Move from Parasound A23 to A21/A21+ or Something Else?

@mrteeves I ended up buying and receiving a mint, one year old JC5 today. Initial impressions are that it's an immediate step up in clarity, detail, sound staging, and bass (both quantity and refinement). Everything feels more effortless and flows more smoothly. And that's just out of the box.

I'll let it run in for a bit and get more time on it to see how things go but wanted to share. Makes my Arcam amp sound muddy and unrefined by comparison and I wasn't even unhappy with that amp's performance previously.

The new Duo lineup from KRELLL seems very well built. I have had the K-300i and now the 175XD and cannot fault them operationally. In fact, the K-300i was the very best implementation of ROON READY that I have tried because it also controls volume.

On a lark I tried my KEF LS50's with the KRELL 175XD and what a great sound. I always felt the LS50 (the original one) scales with better amplification. My Benchmark AHB2 and this KRELL Dou 175xXD (very different sonically) really take the LS50 to great heights. I am going to keep this combo with a KEF KC62 sub in my small office.

@christianb5s4    IMO Krell is a hit and miss company. The EVO line are first class regarding built and sound quality that includes the matching preamp Evo 222. I have not heard the current Duo line but the build and parts quality are not on the same level. Many Krell fans love the FPB line of power amps but most of them are pushing 20+ years old with multiple owners. The EVO line is in that 10 year old window where a 1 owner mint unit is still possible to locate.

That makes sense to me, thank you for the feedback. The forward presentation of the soundstage is good to know as well because with my current amp, the soundstage feels to be at or behind the speakers. I wouldn't mind it to move forward a bit more.

Hello @christianb5s4, I can say the amp has broken in nicely and I am liking it more everyday. The grain has smoothed out and the amp sounds much more balanced than out of the box.

How would I describe it with the Kantas...it is detailed without being analytical. It tends to project the sound into the room more and put the listener in the front row where as before the sound seemed to come from behind the speakers and I was sitting many rows back. This projection threw me off initially but I have become more appreciative of it as the amp has added a great sense of depth to the soundstage. One can tell that the dummer is behind the horn player now on a given recording if that makes sense.

A couple of other cool attributes, the amp has brought out a lot more micro details in recordings and I am hearing things I’ve never heard before on familar material. Another thing I like is, it’s all there even at low listening levels. I really don’t need to turn it up to hear more into a recording but if I do, it just gives me more of the same and never falls apart. The character doesn’t change with increased volume. It’s a great sounding amp and very neutral where as the A23 was slightly warmer.

Anyway, I hope this helps and good luck.

How would the 302/402e series compare to their latest Duo line? If you know of course.

For value you would be hard pressed to find a better 2nd hand SS power amp then a near mint (9/10) Krell 302e/402e in the $5k-$7K range.

OP: I thought I'd check in and see how you're liking the Kantas with the JC5 now that some more time has passed?

I have Kanta 3s and the JC5 is one on my short list along with Pass X250.8 and a few others. 

I preferred the A21+ over the A23 by a huge amount. You can also check Sugden A21SE signature. It is pure class A. 

The Jc5 will take some time to settle, I hold by my advice .

Prepare yourself! When it starts filling in and going beyond borders previously limited don't say I didn't tell you so.

@jdub39, that is what I am expecting. I am guessing the amp will smooth out as it gets some hours on it. I'm going to give it plenty of time before I make any judgements. Thus far, it has some promising qualities.

Congrats on the Jc5 @mrteeves  Yes the grain will go away all I can say is prepare yourself.

@2psyop  Nice recommendation on the Musical Fidelity, I'm using the Musical Fidelity Ms8 preamp with my Jc5 and oh my!

Good choice. I would very surprised if you are not enamored with that product. 

Decided to go with the JC5. Just got it and am breaking it in. Will see how it develops. At first pass it appears to have more resolution over the A23 and sounds more realistic on live recordings. The sound is more forward as well and has some grain that I am hoping smooths out as it breaks in. Wife really likes the way it sounds and remarked right away that is was better than the old amp. The thing is a beast size wise.

