Here’s what you don’t want to hear: unfortunately, the more you spend, the better the sound. At every step along the way, there’s going to be a mismatch, where one part of your system exposes weaknesses of another part of your system. There’s no way around it. Figure out how much you can afford to spend, without being stressed about the expense, then spend it upgrading your weakest components first, but eventually you’ll need to upgrade your entire system. Look at it like a journey, and enjoy the differences, and the journey, but especially the music.
Of course, during the upgrade process, you'll need to ensure that your components will work together, by checking input sensitivities, and input and output impedances, etc.
|
Upgrade your loudspeakers and add better gear as budget allows.
|
I'd keep the blue sound node and buy a great multi bit DAC that should sort your sources out for the downstream. I've bought a few streamers and really don't see the sound for $ here in hi end streamers. unlike a DAC or other areas. The DAC should be able to be used with both your streamer and CD player so its a double upgrade.
|
Thanks for feedback
Yeah this is early on in a journey Im enjoying so far. I ideally want to maximize performance with the fewest components, even as far as where I ’finish’, but obviously will replace every part of this system more or less at some point.
Definitely enjoy focusing on myself as a music lover first, but its plain to hear what Id get going from sonetto I to O.N. 1 or electa amator III in terms of imaging capability and SS depth. Just the Olympica Nova standmount is a massive upgrade.
If, like I mentioned, I don’t really have a ’listening room’ or even a larger room...what is the best solution to getting some controlled but blended oomph in the lower octaves? I don’t want to overpower a room with floor standings (I’ve heard the Olympica Nova floors would do this likely)...
Would eventually getting nova i’s, then a sub be the best solution for a small space? alternatively the amator 2 way floor standing maybe is the best SF for a smaller space?
So far the low-end from the sonetto I is satisfactory for the known sacrifices im making but ideally I can get a good full range experience in a multiuse room that isn’t necessarily entirely laid out for speaker placement far from walls etc.
|
To map out an upgrade path 1st consider how much you are thinking to spend through out the trip. Do you plan on selling your existing equipment as they are replaced?
Then think about where to start, source end or speaker end. If source end I would look into a DAC. If speaker end then think of a matching amplifier as well.
I will get back with more thoughts, need to get offline for now.
Good luck in your audio travels enjoy the ride!
|
Haven't seen any headphone information. I'd add headphones or amp-headphone combo. Other than that, I see you like all of your components
|
Of the components you list, the Marantz is probably last in line for an upgrade if only being used as a transport. Head of the line would probably be a stand-alone DAC as an addition, or complete replacement of the Arcam. Have you considered a Hegel integrated or the Parasound HINT?
|
op
your system is reasonably well balanced as it is, good job (and good job on asking for advice in a way that is informative to us who can provide it!)
i would say in your case, getting a rel sub to couple with the sf’s would be the biggest single move, then second move would be a better dac - maybe a schiit gumby, mhdt tube dac or chord 2qute/qutest (depending on whether you want more transparency or warmth in your improved sound), third move would be to get a better integrated like a hegel, but the sonic impact would only be felt in this move only if the first two moves were done
good luck, have fun
|
@twoleftears I liked the Hint but I felt for >2x more money than the Arcam it was mostly just more power, with some additional edge. I preferred the smoother sound of the arcam...knowing that id rather do a more measurable upgrade a couple steps down the line. For that im considering Denafrips Pontus II with Luxman 505uXII, maybe a one box solution if a get a deal on a mid-tier/larger Moon or Hegel. The Luxman I just found a tier above them all.
Personally I found the Arcam a very well done integrated in its price range and really for the purposes of my current speakers everything the SA-30 offers in terms of sound, sans some of the digital convenience features. I do like Hegels but I didn’t really prefer them until the H390 which would be a ’future’ upgrade anyway. The Luxman/DF-P combo was a really special one that rang to me as a ’proper’ step up, and better than the H390 personally after testing on various SF/paradigm/Totem at a local shop. Unfortunately have only heard Moon int’s at another shop that doesn’t sell SF, so on Dynaudio (generally like a lot as well, my second choice of brand behind SF)
EDIT to the above: I realize I may come off as stubborn about the Arcam. Maybe a tad but I sort of saw it as the best ’musical’ sounding all in one int until I spend in the range of 4k+...which I do expect to do, just wanted room to grow. The main thing is I found the parasound really beneficial for forward sounding speakers but I don’t always want to be leaning forward on the edge of my seat which I felt the Hint6 would be like. Hegels less so for sure, and the wonderfully black BG is a huge benefit for sure with them. Once I have floor standings I feel that lvl of readiness to manage low end bass is gonna come in handy
@jjss49 Thanks for that feedback! I wanted to be thorough but also I won't lie...even though I know how modest my setup is, im still a little proud of it the way I was when I got my HD650's and first headphone amp (some fiio or something haha) and wanted to share it with the community. Excited for what I hear and learn as my ear and tastes grow.
