MBL Insolvent


I apologize if someone else has started a thread I missed, but reports indicate that MBL has initiated insolvency proceedings under German law. Not all businesses succeed- its a feature not a bug in a free enterprise system- but hopefully new investors will come in and save the company. This seems to be following the way of Audio Research (fortunately saved) and others-lots of uncertainty surrounding Dartzeel, Krell, etc, which is unfortunate. So many of these manufacturers are small businesses, obviously without huge capital reserves and sometimes without a good succession plan when the founders move on. I hope MBL successfully restructures, it makes great products. I think we all benefit from a healthy, vibrant group at the top end that has the resources to create and innovate. Good luck MBL.

kerrybh

Yes, it is very sad. But hopefully they will work their way out of it. Glad to hear in the mean time it is business as usual. 

An example of how these audio companies are small businesses run by folks that are passionate about audio and are not getting rich by their greed. Sonus Faber seems to have about 65 employees, MBL 50 employees and Audio Research about 50, Boulder around 20... Ayre is also small. These are small companies making small profits and one small misstep and they can easily go out of business. 

There are many audio companies competing for the funds of the wealthy or more-than-wealthy. It isn’t surprising that not all can survive, especially at this time of economic uncertainty.

That’s unique and valuable speaker technology.  I’m confident it will survive somehow. 

@ghdprentice I agree. Not  muchbroom for error in a low volume business with significant capital costs and  a competitive environment to boost. It seems to me that these are the businesses the innovate and take risks And we need them to succeed. Sooner or later, it benefits everyone who is interested in this stuff . 

“These are small companies making small profits”

@ghdprentice 

That may be true, but what seems to hurt many of these high-end audio companies in the long run is affordability. As prices continue to climb, they risk alienating a broader base of music lovers who simply can’t justify or access this level of investment, no matter how passionate they are.

Yes, quality costs money, and I respect the craftsmanship and engineering involved. But if the entry point keeps moving further out of reach, the future customer base gets smaller and that’s not a sustainable model for long-term growth. Their entry-level floorstander, the 116f is priced at $40K. Let’s be honest — how many here can realistically afford a $40,000 pair of speakers?

I understand the impact of distribution costs and dealer margins, but the speaker category in particular has gotten out of hand in terms of affordability. It’s starting to feel like high-end audio is drifting further from real-world accessibility, and that’s worth questioning.

All of the brands you’ve mentioned, have one thing common….small businesses driven by passion. I hope MBL survives cause I really like their speakers, they are unquestionably iconic, unconventional and produce gorgeous sound. 

A sad fact is that the 2 channel high end audiophile is aging out and dying off. The successor generation has little use for high end gear. 
 

Another observation is that the people and or companies that make high end gear are not getting rich off their expensive products. Neither are the dealers. 
 

As the saying goes: “ sell to the classes and eat with the masses. Sell to the masses and eat with the classes”.  

there’s a lot of competition in what is a very small slice of the market. I don’t think high end will go away, but I definitely think it will change. Over the next 5 to 10 years. I think we will see a very significant migration to all-in-one solutions like the focal diva. The technology will improve and younger folks are going to be less interested in eight boxes and a rats nest of cables. 

@kerrybh 

Not to get off topic but I have noticed two interesting products in your amazing system….Schnerzinger EMI & Grid Protector’s. Do you find them indispensable in your system? More specifically, if one has dedicated circuit to audio room, would you still recommend Schnerzinger Grid Protector? 

Companies like MBL make products that only the 1% can buy. I wouldn't shed a tear for them!

@lalitk Thank you. I don't think these products are indispensable, I do think they make a subtle but discernible improvement-a bit more clarity and presence. When I've removed them, its not as good but certainly not night and day. The better power you have, I suspect the less advantage derived from the grid protector. The dealer taking me through this (last I suspect) significant upgrade cycle wanted me to try them and others who I know that use them are big fans. I think my dealer is excellent, and I hear a positive difference with these in my system

I'm a bit of a cynic about some of this-I couldn't hear a difference with audiophile switches for example, not to say that others don't-not for me to judge, but I hear a difference with these. If someone says its a placebo, well, I'd say maybe so, that's a real thing, No reason to be dogmatic. I just know my experience.

Most improvements I've made produce incremental, not night and day gains to my ears. The exceptions are moving up in speakers-always rendered substantial gains-mechanical devices with moving parts. The other is room treatments which change the way actual sound waves interact with physical structures. For me-only speaking for me-improving electronics produces positive results but not on the same scale. We all hear differently.

