Speakers that disappear

I like the way some omni-directional speakers, like MBL, seem to disappear--the soundfield is completely spread out and there are no hot spots at the edge of the soundfield which correspond with the speakers are located.  

If you really want disappearing speaker, you shall go for line array.

I do not notice any direct sound from my Scaena 3.2.

When I attended PAF 2024, Note speaker also disappears.

https://markporzilli.com/

Thomas

You might consider older Audio Physic speakers.  I liked them back in the 90s.  I have large full range speakers that disappear, Von Schweikert, which have great dispersion.  They can disappear with the right recordings (not many of my jazz combo 1950s though as they are often left/right channel only.   

Mini and regular monitor size speakers are best for disappearing with great imaging potential over large speakers.  Concentric driver design speakers also have the ability to disappear.  

Aha1,

Maybe you should research these speakers. www.bloomline.com. I've heard them and they are really amazing! No sweet spot anymore at all. Even when you walk around, the music seems to come from a stage you're walking by.

Hope you'll find your perfect speaker. 

Few speakers disappear in smallish concrete block rooms. 

I agree that all speakers can be made to disappear with proper placement of the speakers and the listening position.  It also MAY help to have some room treatment (can be as simple and unobtrusive as putting up a wall hanging on large exposed surfaces or adding diffusion with bookcases, potted plants, etc.).

The difference between speakers tend to make certain types easier to get to disappear.  Small standmounted speakers placed well away from walls are particularly easy to make disappear. 

But anything can be made to disappear. Just this weekend I heard a system with very good imaging that sort of defies the usual expectations because of its size.  It is more than 30" wide, taller than six feet and is three feet deep (horn-based).  If that elephant in the room can disappear, anything can.

re: brummgon: I saw a relevant interview with Richard Vandersteen recently, in his opinion the speakers with the largest sweet spot are the ones with the worst phase accuracy, and they can't do pin-point imaging as a result. This is why his designs are not dipole or omnipolar.

I have a pair of Magnepan MMG, Vandersteen 2 and Mofi Sourcepoint 8 all in my living room, hooked up to the same McIntosh amplifier (using a switch-box).

ALL three pair do the disappearing act . . .  but the listening chair had to be moved forward or backward slightly, and the speakers are (obviously) at different positions within the room. It's all about your room (mine is half-treated), the speakers' placement, and the seating position relative to those speakers.

WHY do I have so many different speakers? Each presents the stereo image differently and I switch monitors based on the recording I am playing.

put Vandersteen on your listening list

Whether or not your speakers disappear is system dependent.
My speakers lost that quality for a number of years.
I recently repaired/upgraded the electronics: amps, preamp, phonostage.
They disappeared again. 😊

The room may be the most important thing.

Hi Ahal,

Maybe you should research these speakers: www.bloomline.com. I've heard them play and they really are amazing! No sweet spot anymore at all. Even when you walk around, the music seems to come from a stage between the speakers when you're walking by. This really amazing system was invented by Leo de Klerk, a recording engineer. Based on laws of fysics and audio behaviour. 

Hope you'll find your perfect speaker. Success!

"...speakers that disappear...." ?

Bluetoothed headphones, but keep a sub....coffee table disguised....

Concentric driver designs+a narrow baffle+attention paid to phase precision will tend to be holographic and disappear like a piece of cake...even if your room/setup is a bit suboptimal. If it fits your wallet, get a TAD E1TX. It isn’t very big and will be a significant step up (sonically) from what you currently have.

Or...here’s a less wallet abusing piece with some compromise from Technics (SB-G90M2)

@terraplane8bob

Absolutely! I have the Orion’s also - "Maggies on Steroids!"

But... the OP seemed to be asking for smaller speakers that "disappear."

And... although I love my Orion’s... they are quite a bit larger and more difficult to manage, than the LRS+ or Harbeths. And... I do believe the LRS+ does a fair job of competing with the Orions... maybe... with the exception of the dynamics and drive of the lower mids and bass and the size of the soundstage.

The LRS+ is just amazing at producing not only the accuracy and transparency of the sound, but also the imaging and soundstage, with those ESL 57 or Harbeth mids - which is all you need for "all things acoustic." If I want a bit more dynamics and drive... I’ll add some Rels to the mix of my LRS+. But for most of my jazz, blues, country and classical - I don’t miss it a bit!

And... the bonus is... the LRS+, which rivals most any other speaker - is only $1,000!

+1rick_n

It all depends on what type of music you're listening to, your room and do you also like that slam of bass.  I have Wilson Maxx II's, but my son has some Martin Logans and I love their sound.  I had a pair of Monolith's, but sold them to buy the Wilson's.  I wish I had a larger room, so I could incorporate both speakers in my listening area.  I have a pair of Klipschorns that have been sitting in their corners, unused for several years.  I think I'll find a low power tube amp and connect them up.

