Fantasy or reality? Inexpensive solid state preamps that get you 80% there?

@mr_bill  I actually don't have any problems with the remote for the Pre90.  I sit right in front of my rack though and I'm about 8 feet away.  Guess I'm one of the few that has no complaints about it.

@drewdawg999 

Drew - do you have any of the 'sensitive' remote problems with your Pre 90 - that it doesn't work well from long distances or you have to aim it perfectly?

This is a question that will give you infinity answers.  What one person thinks is good, the other will justify that its not due to the looks, price or specs.  The Schiit Freya + or Saga  brings excellent value as a pre amp costing less than $1k.  Heck, the Emotiva PT-100 at $300 bring even better value at this price point.  If your budget is a $4k system, you're in this range.  If your in a $10k budget, your llooking at McIntosh, and if your at $50k, your in a new realm. People who have unlimited disposable income will never be happy with a lower price cost preamp.  It just won't allow them to say it sounds good, its a phychological effect knowing something cheap is that good. I have never met an audiophile person with one system, they chase for something better.  And thats fine, its a fun hobby and costly too.

I'd have to cast my vote for the Topping Pre90. I love mine, plug my turntable and my DAC into it and they both sound great. State of the art performance for not a lot of cash. Was lucky to nab one used like new for less than 500 bucks. Balanced XLR out to my amp, RCA out to the sub, being put to work and performing. Amazingly neutral and transparent, so much delicious detail and clarity and drive. Relay volume control is top notch, and has volume memory, very useful for switching between sources. 

@hilde45 ...Correct, but the Tortuga is an LDR type and once everything is correct it`s a pretty good passive.

Tortuga has no gain, right? I tried an excellent passive and it was too lifeless.

Denafrips - HESTIA or HADES

Wyred 4 Sound - STP-SE (used)

Try a Tortuga Audio LDR...pretty sure you can get a free home demo.

It will most certainly get you 80% +++++  

@doyle3433 No worries. You're about the 40th person to suggest tubes. No one really reads closely, so you're not an outlier on that.

Ahhh… yes, thank you for pointing that out. The Rogue output stage is tube.

Apologies 

@doyle3433 Is the Rogue RP-1 a solid state preamp? That's the topic.

I have a rogue RP-1 and really enjoy it. A bonus is the phono stage is pretty darn good. 

@doni Now we're talking! Thank you!

OK, I've got one for you.  The SPL Volume2 is a very simple,  very good sounding preamp from Germany, with only one input and one output (both balanced), an ALP's potentiometer, and a mute switch.  I bought mine for $300 from Terry London, and use it all the time in my desktop setup because I don't need a remote, and it just sounds so great.  Very transparent, neutral, truely a "straight wire with gain".  Check out some reviews (particularly the 6Moons one).  I've got some much more expensive preamps, both SS and tube, and none sound any better, just different. 

I owned an Audio Research SP-5 in 1980 for nearly ten years. For its time it sounded very good… it was the most expensive preamp I could afford (used). Great solid construction. A bit lean on the midrange and bass.

The way I look at it, there has been… let me guess, nine successor preamps (I have owned or heard many of them) and in each case the new one sounded significantly better than the former. So, that adds up to a lot of difference. ARC is a good example because they have had a very consistent target on achieving realistic high fidelity over the lifetime of the company, not wavering around on flashy or chase specifications… of exaggerating some aspect of the sound.

But of course it depends on what you are after. The best sound you can get or stopping at some threshold that makes you happy.

@hilde45 Yes, if owning the same as  your two other preamps I couldn't see one using anything but a high end SS one as an alternative. 

Thanks for the additional suggestions. I've been listening to a very very good DIY preamp and it's not convincing me this is a path worth going too far with. At this point, I really want to try a very very very good SS preamp (maybe try one from TMR for a couple weeks) to really rule it in or out. OR get a cheap backup unit -- Topping or Schiit. Otherwise, the critical listening I've done lately says "don't bother."

Audio Research SP-5 is the best solid state preamp I’ve heard, and they’re about a thousand now because of all the bad reviews, haha. I do run it through a tube power amp though, most people were probably running it in a full solid state system.

The Nuprime ST 10 mentioned above is a power amp, just as an fyi

Solid state preamps under $1K.

New:  Topping Pre90, Schiit Freya S (I have and like the Freya + but you said no tubes)

Used: Adcom GFP-750 — great preamp (I have one) by Nelson Pass that is either passive or active; Acurus RL11 or LS11 both punched well above their price point and are <$500; Forte Model 2

Wait a second. I just purchased a used Dennis Had Inspire 3.1 tube preamp for $1k. So why would anyone purchase a SS preamp? A tube preamp is far more expressive. But then again, you’ve got to own both, I do.

Need to have my B and K pro 10mc recapped and new vol pot. 
bought new in Mid 90’s great pre. 
my best is the aging Onkyo p308, simply smooth, great house sound, has depth, and always works since bought used 10+ years ago. Has a house sound which is deep, rich, and gives recordings a nice warmer rich sound, the b and k, is very neutral.