I had an interest in the speakers for a while but they look too weird.  Every time people come to my home they would seem to provide a distraction and I don't wanna break out into conversation every time someone steps into the room about the speaker.  That was kind of annoying to deal with the speaker if I did buy it.

Speakers kind of weird maybe that's why they're not doing very well despite how good they might sound. 

As long as companies like MBL and Audio Research ignore the consumer market, their demise (or acquisition by companies that do NOT ignore the consumer segment) is certain. 

There is a massive audience for great music. The diversity offered by streaming services is proof. Ignoring every customer with less than a 7 figure+ nest egg and under-retirement age is a death sentence. Some will turn up their noses at manufacturers that dilute their aura with affordable products.  Letting passion dictate your entire business model may be admirable, but not very wise. 

@jasonbourne71 You have a point, these are discretionary products that we can all live without. Of course there are folks who are content to listen to music on a $50 bluetooth speaker who would say people who buy a $200 set of bookshelf speakers are just showing off-its all relative.

Creative destruction is part of the system, but I hate to see businesses like this go away (hopefully a white knight appears) because employees suffer, dealers suffer, and we lose the benefit of an innovator. I know I have benefitted from trickle down technology from products I wouldn't spend the money to buy. I've heard the big MBL extremes a couple of times in 7 figure rigs. I thought the technology and sound was amazing. No way 'll ever own anything like that, so be it. I think this hobby is about deploying the resources we are willing and able to put into it in the way that brings us the most joy-that's different for each of us. The way I look at it is if I have a negative emotional reaction to someone who chooses to spend their money to buy an ultra system, well that likely says more about me than them. 

It is, in many ways, a strange hobby, and the rest of the world, if they think about it at all, think we are all nuts. 

Would love to see some “trickle down” of mbl technology to smaller and more affordable products designed to work better in most people’s rooms. 

@kerrybh
Thanks for your grounded take, I appreciate that and it really resonates with me. I think you’re spot-on in acknowledging that improvements in audio are often incremental, and that the most dramatic changes usually come from mechanical or acoustic factors like speakers and room treatments. I’ve had a similar experience, power-related tweaks and cables sometimes bring a welcome refinement, but rarely the kind of leap you get when one takes time to optimize speaker placement or carefully navigate through acoustic treatments. 

I also appreciate your openness about the placebo effect. There’s a lot of ego in this hobby, and it’s refreshing to see someone say, may be it is placebo and that’s A-ok in my opinion. At the end of the day, if it improves your enjoyment, that’s all that really matters.

We really do all hear differently, and approaching the hobby with curiosity rather than dogma makes the experience richer for everyone, IMHO. 

PS: I have added Schnerzinger EMI Protector to my wish list to try someday! 

"It is, in many ways, a strange hobby, and the rest of the world, if they think about it at all, think we are all nuts"

Goes without  saying. 

I've always been impressed/captivated by the MBL demos.

Maybe a Euro equity group will  acquire them and try to wring out what's left of the interest/mystique of  the brand name.

@lalitk "...That may be true, but what seems to hurt many of these high-end audio companies in the long run is affordability...."

Correct. I am pretty sure that is exactly why Audio Research has just released their new affordable line. It has a name, but I don’t see it immediately. Some or all are under $10K. These are directed exactly at entry level. 

While that may seem like a lot of money. When I bought my first audiophile product in 1979 it was a Threshold s500 amp... in todays dollars it cost $20K or in 1979 dollars $5K. So, the new ARC amp is $2.5K in 1979 dollars half the Threshold cost in 1979. 

Another thought on the dilemma. Forty and fifty years ago, there was little budget competition in the field. There was no Schiit, Lumin, Dark Something, Cayin, PrimaLuna. These companies now supply the springboard. 

 

https://audioresearch.com/new_website/new-products-coming-in-june-2025/

@ghdprentice I heard those at the southwest Audiofest, might’ve been the debut and I thought they sounded really, really good especially for the price

@yesiam_a_pirate   "...A sad fact is that the 2 channel high end audiophile is aging out and dying off. The successor generation has little use for high end gear. "

 

I have heard this for forty years. Yet the proliferation of high end companies has been incredible. The population of audiophiles has always been very small. But it must be larger than ever to support all these companies. 

 

On the other hand, before the audiophile there was the short wave enthusiast. But, music is one of the most shared interests of people world wide... so, I'm thinking, not. 

Past innovators like Peter Walker, Henry Kloss, Nelson Pass, and Jim Winey made products that while some were “upscale” they were within the reach of enthusiasts who were not super- wealthy. The idea that innovative speaker design has to be crazy expensive is a byproduct of the ethos exemplified by Gordon Gecko. MBL has never tried to make an affordable version of the Radialstrahler. 

