Hello @toontrader , So many ideas and options!  I am  not into BBC or horns or panels, but will nonetheless add my thoughts.  I have a big room similar to yours, with high and vaulted ceilings.  After several old pairs, I found the Revel Studio and Salon 2 speakers.  I first bought the Studio 2's, but needed more pressure for the big room.  I traded up to the bigger and taller Salon 2's and they fill the room wonderfully.  Great bass and smooth treble.  They can still be found used for around 9-12k, and have held their price for years.  For amps I would buy the best Audionet amps you can afford, if not perhaps the Coda S5.5.  The Audionet amps bring speakers to life, with resolution and sparkle without fatigue.  The Max amps are the sweet value spot, with a used pair maybe for around 16k, but well worth it.  If you can find a pair of the Salon 2's, you can likely use them forever or a year or two and sell them for near what you paid.  Come for a visit in Mayland if you like!

Here is my system :

Wiim Pro Streamer $149

Schiit Yggdrasil+ GS2 DAC $1699

Schiit Freya+ Pre-Amp with 6SN7 Tubes $1049

PS Audio S300 Amp $1999

Harbeth 30.2 XD Speakers $5990

REL T/5X Subwoofer $699

Tom Trager Speaker Stands $1600

Cables $800

About $14k

Similar room to yours. I listen to jazz and rock. Everything in this system is recommended by The Absolute Sound and Stereophile magazines. The WIIM isn't but it's a great product. The DAC is as good or better than their current versions imo but still available from Schiit. This is a soft tube sounding system. I spent a lot of time picking what I believe are the best components available in their price range. TMR has a used pair of Harbeth 40.3 XD with Trager stands for $11,500 right now which would keep you around $20k.

 

Im not going to push any personal faves that are generally highly biased . But may I offer some SYSTEM synergy general decision factors to consider

.Picking your speakers first in isolation without a contemporaneous proper equal consideration to the upstream amplifier options is a high-risk and likely roadway to disappointment. Total system budget allocations matter upfront.

(1) amps vs speakers budget matrix

The philosophy is clear. An affordable speaker with decent amplification (and source) makes more sense than an expensive speaker with a cheap amp and source.

(2) Don’t ignore Amplifier power ratings and your speaker choice impedance curve & speaker efficiency ratings

Another word on amp power: though it’s less of an issue now compared with the days of valve amplification, if your speakers are demanding to drive, you’ll need a suitably muscular amplifier to support them.

Don’t look only at the headline power figure - see what happens when the impedance drops to four ohms. If the number nearly doubles, then your amplifier has good current delivery and will be capable of driving more demanding speakers.

@toontrader start with your speakers.  You need to pin down the type of sound you value.  Some are more analytical and others more romantic or possibly organic.  Traditional box, open baffle, horns or something else.  It depends on your musical taste.  Do you want an all rounder or geared to a specific type of music you listen to.  I would then probably jump to the source component and get the best to satisfy your need.  The amplifer section probably leads you to an integrated solution depending on it's capabilities since they can contain a dac and streamer. Last but not least is how all of this equipment plays together (synergy).  I would probably lean on trusted dealer advise since it's really difficult to get all the elements right by just picking up a component here or there.    

Ai is quite amazing, useful and insightful.  I continue to be impressed with responses to questions like the one above.  Anyone else have this experience with Ai, whether Grok, ChatGPT or others?

FWIW, here is Grok's reply to your question:

Welcome back to the audio hobby! It’s great to hear you’re diving back in with enthusiasm, and your budget of $20k on the used market in the SE USA gives you some solid options to build a high-quality streaming setup. Your room—12’W x 30’L with a vaulted 11’H ceiling—offers a spacious canvas, though the length and vaulted ceiling might present some acoustic challenges we can touch on later. For now, let’s unpack your two divergent paths: the horn-driven Volti Audio with Cary SLI80 vs. the BBC-inspired Harbeth 40.2 with VTL MB185 Series III, all paired with Tidal and Qobuz streaming.

 

The Two Paths: Horns vs. BBC Sound

 

You’re absolutely right that these represent two different sonic universes. Horn speakers, like those from Volti Audio, tend to prioritize dynamics, efficiency, and a visceral, "live" presentation—think bold, immediate sound that fills a room with energy. The BBC sound, exemplified by Harbeth, leans toward tonal accuracy, natural midrange (especially for voices), and a more laid-back, refined listening experience. Your schizophrenia here is understandable; each scratches a different itch.

