Two defective pieces in a row - unreasonable to demand refund?

I think third time's the charm😉

After the 2nd defective unit, I would have demanded a refund, and contacted the cc company.   No refund policy on your hard earned money is bullkaka. 
 Run away and get a better unit.

  Ayre, McCormack, NAD, parasound ETC!

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lisaaea6-mcintosh-ma-8900-solid-state?creative=305983658573&gclid=CjwKCAjwlYCHBhAQEiwA4K21m_6P2ZrDTSNN-Ywc-yTripOd8YKjaj1j6bTgygcRkveHDzV2FxTBBBoCt2EQAvD_BwE&keyword=

here is one that looks excellent and evidently works...

Digital Mac's don't hold value. Sure get a 3rd, you must be looking for punishment.

I would have the dealer get a third one but I would make it clear, third strike and I'm out. I would talk to him first and then I would text or email him a summary of your conversation. Start out with "as we discussed...."

Macs really hold their value. Id try to get compensated someway and take the third unit conditionally.

You bought other products from this dealer and they won’t accept the refund after two defective units? Wow.

You should have an accomplice walk into the dealer pretending to be interested in some Macintosh equipment but they are hesitant because they read this thread.

In an age where many audiophiles buy used equipment and don’t buy new from a dealer, they should be bending over backwards for you. Especially considering that you’re a loyal customer.

Ohh I just now see his issue was resolved. Hope my above post is logged in as a alternative method of working out simple solutions. 
Compromise. This is the key.