Yeah I actually started loving Paradigm prestige 85fs as the first 'starter' speaker 'wow' moment in a store, and then the founder 100fs...but realized the more I listened the sonetto can have an organic quality that I connect with. I sort of built my system to lean into that and, for now at least, see my future as just refining that sound more and more with better pieces. What you say about starting with sub, THEN amp upgrade like Hegel makes a lot of sense to me. It just didn't seem worth getting 190+ unless they would play more of a role in the bass department. Looking at starting with a REL T/5x for now.
@czarivey Headphone stuff:
Senn 650’s
DCA A2 Noire
Focal Utopia (v1)
CA Andromeda 2020 (these get some unfair hate, imo!)
Grado GS-1000
Desk Amp: Schiit Jot 1 w/dac...hopefully will upgrade this to a smoother Burson sometime soon
Living Room Amp: Bottlehead Mainline1.1
|
what is the best solution to getting some controlled but blended oomph in the lower octaves?
Good question and kinda where I was going. Possibly the most impactful and immediate improvement you could make would be to add a pair of good subs — yes, definitely a pair as it improves performance markedly and makes it easier to deal with room issues. I’d suggest a pair of SVS SB1000 Pro subs you can get for $1150, and they offer a truly risk-free, 45-day trial (including shipping both ways) so if they don’t completely rock your world — but they totally will — just return them. The SB1000 Pro is a pretty small sub so won’t dominate your room, gets you down to an honest 20Hz that basically gives you a true full-range system, come with their own integration software that makes seamlessly dialing them in much easier, and SVS provides excellent customer support if you ever need help/suggestions. What many don’t realize about subs is that they not only greatly improve bass, but you’ll find when properly set up your entire soundstage will expand in all directions, imagining will improve, and even your mids and treble will sound better. And as a bonus, as you’ve got a combined system the subs will transform watching TV/movies into a completely different and much more involving experience. Frankly, and especially since you seem to like your sound already, adding a couple subs is so impactful it might cause you to forget the itch to upgrade for a while.
When you do decide to upgrade I’d start with both the integrated and speakers together as they need to play well together, and at 90Wpc your Arcam will struggle to drive most better speakers sufficiently or get the best out of them. Anyway, hope this helps somewhat, and best of luck.
|
I would like to spin what @drbond said.
You have lots of opportunities to improve the sound incrementally and then a big bump when you get to the end of the next upgrade cycle.
‘’It looks like all your components are very roughly of the same caliber… great.
So, it appears you like Sonus Faber sound… I do to (see my systems). I am on my third set, upgrading from old used to new higher level. Each provided a great bump up in performance. I would start there.
So, the question would be how big a jump? I upgrade to a new level about every seven years and take about a year or two to make the transition.
You want to put in no less than 2x the cost in each component… less is likely to be disappointing.
For the first upgrade, I would recommend speakers…. Wait ~ six months… then DAC. Then wait ~ six months upgrade integrated (preamp and amp only… no other stuff). Then streamer.
Unless, you have some compelling reason to add analog I would not… this just dilutes your investment in the core stuff.
Even if you cannot have a dedicated audio room… keep the 2-channel audio separate from the home theater (get a sound bar for the TV). Otherwise your 2-channel is going to be tremendously compromised… or you’ll need to spend 3x on the whole thing or more and still have a compromised 2-channel system..
Get the best speakers you can. Olympica are fantastic… I had a pair for nearly 10 years.
Think roughly about 35% on speakers, 35% on integrated, 15% DAC, and 15% on streamer. Worry about cables and cords after you have landed on your ideal components.