I agree with those supporting the purchase of a used A21+.  

You stated that you like the Parasound signature and want more power. 

A used A21+ fits your budget.

Look for a Canary ca160 and run it in triode try Ulta linear but you will likely prefer triode. At 100 watts triode and 140 ultra linear lots of tube power on tap. Or much more than you want to spend look for a Mark Levinson. 

Regards

Look at the just newly announced Schiit Tyr.  200 watts -> 8 ohms or 350 watts -> 4 ohms monoblock is $1600 and for stereo it will be $3200.

It is built like a TANK.

I owned the A23 for a long time (used with KEF LS50’s) and it did the job, but I was not crazy about the sound. I recently bought a mint used A21+ and was happy with the results.

I preferred the A21+ over the A23 by a huge amount. I used the A21+ with a hard to drive Thiel CS3.7 and also my RAAL SR1a headphones. I got the A21+ mostly for the headphones, since I had a CODA #8 sounding great on my Thiels.

Since the RAAL SR1a are so resolving I noticed that the amp was very powerful and took a bit of the bright bite off the SR1a, however, there was a bit of clarity that it lacked. The A21+ sounded similar to my old CODA CSiB integrated amp.

I decided to spend too much money and replaced the A21+ on my headphones with the KRELL Duo 175XD. Now this was a homerun with my headphones. About a month ago I switched the KRELLL to my Thiel and the CODA #8 to my headphones. The KRELL has now become my favorite amp on the Thiel’s. It is the 175 watts of Class A on the KRELL that is blowing my mind. Just an incredible amp.

Take a look at this amp. It is more powerful than the Duo 175XD I purchased.

Krell Duo 300 XD Stereo Amplifier Dealer Ad - US Audio Mart

I listen for a min of 8 hours (M-F) on the KRELL and CODA amps and while both are excellent. The KRELL is now my favorite in the office system.

If you like the JC5 then you should give a listen to the Anthem P2 amp, it stays cool to the touch and has all the power you will need. It never seems like it's straining and it is a very neutral sounding amp that does not get in it's own way by coloring the music but just let's the music sound as it should.

@lordrootman

"I will definitely look for A21+...

i have own JC5 ,A21+ ,A21 and Hint6 to me A21+ get my vote though it depends on your speakers, but still A21+ is better."

So... you prefer the A21+ to the JC5?

I will definitely look for A21+ you can find one in excellent condition  use for $2200-2400

i have own JC5 ,A21+ ,A21 and Hint6 to me A21+ get my vote though it depends on your speakers but Still A21+ is better 

If you really want to change things up, see if you can find a Pass XA25. If you don’t require balanced inputs it’s a great little amp. Pure Class A.

Of the Parasounds, I agree, the 21 is the way to go. The JC5 is great too, but it’s a bit of a monster space wise.

Lots of options - but the JC5 would prolly be my choice.  It operates in class A up to about 20 watts - which you may never / rarely exceed.  And you have all the power you will ever need no matter what speakers you may have in future.

Ive got 2 or 3 A-21’s snd a pair of JC-1’s.  They all sound great with any of my speakers, in including my Magnestand Maggies - which is why I bought them all.

Few amps sound better - especially at their prices.

You might want to get a used A-21 for a couple of years for $1500+ and upgrade to the JC-5 in a couple of years.  You can always sell your A-21 then.

 Luxman is the way to go.

Thanks for all the good input. Lots to think about here. When I land on something I will follow up. :)

Musical Fidelity M6si500 as mentioned earlier.

Or a Peachtree GaN400 ($3,000), but it’ll be a much different sound then your beloved Parasound amps.

• 400 watts per channel
• Fully balanced topology
• Balanced and unbalanced inputs

I was also thinking and the A21+ to JC5 sound jump is equally notable as the JC5 to JC1+, but at a fraction of the cost. I'm a big JC5 fan!

I love the Cambridge Audio Azur 851w run in mono and price wise I feel like there in the same ball park. I still love those amps and have them as my second system.