rsf5071,111 posts03-26-2021 12:55pmGet a refund NOW!

~~~~~~~~
Well not so fast
Best way to handle this is via compromise
Anytime i make a  electronic purchase off ebay, tubes , cdp's etc etc, I always tell the seller just takea   20% restock fee, 
Even if he has a  30 day refund guarantee
We all have to be fair around here.
Yeah I know 20% is a chunck of change ona  big amp.
So lets say 15%, 
10% is too low.
OK 15% + buyer pays return shipping.
well maybe 10% + shipping. 
This is fair N square. 
Lets not start a war over a  few hundred bucks. 
Just move on.....

Glad you got a good one in the end. But, three McIntosh amps to find a good one?

batting .333 gets you into the hall of fame in baseball

but maybe not with expensive hifi gear with green lights and meters???  😆😆😆

I listened to some of the newer Mc gear recently and thought it was quite good.   I have owned McIntosh in the past and it never failed me.   Good stuff that can always be serviced.

You are a forgiving person after the second one I would be done.

Happy ending. But I must admit I probably would walk right out of a dealer that has a policy of no refunds when I am buying stuff over $7K. The whole point of going to a dealer is service and making sure you are happy. I have no doubt that my dealer would happily refund the money for something I bought if I wasn’t happy and needed to go somewhere else to get something. Number one trait I want in a dealer is integrity… and “I got your money… now you are screwed…” or even the uncertainty of not knowing isn’t in my definition of integrity.

Glad you got a good one in the end. But, three McIntosh amps to find a good one?  https://youtu.be/1fybwCGjNUc?t=41

Update:

Finally up and running with a spotless and functional unit. Chalk my problems up to bad luck, or COVID, or whatever. McIntosh and dealer took care of me with no hassle. Easy to forgive problems when the manufacturer (and dealer) makes it right without skipping a beat. No regrets, sounds amazing. Bottom line, I would advise anyone who reads this thread in the future not to be scared off McIntosh because my experience. It is true that I had to go through multiple units till they got it right, but they got it right and didn't give me any grief, which counts for a lot in my book.

I don't know why this thread goes on and on with suggestions. OP already said long ago that the is ordering a third unit. Enough already.

Many years ago I was scheduled to fly into Detroit.  The day before my flight I received a call from a teammate asking if I had seen the news.  It turns out the flight I was scheduled for the next day crashed.  When I said I would see them the next day they asked if was nuts... to which I replied,  what were the odds of the same flight crashing two days in a row.

Anyway, what are the odds of having another issue with the 3rd unit?  I'd be chill and let the dealer and Mac get you sorted out.  

I would not unpack it at the dealer unless they were willing to repack it.  I might ask them to deliver it and make sure it works at your house.

I had McIntosh in the 70s.  It was often broken. It might have been worth it for me back then because I didn’t have a lot of options.  
Adrays wouldn’t even carry them because Mac’s QC was so poor it cost them too much.  My guy at Adrays referred to the brand as McIntrash.  It hurt my feelings but well, it’s something that you might have to resign yourself to.  Like owning a BMW - you might or might not get one that needs a lot of costly repairs - but either way you might have fun with it.  
These days I think other far less expensive stuff sounds as good or better.  YMMV.  I’m not all that experienced and perhaps that amp sounds better to you than anything else but as far as the return question goes there is no question that if you do want one they have to give it to you.  

You’re gonna have to order from someone. I would say third times a charm. I’ve been buying used Max for years and I’ve only had one problem with broken glass. I love their stuff and nothing holes or value as good as a Mcintosh. Give them a third chance see if they’ll upgrade you to even a better unit because that has such bad luck

1 was damaged. 1 doesn’t work. Get the third one. Really only 1 was doa. This happens. If the next one is doa, I’d demand a refund. 

The stereo Gods are telling you something.....listen,

Take the 3'rd lets face it, it's most likely not either the manufacturer or dealers fault its most likely the shipping company's that it failed on delivery. I'm sure Mac tries every piece they build so most likely its a shipping issue. there's thousands of reliable mac's out there from decades of use. so I'd not worry about the two issues they are not related anyway. also they are responsive and taking care of your issue with out delay I'd say that also has merit. 

A local merchant's policy might not be able to usurp local laws. between credit card protections and local governance, you might have options. 

@audiodwebe

You are. Store policies aren't laws. If I don't receive what I paid for they can't just keep my money. Hence my question whether it would be unreasonable to demand a refund, meaning not simply request, but insist in lieu of filing a chargeback. As someone else mentioned, no return policies are generally meant to prevent tire kickers, not to shaft established clients. Exceptions to every rule etc. etc.

You stated in your original post the store has a no refund policy.

I don't understand your question.

Am I missing something?

@lostark

