New buy, no return policy

thecarpathian,

Yes, I agree. I even thought about letting the dealer keep the $100 discount if I returned the item. But it was the dealer’s attitude that made me walk away. I’ll keep checking on the used market.

ozzy .

Are those speakers worth $48k, anyway ?

I would have gone with the full price option, if anything.

A $100 mistake is a lot easier to digest than a $1000 mistake.

Perhaps not a speaker, but I was very interested in an Audio Tweak that sells for $1100. The dealer offered a $100 discount but then would not grant return privileges.

So, the question is do I trust an unknown tweak for $1000 or pay full price to have the advantage of returning it for a refund if not impressed.

I chose to pass...

ozzy

I think the OP and the dealer both made the right move for themselves.  As detailed above there is much work and risk involved in doing an at home demo for expensive large loudspeakers.  The buyer had a less costly alternative with the option to return if he so decided.  Either party could be second guessed, but if they were to start over again I think they would still make the same decision.

Not everybody is going to get an at home demo.  The answer for a valued long term customers will be different than for just anybody walking in off the street. 

Most dealers don't have ultra expensive floor demonstration models from a company's lineup.  If they do, it is still a big deal to move that speaker into a prospective buyer's system for a home demonstration--the speaker has to be packed for moving, it has to be transported and then set up for a demonstration.  The dealer is out of a demonstration model for the duration of the audition, the speaker has to be re-packed and transported after the demonstration, and the dealer is at risk for any damage in the whole process.  If there is a charge for this, or some assurance that the "buyer" is not a tire-kicker, I can see this working better.  I know a dealer who went through all of this trouble to set up a home demonstration which did not result in a sale only to be shown an on-line discussion where it turns out that the "buyer" borrowed gear from all around the town, held an audio party where friends got to hear various fancy components and no one was seriously interested in buying the stuff.

With most of my purchases, I have been offered the opportunity to do a home demonstration or I had return privileges.  But, I had previously bought gear from these  dealers and they knew I would buy what I liked.  Once, when I was shopping for a high end linestage, the dealer offered to bring in models from two companies for which he did not already have the flagship models I wanted to hear.  On a handshake deal, he agreed to buy both for a demonstration if I promised to buy one of them.  I ended up liking the first model he got in, which I heard in my own system, and told him he did not have to buy the other model for a comparison. 

In this case apparently the dealer had a demo model on the floor that the OP was able to hear so there was no need to use new speakers for the OP to be able to hear them at home.  The dealer missed out on a $20k or so payday.  Good call. 🙄

I don't understand how a speaker has to be marked down so much once it's taken out of the box. I know "when you drive off a car from a dealer". But it's not a car. The difference between inside or outside the box is the tape. It has been plugged in and ran at the factory already. 

It's the same inside or outside the box. It has no damages, scratches, etc. same warranty. Maybe a few % mark down. 

Yes, I understand the dealer, I understand the buyer as well. And he is a small dealer, he can't afford it really. I simply would not think that if I were buying $48k speakers I would be entitled to free or almost free home audition, set up, huge gratitude and a bottle of 100 years old single molt. But again I would want to hear the speakers with electronics, cables and the source they would be used with. Now, taking heavy turntable anywhere would be a big pain, digital source no problem. But if I  still insisted on my own analogue source, I would buy reel to reel tape deck, say, Otari in good condition, make a few recordings off the vinyl and take the deck to the dealer. After that I would either keep the deck or sell it quickly with some loss perhaps. We are talking about very expensive system, so extra couple of thousands dollars should not be a problem. Sounds complicated, but if you want a great sound you got to work on it too !

     An honest dealer cannot take back a trial speaker and then sell it as new.  The cost of a returned item is high.  Most dealers don’t stock such expensive items so a return becomes a very expensive part of inventory that may take a very long time to sell, particularly if the item comes with a variety of colors/finishes.  There is also a risk that the item does not sell before a new model comes on the market.  
     Risk of damage in moving and setting up speakers for a home demonstration, particularly with large and heavy speakers is another disincentive for home trials.

Yeah, that would be ideal, your  own room and electronics. But if the dealer’s room is very similar  it might be alright. Besides, you might move to another room next year. Are you going to replace speakers each time you move your system?  My current speakers have played music in five quite different rooms and they have done it  well enough,, better in bigger rooms, I do mostly listen almost near field, though.

