When I listen to music that’s well recorded I listen on my big rig. When I’m in the mood to listen to really good music that’s not well recorded I enjoy it on a Bluetooth speaker or with my earbuds and therein lies the peace. I refuse to “dumb down” my big system to sugarcoat poorly recorded material and much prefer using the playback system commensurate with the level of the recording, but that’s me.
Wasted Years.
When I think of all the years I wasted listening for sound rather than music I am totally chagrined . After a very long period of placing the quality of my stereo above the beauty of music I’ve finally come around to what I started listening to music for in the first place. It’s especially a source of embarrassment for me since I spent the first few decades of my life as a musician!
My quest for getting better sound actually replaced my quest for the greater appreciation of my art.
What a pleasure it now is to search for things to play based on what I really love rather than picking out something because I want to hear how it sounds. What an empty pursuit that is for me!
It actually took many of my (and others’) postings on this forum to achieve this state of mind.
Now I appreciate all the work I put into the sound even more.
Nirvana!
38 responses Add your response
Setting up a really well matched second system has made me enjoy music more than ever. I feel no need to upgrade like in the past. It gives me 80% of my main system and at the same time let's me appreciate my main system even more. I just set up a turntable in that room, it's more forgiving of records that aren't so great. That plus millions of songs at my fingertips has really made me enjoy the music and not think so much about hardware. |
@oddiofyl A corollary of that, at least for me, is that I’m finding a ton of great new music that’s also very well recorded (and a lot of it in high res) — win win! |
I enjoy the music now as well. But in all honesty I really enjoyed the pursuit of better sound, even with its twists and turns. I assembled some great sounding systems. However... For me, it wasn’t just a shift in my mental focus... it was literally changing my system to be musically accurate instead of sonically striking. Over the period of about ten years I changed my objectives from hearing more detail, getting better bass, imaging, to correctly representing the music... so the details were as apparent and in proportion to what they are in real life. Also getting the rhythm and pace and natural midrange bloom. Step by step (component by component) as I did this my focus moved my attention from the system to the music. It isn’t dumbing the system down at all, the details are still there. It is getting the gestalt and details right in perfect proportions. It is a step further than a system that presents all the details and has great slam. It is absolutely not about shear details. For instance, there is a current thread about hearing the squeak in the drum kit on a recording. It is the glee in this kind of pursuit that obscures what most of us really want. If I listen to the recording could I hear the squeak? Sure, I have a great system. But if you are listening intently to hear that... you’re probably completely missing the point. It is a distraction. With my system now, I find it hard to listen to the system... the music is so compelling. I mean, if I try to listen to some characteristic... it only last a few seconds until I am distracted and lured into the music. My focus is drawn to the music... no mental direction is needed. To me, this is what a great system does... not what the big rig Wilson, Rowland, Burmeister dCS. Those are technical feats of amazing sound. |
I really enjoy utilizing great equipment to get the best possible sound into my earballs and quickly dispense with any gear that turns out to not do that. I'm an old musician and I also like excellent guitars and amps, but in the case of that stuff I'm forced to provide the music part myself which is a lot of pressure (and you need to keep yer chops up). I've always been well into the music part of audio as that's pretty much the point...listening to the gear without the music part is simply less interesting unless silence is what your'e after. |
I’ve done a similar thing with listening to my system for years and slowly losing interest in the music. I got to the point I would not buy music unless it was perfectly recorded etc. My system and the level of detail etc. was what I was looking for. Slowly I stopped listening to music, I’d go a week and only have listened to two or three records. Listening sessions went from hours to minutes etc. Recently I’ve sold off much of the hi dollar equipment and focused on musicality and engagement in my new equipment. I stopped chasing the big dollar items. This is at odds with the pursuit of the ultimate sound I was chasing, and many of my audio friends still are. But the long and short of it I’m listening to more music again. Equipment that’s musically engaging with emotional response is king now, not how much it cost or the newest thing /version on the block. I’ve stopped worrying about detail and looking for engagement and musicality. Was a hard step but when you realise the chase for ultimate detail etc. is a chase in the wrong direction you soon move back to all the music you’ve missed. I know some are still engaged in the hi detail systems but I find it tiresome long term. |
I think we tend to look for sophisticated sounding ways to express the simple fact that it’s a matter of delivering sound to your ears in a way that you find the most enjoyable. That’s different for everybody, and sometimes the descriptions can be a bit condescending, forgetting that it is different for everybody. For me, I want to hear what is on the recording and I don’t want it distorted or mellowed or artificial. But then again, I like my coffee black while other others take it with cream and sugar. Who’s right and who’s wrong? We all are if we have what we like. I think I finally got there with my system after realizing that I could do better than the compromises I accepted. I love my system, it gets me over the line, but it may not do it for you. Nothing wrong with that. I don’t worry about what the artist intended because I don’t know the artist. I don’t worry about trying to replicate a live performance because that’s impossible with reproduced music through electronic components. I just worry about the sound that brings me the most enjoyment. Sounds like that’s where the OP is now and that’s the right place. |
I know what you mean. And yet this came to mind. “When I think back on all the crap I learned in high school When the music transports you, uplifts you that’s the real deal Copacetic daddyoh.
