When were the best tube amps made?

Like asking who was the best fiddler. Paganini not eligible.

Modern state-of-the-art tube amps continue to evolve and push the envelope ever farther, so the best tube amps ever made are likely on a test bench right now.  The Convergent Audio Technology Statement Extreme comes to mind.   

@knotscott  No argument with CAT!!

There are other aspects to this question. IMHO value must certainly enter the equation. All amplifiers are compromises on some dimension. Either with respect to size, weight, convenience, aesthetic considerations, system synergy.

Nowadays there are many very fine builders who have studied the history of this field and are now seeking out the best components they can find.

Synergy with the desired speakers is also important. In my system, with my 94dB efficient speakers, 1.5 watt amplifiers sound superb.

Guess my short answer is the best amplifiers are being made now.

After Audio Note kondo' s Ongaku.

NYC at Julius Futterman’s West Side apartment. His hand-made OTL tube amps remain unequaled today! Starting in the late 50’s with the H1 and H2 triode OTL’s , then in 1964 with the H3 Harvard Music HB5 pentode OTL stereo chassis and finally the H3aa mono 6LF6 OTL’s in 1975. The H3 was the only one to get a mainstream audio mag review by High Fidelity in 1964. In 1976/77 The Audio Critic reviewed the H3aa mono’s and was quite impressed! Julius died in August 1981. Soon afterwards I bought my first pair of H3aa’s (#111A,111B) from a Boston dealer (Q Audio). I used them with the Quad 57’s.

You can find great tube amps throughout the time they have been made.  There haven’t been any technological breakthroughs in recent decades that render older models mere outmoded.  One of the best I’ve ever heard is the Western Electric 59A, which is from the early 1930’s.  I also like Western Electric 124 and 133 amps.

I have heard a few good OTL amps from the 1990’s to current times and these might be considered more “recent” in design than most tube amps.  The quasi-OTL amps, like Berning’s ZOTL amps, represent a sort of modern innovation, but, I personally don’t much care for the sound of the amps I’ve heard.

Most of the parts in tube amps have not been improved much in a very long time.  The best output transformers from the past remain highly sought after because they sound better than most currently manufactured ones (e.g., Chicago, Accrosound, Western Electric).  The same with tubes themselves—many older tubes sound better than current versions.  Perhaps some newer parts, like teflon caps, are an improvement in certain applications, but, in many of the amps I really like, old parts, like some paper-in-oil caps sound very good.  Some current manufacturers make great new parts, like Audio Note, but they charge a small fortune for them.

When I was selling audio in the 70’s, I sold and delivered a new system to an elderly man.  He owned a Fisher tube integrated and a Fisher tube tuner and he gave it to me!  I had our service tech go through it ( it needed nothing) and used it for a few years.  I kept them around and used them on and off.  They had that really lush and addictive midrange.  I lent them to a friend who was between systems and he got divorced and his wife wouldn’t let him take the system, even though she knew I lent it to him.  Eventually, I got them back but I think she ran over them with her car because they were in totally damaged shape.  When I questioned her she said the moving guys dropped them out of her second floor window.  I knew she was lying.   I wish I had those 2 pieces today as I would have used it in my office with some very efficient speakers.   The tubes were EL34 I can’t remember what the rectifier tube was but I think there were something like 12 or 13 tubes in the integrated and a few in the tuner.  

How I used to lust for a pair of VT 150 SE’s when I was young. Never heard a pair, but they were all the talk in Stereophile and TAS in the early 90’s. I bet today with a LS5 they still sing. Remember around 1990 or so going to Audio Perfection and listening to a pair of Jadis with dedicated power supplies, four full size chassy’s on maybe Wilson WP 5’s and was floored. By far that was the first system I heard that had me chasing that sound to this day. My opinion, today tubes are a pain in the ass and I’m fine with my Pass. I also own a Cary tube amp that’s magical but right now she’s being difficult…

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Unobtanium like vintage Western Electric aside, there has never been a better time for tube amps  than NOW. !!!!     

There's a tube Renaissance and it's right now.   So many great independent builders and large mainstream companies offering more tube gear than ever .   

Probably from 1998 or so to present by Wavac. Not a good value, but taking things to the extreme, no one else has done or attempted to do what Wavac has been doing. 

@fsonicsmith Don’t mind fan boys/fan girls, but tell us a little of why you think they are exceptional, please!

P.S. - Are they still in business?  Their website hasn't been updated in years.

Another version of "back in the good old days".  I suspect with tube amps or anything else, it's hard to say that advancements in design and technology haven't improved todays products over things being built in the past.  Politicians being the exception to the rule. 

Now. So many choices at so many price  and quality levels.

Due to the improvement in component materials the best sounding amps are probably being produced today.  Unfortunately the best tubes produced are from the 40s and 50s.  It does seem that recent  tube manufactures are  focusing on producing a better quality product but at a increased cost.  That makes sense as the numbers produced are so much lower than they were in their hay day.  