Recommended brands:
Speakers: Sonus Faber
Integrated: used, Audio Research or Pass
Streamer: Aurender used N100… new N150
DAC: Schiit - Yggdrasil
If you are able to pull off the above upgrades over whatever time frame… you are going to have an system performing at levels above what you have now. Each step should provide great satisfaction. Get to know each new piece as you get them and save for the next.
Then you can get into interconnects, cables and subwoofers.
|
Focus on the room first. What can you do to improve your room acoustics.
As you go up the food chain in audio you will find the room play a bigger role than it does with low/mid-fi gear. Just something to think about.
|
@zander024 I applaud you on recognizing the journey. Enjoy it.
I concur on starting with improving your speakers and make it a significant upgrade. I like Sonus faber and have owned the Sonetto Vs and really enjoyed them. I also upgraded to the Olympica Nova Vs and it was a significant improvement.
Why do I say upgrade the speakers first? You have a complete system - if you start with your speakers you'll get an upgrade now and you'll be able to appreciate upgrade of your source (DAC/Streamer) next and then amplification.
Good luck on your journey!
|
Buy a good dedicated dac like the Denafrips terminator2 night and day better
sound , even witha newer computer with SS drives, the source is where your system makes or breaks the audio signal your system has very low quality digital
this upgrade you can guarantee 150% !!
|
+1 on both @drbond @ghdprentice
Your system looks balanced. You probably need to change almost everything to get a huge improvement. Doing this a step at a time is easier and spreads the cost but you may have to aim for components 2x the price of your current ones. My biggest improvement was changing the amp so you could let the Arcam go. Or change the DAC first and then the amp and speakers after that. Or some other order.
|
Thanks much everyone for the feedback. Definitely pairing amp upgrade with whatever speaker upgrade (which I HOPE would be Olympica Nova 3 but maybe next would be either sonetto V or ON 1), and DAC is something I wrote off as like...’sure, maybe...eventually’ before this thread.
I want to try Yggdrasil and various Denafrips (Venus 2/ Terminator 2...maybe Pontus 2?) but the lack of ability to hear either of those in a shop/nearby makes it scary to clunk that much down without ability to trial. The Denafrips T2, and T+ get SUCH love Id love to eventually have one but in service of being able to hear what’s at my local shops, any thoughts on these brands/models as ’other’ high end ones? I know the qutest is a crowdpleaser but also maybe not endgame for something like Olympica novas? I can test it at least with my sonettos. I’ve also heard Ayre anything is really great, and their amps work well with Sonus Faber...which is promising as a prospect to have good synergy down the line when I up my amp. Luxman ive heard from my shop (that sells them so...grain of salt?) has great dacs, and if I ended up with Luxman amp that could also be synergy.
Luxman Da-250
Chord Qutest
Ayre QX-8
Ayre Codex
Moon 280D
Not that I can hear Yggdrasil in a shop, but how is that one as a "great" dac. I don't need like...DCS Lina full stack for 30k...but is it 'somewhat close-ish' to idk..Dena Venus II? Obviously one is chip another is R2R but the Schiit I see now has some upgrade options to give it a different balance in sound.
As a (characteristically for me) long aside, Story time:
Coming from headphone world one of the first big you tubers I watched was Zeos...who was the person that turned me onto the Hivi 3.1 speaker kit. Man did I LABOR over making those look as luxury as possible. Automotive glossy finish with Porsche flake black paint, painstakingly bevelled corners, upgraded caps in the x-over, and I was ’blown away’...for a few days.
Something happened after about a week. Nothing new occurring so much as I knew I had to be honest with myself about a deep, dark truth... I could practically pinpoint frequencies moving from driver to driver...was so disappointing to admit to myself that no, these are not satisfactory. The crossovers were complete garbage, the synergy of drivers was bleh, the aesthetics of the speaker front was so blunt and utilitarian compared to my poorly matched finish I poured over.All this to say it was a money pit (relatively, for that kit haha) at the beginning of this loudspeaker journey...BUT in retrospect it Tought me SO much:
- 3 ways are complex and you’d better get one with an artfully done crossover.
- The speed of ribbons sound nice but quality soft dome tweeter solutions have all the detail I could ever want.
- Forward presentation can be exhausting (this obviously can exist with headphones but it feels like a different kind of thing in a way to me)
- Care about every point in the chain, ESPECIALLY terminations and connections in some cases.