 

Option 1: Volti Audio with Cary SLI80 Integrated

 

• Volti Audio: Volti’s lineup (e.g., Rival or Vittora, depending on what’s available used) is known for high sensitivity (often 95-100 dB/W/m), making them a great match for lower-powered tube amps. They deliver a big, engaging soundstage with punchy bass and a lively top end, thanks to their horn-loaded design. In a 30’-long room, their ability to project sound could be a real asset.


• Cary SLI80: This integrated tube amp (around 40Wpc in triode, 80Wpc in ultralinear) uses KT88 or 6550 tubes and offers a warm, musical signature that could complement the Volti’s boldness without overwhelming it. It’s got enough juice to drive high-sensitivity horns, and the triode/ultralinear switch lets you tweak the balance between sweetness and power. Used, it often goes for $2k-$3k, leaving room in your budget.


• Synergy: Horns and tubes are a classic pairing—think Klipsch with SET amps. The SLI80’s richness should tame any horn edginess, while the Volti’s efficiency maximizes the amp’s modest wattage. Expect a fun, dynamic sound that excels with rock, jazz, or anything with impact.


 

Option 2: Harbeth 40.2 with VTL MB185 Series III

 

• Harbeth 40.2: These are large standmounts (or floorstanders, depending on setup) with a reputation for midrange magic, thanks to Harbeth’s Radial2 cone. They’re less efficient (around 85-86 dB/W/m, 6 ohms) and demand more power to shine, but they reward with coherence, detail, and a natural, unforced sound. In your long room, they’ll need careful placement to avoid bass bloom or a distant soundstage.


• VTL MB185 Series III: These monoblocks (200Wpc tetrode, 100Wpc triode with EL34 tubes) are overkill for the Harbeths in terms of power, but that’s not a bad thing. They bring a refined, balanced tube sound with tight bass and adjustable damping factor, letting you dial in control over the 40.2’s 12” woofer. Used, a pair might run $8k-$10k, eating a chunk of your budget but delivering serious performance.


• Synergy: Harbeths love tubes, and the MB185’s power and finesse could elevate the 40.2’s strengths—think lush vocals, precise imaging, and a fatigue-free listen. This combo leans toward classical, acoustic, or anything where nuance matters.


 

Streaming Integration

 

Since you’re all-in on Tidal and Qobuz, you’ll need a streamer/DAC to feed these setups. Options within your budget:

 

• Bluesound Node (~$500 used): Simple, supports both Tidal and Qobuz, decent built-in DAC. Pair it with an external DAC later if needed.


• Cambridge Audio CXN V2 (~$800-$1k used): Better DAC, same streaming versatility, a step up in refinement.


• Used Roon-ready streamer (e.g., Auralic Aries, ~$1k-$1.5k): If you’re open to Roon ($150/year), this unlocks a premium interface for Tidal/Qobuz and future-proofs your setup.


 

You’ll also need interconnects and speaker cables—budget $500-$1k used for decent brands like AudioQuest or Cardas to keep signal quality high.

 

Budget Breakdown

 

• Volti + Cary:
  • Volti Rival (~$8k-$10k used, depending on model/condition)
  
  
  • Cary SLI80 (~$2k-$3k)
  
  
  • Streamer/DAC (~$1k-$1.5k)
  
  
  • Cables (~$500-$1k)
  
  
  • Total: ~$12k-$15k, leaving room for tweaks or upgrades.
  
  
   


• Harbeth + VTL:
  • Harbeth 40.2 (~$5k-$7k used, 40th Anniversary editions pop up often)
  
  
  • VTL MB185 Series III (~$8k-$10k)
  
  
  • Streamer/DAC (~$1k-$1.5k)
  
  
  • Cables (~$500-$1k)
  
  
  • Total: ~$15k-$19.5k, pushing closer to $20k but doable.
  