@ghdprentice 

I am digging the updated LS series. The chassis build quality went up few notches and appearance, subjective as we know, looks is pretty solid and inviting. 
 

@yesiam_a_pirate 

”A sad fact is that the 2 channel high end audiophile is aging out and dying off.”

That’s hardly a ‘fact’ ….I believe there’s hope. There are younger listeners who are getting into vinyl, tube gear, or desktop systems, even if their entry point looks different than ours. Maybe the future of this hobby won’t be exactly what it was but that doesn’t mean it’s gone. It might evolve into something more diverse and accessible, and maybe that’s not a bad thing.

Still, for those of us who value the 2-channel experience, there’s definitely a sense of time passing and a responsibility to share what we’ve learned while we still can to somewhat shape the narrative for future generations. 

I'm not a MBL fanboy-never owned one of its products, and MBL leadership obviously didn't execute a viable plan. I hope MBL survives-I respect what they do. I've never been really tempted by ARC but I know it makes really good stuff and think the hobby is better off that it came through. I think MBL's entry level integrated is around 12 and entry level speaker is about 15. Whether that's affordable, I suppose, depends on where you sit. Certainly not competitive with ChiFi entry level stuff, which can be very good, but not through the roof either.

I suspect the fact that MBL speakers are so different and its reputation is that MBL stuff doesn't play well with others-they try to leverage customers into the whole MBL ecosystem- may be contributing factors, but that's just a guess.

Raises an interesting question though- I suspect we all agree with the wisdom of selling "affordable" gear, but what is that price point? Is it $1,000 speakers, $5,000? I don't know, but an interesting question.

@kerrybh 

"..Raises an interesting question though- I suspect we all agree with the wisdom of selling "affordable" gear, but what is that price point? Is it $1,000 speakers, $5,000? I don’t know, but an interesting question."

Yes. Absolutely, An important aspect is that an audiophile company cannot sell an inferior product. I have been in this for fifty years. Every time I have purchased and audiophile product, it has performed at a very noticeablely higher level... not subtle. Never subtle. If and audiophile company produces something that is mid-tier then their public image gets confused. Then communicating I have a Boulder amp... suddenly means nothing... your have to start asking if it is a consumer one or one of the good ones. 

It’s one thing to have a consumer company stretch up... but there is real danger in an audiophile company making products that are not audiophile grade. Let's not get hung up on the word audiophile... the bar that sets the great stuff from the good. 

@kerrybh

but what is that price point? Is it $1,000 speakers, $5,000? 

 I think it's about turning the music lover into an audiophile. It's hard and not that hard. 99% of people will never become audiophiles for $5000 no matter how wealthy they are. Significantly better sound for a $1000 than what the subject has ever heard before? Absolutely possible. Even a $500 active speaker, placed correctly can drop jaws. 

I remember when I stumbled onto the Upscale website before my audiophile (mid-fi) days. I was angry. 10K for a turntable!? It's all about the perspective. You get what you pay for but it may be meaningless if you don't know what you are doing.

Of course the house sound of equipment varies greatly... so while it might be of the right quality and one does not  like the house sound. Also, there are differences in how well designs are executed among companies. But I would say the lie between mid tier components and audiophile (or maybe call it high end) at this point is around $10K and up per single function component or $15K and up for speakers. No, there is nothing absolute about this... just a generality. The higher you draw the line the safer the conclusion. 

I was in business for 45 years.  If you want to sell ultra high end products, you must realize the air is pretty thin up there.  Maybe someone can take that wonderful technology and try to make a more affordable product.

Sad to hear but the ultra high end 2 channel market is so minuscule and the prices they are asking sometimes costs more than an Audi SUV or even a Rolls Royce, it is not surprising.  The economics is just tough...

"take that wonderful technology and try to make a more affordable product." For example, Linear Tube Audio worked with David Berning and did that with his ZOTL technique.

 

One thing that seems to be missing from a lot of high end manufacturer’s business plan is this: offering a product that qualifies as "value for money".

 

There are a lot of really good high end pieces that have interest to the hobbyist, until the price tag is looked at. Then the typical hobbyist smiles and walk away. Not so much (although this is certainly an issue with many) because the piece in question is unaffordable, but more because the purchase decision is altered by the fact that the price asked is simply not reasonable for what is being offered. 

We have folks in the high end audio business who believe that their goods are worth whatever price they ask for it, because there are people who can afford it....IMO, that is a fundamental business error. One which I believe the principals at MBL had.

