites to those interests. I wouldn't watch cheapaudioman for a review about a halo Sonos Faber floorstander, he isn't about that and doesn't pretend to be. For different reasons I like watching A British Audiophile, because I like his level, methodical, analytical and comparative format. Having good production values and a consistent pattern helps. (For YT reviews, I benchmark savagegeese because of the consistent method and high production values; it is an automotive site, not an audio site.) |
One site I look at is ASR. I know there are many people her who dislike Amir's approach. He has a take-no-prisoners approach and doesn't seem hesitant to pan gear that doesn't meet his particular testing standards. Those standards are open to debate as far as how well good performance in a user setting corresponds to good performance on his bench or in the spinorama. Products from cherished makers have sometimes seen a skewering. I have observed that he seldom reviews something well that doesn't also perform well. His methods skewer amplifier distortion, and he declines to do testing of tube gear because of its high levels of measurable distortion, euphonious or not. I can't see a brand bias; his SINAD scale places ultra high end next to low-end unknowns at both ends of the performance scale. He seems to prefer speaker offerings by KEF, and if there is a preference, it is for neutral coloration and flat frequency response and low distortion. I have heard some of his critics dismiss him, but few are able to persuasively explain why, except that he has expressed a dislike for a reader's cherished brand or model. |
Reviewers are like us... Humans.... The difference is that they have their own ears , not yours; and they must sell in a way or in another...Generally they sell new offers on the market... They dont compare with the past, even to recent past...For most all is progress... Some are better than others... The problem is reviewers spoke for all of us indistinctly...And no one here is on the same place in his audio journey.....The reviewers cannot know about your needs; you must learn to identify your real needs... it is generally better to read articles than listening reviewers to do this... At the end of the road we dont need reviewers...At the begining of the road i am not sure we need reviewers...We need to read ...When i had listened reviewers i had been put aside and i regret all i bought ( many dac , many amplifier and many speakers and many headphones 😊 ) ...I begin to understand by reading about acoustic basic... And i read about some vintage mythical products, it is better to buy a myth with a ton of reviews and advices, than to buy a new product which will be forgotten soon ... Reviewers may be entertaining and can give good suggestions for sure... But you must listen to yourself reading with open mind about the past products not only the new one...Past products can be vintage but they can be product of ten years ago ... There is a revolution now in audio for example in the last 15 years , how many reviewers youtube spoke about it ? Very , very few... Guess what it is ? How many revolutions there is in audio in the last 15 years and which one ? 😊 No it is not a mere new dac like all the others more or less ....
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The OP is flat out wrong about the better internet reviewers. Kmart gear, really? Have you seen Jay's Audio equipment? Jay has spent more on room acoustics than most magazine reviewers paid for their reference gear. I would listen to the better internet reviewers over ANY of the magazine reviewers for a few reasons. 1) When was the last time you saw a negative review of any piece of equipment in a magazine review? Never (except the for the botched Totem review done by a magazine 10-15 years ago). Why did a magazine have to add a column in their Axpona review last year that was on the worst sounding rooms? It's because a few of the internet reviewers already made those claims months earlier so they didn't want to look bad. BTW:a couple of those rooms had a couple hundred thousands of $$$ worth of equipment that this magazine just gave glowing reviews on the month before. 2) Most magazine reviewers rooms are terrible, no acoustic treatment, no special speaker positioning because of tight quarters, and even 1 magazine reviewers positioned the equipment in the corner because of space issues. Most don't even have dedicated rooms. 3) The OP claims the YT reviewers get paid for each review. Really, you know that for a fact? Can you say the same about a magazine review? How about selling ad space? How about giving the reviewer huge discounts for the gear if they want to purchase it? Aren't these incentives? Would a manufacturer keep buying ad space if they keep getting negative reviews? Maybe their is a coincidence why there are no negative reviews. In all other magazine reviews of other products: cars, stoves, refrigerators, you name it, there is only 1 product that is the best, the others come in 2nd, 3rd, on down. Never will you see this in a magazine review. What ever product they are reviewing, its the best of the best.