  
   


 

Room Considerations

 

Your 12’x30’ space with vaulted ceilings favors the Volti’s projection—horns can energize that length without strain. The Harbeths might feel swallowed unless placed 3-5’ from the front wall with the listening position closer to the speakers (say, 8-10’ away). The vaulted ceiling could diffuse sound nicely but might also muddy bass—some rugs or panels ($500-$1k) could help tame reflections.

 

Listening Opportunities in SE USA

 

Sampling these pairings is tough without dealers nearby, but here’s where travel could pay off:

 

• Atlanta, GA: Audio Alternative often carries high-end gear; they might have Harbeth or similar BBC monitors. Volti’s less common, but call ahead.


• Charlotte, NC: Audio Advice occasionally stocks premium speakers and tube amps—worth a trip.


• Asheville, NC: Smaller scene, but shops like Soundwave might have tubes or horns to demo.


• Florida (Tampa/Orlando): Suncoast Audio has handled Volti and high-end tubes in the past—check their used inventory.


 

If none pan out, audio shows like Capital Audiofest (Nov ’25, if timing works) or Florida Audio Expo (Feb ’26) could let you hear similar setups. Volti’s Greg Roberts might even arrange a demo if you’re near his SC/NC border base—reach out directly.

 

My Take

 

• Volti + Cary: Go this route if you crave excitement and a “big” sound that fills your room. It’s cheaper, leaving budget for room treatment or a better streamer. Risk: Horns can be polarizing—some find them shouty if not paired right.


• Harbeth + VTL: Choose this for a sophisticated, intimate listen that rewards long sessions. It’s pricier and les


 

For $20k, KEF R7 Meta ($,5,000/pair), KEF KC92 Powered Subwoofer ($2,000), NAD M23 amplifier ($3,749), NAD M66 DAC/Streamer/PreAmp/Dirac/Dirac Bass Control ($5,499) plus ~$1,000 for cables and you are comfortably under $20k, much less so on the secondhand market.

What a big, beautiful dedicated listening room you have!

@yoyoyaya   +1. The audio system has to be viewed as a whole entity not just an individual component. An outdated view is the speaker is the most important link in the audio chain. Why is it outdated? It's the most flawed component, most room dependent and can be the least expensive item in a highly resolving system. The mainstream audio media/merchants has this backwards for a reason,. They want you to keep upgrading all other gear to find the correct balance with a speaker that did not fit in your original budget. 

@atmasphere Good advice, something I discovered on my audiophile journey, inefficient and/or insensitive speakers require watts, and not just watts, quality watts. Any amp capable of delivering quality watts brings a price, the more there are the greater the cost.

@OP. If you don't already have the other system components, you should not start with speakers. You should start with the entire system. The speaker-amplifier interface is especially important because your room size, listening position, preferred listening volume and impedance and efficiency characteristics of the speakers, along with the output impedance of the amplifier will have a major bearing on your choices.

Check craiglist for used JBL speakers

If I was starting from scratch, and just wanted streaming, i'd look at active speakers from KEF.

Then you won't have to worry about bi- or tri-amplification, interconnect cables, speaker cables or much else.

Because they approximate point sources, room treatment is much less important.

The only things left to obsess about are your internet connection and maybe a couple of power cables and an Ethernet cable.

The Schlitt gear recommendation is something I have realized is great advice. I used to have a negative opinion of this company before I took a chance and ordered some gear. Their products cost a lot less and they had a unique name and marketing approach. I was a little turned off by this. After hearing the gear, I am all in.

One thing I would suggest is to wait until late summer 2025 for the new Schitt DACs. I am holding onto my Schitt Yggi+ LIM DAC to upgrade to the new iteration of the Yggi+. The Yggi+ chassis and internals are upgradeable.

I will never part with the Schitt Yggi+ OG DAC which is no longer available. I sold a $15k DAC to go with the Yggi+ OG. This DAC was recently in a shootout with the Mola Mola Tambaqui and Chord Dave. Comments are on Head-fi. It did not beat them in preference but did not lose either.

I am selling a $7k amp to go with the $2k Wotan (for my office with Maggies). 

 

Some of the responses here are extremely helpful. In my experience with tube amplification Harbeth speakers didn’t sound nearly as compelling as compared to single driver or horn speakers. I endorse the idea of trying to listen to a lot of speakers before buying and I would suggest you hear DeVore O96 speakers. They are marvelous with tubes! Good luck!