The late John Strohbeen of Ohm Acoustics once wrote an article on the site where he indicated his admiration for mbl speakers indicating they were one of few that sounded right to him (other than his own Walsh CLS design) and took great pride in providing more affordable products cut from a similar mold.   His goal it seemed was always to deliver the best sound possible for an affordable price to as many music lovers as possible. 
 

Also interesting to note that Ohm Walsh speaker prices both used and new seem to have soared in recent years.  

Sad news indeed.  We don’t know what went wrong and it is not fair to second guess their business decisions that got them to this point.  Even though I did not like all aspects of their sound (a touch too hard and metallic sounding), they certainly did other things well (imaging and having a wide sweet spot.  From a purely sonic perspective, they deserved a place in the market.  I bet someone will buy the design and this design will remain in the market in some form.

@kerrybh well said and good riposte to JasonBourne's ultimatum cheeky

Ultimately value is in the eye of the beholder.  I have no problem with people buying high end stuff.  I know people with systems that cost more than 10x their car.  Priorities and income can be vastly different... some people aren't 1%ers but they just put their income into audio.  People spend a million dollars on a car.  I'd rather have the sound system...

They should have raised their prices to attract the clientele that they are after. 

I don't know how many moving parts there are in a MBL speakers, but I'd guess that service would be frequent and expensive.   

@yyzsantabarbara   While you may be sarcastic, there are folks in the high end industry that think that business plan is a solid one. I know of a high end manufacturer who was told by his Far East dealer/rep to increase prices considerably, because that would impress his clientele and add value to his line. Unfortunately, as soon as he raised prices to the levels that he was requested of, the sales dried up..

I was not being sarcastic. I also see where something is not considered desirable unless the price was higher. Case in point, was the TAD ME-1 that went from $15k to $10k then back to $15k. I lost interest in buying that after that play.

@yyzsantabarbara They are an excellent speaker at $10.5 including stands. 

As for MBL of which i have significant seat time listening to at dealer not a show with appropriate front end Wadia > CJ GAT > MF AMS-100 amp > MBL is the correct sized room which is going to cost a lot… Top five systems in have heard wandering globe…. Sorry to hear of demise. I know the midrange dosent scale well up or down…

Now might be the right time to buy MBL equipment.  You should be able to get substantial discounts?

I imagine someone will buy up the rights to their loudspeaker technology.

I’ve no knowledge of MBL’s workings.  However, for decades I’ve followed decline and failure of hundreds of companies.  Usually, much is self-inflicted.

Nissan faced 35B in debt, recruited Carlos Gosn who brought it round to profitability (+2.7B $US)in three years.  He’s gone and Nissan is back underwater having forgotten all lessons.

Having worked plenty with Germans and Austrians, they are quite inflexible to changing environments.  Could be contributory.  Wish them the best.

Why are cars considered the more worthy product? An Audi moves people from place to place. A fine stereo system moves an orchestra into your room. 

Hope MBL gets things straightened out. They actually produce something trailblazing vs copy cat box stuffing. Hope to hear Radialstrahlers some day.

Thanks,

aldnorab 

I've never heard an MBL product. I've never been to an audio show and non of the dealers near me were/are MBL dealers. I believe most any company can justify its prices however, knowing whether or not your audience will keep you from drowning is indispensable. I suppose MBL didn't reach a large enough customer base and the people who have purchased MBL products, just stopped buying them. But the only ultra high end products that leave me scratching my head, where ultra high prices are concerned, are the digital components like DAC's and Streamers. I can't see why anyone would spend $100,00.00 on a DAC knowing that it could become antiquated ten years from now.

I don’t believe for a minute that the market for such products is limited. There are millions of people world wide with the means to buy ultra high end hifi. Wilson is very successful although they do have more affordable products. I’d bet Magico can’t build enough M9 speakers. There is a market for $25,000.00 speaker wire and interconnects. And on and on. 

Maybe the employees at MBL decided to take a vow of poverty for religious reasons?

BTW MBL is not just a speaker company. It makes a very extensive line of electronics too.

I have owned Several of their gear excellent build quality ,the issue is they never made much for the average working Audiophile  and the North American distributor 

never had much of the product reviewed on a consistent basis that is not good for the industry . Their 101 Omni directional Loudspeaker is lengenary one of my all time favorites . Their digital transport and dac I owned a work of art like a submarine hatch ,hopefully their will be restructured .

Should we be surprised these companies have be flooding the market with their overpriced junk for last 50 years….ive spent over a million in audio and make a great deal of mistakes until I woke up….we still STILL HAVE HIGH END MANUFACTURES CHARGING 20K for a preamp and using 10 dollar ALPS GARBAGE POTS

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