Warning for Revel lovers
I have read these forums for some years, and have never contributed, but feel I really must let people in on what is happening at Revel. I ordered a pair of Salon2's in March '21 through the great folks down at USA Tube Audio in Scottsdale, who I can unreservedly recommend for excellent customer service. After ordering the Salons, Revel estimated their delivery at the end of April. When that date approached the delivery was changed to end of June. Then it was changed to August, then November, then February. '22. Just found out the new delivery date. It is August '22. Well, you might say, this is supply chain, pandemic related. Read on. During my year-long wait, Paul and Charlie down at USA Tube several times tried to find out what the story was for the delays. I also wrote to Revel to try to get updates; I had sent them 50% down to reserve the speakers. The most either I or USA Tube received back was a one or two terse sentences which shed no light on what the issues were effecting delivery targets. During this time, I sent some equipment in to Audio Research for factory restoration. It took them 6 months to get the job done, but they were excellent at keeping me in the loop, and I always knew when to expect them to finish the job. Just last week I canceled my order to Revel. I will receive a refund, but there was not one word from them apologizing or attempting to explain what happened. I have since ordered a pair of Aspen FR30's from PS Audio, and have already been contacted by them several times for updates and videos of in home installations. Anyway, they are delivering the first couple of pallets as I write this, and somehow are able to honor their commitments to their customers. Though I will have to wait for mine, I have high confidence they will arrive at my house when Paul and company say they will.
The point of my ramble is that the high end community is rather small, with many excellent companies competing for for business within it. It is sad to note that one of the absolute best, Revel, is now under the corporate umbrella of Harmon, which is under the corporate umbrella of Samsung. They have not been represented at the last two T.H.E. shows in Long Beach, home state for Revel. They sent me an email back in January, announcing a change in their management, along with no information on the status of my speakers. They appear to have had no interest in keeping a buyer of their flagship product either happy or informed, for an entire year. I am not a wealthy man. I've been trading and buying audio products for almost 40 years, and was excited to lay down a large commitment in capital for some amazing speakers. I am assuming that sometime in the recent past Revel, after having been absorbed by its corporate overlords, was "restructured" (read gutted), and is not currently equipped to supply a quality product to discerning audiophiles. It also appears that the parent company is content mass-marketing cell phones and "speakers that rock", but sound the same whether playing MP3, CD quality, or high rez. If anyone out there is thinking of sinking a bunch of money into a high end speaker, Caveat emptor! P.S. I own a pair of original Salons, and have always enjoyed Revel's products. Very sad
bratscheboy, I read your post and empathize with your situation. Your cautionary tale reminds me why I nearly always buy used. I like to buy locally so I can see what I'm buying and load it in the car as I exchange cash with the seller. You're very lucky to have a pair of the original Revel Salons to take away the sting of disappointment with the Salon 2. I'd like to feel sorry for you...but I just can't. |
Audiowatchfreak,
I doubt the revel will wow you on first listen. They are a somewhat laid back speaker in room and are east to listen to with no real fault. I would curb your exceptions to be wowed but they could easily be a “last” speaker as they sound good and don’t wear on your over time with odd issues. For me I like a little more kick in the 60-80hz range. Revel’s house sound with subs has worked well for me. |
@audiowatchfreak - The Revel Salon 2 speakers are indeed an exceptional product that has stood the test of time. They're actually very nicely finished, not just thrown together by any means. Like with all high end audio products though they do have some specific needs when it comes to matching with supporting gear. They thrive on high power and really come alive when driven by amps with several hundred watts, some claim 500 watts works well which I've heard Revel recommends themselves. They're also very revealing with that beryllium tweeter so the electronics need to be of suitable quality (not just any high power amp) or they can become harsh and glaring. With all due respect I don't think your comparison to Emotiva is valid, the Salons are in a much higher class of gear than that. Since they've been available unchanged for so many years there are good deals to be had on the used market, just be sure to verify their condition. |
This thread and the ever stranger saga of Revel (I say ever stranger due to the odd mix of Samsung corporate ownership, weirdly not “officially” discontinuing the Ultima line for so long and now the fact they seem to be calling the PerformaBe their flagship as if they’ve given up entirely) only makes me want a used pair of these alien looking things even more. Very very odd for me who is usually vehemently against anything that calls itself “high end” yet offshores manufacturing to China, Vietnam, Malaysia and Indonesia. But *never* have I heard more glowing praise from owners on any single solitary speaker in my life than those who own Salon2s. Effusive praises like “end game speaker”, “my last speaker”, “I’ll never let these go”. Reviewers that swore by them as their reference for years etc etc. Best I can figure; the Salon2s are to the high end of speakers what Emotiva is to amplifiers. Are they pretty? No. Are they made of exquisite materials and designed like an art piece like Focal’s Utopia line? Not even close. But it’s like Kevin Voecks just smashed together damn near what seems like as many of the simplest car-audio looking aluminum drivers he could muster with one semi exotic tweeter material, made the case as inert as possible, said “phuk it” to aesthetics and created a masterpiece of audio. I have to audition these things if for nothing else to say I had been there and done that and have the t shirt. I too have no local dealer to audition at. So I just hope that I am not building them up in my head only to be let down with a “never meet your heroes” moment. Time will tell.