Shipping will always have an impact no matter how it is boxes up.  When I was looking at a company to make our shipping boxes (same people who make the Peloton bike foam) he told me something very interesting - a box is made to ship from point a to point b and not to be used to return an item. The shock of dropping a box can cause damage that you cannot see.  I shipped an item where the transformer actually came loose and did quite a lot of damage inside the unit.  I  reshipped a CEC CDP - the box arrived in perfect condition but the actual spindle inside the unit was dislodged and was jammed under the transport area.  The remote had a dent by one of the tracking buttons with no other marks.  Go Figure.

It’s unfortunate that you received 2 bad units, but it happens. All my McIntosh units were purchased second hand from Audio Classics and after 50+ years of being on the audio merry go round, I am done.  It sounds like the first unit after it was QC was improperly packed and the person who packs the unit probably missed the bottom spacer the screw goes through to bolt the amp to the plywood base.  It can happen. 

The second unit most likely has a ribbon cable from the front panel loose and needs re-seating.  It happened on my C2500 preamp. I was going to ship it back until AC told me what to look for.  It took me less than 5 minutes to remove the 6 top screws and reseat the cable.  Saved me a trip back to Vestal, NY.  

You were wise in getting a third unit.   Doubtful the dealer will give you the DAC2 module as it is around $1500.00 or more.  That would take all his profit away from the sale of the amp.  It really isn’t their fault for the poorly packaged unit and non working unit.  When you get the new amp, have the dealer unbox in front of you and have them hook it up to be sure it is ok.  Once you know it is good, you will have a amp that will last a few lifetimes. 

To the person who recommended you return the Mac and buy from Klaus at Odyssey, I need to chuckle. I owned Odyssey prior to Mac and there is absolutely no comparison.  As good as the Odyssey equipment is, the Mac is light years better.  Once you are up and running, let us know how it worked out.  3rd time should be the charm. 

@yogiboy

I bought speakers to match this unit (many hours of auditioning), so after my initial frustration subsided (I wrote my post just minutes after finding my 2nd unit was DOA in order to get unbiased advice) I decided it's less of a pain to just wait for a 3rd unit than start start from square one trying to find a good pairing. I do really love the way the speakers sounded when paired with this unit and that's the whole point it no? 

@audioman58

Sorry, maybe I was unclear, the units were shipped to my dealer from Binghamton and I picked them up from the dealer.

@hobo1452

I beg your pardon?

Aggravating, worrisome, but, I agree, let them get you a NEW (not fixed) unit, even if you have to wait.

Go in writing, if the 3rd unit has any problem, you want a full refund, not store credit.

I would send a copy of that, and the prior problems to McIntosh also, so it is on record.

My SS McIntosh, mc2250, made in 1986, is still ’perfect’ after 35 years, I sent it to McIntosh for factory once over, they replaced one led lamp, that’s it.

Usually their stuff is like boat anchors, the biggest problem I had was a torn meniscus from lifting it (80 lbs) from a bottom shelf in a cramped space.

my mx110z, made around 1967, 55 years old, plug and play, sounds fabulous. I cleaned all controls with contact cleaner, noise free, IOW, these things are normally very long lived.
..................................

When you think about it, they ought to give you a reduction in price for your trouble. Like a car dealership, the Manufacturer is the one who pays for warranty work, the dealer makes money on warranty work. The dealer could request a price reduction on your behalf. If me, I would get it ordered first, then before it arrives, ask them to ask McIntosh for a cost reduction.

Best of luck, hope it sounds great, and your memory fades quickly.

You might call Klaus at Odyssey Audio ... I have one of its preamps exceeding craftsmanship

No refund policies are designed to discourage tire kickers, not to penalize a repeat customer with a legitimate issue/claim.  Talk to your dealer and simply tell him you have lost confidence in the manufacture to provide a reliable product. 

The aroma of aquatic life is strong with this one.

3rd unit...

" McIntosh said they would replace it again but I’m frankly done, just want my money back at this point."

Why the complete turnaround?

If it were shipped to you ,your dealer is not local.  Ship it back
as soon as it is delivered ,file a claim with your credit card company 
if the dealers refuses to give your money back ,or tell them give you a $10% refund for all your trouble. If you except a 3 rd unit . I would just ship it. Back 
call credit card company with tracking , they should give you the credit back 
after you file a dispute all the time and effort wasted . It’s totally on McIntosh.
there is no excuses  .Coda for example soak test each product48 hours then 
do a final bias and inspection before it ships ,10 year warranty parts and labor,
and the 1st year if any fault they will pay freight up and back,that is excellent service.

If you bought the item using a credit card you may have recourse by explaining the return and disputing the charge.

@hobo1452

There's no way it was damaged in transit, as I've said repeatedly. Believe it or don't. My dealer isn't just authorized, they are McIntosh "platinum" tier dealer. No reason for me to name them because I'm not having a problem with them, and even if I were, I wouldn't name or shame unless I was getting shafted, which I'm not. In both instances when I called Mc they said take it back to the dealer for a replacement. By the way, I haven't said a bad word about Mc either, just stated facts. Can't fault the customer service I've received so far, which was reassuring enough for me to go for the 3rd unit. Why would I do that if I had some kind of anti-Mc agenda? 