The best amps were made when Japanese thoroughness joined American ingenuity: think Wavac, Shindo, Yamamoto, Kondo and nowadays Allnic, Zanden and Luxman

Another version of "back in the good old days". I suspect with tube amps or anything else, it’s hard to say that advancements in design and technology haven’t improved todays products over things being built in the past. Politicians being the exception to the rule.

You got that right, and I wish we could fix it! 😲

I also agree with the rest of your comment. Engineers and designers are as well educated than ever, and they can do things that weren’t common practice decades ago. With every advancement in capacitor, speaker, measurement, and wire technology, it becomes easier to hear some of the subtle things that were masked by the systems of the 50s, 60s, 70s, etc. Transformers in general aren’t as robust as they once were (as with most things), but the capability definitely exists and forges on over time....at the cutting edge of amplifier technology transformers are better than ever.  At the entry levels, not so much.

Even though it’s controversial for some things, I know that cryogenics are used at many levels of the true SOTA stuff. Kodak used cryogenics many, many years ago to make their machines and tools last longer, and many audio engineers are experimenting using it on other materials and aspects of audio.

Who knows....in 50 years maybe computer circuits will be housed inside a vacuum to make better sound!

and an honorable mention to the OTL crowd: Futterman, Graaf, Ralph Carsten and Dave Berning

D-150  1975.  I have heard that the 1995 Ref 600 III was as good.

 

Did I fit your "timeline?"

Any amp that can't even reproduce a simple sine wave doesn't count. If the negative half of a sine wave doesn't go down as far as the positive half goes up the amp is non linear and may be musical but it's not fidelity. If it does that to a sine wave think how poorly it will do on much more complex music wave forms. By the way this means every single ended amp and it's not curable since it's inherent in single ended topology.

2022. Audio Research, Conrad Johnson, VAC… unless you have different sound preferences from me.

@jasonbourne52  they all sound the same the cheaper the better. Snake oil!

IMO the older amps benefited from better transformers.  Think Dynaco.  In repairing audio components for close to 30 years now, the transformers have stood the test of time but the circuit boards have generally failed.  Each manufacturer from back in the day had build a few amplifiers that still sound great today especially with a few parts upgrades.  Just finished an old Audio Research D-79B.  Once upgraded, it really sounded great.  A beast of an amp though.  Futterman, Graaf, Lafayette, etc., were great sounding amplifiers, even some Counterpoints amps sounded great.  Unfortunately, 20 to 30 years later, they need to be repaired.

As someone else mentioned already, no real advances in tube amps but there are a few really good tube manufacturers around today that build excellent amplifiers.  My company is one of them. Hand built, point-to-point wired, best parts available that are even better sounding than the old amplifiers.  There are a few of us still making great equipment.

Happy Listening.

 

 

 

The best tube amps are being made today. Unfortunately, with the exception of the best current 300Bs, the best tubes aren't. But from, say, the 1950s to the current day, the pace of improvement in SS amp technology has radically outstripped tube technology.

@antigrunge2 - Allinic is a South Korean company, did you mean AirTight

When were the best tube amps made?  Last Thursday.

What were they?  Conrad Johnson.

Kondo, Allnic, Airtight, Audio note (uk), WAVAC, all make great sounding tube amps, but they are not necessarily better than vintage models (even the older models of these companies will favorably compare with current manufacture).  I am particularly enamored with modern tube amps from the Italian company Synthesis.  But, my absolute favorites remain quite old Western Electric amps and a custom built OTL from the early 1990s.

Yesterday 

1980's Audio Research need not apply. 

 

Of course I was deliberately being a bit of a troll here, but I always liked CJ of the era better than ARC, and I like modern ARC a lot more as well.   :-)

All in good fun.

Really like this post as someone who is on the fence about tubes in general. After a the posts I'm still on the fence.... But CJ might have a greener field. Peace

Tomorrow.

I'd still go with a properly maintained 240.

 

Having both vintage and new tube components, I prefer the older stuff - think Marantz 8B, Fisher 800c, Citation I and II, heck even my original Sansui 1000x is highly regarded in a sea of vintage and new solid state and tubes. The older stuff often benefits from simpler designs and less complexity in the signal path. Of course modern technology is more advanced, but modern tubes sound more like solid state to my ears. Why would I want printed boards in a tube component? All that said, I’m on the waiting list for a Decware triode amp. Gotta see for myself what all the hype is about. 

Most individuals today only receive demonstrations from a very modern design for a Tube Amp'.

The Companies were becoming more 'Corporate Like' the Bean Counters were taken advice from Techies who had not respect for tradition.

Resulting in designs that were enforced to change Topology and Schematics were designed to omit Transformers from the Circuits. Streamlining the component count and casing dimensions took precedent, over overall performance.

If a Amp' with circuits from the period of Halcyon, is discovered and breathed on with a sympathetic approach, using the accuracy of modern components to interface with the Olden World irreplaceable components, now one is 'cooking on gas'.