@inna 

I disagree!  $48K speakers?  I want to hear them in my own space.  That dealer made a...what's the markup?...$20K mistake?

@mintakax 

Sounds great! 

Ron 

@everyone--  Thanks for all the responses. Lots of wisdom and insight. 

@ronboco -- Lets get together, that sounds great! I'll reach out as soon as things are settled in. I look forward to hearing your system as well. -- Dan

@mintakax 

Congratulations on the Acoras ! I am only 15 minutes from you and would love to come over for a listen when you get them all set up! I’d love to have you over to my place for a listen as well! 
 

Regards 

Ron 

I’ve had a good experience buying from local dealers.  The only time they don’t allow returns is with used equipment or special deals.  If you’re getting a great price you’re taking a chance for the savings.  If you’re concerned I would buy from a dealer that will allow returns if necessary.  

Once you open the box and set them up in someone's house you lose 10k on that pair. I don't know how dealers are expected to eat that cost.  Tough business to be in.

" comparable electronics " does not have much meaning, even less when very expensive equipment is involved. $50k speakers should sound almost spectacular or why buy them ?

Anyway, hopefully that used pair will perform just fine for a long time.

I dissent. You should’ve brought your own source, electronics and cables to the dealer’s and listened. Had the dealer refused, yeah, walk away and never buy from him, regardless of price. If you can pay $48k for new speakers with full warranty why bother with used stuff? Still, the dealer might’ve made a mistake but so might’ve you. Interesting situation.

I'm not surprised the dealer relented, too bad for him being too late.

I've had similar conversations with dealers over "special orders" and my response is always the same. No 30 day demo, no sale. Most relented and some got a sale. I'm willing to pay shipping or a reasonable restock fee for the privilege. 

I travelled halfway around the country to listen to and check out a brand that only a few dealers sell. I made an appointment 4 days in advance.  I was ready to purchase it. 

When I arrived, sharp, the salesperson was busy with another customer. They told me to wait. I waited 45 minutes and then left.

I know the salespeople make their money from sales and I always feel for them when it doesn’t work out. 

Do not feel bad.  You more than did your part and they just refused to do theirs and got exactly what they deserved — nothing.  The arrogance of them in this day and age to not expend a little effort to sell a $48k pair of speakers for someone who was obviously a serious and likely buyer given you already loved the speakers is staggering to me.  Compare that to TMR who was willing to bring the speakers to you, help set them up, and take them back if they didn’t work out and all this while standing to make far less on the sale than your dealer would’ve made by selling you a new pair.  That’s just absurd and sad.  Hopefully the dealer learned a big lesson here and will rethink their archaic and lazy business policies going forward.  In any event, congrats on some great speakers and saving a bundle!

Congratulations 

I heard some of their speakers at CAF. Very nice.

The new speaker dealer did just reach out and offer to bring the new speakers to my house for a demo 

I really don't feel bad for that dealer you gave them a chance. I bet they saw this thread which is why they changed their tune. Again I know you made the wise decision. Good luck.

So, I did go with the pre-owned pair and the amount I saved is staggering.

Congrats, hope you  enjoy:) 
You did the right thing. I like to support good dealers (and have done my part there over the years), but the monetary discrepancy is often too great to justify buying new. And my local dealer just retired - 2 decades of relationship built up there - so it will be almost all used market for me, going forward. 

TMR is nice because they have the resources to ship the bigger stuff safely, for reasonable rates. They also get a lot of good stuff in - I’ve been finding far more "hits" there than on Audiogon, for years. 

So, I did go with the pre-owned pair and the amount I saved is staggering.

 The new speaker dealer did just reach out and offer to bring the new speakers to my house for a demo and if they were acceptable I could purchase that pair. At that point it was too late as I had already paid TMR. Probably best for me in the end.

I know the salespeople make their money from sales and I always feel for them when it doesn't work out. 

Getting a dealer to work with you is getting harder.

If you're able to listen to them in the store, will they not let you take them home for a home demo? If not i'd buy from somewhere else. Or get the used ones and save some money. Who cares about warenty on a used speaker. If it didnt break in the first few months its probably fine for decades. 

You live near TMR.... and they'll deliver and set up?     no brainer.   Enjoy

The bottom line is, If you pay with PAYPAL or a Visa or Master Card they protect the money,so if your dis satisfied, you show that you shipped the new/used items back you will get reimbursed! Regardless of ANY return policy stated by seller. 