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I wish you knew they stopped making Salon2 for years. Obviously you did not know. Glad you got your money back. But waiting for over a year for nothing is no fun. I sold my Salon2 just end of last year. They are great speakers. I called Revel last year to verify the date of manufacture with the serial numbers printed on the back of my Salon2. They said they couldn't find the serial numbers in their system. That told me they weren't serious about their products. Revel was once very popular. Sad. |
I bought a demo pair of salon 2's from a dealer for an amazing price because they had done a show. Black with no blemishes for less than 1/2 list price, cash no tax! The reason for my post is to say even at the price it was so much more than I was comfortable spending that I was emailing support with supply questions and nearly everything that kept me up at night. Not only was Revel service prompt with Emails and when 9 months later I decided to resell them a Revel tech actually called me on my phone and patiently answered all my questions. I was concerned about reselling a product that might be flawed in any way, so, this guy under the direction of KV took all the time I needed to look up the inventory of every driver, durability of the titanium drivers, he subjected them to every over the counter product with the intent of damaging them. I don't know what to say? How the mighty have fallen:( I read KV and his brain trust are no longer part of samsung/revel so keep an eye out for their next start up. It is interesting to me that Revel was basically and independent under the HK umbrella that produced nothing of their own and with everything being outsourced margins are smaller and supply and demand aren't in the control of the parent company. The salon2 will need 500 watts per channel to operate as designed and don't be afraid to buy 'slightly used' as they're one of the more bulletproof models out there. |
Thing is there is so much variability in product availability. Service for high end gear by manufacturers is also highly variable. So there are examples available at either extreme and everything in between. I will definitely more strongly consider a company's service record than in the past when purchasing their product new or even on the used market. A good experience I had was with PassLabs. I had purchased one of their amps used and about 18 months later it quit powering up. My first query was not answered but my second one was. I got a box from them shipped it and they repaired it for next to nothing. I did inquire as to what they fixed but got no response back. Nevertheless, compared to my experience with some other reputable companies, I rate this a good experience. Maybe I am grading on the curve. |
I had been considering getting a pair of Salon2s myself, and was a bit concerned after reading this post. However, I just recently received my pair and felt like someone thinking about buying might benefit from hearing my experience. When I placed an order in late August 2022, my dealer said a delivery was expected in December. It was a long wait, to be sure, but the speakers did get delivered in December. Unfortunately there was shipping damage (someone in the delivery chain drove a forklift blade through the speakers) to the speakers - but Harman was actually quite prompt in replacing them. So overall, it was a long wait and some bad luck, but I am overall happy with how Harman handled the process. The speakers are superlative. Anyone getting them won’t be regretting the decision. |
For Samsung fridge owners with ice maker issues, you can also try turning down your freezer temp to -4 degrees, and there’s also a reset button for the ice maker that (once you find it) you hold down for a few seconds until it beeps. Unplugging the fridge for a few minutes may also be something to try. Sorry for going off topic. |
Just read this…IF indeed Revel is under the Samsung umbrella…that’s probably why! Samsung is awful…absolutely awful. The steps they made me go through to get an in-warranty tablet service was shocking. The communication was nearly non existent…it was truly like they make things difficult so people will give up. They have lots and lots of issues with their appliances too. Awful, Awful company. If you are smart..you will avoid anything related to Samsung. |