Linkwitz "ORION" open baffle speakers. Truly amazing !

+1 @sounds_real_audio .

It really begins upsteam...if you can hear you amplifier grilling, then your speakers no matter what they are will not disappear...it is the whole chain. 

My Magnepan LRS+ does a pretty good job disappearing even though I sit close to the LEFT speaker in my small office. However, I cheat by using ROON's digital speaker placement option. That thing is like an analog balance control in a preamp, but on steroids.

The best speaker that I know to totally disappear and also have an incredible soundstage is the KEF Blade 2.

Anthony Gallo ref 3.1 or 3.5s or their current stand mounts Strada II. I obviously a fan boy for Gallo. The cdt tweeters are among my favorites in all the speakers I’ve ever heard. 
 

I’ve also been drawn to most open baffle designs for the disappearance act. Depending on budget, Nola makes some really special sounding speakers. All disappear without much fuss.

No highs no lows, must be Bose.  

I am pretty sure that there are stand mounted speakers that do a better job at the disappearing act than Bose 901s.  (And I had never heard Bose 901s referred to as "stand mounted" before, but who knows.)

Bose comes to mind, but only if there's at least one Synergistic Research fuse in the system.

When you speak of listening to speakers that disappeared and were stand mounted, you were most likely listening to the Bose 901s, which sit on a pedestal as an integral part of their design. To me, none of the other Bose products come close, but the 901s via their equalizers can put out a nice sound, and they certainly disappear without needing a lot of additional equipment to achieve the objective. Many can find fault with them, but that's what you were most likely listening to.

Hello ahal1!  All of Linkwitz designs will vanish when playing music. They are abailable in kit form from Madisound. I have built three different models (Plutos, LX minis, LX521) and all sound wonderful and are good at the "disappearing act."  Happy listening!

A lot of speakers can disappear on some content. Maybe there are some that can disappear on all content, if put in the right situation. I imagine a single dipole positioned correctly could project a perceived image far behind the speaker. I think I’ve experienced that on some occasions even with a single cheap bookshelf. The sound seemed to come from the speaker’s direction, but it definitely sounded like it was well behind the speaker. What’s really rare is when it really seems like sound is outside, way behind the speakers, and somehow clearly coming through your wall, as if the wall was just a thin cloth fake.

I had a pair of Klipsch RF-7s doing that at one time (they didn’t do it individually in mono). Overall I was disappointed with those, but at one point I would listen and look out the closed windows with amazement because it seemed like a concert was going on out there.

Also, for me the ability of the speaker to disappear seems reliant on my state. Sometimes my brain falls heavily for the illusion. Other times it’s not so easily deceived. This morning I came to work and listened to a setup that I had configured last night that was really wowing me. When I came in this morning I had a quick listen and the disappearing effect was underwhelming. I didn't have the luxury to listen for long, but after a few minutes it was starting to work better. For me, the effect grows as my ears and mind relax into it, especially if they're not disturbed too much by other sounds.

I had several speakers in the garage that disappeared completely. I suspect my wife put them out on electronic recycling day but she swore she did not. Still, where are they?

@bassdude +1!

There was of course never any such moniker as “ESL-57,” except in retrospect, to distinguish it from its distinguished successor the ESL-63. Designed by the legendary Peter Walker and actually introduced in 1956, it was called simply the Quad ESL, but soon became known as “Walker’s little wonder.” Little wonder: For top-to-bottom clarity, coherence, transparency, resolution, openness, naturalness, and a disappearing act that still inspires awe, the ESL established and remains to this day (even though production ceased over a quarter century ago) a reference standard among countless designers and reviewers (including the undersigned) across the globe. Despite undeniable limitations—inability to play very loud, lack of deep bass, quite directional highs—it tops virtually every list of the best, the greatest, the most significant—supply your own category—audio products ever made. Why? Because at the dawn of the stereo era this “little” wonder demonstrated what was possible in most of the essential areas of speaker performance so validly that from a certain point of view the subsequent history of speaker design has been catch-up. Paul Seydor

RE:  the Quad ESL 57's, which are the best sounding speakers ever created (with the right set up) - both the Maggie LRS+ and Harbeth 30.1/2's and 40.2/3's (with the right set up) (which I also have) sound very, very close to the ESL 57's!  All of the Harbeths sound very similar to them.

This, Why I liked MQA so much, the hi rez mqa was so spacious sounding that the room, speakers and everything in it disappeared.....

  I find the further I can get speakers away from reflecting surfaces the easier they vanish audibly. 

In my experience the best speakers at disappearing tend to be planar - the original Quads were quite good and ones that I still own, primarily because of this particular attribute, are Martin Logan CLS.