Matt M

Good choice. Once you get them in your room let us know your thoughts on the speakers. Enjoy 😉

I’ve decided to go with the preowned TMR.  
that voice inside my head has been saying exactly what @soix said, its a no brainer. Big savings of money, and the security of returning if need be. I have discussed the speakers in detail with TMR and have pretty much got all of the information I can from them. I have dealt with them many times in the past and have never been disappointed.

the new speaker dealer is very reputable, but they have their policies and Home demos and returns are not part of them. 

thank you everyone for taking the time to help me out! 

Bows to you alll!

The TMR pair is a no brainer to me.  Much cheaper and you can return them and TMR is local?  Done.  And if your dealer isn’t offering you to borrow his demo pair at home for speakers at that price then they don’t deserve your business IMHO. 

First. Have him bring his demo speakers to your house and allow a trial. If you agree to buy, he should leave them there until your new ones arrive. This is how my purchases from small dealers have worked. This has been offered to me on all purchases over $15K. This kind of thing is exactly the point of a dealer and demo units. My dealer... not that small any more has over half his stock out all the time on trial. 

One thing is for sure, I would walk away from that dealer. TMR is a toss up, but a much better option IMO. I guess I would ask more questions from TMR about the condition of the speakers and if the bottom of the speakers are damaged where the spikes go in and ask Acoro if you can order them. Moving heavy speakers on spikes is probably how they got bent??

keep walking

Thanks all, so nice for folks to take the time to advise on this. I forgot to mention that TMR is in my town and they would deliver and set the speakers in place for no charge. If I had to return them, that would be on me.

@mulveling -One other issue I have with the used pair is the spikes in the TMR photos appear to be bent. I suppose that could be by design but I can't imagine why. These speakers are close to 250lbs apiece and I wonder what activity (besides gravity) might cause the spikes to bend? I have a call into Acora to ask about this but AXPONA might delay a response.  I have a very large listening room and my sense was the SRC-2 was a better fit. And my wife loved them also!

@rsf507 This particular store doesn't sell their demos and doesn't do home demos. I wish they did, that would be ideal! 

@rsf507 ,

Shipping to customer is $900.

It seems to me that being a high priced speaker, your dealer would be happy to bring them to you for a demo to make a potential sale.

Curious what are the shipping charges from TMR to and back if needed? Seems if that cost is reasonable then buy from TMR. Or why will your local dealer not bring over his in-store pair to your home for a short demo. If you like them maybe work out a deal to keep them and the dealer can buy a new set for the store.

A $50K speaker is a different ballgame than $5K. That’s "special order" territory, and a small dealer is going to have a hard time eating the loss of a return. I don’t blame him for sticking on that point.

The TMR deal doesn’t look too bad. This model isn’t that old, and what could go wrong other than over-driven drivers (damaged voice coil), which would be immediately apparent on a test listen. TMR would be my route, in your shoes. Only Acora or TMR would attempt to ship these beasts. You won’t find them for sale used often, on shipping logistics alone. 

The SRC-2 is a very nice speaker. That said, think I preferred the smaller SRC-1 based on a listen to both at my dealer’s. It has the silk dome tweeter. Musical as hell! Of course it depends on the room and equipment - the SRC-1 was in a smaller room with lower ranked (but still quite spectacular) gear behind it. 

Hi, I’ve gotten to know a couple local dealers and pricing that we’ve developed over time, money and trust has givin me options. If I want the best price I buy with the understanding that I can’t return the item. If they have a demo they swipe my card and I take it home for a few days to help me decide if I want to go forward with the purchase. Dealers have honored the factory warranty on these and I did have a $10k electronic product fail on one of these ‘cash’ deals and I got a BNIN replacement. 
 

Just talk to the dealer, get a clear understanding of his terms so you’re making an informed decision. 

Shipping them back will be $$$ but i have had good dealings with TMR.   I like to buy locally but that's the risk your dealer takes for not letting you do a home demo. 

I just bought a pair of speakers direct from the manufacturer,  30 day return policy.  I knew very early in that they were keepers.    

If you liked them in the store , the risk for him is low.   I would go with TMR.  Their condition rating is usually very accurate.   If they say something looks new, it does.