I should start with speakers. This I know.

@toontrader I’m not sure this is actually the best approach. But here are some tips.

The first thing you need to sort out is your budget, since if the speaker is inefficient you’ll need a lot of power and a powerful power amp that actually sounds like real music can be an expensive proposition.

So this points to the idea that perhaps a more efficient speaker would be a good move.

The other thing to keep in mind is that the lower the impedance of the speaker, the harder it is to drive, the more critical the speaker cables become and the more distortion the amp (regardless of technology) will make.

So again from a simply ’best sound’ point of view a speaker of higher efficiency and moderate impedance is a good idea. Distortion in the amplifier obscures detail and can make the system sound harsher.

Inefficient speakers have another problem known as ’thermal compression’. This is where the voice coil heats up due to the power being put through it; as it heats up it becomes less efficient and its harder to put current through it. So the speaker tends to compress, which is to say becomes less dynamic.

Your room is on the larger size of things so again efficiency is important.

Since you are already considering horns another advantage is that amps of less power often tend to sound better, especially if the amp is a tube amp.

Here’s something else to consider:

In many rooms you get a phenomena known as a standing wave. This is where the bass waveform is so long that it can bounce off the rear wall and coming forward, can cancel itself. No amount of room correction can fix this sort of thing because room correction depends on amplifier power and if its being canceled, even 1000 Watts won’t fix it. The solution for this is multiple subs asymmetrically placed so to break up the standing wave.

Audiokinesis makes a sub designed for this called the Swarm. Essentially they are placed against the wall in various spots and as long as they are not active above about 80 Hz will not attract the attention of the ear. This can work because at 80 Hz the waveform is 14 feet long, which means by the time your ear has sorted out what note is being played, the bass note has bounced all over the room and is entirely reverberant. So you can use a mono signal to drive all the subs.

The advantage of this is that the main speakers don’t really have the plumb the bottom octave. If they roll off at 40-50Hz you’ll have no problems blending them with the subs. This means there are a lot of smaller speakers that will be easy to place or you can use horn speakers that have horn loaded woofers (which in most cases, don’t go much below 60Hz).

Good Luck with the quest!

 

For $20K you can buy brand new and have a really good all around speakers. Consider a Coda CSiB Integrated Amplifier and Legacy Audio Focus Speakers. Contact James Thompson at Destination Hifi and I'm sure he would make you a nice package deal delivered to your door. https://destinationhifi.com/products/coda-csib-integrated-amplifier

Huh, what? He needs to buy used with 20k for max value?? What??

 

Speaker: Tekton Epic 15 ($2400, new, made in the USA)

Subwoofer: Tekton Cinema Sub ($1050 new)

Amp: Schiit Freya+ tube preamp ($1000 new) + Schiit Wotan poweramp ($2000 new, made in the USA)

Dac: Schiit Gungnir 2 ($1600 new)

Conditioner: Audioquest Powerquest 707 ($1300 new)

Sum Total, (new, made in the USA): $9350

Balance: $10650

 

I might just eat my hat if some 300k Daryl Wilson & D’oggastino rig sounded better. He even had 10k left over to get himself a nice suit, go watch some wind ensembles and dance companies.

$20K budget means you will need to buy used to get max value.

Lots of info offered some pretty good, others not worth the time.  We are a manufacturer of audio components and have been doing equipment repairs for 25 plus years.  We have heard more equipment than probably everyone posting here combined.  That being said:

Forget Harbeth 40.2 - consider the Revival ATALANTE 5 speakers at around $5K.  Better sounding in every way.

I am also hearing very good things regarding the PMC speakers from a  very good source although I have not heard them yet.  I was not a fan of the old designs.

The other speakers I would go listen to would be the Vandersteen Quattro.  You can get amazing sound from them even against setting them up against the wall.  That can be helpful if your wife is involved in this decision, etc.

Happy Listening.

 

$20K budget means you will need to buy used to get max value. Even then you are going to have to be a sharp negotiator. 

I'd start with listening to different speakers where you can- dealer, friend, etc. Listen to the leaders in their class- ie: Maggies, Wilson, Sonus, Bryston.  Each type has a "voice" that is somewhat consistent throughout the type (ie: Electrostatic vs. cone vs. hybrid)

Once you pick out "your sound" buy the best speakers you can afford. IMO speakers have the most dramatic and identifiable effect on your rig. 