They rarely ever get mentioned in a conversation like this, but my Polk Audio Legend L 800 are among the best speakers I have ever heard when it comes to the disappearing act. They require proper set up and replacement, but if you take the time to do it they will simply vanish into the ether. Associated gear is also important, and my system consists of Carver Raven monoblock, McIntosh C2300, and Simaudio 680D…

My Rockports completely vanish.

My Heils' and Walsh do that all the time.....

'Fatigue' is from reading complaints....

Ive had some very good soundstage affects but, never made my Maggie 1.7i s disappear  however, another " cheating way" as mentioned, listening in the dark or in my case dimly lit room really changes the visual / accustic dimension. I also project a DJ light  / party light againest the front wall. This seems to open the front wall and distract the eyes from the speakers.

May sound silly, but the soundstage is so much better than lights on or day time listening. .

I once heard old Polk Audio box speakers ( forgot model #) that used their unique interconnenct between speakers. The phantom sounds from way beyond the speakers was amazing. 

My choices would be as follows:

1.  Magnepan LRS+

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pY-zS4eJogE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lprCVHnMmDg&t=83s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLdlZ5bJXIY&t=433s

I have these, as well as several Harbeths, and had the LS50's several years ago.  They're all superb - but - I really prefer the LRS+ with the right electronics and set up.  Both these and the Harbeths are very hard to beat - though, I think with the right set up... the LRS+ are about as good as it gets... no matter what speakers you chose.  They are truly "giant killers" for modestly sized rooms and can be easily moved for listening... and out of the way, when not.  

2.  Harbeth P3ESR XD 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGnWGMfg08k

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up6ZpOGt66E

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9nsm8ghU7o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9iN2aRmYfsY

The Harbeths would be my close 2nd...

3.  KEF LS50 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFUGo_zGUgE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uTT1aYQ0Hs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXgt8BhqckA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5UEMS1efys

Had some in the back seat of my unlocked car disappear.

GR Research's NX Studio disappear amazingly well.

Open baffle planar tweeters are the magic.

They are kits, but they come with finished baffles, and flat packs are available (so you don't have to do any wood cutting). 

The end results are a speaker that compete with speakers at at least twice their price.

NX Studio

I run a pair of slightly modified KEF C55 stand mounts. They disappear with lights on or off. 🤘🏼

I always listen in the dark; I guess that probably doesn't count?

Bowers and Wilkins with tweeter on top designs are amazing at wide soundstage and disappearing act. 

The ProAc Tabletttes do a great disappearing act. I still remember being amazed at this small system with the anniversary edition from CAF 2013.

https://parttimeaudiophile.com/2013/08/04/caf-2013-deja-vu/

B&W  801#3 Drivebn with krell ksa250

Completely disappeared.

Id look at the speaker's and wondered what the hell are those things

Really

If you have a difficult room and having a hard time with placement, Dirac Live can do wonders.  It did for me.  Good luck.

Most comments in this thread are correct and setup is key. I will add low defraction designs will help too. I am not too much into stand mount speakers and I can’t not recommend anything but speakers with round smooth surfaces and narrow faces will help (think Vivid Audio, Kef blade, etc). 

While I agree that all speakers “can” disappear to some extent or another and that things like the room and recording quality also matter significantly, some speakers still just inherently and more easily and completely disappear as a sound source better than others regardless of other factors.  Joseph Audio does this and I’ll add ProAc in there too as standouts although there are certainly some others that pull this off well.  So to say individual speaker recommendations are not helpful in this regard is simply not accurate in my experience because certain brands do excel at disappearing as a sound source better than others, and that’s what the OP was asking for here. 

Quality of Recording is really important, placement of listening chair.  And volume.

Unfortunately, speakers are always at the mercy of recording quality.

@willy-t  has it right.  Ignore all the specific speaker recommendations.

check out the monitor audio platinum 100s if it's in your budget or the gold 100s.

@willy-t wrote, "pick music that doesn't have widely panned instruments and or vocals"  Oh man you hit a nerve there for me!  This is one of my biggest peeves.  Sound engineers often try and do too much and overwide panning has ruined too many songs that we all love.  I find that when engineers try and spread the mix as wide as possible the sound gets trapped and never releases from the speakers and just makes mud.  

For the OP to realize his goal when auditioning new speakers I would recommend that he hand picks some tracks that are very well recorded and that are known to produce a good sound stage.  I would look for music recorded by Alan Parsons and Ken Caillat, they are two of the very best at getting good sound that allows the speakers to disappear.

One other thing to keep in mind when auditioning is that more complicated music with more band pieces is harder for the speakers to render.  Simple acoustic or small ensembles can be successfully reproduced by any entry level Best Buy speakers but the bigger more complicated stuff will separate the wheat from the chaff during your demos.  Good luck and cheers.