|
It's about the music first. Proof is it has been many years since I listened to all the so called reference albums. I simply got sick of hearing the same beautifully recorded music over and over. Instead I spend my time discovering music, new and old, that I never heard. And it doesn't hurt when it is well recorded. Streaming has made this complete switch in my listening habits possible. |
When I first got into higher-quality audio equipment 5.5 years ago, it was after my last girlfriend broke up with me and I decided to invest in more expensive and physically intrusive audio equipment that my gf likely would not have wanted. So, free of interference, I started looking about. I joined this audio community to try to get a better bearing on what was out there. What a shock and revelation. I had no idea that the range of audiophiles would stretch from people like me, just wanting an upgrade, to people that spend more on a cable than I did for all my equipment! 😳. I thought “Is this the place? What am I getting myself into?” I initially posted more here, adding my observations and asking questions. I eventually decided that Audiogon is good for its entertainment value, but I have little to add here that is of value. I still come to read, but I seldom post because — what’s the use? A lot of members here have experience with equipment I have never heard of, let alone heard. I used to want to post my suggestions when someone asked for recommendations for a new, upgrade piece of equipment. But I learned I’m in the dark on these things. I don’t have any relevant knowledge compared to others, and I likely never will. But I do notice that Mahgeister has very modest equipment and has still amassed over 13,000 posts! Maybe there is hope for me after all?
|
Often the learning process takes longer than we'd like. Sometimes waaaay longer...but on the flip side, those tend to be the lessons we REALLY learn. It's part of the process nonetheless, so I'd hesitate to call it "wasted" time. This hobby shoehorns many disparate pursuits into one box: musical appreciation, music library building, system building, community building & participation, wife/girlfriend management, technical know-how, gear lust, budgeting (or lack of), and the addictive dopamine hits from new acquisitions. It can definitely be hard to find a good balance here! |
Started upgrading my system shortly after I started on Audiogon (coincidence?). Over 25 years later now, I sometimes sit back and ask myself, "what rainbow are you still chasing?" The vast variety of new music available through the addition of digital streaming has been a great impetus for me to refocus on the music instead of the gear. The only meaningful changes to my system in the past 5 years have been in the digital realm, which is not surprising. |
The same could be said for many pursuits in life. It's certainly true of the arts.
|
I don't consider any of my past audio endeavors as wasted, it was like a survey course in that I had to learn and experience different presentations to come to a preferred presentation. I've found once you get to a 'certain' level of resolution/ transparency that never fails to engage its all a matter of presentation.
The greatest angst I felt was the years spent in attempting to reach a level of resolution/transparency that was always engaging. This was a real slog in that while I'd at times realize my goals here there was often only temporary bliss. For me there were no short cuts, much time, effort, expenditures, fine tuning, butt in the end I've reached my goal whereas every listening session is a totally immersive, engaging musical experience.
And I'm still not done, I'm now enjoying various presentations via relatively easy rotation of a couple dacs, three amps and two preamps in various permutations. And I"m planning on adding at least one more amp to the brigade, this all great enjoyment for both the audiophile and music lover in me. |
I was lucky enough with a very low budget to be in the obligation to learn the basics instead of "buying" my pleasure from always costlier upgrades... The most difficult part in term of gear : Almost all low cost dac had no timbre naturalness...The last one i bought is in the trash bin ... It cost me 150 Us. I stick to my SPS TDA 1543... To upgrade it will cost me the price of my actual system..(1000 bucks) Anyway i am pleased with it... A simple rule is to keep design gear value proportionate ...You dont buy 1000 bucks cable for active low cost speakers... I upgraded my active speakers cable anyway (35 Us ) and it was very well done and very audible... There is no wasted years only wasted money...