The next is a toss up- The saying  "put your money in your DAC" saying has a lot of truth to it.  Then your amp. IMO tubes are best for depth and soundstage but there are some fantastic SS amps out there these days that get pretty close. 

Expect about a year to get this all right- and maybe some mistakes along the way. The process is fun if you you're a journey kind of guy. Most here on these forums are. 

Your on right path with the Volti's, horns don't require loads of power which helps to keep total costs down. Horns specialize in bringing performers into the room perspective, pair them with some 300B SET amp and you'll have the beginnings of a great system.

 

Starting with speakers is how I've always built systems, matching amp is absolutely necessary at this point. I also like the open baffle suggestions if you're after the performers in room perspective. They may require more from an amp so that's a consideration.

Over many decades I evolved from box to open baffle to horns, horns matched with SET amp is magic for me. Again, the Volti's would be a great initial choice, they're an evolution from Klipsch Heritage, that's saying a lot.

@hilde45 You have given some great advice

@toontrader let’s circle back on your room dimensions. They could be a real challenge or you could do something really specia. The long wall may very well play into an outstanding fit for large Magnepans like the 3.7i and a sub(s), and something quite different on the narrow end, maybe British and more ’intimate’. KEF F, B&W amd Monitor Audio all offer excellent choices for that application. It really is a unique opportunity.

On the other hand, it think the room is just too long to be well served by a single pair of traditional cone speakers. Horns biggest benefit  is controlled directives, which could make a very small listening window if used on the long wall. Cones might have broader coverage, but thats a lot of room volume for them to fill with the amps being mentioned. 

@hilde45 OMG, I shrank your post. 🙄

@toontrader, when I read @tomcarr 's comment 

Acoustic treatment.

The room will dictate at least 50% of what your system will sound like.

followed by @hilde45 's

If I was in the position of the OP, I do the following:
1. Try to size up the assets and challenges of the acoustics of the room. 
I'd lay hands on whatever gear I can find to listen with.
I'd listen, position, and once some reasonable positioning is established, I'd measure for frequency response.
2. With the information gained above, I'd try to treat the rooms major flaws, focusing first on 20hz to 300 hz, since those frequencies have to be mastered before dealing with the rest of the range. I'd work a bit, next, on 300hz-20khz.
3. Having brought the room to a baseline of decent response, I'd do a bit of research on speakers and amps that will match my tastes and my room.
4. Next, I'd start borrowing speakers or buying, used. I'd get a decent solid state amp (used, hopefully a keeper) that can drive a bunch of speakers.
That would be the "launch sequence" to getting the basis of a good system going, in my opinion.
Sum:
Get the room ready.
-Try speakers and amp.
-Get final speakers.
-Get final amp.
-Figure out how to optimize the rest (preamp, DAC, cables, power, additional   treatments, subs)

I suspect that many of us got the first part of 'Sum' bass ackwards either long ago or too recently to be entirely comfy with, so....

New home?  Lucky....built to a plan of theirs' or yours'?  Make a sketch or copy that area of the plan with door/windows/ac plugs with the ceiling detail(s).  Dimension all.  Have it on phone or laptop when you prowl the B&M's.  Consider the what, where, and why.
Buy used for test purposes; if you absolutely must have a That, work on timing for a demo in situ. Or consider a gently used part of the (never, really) Final Outcome.

Have a great time. ;)  👍😎 J

I used to own the Revel Salon1 for 5 years and have heard the Salon2 a few times. For my ears the Salons are not as fun as the Blades. The thing with the Blades is that the soundstage on that thing is incredible. The aluminum Blade drivers are not my favorite but that soundstage, especially on a long wall placement is the best I have heard. I always have fun listening to the Blades.

In terms of cone drivers, I have not heard anything better than the Zylon drivers in the Yamaha NS5000. The Zylon is similar to Beryllium (BE) in the tweeter of the Salon2. However, while companies like Paradigm can make a BE tweeter and midrange in the Persona lineup, Yamaha is the only company to make tweeter, mid, and woofer from the SAME material. What that means is an incredibly coherent sound, especially when the cone material maybe the best around. Yamaha actually had the first BE tweeter and mid in the 1970’s in the NS1000.