 Saved for extra year and a half, to get the Sanders sound “the preamp” with MM/MC  card. This thing is fast, or it seems to push the sound, or something, ads ZERO, house sound, it is the textbook definition of wire with gain, I always use it in stock mode. Simple, no added tone, bass, highs, anything, just allows music to hit speakers as the recording is recorded. So good in,..etc etc. 

looks classy, no strange shape, or added large knobs, just a small unit which is flawless and passes recordings through as the recording intended. 
 

 Plus Roger is a gem in the audio world, his knowledge, and no BS approach is great. 
 

wanting to get the Onkyo rehabbed soon, and use for another 20 years (I hope)

  not a better house sound preamp than that p308.  She is my emerald.

makes most my metal demos sound full, and listenable. Sanders plays as it is, which for acoustic, and some rock/ Dylan, eagles, sound amazing. Speakers have zero “s” swerve sounds. Took me 35+ years to achieve what some get in a single paycheck, the journey was a blast, I’m done for a while.

\,,/

The Rotel and Coda are SS, but I was answering your initial $4k or less new or used.  I didn’t follow this thread which seems that you are now looking for SS only at $1k or less.  Good luck.

@kennyc Which of those are solid state amps? All of them? I hope so, because that’s what this thread is about. And how many are around $1k or less? Thanks for your relevant input.

preamps w positive reviews:
3.1 Icon Audio LA4 MkIII SIGNATURE LINE PREAMP- D.O.

-4.0 Rotel Michi P5 (to match their amps, DAC also good)

4.0 Supratek,

5.3 Audible Illusions L3B

5.4 First Sound Presence Deluxe MkIII-SI- Special Edition

7.2 Coda 07x FET Preamplifier.

All of the best sounding systems I have ever used or owned , or heard had one thing in common.   A great preamp.  Usually the most expensive component in the chain.   I had a Zesto Leto for a short time and it completely elevated the performance of everything around it.  
 

Your original target price of $4k seems like a lot now but you’ll soon forget about the price if you buy something like a Backert or CJ.     Or whatever suits your taste.

I have a RME DAC that I tried running direct.   Boring.    Put a great preamp after any good DAC and Bam…. Much more realistic   I retired that DAC for a fixed output tube DAC and it is sublime 

Sometimes you get what you need in unlikely places. Over the years I've owned maybe a half dozen solid state and 4 tubed preamplifier's since first buying a used Sumo Athena. 

I always go back to it, like right now.

After enquiring about improving on it in passive mode, I generally hear from manufacturer's salespeople- oh of course! What are you using right now? When told, they have all said, well, that's a pretty good passive stepped attenuator. It's not likely you'd hear an improvement.

The only thing I'm missing is remote control with it, and only for movies or cable in my all in one 2.1 system, and for that I use a CS 3010 volume control I built for just over $75 Canadian.

It's not new, but has been fine for me over the last 25 years or so, so my original $300 buying second hand price isn't bad at all, and I recovered the cost of most of my "upgrade preamplifiers" it's bested.

Athena doesn't have "wow" frequency abberations to get attention. She might not be great at any one thing, but is pretty good at everything 

@tomcarr Thank you! Exactly what I was hoping for.

I realize that some people use tube preamps as their aesthetic standard for all preamps, but for those who do not, what word best describes a solid state preamp at its best?

I would say neutral, transparent, clarity, cohesiveness top to bottom, quiet.

I remain honestly surprised how well $1500 Nuprime ST 10 sounds (airy,  tuby and enough detailed). 

It's interesting how, for some, the way a solid state preamp is praised is with words like "tuby" -- as if, solid state preamps need to measure up to tube preamps.

I realize that some people use tube preamps as their aesthetic standard for all preamps, but for those who do not, what word best describes a solid state preamp at its best?

I remain honestly surprised how well $1500 Nuprime ST 10 sounds (airy,  tuby and enough detailed). 

Thanks for the additional suggestions, especially the Threshold, which sounds interesting. @avanti1960 your SLP-05 sounds lovely, but I have a tube preamp I like. Does Cary make an SLP in solid state, too? You keep telling me about tube preamps, but maybe you're telling me about a solid state alternative, which is what I'm asking about?

My 6SN7 is very close to the Dehavilland Ultraverve III. It's everything I need in a tube amp, which is why tube amp mentions are totally irrelevant to this thread. 

I skipped to the end.. I started with realistic recievers and dept store speakers and have worked my way from there. I think the closest we can get to a decent compromise is 2 to 1, speakers to amp. As speakers get better so does their ability to let us hear cheap components, I thought all amps sounded the same because I was shopping the same price range. So your speakers will tell you when you need to upgrade the amp/pre, likewise if you have an extremely difficult room the amps might make a bigger difference tonally than the same outlay towards speakers 

No offense, but I've run the Apt Holman years ago and it was truly lifeless in my system.  You deserve much better.  The 4K estimate is close enough for Sugden Masterclass which I also own.  It is remarkable.  I give a Stereophile weblink only for reference.  I'm not flogging them.  Class A grips and controls the music.