|
With age, taste (in music) also changes, and so do our listening habits. I find it funny that we are discussing this. Each of us came to this site for a reason. While music is our primary driver, I am an audiophile because I would like to listen to the music I love, in highest quality I can afford. If not, I would have purchased a Bluetooth soundbar and be happy. No wasted years for me; just building my experience for future and what is possible. Wonder if we can ask an AI agent to find the % of threads here that discuss equipment Vs music. |
Continues to baffle me how audiophiles seem to want to deny they are in fact audiophiles. I know I'm going to repeat myself. But why on earth would I want to deny I listen to the sound quality or qualities produced by this system I spent so much effort and funds to amass? I absolutely notice and admire very certain and specific sonic presentations offered by various recordings. And I also experience the same sensations with the wide variability of presentations I can achieve by mixing and matching my various amps pre's, dacs. I can both chew gum and walk simultaneously, why should I deny myself the pleasures of sonic excellence. |
This thread made me think of a couple of Mark Twain quotes which are. "Good decisions come from experience. Experience comes from making bad decisions" and the second one, "it ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so". I thought these were relevant. Enjoy the music |
A solid system should be able to make the music come to life and I agree that musicality and realism should be more important than things like resolution and perfect playback. I've also found myself in the trap of listening just for sound purposes. It is part of our minds getting into habits when we are auditioning gear and trying to find what sounds the best. Best advice I can give you, which I give to myself, is if you find yourself listening more to the sound than the music, take a deep breath in and out while trying to focus on nothing but the music itself. Then do that again. If you get distracted, let that thought pass and continue to breath and listen to the heart and soul of the music, stretching your mind into it until you become totally entranced. This can be done at any point during one's audiophile journey. Breathe and let the music speak. |
Agree - there is this nasty trope that enjoying hifi gear and pursuit of elevated sound quality is somehow inferior to and less virtuous than "pure" music listening & the pursuit of large music collections (frankly it gets obonoxious to browse / search past a certain point). And also, that the former somehow precludes (partially or wholly) the latter. It’s not true at all. I proudly enjoy both. My other least favorite corollary of this is the implication that you’re some kind of rube if your gear collection totals more $ than your music collection. What?! |
There is successful audiophiles and obsessed audiophiles... If you had learned how to optimize a chosen synergetical system in a room for your ears you are a successful one.. If you are more obsessed by the gear design pieces and price and goes around in a wheel of purchase, you are an obsessed audiophile... I am a successful audiophile...( my limited budget helped me here putting me in the obligation to learn more than purchase ) i enjoy what i had optimized successfully ... (a low cost system but give me the money i will optimize a costlier one; but we have all our needs, budget, room limitation) What matter is knowing how to optimize any system at any price ... Acoustics is the root ...(not mere room acoustic but acoustics with an "s" ) Acoustician are always successful audiophile... Gear obsessed people generally dont use acoustics concepts and experiments... The objectivist use electrical specs, the subjectivist use "gear tasting", the two groups are focussed on the gear...
|
While I largely agree with your post, I’m skeptical that acoustics expertise and an affinity for high-end gear are mutually exclusive. I like gear. I appreciate rigorous engineering and elegant electronic design, I see beauty in impeccably laid out PCBs, in spotless soldering, in the tactile feel of an otherwise alarmingly expensive analog volume control, in aesthetically pleasing industrial design, in the heft of a massively well-built component, in how precisely components and panels fit together, even in a designer’s electing to eschew ICs in favor of rows of discrete semiconductors. I hope to learn more about acoustics, but until then I agree with you that merely throwing money at an audio system is counterproductive and gauche. |
Acoustics concepts are necessary to understand what we hear and how... It is never exlusive from Gear design expertise at any price... My point is people underestimated acoustics versus gear design... Price dont matter, what matter is what can we do to optimize any system at any price ... How can you decide what is best if we dont unbderstand the acoustics concepts of Timbre for example or the acoustics concepts related to spatial sound many attributes and how to use the associated parameters? Most decide by purchasing costlier components to change the place of hurt...They dont study sound parameters with what they already own...Marketing conditioned the mind not sciencve and experiments.. Anyway we are on the same opinion :
|
@rvpiano nothing wrong with wanting the best sq of your favorite music. For me, it was always about the music, 1st. and foremost. It is a shame how many listeners choose not to listen to music unless it is recorded well. Musicians doing their thing, to compositions created by them. This is the beauty of music listening. Enjoy my friend and stay well. Always, MrD. |