- While it hurt to sink so much money into quality ’finishing’ materials for those speakers, forcing myself to really try to love them really taught me to love the craft and taste great companies put into theirs.
Excited to keep going and Thanks for the engagement and advice all!
|
At your level you need to sell it all…not upgrade this or that.
You will need a real DAC like a Lampizator or Esoteric or MSB.
Then save up 20-50k for speakers. I would hear a pair of YG acoustics Carmel 2 or go up to a Magico A5.
Your amp will be a Pilium integrated, their small one is only 30k and it is fantastic.
|
The weak links as I see them—and this is relatively, as you have a decent system-are:
1) The lack of low end extension with your speakers. As you increase the bottom end you will start hearing things that you had no idea were there previously, low end information that fill out the soundstage.. I can’t address which sub is “best” for SF but REL subs are very musical. I would check their lineup.
2). I am not a fan of Arcam house sound. To me it is slick and soulless, kind of cool. I would ditch it for another integrated minus the DAC. I would then opt for the best DAC the budget (did you ever specify one?) will allow, as it is the heart of a digital system.
I am not crazy about the transport you have, but the other two issues take priority.
|
Xander,
You should consider another path no one has mentioned yet, which is the array integrated or partially integrated systems. I am talking about the KEF integrated speakers such as LSX for the new LS 60. There is also highly acclaimed Kii three system and an array of powered monitors out there such as the Genelec monitors. There are lots of good arguments about why these systems offer synergy not possible with separate boxes. Some reviewers that I respect have suggested that if their business was not reviewing individual pieces of equipment they would be very happy with an integrated system so they could stop focusing on Equipment and just enjoy the music. Integrated systems also are a big plus in small listening area because of the obvious space-saving. The last thing I will mention that you might want to be on the lookout for quality digital signal processing that can be added into your system. It helps compensate for the room and can make a bigger difference then the marginal upgrades in things.
|
Those speakers are very nice, but BOOKSHELF, inefficient and frequency limited.
The most improvement you can make is to replace them with full range. I prefer no vents, if vented front facing like your existing ones are.
Efficient, so you can drive them with lower wattage, lets you use smaller amp which saves money, less heat, more placement options, especially if remote sensor involved.
IF you try subs, agree with soix, TWO, a stereo pair, front facing, adjacent to your mains. Bass, fundamentals and their overtones are/become directional, a wonderful part of imaging.
|
Just saw this review of the new Gustard R26 DAC and think it should be very high on your list of potential upgrade options. I trust this reviewer’s ears as his take on my Musician Pegasus DAC very closely mirrors my own impressions, so when he says the R26 performs very near the level of the incredible and much pricier Denafrips Terminator Plus this comes across to me as a no-brainer level recommendation. Heck, buy it on Amazon and return it if it doesn’t just blow you away, but that seems highly unlikely. While I’m very happy with my Musician Pegasus, if I was doing it over that is absolutely what I’d do. But, I still think as good as the R26 may be and as per my prior post, adding a couple good subs will make the most significant improvement to your system and your enjoyment of it on an absolute basis. Once again, FWIW.
https://soundnews.net/sources/dacs/a-new-point-of-reference-gustard-r26-discrete-r-2r-ladder-dac-review/
|
For a small to medium room the Sonetto 1 is fine. I would have popped for the Sonetto II but that is me. I prefer a hi quality 2 way like the Sonner or QLN over floor standers. I have small REL T Zero’s to fill out the lower registers and have tuned them to my treated, small listening space.
|
Just my thoughts.
first of all, you have done a good job building what you have. Second, I am so glad to see you did not mention cabling as I don’t think they really make a bit of difference at this level.