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Well for starters YouTube reviews are more about the reviewer then the equipment as always, but that’s Entertainment so it shouldn’t surprise you and hopefully not bother you. As for the equipment they choose to review, and the overwhelming positive opinions they have on products, yes they do slant mostly positive and keep them in good graces with manufacturers and garner views. Again it’s no mystery. But yeah room treatments is a big deal, I feel that if you don’t have a treated room then it kind of defeats the purpose of what you’re doing. But then again maybe some people want the more everyday man YouTube reviewer to give them product suggestions. And again there’s reviewers who do just that. I enjoy YouTube reviewers rather then other junk I could be watching. |
Some youtubers do give useful technical information. You just need to listen to them selectively. Audiophiles are not blind. If the youtuber raves something that is not really up to expectation and misleads people to make wrong buying decision, the user feedback will show. I always take their reviews with a grain of salt, cross check them with others and couple with the demo listening (good quality one) to verify their statement. So far, I have been lucky. Except two entry-level DACs that I need to resell to upgrade to higher end products, all the purchases based on the on-line reviews and Stereophile are pretty satisfactory. Trust me, their reviews / recommendations, if quality ones, are much more informative and reliable than a few sentences' write-up from forumers. |
It seems most people will never get that audio is not about the gear pieces but about how to learn to listen... Yes must learn to listen not only to sounds which is acoustic basics but also to music,classical,jazz,world; and no, our "tastes" must be educated by ourself not by reviewers...
«I like my meal well rotten for a month , it is question of taste»-- Anonymus crocodile |
FWIW, here is the list of the on-line reviewers ordered by the number of subscribers. It does not suggest the quality of contents they have presented but give you some idea on their popularity. The ones highlighted are those I listen periodically. Some of their verbal description of the gears' sound traits they review are spot on. Some often gave measurements and how that entails to the actual sound. Some gave rather technical details to the components under the hood. I appreciate the time and effort they have put together for each show.
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I think it's profoundly sad that YouTube reviewers fail to really discuss the merits of the quality audio gear they may be reviewing. What makes audio gear better than others. There a profound differences between audio gear pieces it would be nice to learn more about this. For example, jays listening room YouTube channel probably has the most expensive gear of all the YouTube channels and yet all he does is set it up in his room and we're supposed to be awestruck. He doesn't discuss the merits of the gear and why it might be better and I don't even think he understands technical aspect of what he's got. He's not alone. It's profoundly sad the level of expertise that's out there that only finds its way onto this forum. Which is a great thing, although, Many of the posters herein are exceptionally bright people and they should consider doing some YouTube channels to explain things. |
There is a channel called the audio analyst, and this guy has got to be the best technician I've ever heard. He's a really smart guy and a superb reviewer of high-end high-quality components. He really seems to know what he's talking about. By listening to him, you truly appreciate how complex audio issues are. He does a great job and is very gifted at explaining things. A very credible individual. Yet mysteriously he doesn't have a large following versus the rest of the audio YouTube channels. |
When you are in awe with your own system , you dont need entertainment, you listen music for the first time in your life , nobody has ever experienced it save me ? i dont read audio review anymore except sometimes one recommended here , by curiosity, because i love people here and what they recommend , thats all... The last one i really read and study was Dr.Choueri BACCH filters acoustic revolution... There is nothing else to read for me... All the rest is marketing, honest one , at best ... But i dont need to upgrade ...Then ... I read my friends here and i listen music... |