I love the soundstage on the Blades and love the sound of the NS5000. My ideal speaker is a Blade with Zylon drivers. Even the Paradigm Persona 9H with Zylon (instead of BE and the woofer material) would be something special.

Saying all of this, the Blades are great, the NS5000 is great, and the Persona can be made great with some work. I take the NS5000 from this cohort.

I still own/have owned 1/2 of the speakers that somebody listed above.

If you post you want opinions on a speaker, 100 people will reply with a 100 different recommendations. IMO, start going to audio shows like the Tampa Show this weekend and you will see maybe 100 different speakers.

There are many speakers that are better than the kef blades for quite a bit less money. If you want some great sounding speakers for your room, used, you can pick up a pair of Revel Salon 2’s for $10k and would never need another speaker, then you will need a very good amp to power them. Look at the Usher BE10’s used for $7k, Usher BE20’s for $10k used, or the Totem Winds for $5k-$8k.

If you want something very close to the Kef Blades for 1/5 the cost, look at the Kef LS60’s that are active meaning they have the amps/dacs built in to the speakers. I’ve auditioned both speakers in the same largish room and I would buy the LS60’s. All you need is an Ethernet cable (or WiFi) and power to each speaker and you are done. Because you have a large room, I would also add 2 of the Kef subs which are easy to add to the LS60’s via the Kef app on your iPhone. 

If you are considering speakers other than a Volti or Harbeth 40.2, you should here a range of types—conventional box speakers, panel speakers like Magnepans, open baffle speakers like PureAudioProject. speakers meant for placement in the corners of the room, like Audio Note speakers, and other speaker types that you can see at shows.  The brands I mentioned above consistently deliver good sound, in my opinion.

Also, don’t stretch to get a speaker out of your price range if it means going cheap on the amp.  The right amp is very important to getting the right sound.

@toontrader Having owned both Harbeth 40.2 Anniversary's and horn speakers, I prefer horns.  I'm currently using Cary SLI 80 HS with factory cap and hexfred rectifier upgrades. Pairing this integrated with upgraded EL34's and NOS tubes is a sneaky good combo with horn speakers.  So based upon first hand experience, I'd pick the Volit / Cary combo over the much more expensive Harbeth 40.2's.

this rare model 4 with 1 damaged tweeter might still be available

seller says local pickup in Florida

pair of dynaudio d28 tweeters

Model II’s started with D21 tweeters, most were blown/replaced, several options exist, the D28 above was the tweeter for the Model 1.8

Model II Bass is a 10" and a 12" with the Bass Phase Shift Patent

Model 4, their last product: Bass is two 10" (in more cu. ft. cabinet), with the Bass Phase Shift Patent. I never saw or heard a Model 4, the Model II has more than enough bass IMO, and I prefer it’s appearance,

 

 

You will change whatever you start with, so make a start with used speakers, get listening, learn about the room.

I don’t care how much money you have, I would start with this pair of JSE Infinite Slope Model II’s. Two unique patents make discernable differences. Have seller drop them off unpackaged for you at his local UPS Pack and Ship (who you pre-arrange with).

Rosewood (walnut stained reddish)

 

They are easy for a woodworker to cover in a new select veneer after you fall in love with them. Recommended substitute drivers are known, the grille’s wood frame’s are easy to simply staple new cloth, the results will stand up against nearly anything you audition to replace them.

I owned and loved them

Change from 4 to 3 wheels, get advantages of easy movement

Toe-In Alternates, Stereo and Video

btw, they are shown backwards, you want the tweeters narrow beam on the inside

 

Volti Razz paired with a Cary SLI 80HS here and could not be happier! The synergy between them is sublime, like they were designed to work together. I’ve heard Volti plenty of times with Border Patrol amps and the sound is quite beautiful. But for me the Cary does everything i need and then some. Hits hard when I want to rock with Tool or Sanguisuabogg, or relax with Bill Evans and Oscar Peterson.

@toontrader Richard Vandersteen is still around, and still relevant.  One of the coolest "got it together" guys I've met in all my years of audio. 