Still waiting for the name of the "reputable dealer". Do you really expect us to believe that McIntosh would authorize a dealer that had a "no return" policy? 

You ever wonder why you don't see McIntosh sold all over the internet? It's because they have a reputation to maintain. They won't let just any Mom And Pop outfit sell their product. They only use vendors who will back their guarantee 100%. McIntosh is a quality and reputation oriented company. They didn't stay in business for 75 years by screwing people, and they damn sure wouldn't  sacrifice their reputation because of a pandemic, they would explain why they are taking longer to ship. If your package was damaged during transit, that's not on McIntosh. Tell us the name of the place you got your bargain basement items from, then maybe we have something to work with.

@hobo1452

Bought from a reputable local dealer I've been working with for years. Brand new units with McIntosh security tape on inner and outer boxes, freight label addressed to the dealer with a Binghamton return address. I'm brand agnostic, so however troubling it may be if you're a Mc fan, the fact is I did get two bad units in a row, straight from Binghamton. 

The outer box of the 1st unit was pristine, no signs of mishandling. Nothing was loose in the inner box. Implausible to me that the damage could have happened in transit, it almost certainly slipped passed QC or occurred while it was being packed. I realize this could have happened to any mfg, but I've never seen a 1/2" gouge to bare metal on any other $$$$ gear I've unboxed. As for DOA gear, this is the first time I've experienced it. I think the production backlog at Mc might be to blame for QC rush jobs, that or I'm just having a streak of bad luck. I don't mind if they'd just take their sweet time putting together a unit for me that is spotless and works.

Regardless  of what the Mac haters are trying to shove down your throat, McIntosh is still a reputable company.  McIntosh wouldn't still be recognized as one of the foremost purveyors of high end audio eqiupment if they had suddenly and mysteriously decided to sell their reputation to some fly by night company. Considering the fact that McIntosh QC checks every single finished unit they manufacture for both blemishes and proper operation before shipping, and since you didn't bother to name the vendor, the odds are most likely that you chose to buy your Mac from some shady dealer who offered a bargain basement price. and you fell for it. You learned the hard way that if the price is too good to be true, it most definitely is a scam.

Really, it is not the dealers fault and probably not McIntosh's fault. I ship items all the time.  Had my packing materials made by the company that does the Peloton exercise bikes.  Once the shipping companies get a hold of them who knows what they do with them  I have had transformers come off the center bolt and knock around inside causing all types of damage.

It would different if you told me that each unit broke after a week or so with the same issue.

Happy Listening

 

Get a 3rd unit. This is totally unlike McIntosh. I've had an MA6100 I bought in 1976.  It will still outperform anything that Japan can put out today in its class. It's been in constant use since the day I took it home. Do this day, IT'S NEVER BEEN SERVICED. I also have a Mac 7082 tuner, and mcd 7000 cd player.  They have also never been serviced. I've been on the Binghamton company tour. It's unbelievable. STICK WITH MAC. I've been offered double what I paid for my 6100.but ill never sell it. 

Google ANY major company and you will get a litany of lawsuits and complaints filed against them. Including all audio brands.

This knee jerk reaction to jump all over McIntosh over something that has happened to EVERY BRAND on the planet says more about the nay-sayers than anything else.

And I'm with the person who said get the third unit. Cosmetic flaws are not manufacturing QC issue, but a transit issue. The DOA unit is legit, so let.them replace it.

If  Mac sounds good to YOUR ears, go with it. Any brand you pick can have issues. That's what warranties are for.

My two cents.

I'm with @millercarbon. Get out from under the Mac and get something reliable that performs better for less $$$. Lots of options in the marketplace, new and used. 

I bought a new C49 and the remote was missing from the box. They sent me a remote and tried the unit and the headphone jacked hummed, so I returned the unit for a refund! Completely turned me off to McIntosh.

McIntosh fort sure is not the same ,No longer owned by audiophiles for years now.I sold Mc and parts quality is average at best , nice meters , but Waay over priced . Owned by a Korean company with just $$ profits in mind IMO.

Much depends if you paid by debit card, or credit Cardas where the card is from 
I tried to get a refund on a defective product ,after it was sent back
and my bank wouldnot back me, horrible little crappy bank 
webster5 cent savings.  If bought buy credit card then file a claim 
tell them you have no faith and waste of time .
tell your dealer to hold off on sending anything .
since they have the product back. The ball is in your court .
if they ship it after you said no put a note on your door in big letters Return auto Sender then you will get your money back.