I’ve been watching audio related YouTube reviewers for the last 6 years. Honestly it was Paul McGowan that I started watching and over the years, I’ve subscribed to all on the above list and even personally (and virtually) got to know some of them. Then I took a crack at creating content on YouTube 4 years ago. I am not a reviewer and clearly state it on my channel. I don’t believe in all the flowery Harry Pearson Audio Adjectives. But I have my very crude & lude way of scaling equipment on how it sounds, and my excitement of either owning, or being loaned certain gear. Ron Brenay was a big help to me and more importantly Randy. While I don’t agree with 90% of his YT content or Steve Guttenburg for that matter. I still watch both like a crack addict waiting for my weekly/daily fix. My channel is small but the others on the list work hard at maintaining content and even making a living. I think they should be paid to do reviews IMHO. It’s a lot of work and getting greased to do it is a good thing provided they aren’t being positive about some or all aspects of the gear they review. I’ve had one pair of Speakers that cost $6k that I had a hard time dialing in without adding some miniDSP to fix room interactions between the Speakers and my room (both to blame actually). I had a Tube Integrated that wasn’t up to snuff and actually had some IP issues so I killed that review. As much of an Orchard Audio fanboy that I am. I blew up 2 pairs of the little StarKrimson’s that came out 4 years ago. I was not a happy camper and mentioned it in one of my Video’s. Then the Ultra came out, everything wrong about the previous Amp was fixed plus double output and Tons of protection. I was pissed but then I bought 5 Ultra modules and powered them with Toroidal + beefy filter caps. Old School meets New School. I’m a PS Audio Fanboy and that’s purely Paul McGowan’s fault. Andrew is #1 for a reason and I like Kristie & his style of reviewing. YouTube & Social Media in general is how one sells equipment nowadays with in home trials and online sales. There are good brick & morter stores around but everything I’ve bought is gently used because I couldn't afford these items bought at a Dealer or online. I still subscribe to Stereophool , Sound & Vision, & The Absolute Sound. delivered to my Zinio account. I miss Audio Magazine, Stereo Review, Sound & Vision (Canada), Audio Ideas Guide, & UHF. I subscribe to HiPig, Darko’s mag., SECRETS of Home Theater and High Fidelity, & Soundstage Network.
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If you look at a lot of youtube reviewers, you quickly find out who knows what they are talking about and whether they offer any worthwhile advice. Here is what I think -
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I have watched few utubers. I found it somewhat unproductive relative to the time dedicated to it. But I can understand why it's attractive to some and for them I would suggest that they not abandon 'critical analysis' when watching. I think that like the magazines, much of what they convey which might be negative is opaque. What I missed most was a lack of meaningful context. |
I wrote "gear pieces" not gear prices...
And because i dont focus on selling gear pieces i will never create a youtube channel... I am interested by music ... Sound is my past history... I already created my room and after that my headphone system... I dont want nor need to focus on gear... It is marketing not acoustic...
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I would really like to know how they make money when they only have a few thousand views per video. One youTuber says he bought a $350, 000 Wilson, which he probably showcases, along with a lot of other extremely expensive gear And then he’s begging people to subscribe and become a paid member I guess. He’s not actually selling gear although he has a website. Are these guys really operating in positive cash flow environment? Doesn’t make any sense. |
Like many here I enjoy Paul McGowan, Darko, Thomas & Stereo (despite the Chifi hype). Here's one that pisses most people here off: OCDHiFiGuy He's more than irritating and may be bipolar but he has said some really profound things that turned out to be true. His bashing the ARC Ref 750 hit a nerve! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PR-ry-DFdeo I have learned a LOT form OCD Mikey. Ditto Paul McGowan |
“It seems most people will never get that audio is not about the gear pieces but about how to learn to listen...”. IMO, if you know how to listen, you would know that the better equipment makes a bigger difference in sound quality! It’s like taking a Honda accord to the racetrack. Even if you are the best driver in the world, you will not beat a rookie in a F1 car. If you have a pioneer receiver, I don’t care how you listen, the sound quality will be crap. If you truly know how to listen, you will hear differences in cables, room treatment, different price ranges of amps, dacs, preamps, etc… But hey, if you can’t hear the difference between entry level equipment and the better higher end equipment, that’s cool, you just saved yourself some money. Me, I’ll spend the money on better equipment to get the best sq I can for the money invested, same goes for cars, homes, appliances, we’ll just everything