Barn finds are still big business, as the few in the know, charge substantial amounts to allow another to share in the secret.

    

I think it depends what kind of tube amplifiers.

The are number of types:

1. Low power SET under 10 watt - 45, 2A3, 300B, PX25, AD1,...

2. High power SET over 10 watt - 211, 845,...

3. Small push-pull up to 20 watt - EL84, 6V6,...

4. Mid power push-pull 20-50 watt - EL34, KT66,...

5. High power push-pull over 50 watt - KT88,...

6. OTL

It also depends for what kind of speakers these amplifiers for.

@alexberger  Those look like tube names, not amps. :)

Erik, I didn't find your OP trolly.  But the SP10 is an 80s AR design and it is difficult to beat.  But when Krell entered the market around that time with the KSA50, it had that era's valve amps beat.  I still have mine and it's still very good.

Why should I care?

1987

the best tube amps are being made now.

modern power tubes are in some important ways “better”, i.e. kt-120, Kt-150 and Kt-170 have greater plate dissipation.  So amps using those tubes can be designed which exceed past efforts, in a more compact form factor.

modern biasing controls have advanced, yielding better sound see, e.g., VAC.

even transformers have advanced; amps can be designed are quieter toroids with wider bandwidth.  Capacitors and other parts are improved. 

I loved my Mesa Baron, but 12 power tubes was too much to deal with.  Keeping an old tube amp going is like having an old sports car - more ongoing maintenance is required than a modern design.  To send it back to the factory cost over $500, round trip. 

the build quality of my Rogers integrated is Nasa-satellite level, way better than anything from ”back in the day”

Today, also with recent output and input tubes coming into focus past 3 years. 

If value is a concern, Quicksilver, Aric audio, Don Sachs, others + with a few small upgrades can be a great value with some patience and letting go of some of the vintage stuff. Clean simple designs, easy to repair, less-is-more circuit designs.   

 

Absolutely right now. Just heard a pair of VAC Master 300 monoblocks. Holy cow. These have me thinking that AMP is the most important component of the audio chain. Including room.

In terms of engineering brilliance and sheer transparency, timbre and attack Nobu Shishido’s Wavac designs are unequalled in my mind 

Music Reference, Roger Modjeski amps.  

The question finally goes down with today or past.

When we talk about tube amplifiers, we should  be more focused on music. When we listen the music, what is important? If we are talking about the  enjoyment of the music, and whether matter it is the original sound, then I vote for today 's amplifier. Otherwise, it is definitely belongs to the past.

Interesting topic,and I will add more. If the amplifier make the sound more beauty, and it looks like not the real one. I call the declaration of sound. Do you like or dislike? Let me be clear, there is no wrong or right. It is your choice, and I just dislike that kind of sound. Someone do, as far as I know. So it becomes the huge background when we talk the best tube amplifiers.

When I had Spendor 2/3 speakers I liked these speakers in combination with McIntosh MC30 monoblocks from 1950x. Than I moved on to high sensitive speakers Altec 604E I recognised that 30 Watt push-pull is too rough for such speakers.

I decided to go to 300B SET DIY amplifier. For high sensitive speakers SET sound much more refined and transparent and not less musical than McIntosh. 

After living 17 years with high sensitivity speakers, I will never go back to low sensitivity. As a result, high power tube amplifiers are no longer interesting to me.
 

Modern tube types, like KT 120, KT 150, and KT 170 deliver more power, but to my taste, they don’t sound that good.  I like much lower power alternatives, but of course that means having speakers suited to lower power.  I will take a modern or vintage 6L6 or KT 66 amp over amps capable of running higher power types.

Over the last few years I have learned to appreciate the work of small, "boutique" builders. These talented artisan/engineer/enthusiasts can produce equipment that performs at an elite level. In my experience they are all working with vintage, very low output tubes. The equipment is produced in tiny quantities for the hardest of the hard-core zealots.

For a long time I listened, with great enjoyment, to amplifiers with prodigious power. I loved it. They sounded great. I’m not saying that high powered amplifiers, SS or tube, can’t sound wonderful.

But I noticed something. Lots of times I’m listening in the near field at 65 - 75 dB. On my 94 dB efficient speakers that means I’m listening to much less than a watt.

I had the chance to try a 300B, point-to-point wiring, zero negative feedback amp. Loved it. Now I'm down the rabbit hole listening to amps employing ancient 45 tubes. Glorious.

Yes, I appreciate that the dynamics of the music can sometimes require huge, instantaneous spikes of current and power. And I also appreciate that these low powered amps can produce a lot of distortion, if driven beyond their limits. But, for my listening, to my mixture of jazz, classical, vocal, dub, hip-hop, ambient, country, soul and R ’n B, I don’t think that’s happening. Again, my music, my preferences, my system. So, might not work for everybody. I get that. And I’m not trying to argue with anybody. Just trying to encourage others to really think about how they are really listening and how much power they need.