The $20k budget is to include speakers, integrated amp (or amp & preamp)

Ah, ok. Well opinions will vary about integrated vs. separates, but I'd imagine you could get a pretty nice used speaker for 10-13k and then use the rest for a really good integrated or separates.

The $20k budget is to include speakers, integrated amp (or amp & preamp)

@yyzsantabarbara Good point. I wasn’t sure if he was planning to spend beyond that on other stuff. When you suggested he could get the Wotan for $2k, it made me think that it was $20k overall, not just for speakers. Otherwise, you could choose a more expensive amp option rather than just ensuring your suggestion (for  Kef + Wotan) come out to a neat $20k. I may be in error.

@hilde45 I thought the $20k budget was for speakers.

The NS5000 speaker that is posted above is a killer speaker and what I got for about $11k new. I tried it with the Wotan and the #16. I think all my gear was under $20k, new and used.

I listen to a lot of Zep on the NS5000.

BTW - for Blades you need a nice long wall. A lot of people place them in a confined space.

@yyzsantabarbara  A local guy to me is selling an almost new Blade 1 Meta for $18k. His ad and 2 others for under $20k are on USAM.

That's great to know. I don't know how the OP feels, but in my view, $18k or so on speakers almost depletes his $20k limit. If I had speakers as good as the Blades, I'd probably want a bit more in reserve for a power amp and other aspects of the system to fully optimize those speakers. $18k leaves him $2k, which doesn't leave enough budget, IMHO. 

Huh, What?? Harbeth is not a musician’s speaker.

This is a musician’s speaker, made by the guys who made all the musical instruments.

 

Harbeth knows something these guys didn’t? or what?

I noticed HARBETH as a recommendation. HARBETH is very high on my list of top speaker choices, but - - - I consider HARBETH a musician’s speaker.

“HARBETH is very high on my list of top speaker choices, but - - - I consider HARBETH a musician's speaker. Classical and Jazz sound incredibly realistic.”

My music taste is all over the map. I do like classical, acoustic and human voice. I’ve mostly left the hard rock of my youth, however I did enjoy “Becoming Led-Zeppelin” at an iMax theater this weekend.

Choosing a speaker first may be a good direction to take, however making that choice should and really must involve some serious auditioning. If it were me attempting to make my speaker choice FIRST, and assuming that I discovered a set of loudspeakers that really "rang my bell" (assuming that the audition involved some music and recordings that I enjoy and am familiar with), after the audition, I would make careful note as to the exact components used in the audition. Next, I would attempt to locate another knowledgeable brick and mortar dealer that has the same speakers but is recommending different system components to drive them.

This approach gives a person an opportunity to determine how those speakers perform with a different set of variants. If you come away from audition two, with a satisfactory conclusion, than there is better than a 50/50 chance that you will truly be satisfied with the purchase. Especially if you choose your components as a 
"post facto" approach, and of course, select components by reputation and hopefully, by audition.

Frankly I have found over the past 30 years or so of working with a wide range of audio reproduction components at all price levels, that most people I have run into tend to do their selection process in reverse to what you are planning. Honestly, I can't authoratively say either approach is the best road to take.

One thing I can inequitably say and recommend to you, is to "stay away from audio shows as a definitive way of making component selections".. Frankly, I haven't heard an audio demonstration since the late 50's at a major audio show, that really" rocked my boat" and has stuck in my mind all of these years. 

I noticed HARBETH as a recommendation. HARBETH is very high on my list of top speaker choices, but - - - I consider HARBETH a musician's speaker. Classical and Jazz sound incredibly realistic, (depending on room setup) They are not necessarily the most likeable choice for a person who has musical tastes in the direction of "ROCK", FUNK"; ABSTRACT MODERNISTIC SOUNDS, etc.. Especially to a person who prefers disproportionate, over driven bass reproduction.

There are a lot of fine speakers out there depending on taste. {Choose wisely grasshopper")

I like the idea of traveling to audio shows. I’ll need to keep an eye out for where and when can work for me. And yes, I’ll need to take my time. I was getting a bit antsy once I restarted my journey. Reading reviews and discussions herein along with the vast array of products gets me a bit worked up. I can be too impulsive. After all, the hunt is fun.