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Caveat emptor, let the buyer be ware. One guy I saw is partnering with manufacturers. No bias here folks, move along. It runs the gambit. Some have decades of experience, Guttenberg for instance, but he likes just about everything. Vandersteen 2's are dull/warm as hell, he loves em, Zu speakers are super detailed from what I hear, he loves them. Him loving anything tells me very little. My opinion, if you don't know my prejudices, is completely worthless to you. I Holtz and Cordsman(sp?) were the only 2 reviewers I used to pay attention to. Others may be even better, but how do I know that? It's a crap shoot. Heck, even if you and X agree on everything, whose to say that X won't change what he is looking for? Did he move from a castle to a former funeral home with heavily passed floors? Or got into economic trouble and started taking bribes? Sorry, I wish it wasn't so. |
You get it completely in reverse... 😊 we must LEARN how to listen.... Nobody is born with it ... Ask to an acoustician and to a musician.. Then when we had learned how to listen and we perceive acoustic aspects of the sound experience , then , only then , are we able to make the most of a receiver or of an high end costly piece... Anybody can hear didfferences, what we must learn is how to make this perceived differences meaningful and useful in the embeddings process of an audio system.. And how do you know a component sound better ? is it because of his price tag or is it because you are trained well enough to embed it in the right electrical,mechanical and acoustical conditions ? I call that learning how to listen... It does not matter if you use a Pioneer receiver or the Ferrari of amplifier instead , you will be able to get the best of what you have and never be frustrated ... Thats was my point and you dont figured it out... 😊 Money dont create audiophile experience, acoustic may do it and did...learn it to know what the audiophile vocabulary means at least... And acoustic is not buying bass traps or ready made panels by the way...It is a bit more... 😁
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Honestly, it's 99.9% crap but in that 0.1% you find the gems or at least someone with the same tastes as you. Just today I ran across a video of restoring a not particularly audiophile product but when he took the cover off, I thought, you know, a not bad slim amplifier, and went through his procedures to bring it up to speed in a smart, concise way. I enjoyed it immensely. |
Reviewers sell... Their usefulness is delivering official specs, appearence and details about the products... Their opinion generally have no value...Those honest dont accept to write about a product they dont like... And they speak about all products they dont dislike in a neutral way generally... Imagine one of them writing a review about a product of a young company and imagine he destruct it in his review.... What could be the consequences ? This does not happen often and there is a reason why : responsability... The opposite is possible and way more frequent , the worst product i ever listened to was a product i bought 10 years ago after reading a positive review of this horrible headphone amplifier... What could i write if i was a reviewer ? Nothing i would have never write anything about this junk... Imagine the responsability if i do write a destructive review corresponding to my impression ... I will never wrote the review but i bought this product because a reviewer wrote very positively about it... My friend bought it too... We sold it on the spot after few minute listenings and laughing about our credulity in reading reviews ... 😊
Experienced owners reviews matter way more ....They had skin in the game... They paid the product and dont borrow it to sell it with their words... All relatively low cost products i bought after pro reviewers opinions were an error i regretted... All products i bought after inquiring their many owners opinions on the net or informal reviews i never regretted...I statiscally compared them to make my mind... I bought my best components this way... No regrets ever... Only pure joy ...
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what i can say is i will never trust a you tube reviewer i will go to a dealer or trade show at least before i buy a speaker again
these kind of purchases are highly subjective so when Ron at new record day recommended a open baffle loudspeaker i decided to give them a chance luckily they had a return policy at my expense i might add the speakers were so bad i couldn't believe it anyhow i learned a valuable lesson after that |
I dont pay attention to reviewers... I dont need to upgrade... 😊 I dont even criticize them... They sell the gear... Sometimes they inform us well sometimes less... I like Steve Huff as a reviewer because he exhude honesty... And this video of him spoke truth... I know it is true because my 700 bucks system is high end in sound but not in pricing...😁 |