I would recommend a stand alone DAC. I would not get a DAC/streamer combo. Too much is changing in the streamer market to lock into a single dual use function. The Bluesound node will work fine with an outboard DAC. I suggest you look very closely at the offerings from Gustard. The x26 Pro ($1,500) for a delta-sigma DAC or the R26 ($1,650) if you want an R-2R/Multibit DAC. Both offer fantastic sound at a great price point. Lastly I would upgrade speakers. I always buy speakers for my NEXT amplifier as having them as the strongest link is always the best path IMO. If you like the Sonus Faber sound, have a look at the Dynaudio line of speakers. I feel they offer more value in speakers with out flashy leather wrapped cabinets, etc. personally I prefer stand mounts. I own Dynaudio Confidence C1 Platinums (now discontinued). I would suggest trying the Dynaudio Contour 20 or 20i, Heritage Soecial, or the Confidence 20. All are amazing 2-ways and can run alone or be complimented by a sub for only the lowest octaves as they go down to ~35Hz.
enjoy the journey.
|
Stick to your gun. SF Sonetto 1 is an excellent pair of speakers. Ignore some forumers' dissing here. I am not sure about the SQ of the internal DAC of SA20 or Node 2i. I have heard audiophile comments about the so-so sound quality of the internal DACs in Node 2i,and a variety of the integrated amps. To fulfill your curiosity and if you want to invest on a DAC, the highly raved Schiit Bifrost 2 is a good start under $1k. Sky is the only limit if you go beyond that price range, which diminishing return will start kicking in imho.
|
After reading this thread I am glad I am not the OP.
No one is reading what this guys goals and limitations are.
At your level you need to sell it all…not upgrade this or that.
You will need a real DAC like a Lampizator or Esoteric or MSB.
Then save up 20-50k for speakers. I would hear a pair of YG acoustics Carmel 2 or go up to a Magico A5.
Your amp will be a Pilium integrated, their small one is only 30k and it is fantastic.
|
@juanmanuelfangioii haha, thanks for that. Im not new to hifi forumers, just loudspeaker ones...so Im not naive enough to believe stuff like that post you quoted, but people gonna try 🙄
I will say I didn't 'give' a 'limit' in price...partially because im not looking for 'hey if u had a dream 2 way setup what would u put in it', and I think im getting enough useful feedback to know that came across to many.
I could imagine dac mattering but no matter how much source matters I couldn't imagine having a $6k T2 makes any sense until ive upgraded speaker and amp, though am curious what's the entry point of other gear when a DAC like that makes sense.
For now Im likely going to get some small Rel T subs, then eventually separate int amp/dac pieces...then speakers.
Regarding my choice of Sonetto I if it gives understanding why I chose the speaker...The SII is almost 2x the cost and I found it was lower on the value/$ scale which is already tough for SF given import costs to NA. The S1 gets close to the S2 (at least closer imho, compared to idk...lumina I and 2 or dyn emit m10/m20s, other big/baby brother 2 ways Ive heard), and will be sort of my training speaker for paying attention to depth and imaging on a loudspeaker setup.
@lanx0003 thanks haha. Yeah I know the sonetto is not the maxima amator, or ON 1 etc...let alone their 'true' high end lines...but I view it as the lowest point of entry to have usable training ground for what SF can offer. Lumina imo sacrifices too much on imaging to use as a chain in SF upgrade path that teaches you what to listen for.
As for the Arcam its actually a really nicely done thing. I didn't trust the added electronics for the SA30 (wireless/dirac etc are something I could use down the line but not for now), and I know id upgrade the amp relatively soon anyway. The dac is easily best bang for buck Ive heard for a digital int amp at 2k or below, and I got it new for like 1100...was an easy choice! Its generally an easy going amp, and some of the lower end Hegel construction concerns me (was considering h95 but something irked me about the way everything mounted to chassis). That said, I wish it had less plastic and more metal, and the standby light can be seen from space.
|
Way back in the day, Arcam made some good CDPs and their Brit-integrateds were competitive. But then they went off into class H, and that model and subsequent never seemed to get any traction, at least in the US. There are literally dozens of excellent integrateds in the 3K-10K range, and there are a lot of threads about them on this site.
|
i think the op is knowledgeable enough to parse through the myriad of comments and ’advice’ posted thus far, separate good advice target to his situation and needs, from the garbage
i would only add a few add’l points here for his benefit
1 - don’t underestimate hegel... they know what they are doing, their gear is really excellent
2 - i agree that arcams’ sound has left me cold for a good long while (cool, shrill sound, little heft or body to the music), but i have not tried their more recent stuff (last 3-4 years) - the nice warmth in his s-f speakers are likely compensating for this presently
3 - op’s sonus fabers should scale up decently for a few upgrade moves, the most significant of which is to integrate in a decent sub (or two)... that would be the most transformative equipment improvement imo (assumes his room and setup are decent)
|
Get decently efficient speakers (high sensitivity and moderate impedance/phase angles) that will allow use of a wide range of amplifiers. Then upgrade the rest from there. Good examples are the DeVore Orangutan 0/93 or 0/96, or Spendor D7.2.