My primary I went...

JC5’s and then bit the bullet and now have the JC1+ amps and couldn’t be happier.

But I’ll be honest SPL’s stereo amp really has my attention and they make awesome stuff.

So my recommendation as a non-parasound brand would be the SPL Performer s800,

Output power (RMS, 4 Ω)

570 W

Output power (RMS, 8 Ω)

370 W

But is $3,500... But cheaper then a JC5 (which is a great amp)

“+++I had the A23 5 years ago. Nice amp, but...GaN technology brings a number of benefits to the table, high efficiency, cool running, and most importantly, fantastic sound. I have owned the LSA Voyager GaN 350 for over a year, and thrown all kinds of music at it that I am very familiar with. I can’t imagine a better amp for MSRP $3000, but they do run specials”+++

I have the A23+ and owned the LSA Gan350. The A23+ dominated it! The Gan amp just didn’t project sound like the A23+. The Gan lacked bite and turned out to sound boring. Never got my toes tapping. One can say the Gan amp sounds good, especially on the top end, but it just wasn’t nearly as engaging as the A23+. On the A23+, the bass was tighter, the mids were more prominent and the top end had more sparkle. It was also quieter with no source playing with volume cranked.

After weeks of listening for several hours a day, I wanted the gan amp to be better, but it never happened. On a final note, the Gan amp was less dynamic and it actually raised Sinatra’s voice a half octave where the weight of his voice was lacking. (Compared on a professionally calibrated system using Xtension10 turntable, Soundsmith Paua es cartridge and Modwright PH9.0X phono pre.)

Try a pair of Schiit TYR mono blocks.

https://www.schiit.com/products/tyr

I had to have a Mc452 repaired under warranty last year which took 5 months. 

In the interim,  I recapped parasound HCA855 to run the front speakers.  My God it sounded great. When my MC452 came back home I thought it sounded lifeless. 

On a whim I purchased a parasound jc5. 

I'm now using jc5 to  power the front speakers 🔊 

I had the A23 5 years ago. Nice amp, but...

GaN technology brings a number of benefits to the table, high efficiency, cool running, and most importantly, fantastic sound. I have owned the LSA Voyager GaN 350 for over a year, and thrown all kinds of music at it that I am very familiar with. I can’t imagine a better amp for MSRP $3000, but they do run specials

 @russ69  +1 The same thought ran through my mind when I read the OP‘s post. Maybe he should be looking for a pure class a amp?  It sounded like a description of what one might experience when a class a B amp switches from a to  B mode

I have two A23s in boxes that I should sell.  I much preferred the A21.  I'm now using an Ayre VX-5 Twenty in one setup, JC 1 monoblocks in another.

db

Two Schiit Vidars (in dual mono.)  Problem solved 

I have a used MF A1008. Great integrated. Prefer it to both a Micromega M100 and the A21 with tube preamp. MF are great deals on the used market and I hear dealers are hot to negotiate new. Dunno I buy used 90% of the time. 

there are people who prefer the sound of the a23 vs. the a21 FYI.  

@2psyop Hard to argue with that advice.

The A21 is much, much better that the A23 and will drive your speakers... no problem. The A21+ is an upgrade for sure but not worth the extra cash IMO. The JC5 is in another league but still not dual mono . I like the advice by erik to try other amps too. I listened to an integrated dual mono design by Musical Fidelity, M6500i and it was very organic, effortless power. Not even a hint of strain with Vandersteen 2CE Sig II speakers. BTW I own an A21 and pair it with Schiit Freya Plus tube preamp. If I didn’t have it... I would get the MF integrated.

I would say, as a past Parasound owner, you should listen to contrasting gear before staying.  yes, the A21 is a bigger amp, but listen to Ayre, Luxman, Pass and McIntosh.  You'll either love the Parasound more or you'll realize you want to move in a different direction.

Probably the amp going from class A to class AB. The A21+ is a much better and stronger amp than the A23, you will be happy with that one.