Now that you are open to used the Threshold FET 2 might just fit the bill. I owned one many moons ago. If you check HIFI shark you should score one within your budget. BTW, Threshold was the company that Nelson Pass started. FET solid state have a tube like sound!

@hilde45 

I retraced my preamp upgrade path to demonstrate that as you go up in price, the sound will likely improve. 

The biggest bang in a great preamp is power supply for low noise, dynamic delivery and an exciting presentation.  Passive preamps simply cannot deliver the dynamics and excitement that a great active one can.

My SLP-05 uses low noise R-core power transformers and a stand alone power supply chassis.  Incredible sound. 

You get what you pay for.   

@panerai557 ...However, more you read reviews, forums, and listen to other systems, your preferences will change and upgrade desire will start eating you from inside.

Or, one day you go and listen to someone else’s system or at a show where they believe it sounds really good, sitting there asking yourself WTF? Simply need to try stuff with your own speakers, room, cables and system anyhow - - if one has any hope of giving yourself and existing investments a fair chance to evolve reasonably.

I do not like autoformer passives, just as an fyi.....they are completely different. But, I understand.

@hilde45,

The Aragon Aurum is a nice balanced solid state preamp.

Mike

@panerai557  I have an enviable system. It does much of what I want. This thread is about getting a SS preamp that can serve in a subsidiary way, some of the time.

@mrdecibel  Why not go passive? Because I tried it with an exceptional passive autoformer and the results lacked gain and robustness. They were too lifeless in my system.

@avanti1960 
Thanks for your feedback. You list a bunch of tube amps. I'm not interested in tube amps and this is not a thread about tube amps.

Now days even listening Spotify from macbook pro can give a decent music listening for many people. But we audiophiles want something more, we want to experience that realism and stereo effect that surrounds our head- da magic!  Unfortunately, to create that magic involves lot of effort and money, potentially. You can be totally satisfied with schiit and other inexpensive solutions. However, more you read reviews, forums, and listen to other systems, your preferences will change and upgrade desire will start eating you from inside.

Why not just go passive, like the TOTL Luminous Audio unit, near your budget. Do you really need additional gain ? All of the preamps mentioned have a color, which you have with your tube units. If you want clarity, ime, go passive....and even the entry level Luminous is far superior to the SYS, from my actual experience. Douk Audio makes a passive superior to the SYS. I have RGR, AGI, Hegeman, Soundcraftsmen, Hitachi, Hafler, Apt, Superphon preamps, and others, and they all are colored, sacrifice detail and neutrality vs the Luminous. Many have been modified, and still fall short, ime. What do you want ?, is the biggest question. Keep in mind, passive is not for everyone, but if the gain and impedance match, it could be the way....Just my thoughts after 50 years of this BS....lol. My best to all, MrD.

With few exceptions you get what you pay for in reasonably priced high end audio. The caveat being if the rest of your system can take advantage of it.

My most recent preamps include-

1) Vintage early 80’s Pioneer solid state. Used as a backup. Sound is lackluster and dull. Small sound stage, poor dynamics.

2) Rogue Audio RH-5 Linestage / Headphone amp. Tube buffer stage. Sound was spectacularly dynamic and powerful. Sound stage very large in all directions. Tonality was neutral and refinement was good.

3) Rogue Audio RP-7 preamp. Sound was rich and beautiful. Dynamics not as good as the RH-5. Sound stage was large. Sound was a touch too burnished but highly refined and colorful.

4) Cary Audio SLP-98. Sound was slightly rich and neutral. Transparency and tone accuracy / musical recognition was through the roof- goosebumps. Dynamics were very good, refinement good. Soundstage very large.

5) Cary Audio SLP-05. Sound is warm, rich but highly detailed. Amazing high end sound quality- refined and colorful- passes the ears test with flying color. Dynamics very good. Sound stage is enormous in all directions, the sound projects out to the listener.  My final preamp.  

Great question. Quite possibly the answer is yes. In other forums, fans of throwback Wharfedale Lintons actively explore the same question. Fan favorites there include the full featured Cambridge AX81, Leak 230 and the interesting Vincent hybrids, including the bargain priced SV500.

@kennyc As I indicated in a number of my responses in this thread, I'm open to new or used. See comments below about some of the better used options people have mentioned. I'm interested to hear your views!

I was thinking used, or are you considering for new gear only?

Aesthetix Calypso  -- is $6k. Not $1k. But you like it -- I get it. 

+1 Aesthetix Calypso 

I know it has a very positive reputation, that’s why their Aesthetix Mimas integrated was on my short list until I blew up my budget.