Don’t run out and buy B&W 800s or Wilsons. Not only will they not pair well with your current amp, they will highly limit your amplifier choices going forward.
|
Don’t run out and buy B&W 800s or Wilsons. Not only will they not pair well with your current amp, they will highly limit your amplifier choices going forward.
The flip side of this is that going with high-efficiency speakers will greatly limit options there. Always trade offs.
|
There are some parallels to where you’re starting from and where I started. I used an Arcam AV40 and PA240, both of which I still have. It was good for what it is and both still remain although the AV40 is purely for AVR duties.
I now have a fully separate 2 channel system and there is no comparison with the Arcam. Lumin U1 -> Denafrips Terminator Plus dac -> Pass Labs XP22 -> PA240 -> Focal Kanta 3s. It's my first foray into 'hi-fi' and I'm glad I've upgraded piece by piece because you learn a lot about how every item in the chain matters.
Just adding the XP22 alone was night and day over the Arcam as a pre-amplifier, not to mention the other components that replaced the AV40 on the streamer/dac side. But it all comes at significantly higher cost so it’s all relative. The amp is the last item in the chain I will be upgrading.
|
@christianb5s4 Thanks! Yeah I know the Arcam is something I'll outgrow soon, which is fine with me..I just think they Sa20/30 are a big improvement on the A19 (within the 'entry-hi' or entry-mid space at least) and are the easiest to listen to until the 5-7k territory imo..., especially given its focus as amp rather than added electrical complexity and noise in their AVRs. I mean, I hear the vast difference between it and, say, Sonetto VIIIs with Hegel H590 and Musical Fidelity M8xi though haha. I ideally want to 'call it' further down the line at an endgame setup somewhere around what something like the H390/Nova 3s do, and with as few components as possible. its a fun journey but Ideally im also sensible and don't rush into getting USB clocks and upsamplers just for kicks...
I think ive just heard some truly great sounding stuff via integrated and take the philosophy that there is a truly synergistic integrated out there for any pair of loudspeakers for a long stretch...maybe biggest diff being better DACs/money once you're in the > ~5-10k territory for amp/pre/dac combined budget. My thought is if I want to go full separates id only better do it when im also ready to invest in legitimately expensive interconnects, which is the difference between like a 6k system and a $40k+ system...not approaching that yet haha. Let me know if I am way underestimating the value in going separates earlier though, I just think
Separates -> more terminations and I/o stages -> compensate for busier chain with cabling that minimizes those drawbacks. Aside from more components into wall, thus needing proper conditioning and I can't run dedicated pwr lines where I am.
I am looking at pass though. Pass, Hegel, Musical Fidelity. And for dacs the T+ seems to be amazing but yeah its such a risk since there are no trials or stores to demo, and I don't buy it'd get me value over idk..something a bit more affordable like Venus/Pontus/Yggdrasil until I have Novas or something like that. Again, might be dead-ass wrong lol. Curious what your DAC upgrade process was though. Did you go straight from AVR to what you have now, or did you try a Yggy or Pontus/Venus or something along the way?
|
Hi , you have at least 3 different directions I can go here, I’ll address the front end. I’m a Mid Fi guy, searching for cost effective upgrades. My chosen path is a Project Stream Box Ultra II with an Sbooster linear power supply, Shitt Yiggy, Cardas Clear usb cable, Morrow 5 interconnects to a tube pre. In your position I’d upgrade the Node power supply and get a stand alone DAC. There have been 4-5 great ones in the sub $2K range listed by some very wise members. If you do this , get it dialed in, then search for a sub, you’ll be able to see your amp/ speaker limitations. Then find the speakers that really catch your ear, followed by the amp that brings them alive. For my journey considering what I’ve spent, a $5-6 K DAC/ Pre combo feeing a power amp would be a step up. But we don’t know what we don’t know. But more importantly it’s the journey , not just the destination. So you’re right where you’re supposed to be. Happy Hunting my friend, Mike B.