This is exactly the type of discussion and feedback I was hoping for. Hilde45, Thanks for the process notes as well as thoughts from larryi and knotscot. All helpful. Brick and mortar showrooms are hard to find outside of larger metropolitan areas, so I’m trying to first gain insight through verbal discussion and feedback before setting off on my quest during a renovation of my future home and listening room.

History - my first foray into the audio hobby began in the 80’s with Vandersteen 2s, then 2Cs along with Stan Warren’s ugly little Superphon Revalation preamp (replaced by ARC SP9) and Adcom GFA-555 amplifier. My last system in 2005 was based on Thiel CS6es driven by a pair of VTL MB450s. Not sure of the other elements of that final system as I seemed to have been continually moving pieces in and out at the time.

I look forward to enjoying the music again now that I’ve retired with time to focus anew on a most pleasant pastime.

@toontrader Two different worlds, but each intrigue me.

Yes. I’d suggest trying to decide if you want to go the A) higher efficiency speaker and lower power amp route. Or, B) the lower efficiency speaker and higher power amplifier route. Each path provides its own journey and type of sound. Each of these types of systems can provide a very different presentation and experience.

If you are comparing any new to used components, you can ask dealers if they have customers in your region who could show and share their systems - with the speakers or components you are looking at. Sometimes this can work out nicely. I’ve done some 2-day overnighters to go see and listen to other peoples systems. This can be helpful to get ideas of what YOU like. Traveling to a good audio show can be a real eyes and ears opener too. Take your time if you can, it will pay off and prevent major do-overs later on. 

@knotscott 

+1 Yep, look at contemporary speakers. 

I would review Stereophile, The Absolute Sound, and HiFi+ recommended component issues. Concentrate on descriptions that strike you as your liking in sound quality. 

Then get on the road. Make appointments with a couple dealers in advance to audition the best fit two or three. Find the one with the emotional connection. Not just that has the most detail and best slam.

@hilde45 A local guy to me is selling an almost new Blade 1 Meta for $18k. His ad and 2 others for under $20k are on USAM.

I was tempted to buy since the Blade has been my fav speakers for about a decade. However, I decided that the Yamaha NS5000 I own now is something I want to stay with.

Only issue with the Blade for the OP is that the Op’s power amp maybe too weak for the Blades. I would pair the Blades with either the $2k Schitt Wotan or the $20k CODA #16. Both of which I own. Those 2 amps have prodigious power. The Wotan is not at the sonic levels of the #16 (but close). It is at the level of many apps that are considered top notch. Schitt also have a 15-day home trial.

 

Of course it depends on what you value most; smooth rich sound w/ nice subtle details often w/ good 3 D imaging or more live, dynamic sound that can rock out without straining or requiring heroic amplification. Very challenging to find both in speakers that cost under $20K. You’ve got a big room so if you like to play loud & enjoy music w/ real bass, a high sensitivity speaker may be your only choice in your price range. Volti Rivals work very well for me in a big room w/ good tube amplification (Rogers High Fidelity). 

@hilde45 

Bravo!

Fantastic summation.

Orderly progression.

Now THAT'S how to set up a dedicated room!

 

@tomcarr  Agreed. 

If I was in the position of the OP, I do the following:

1. Try to size up the assets and challenges of the acoustics of the room. 
I'd lay hands on whatever gear I can find to listen with.
I'd listen, position, and once some reasonable positioning is established, I'd measure for frequency response. 

2. With the information gained above, I'd try to treat the rooms major flaws, focusing first on 20hz to 300 hz, since those frequencies have to be mastered before dealing with the rest of the range. I'd work a bit, next, on 300hz-20khz.

3. Having brought the room to a baseline of decent response, I'd do a bit of research on speakers and amps that will match my tastes and my room. 

4. Next, I'd start borrowing speakers or buying, used. I'd get a decent solid state amp (used, hopefully a keeper) that can drive a bunch of speakers. 

That would be the "launch sequence" to getting the basis of a good system going, in my opinion. 

Sum:

• Get the room ready.
• Try speakers and amp.
• Get final speakers.
• Get final amp.
• Figure out how to optimize the rest (preamp, DAC, cables, power, additional treatments, subs).

Acoustic treatment.

The room will dictate at least 50% of what your system will sound like.

food for thought https://speakerchoices.com/