|
A solution for my system that is in a small room with exceedingly terrible bass problems was 2 subwoofers. The Arcam has pre amp out so an easy connection. I must say I absolutely hated the next suggestion however I tried it and it changes everything (for the better). I use a MiniDSP cut bass at 60Hz to the main speakers, this means your 80 watts will drive better probably never using more than 6 or 7 watts, this lack of amp stress will improve it. The Sonus Fabers are not trying too hard to produce bass which is beyond them, they will improve. Dial in the room bass nodes in my case all around 70 Khz and remove them from the equation, the room will sound better.
|
@zander024 Here's my journey, which is all over the place until I got serious about a two channel system. I unfortunately don't have any dealers of anything local that seem willing to allow at home demos (I did in store demos when possible) so I've relied on countless hours of research. My biggest tip is to decide on what kind of sound you like and what you're ideally seeking as an end result.
1. Denon AVR, two Klipsch subs, and old KEF Q75 towers.
2. Denon AVR, PA240, old KEF Q75 towers.
3. Denon AVR, PA240, KEF R5.
4. Arcam AV40, PA240, KEF R5, added Bluesound Node 130 and shortly after did the PD Creative power supply mod.
5. Same as 4, but added Denafrips Venus 2. Major improvement but hampered by the AV40 since there's no way to eliminate everything going through the internal DACs.
6. Pass Labs XP22 added, Arcam goes through the XP22 pass-thru function. First separate venture which made a tremendous difference, Bluesound and Venus now are routed into XP22 which then goes to the PA240.
7. Same as 6 but added Focal Kanta 3s, again massive improvement.
8. Same as 7 but added the Terminator Plus because I was already familiar with Denafrips and wanted more of that. It's an excellent, balanced DAC, detailed yet smooth, huge soundstage, great separation.
9. Added Lumin U1, along with the X1 upgraded power supply. BIG improvement over the Bluesound, night and day.
That's a wrap. My final upgrade will be the PA240 amp, which is actually a good pairing with everything but is by far the weakest link in the setup.
|
@christianb5s4 What an excellent progression! One of my biggest “aha” moments in audio was when I upgraded from a pre pro to a dedicated stereo preamp and sounds like you experienced something similar. It truly is the heart of a truly good audio system. Maybe a nice Pass amp next to go with your pre? Gotta be on your radar, no? Although I gotta say I’d make it a point to hear the GaN amps from AGD and Atma-Sphere before making any final decisions as they seem to be pretty groundbreaking amps that people are already putting in the “end-game” category, if there even is such a thing. Best of luck in finding THE amp that ties all your other excellent equipment together.
|
Well just my thoughts when you are looking around you have to hear different systems and get to understand what is making eCh systems sound as it does. Get to know as many audio files that live around you. People always up grade and you have to know a deal when you see it and when you see it you need to be able to jump on it. That is how you will get the best sound for the least money. Be nice to everyone and you will get offered many items.
Regards
|
@soix You guessed it. I'm pretty focused in on either the X250.8, x350.8 (or the X260.8 monos but I would need to redo the house electrical side). Others I'm considering are Parasound JC5, Coda 8, or similar. Can drive oneself crazy hyper analyzing all the options. And I'm always jealous of those who have dealers willing to allow at home demos. Those don't seem to exist in my area.
The Kanta 3 are a very dynamic speaker already (which is why I chose them over the Sopras and others). So based on all I've seen and heard from other owners, Pass amps are a great synergy since it'll add some warmth and bass extension (lower dampening factor will pair well with the fast Kantas) while still providing a good level of detail. I don't like overly warm, but do love soundstage depth and detail.
|
@zander024 Forgot one step, which made a massive difference in my setup. Room treatment.
10. Added an area rug, GIK Acoustics 244 Bass Trap with FlexRange (absorption) for points of first reflection, Soffit and Tri-Trap bass traps to tame bass modes, have two freestanding 6A Alpha Pro Series Bass Trap Diffusor/Absorbers behind my listening position and two on the front wall behind the speakers.
The difference in the room with and without even basic treatment is night and day. Don't discount treatment even if it's minimal. My listening room is also the living room. It's kept the room lively while taming all the major issues.
|
Just a thought--
You have a decent system now.
As long as the name isn't Lloyd, Soundesign, Bose, or a HT receiver...you get the idea....I wouldn't call it mid-fi.
Your system is especially suited for a non-specific room.
|