hmm, this is worrying me.. I purchased the Luxman C900U in March, and I have been told, it'll ship to me in June.. Sigmund from Luxman America told me on the phone, once they have the order in, it'll be good to go.. We shall see.. @gregp858 I totally agree with you on Mark Levinson.. It used to be one of my favorite brands.. But once Harmon/Samsung grabbed it, I won't touch it.. |
Last October I put 50% down on a Clearaudio tt/arm and Ortofon cartridge rig from HiFi Buys in Atlanta. I was told it would be in in three weeks. Nineteen days later it was in the store waiting for me to pick it up. I only mention this to point out that even post covid-19 purchasing high end gear doesn’t always have to be a big hassle. |
Three years ago I purchased a Samsung washer at Best Buy. They delivered it and after a test run it spewed water all over the floor. The delivery guys rolled their eyes and said sorry. Needless to say I did not accept the machine. Best Buy sent the same exact replacement washer the next day and it too leaked like a sieve. No more Samsung anything for me again. |
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Wealthy is a subjective term. What I consider wealthy, you might consider comfortable. And vice versa. Who are you to hold court over how someone spends their money or how they consider their station in life? In the OPs world, 25K speakers might be bottom shelf. Or maybe he ate PB&J for 10 years straight in order to afford them. Either of those scenarios is none of my business. And none of yours. |
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@chrisoshea Will you enlighten us on how much we are allowed to spend ? Not just speakers, make it all components. I want to be sure to stay on the right side of crazy. |
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Just adding my sympathies for the frustration. High end isn't always what is advertised or implied. To me this was only about communication, and Revel/Harman/Samsung may not even have a process or department for it. Our Miele built-in refrigerator has the worst ice-maker we've ever had. Makes about 10 cubes a day and they freeze into a giant blob. And it's not a door unit, it is smack in the middle of the freezer. At least you have a local dealer than can help you. I always rely on Andy at Saturday Audio Exchange for these types of things. Great service, actually cares, and really friendly dog in the store. What more could you want?
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My advice based on recent experiences: I would not put money down on anything that is not confirmed already in stock these days unless one is willing to wait indefinitely. Too many good safe options for buying out there these days to play games with many smaller one-off "high end" vendors who cannot afford to keep expensive "high end" items advertised in stock. |
I wonder if it is the business model used by Japanese audio companies. I have Technics SUG 700 integrated amp and it is a fine piece of gear but Technics support is nowhere to be found. It seems to me after many nonworking phone and www addresses were tried communication ends with the customer’s initial purchase. Unlike Schiits and PS Audio two companies, I have dealt with who are customer-centered.
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Just to help you feel better, Artemis5, I've experienced the same refrigerator/freezer situation with my Whirlpool unit. Thank goodness I watched the tech who came to fix it and see what was involved, but the same issue kept rearing it's ugly head every two weeks or so. Finally, I gave up and resorted to your resolution, ice trays and bucket. So it's not just Samsung! Sorry to stray from the original intent of this thread, but I just needed to vent after seeing your dilemma. |
i've had a couple of interactions with revel's customer service/parts departments over the years and all have been frustrating--considering they're a division of a gazillion dollar conglomerate, they're like dealing with some chaotic third world, back-alley operation. that said, they're not venal--i was ultimately able to get what i needed--and they do make a helluva speaker. |
You are quite correct @bratscheboy It is axiomatic that big companies are unable to deliver. Why complain? The owners of successful small companies aren't compelled to sell out. They just want the dough. They don't care what happens to their company and their product. In fact many companies fail under the new extractive command. Private equity is the worst. It often bleeds a company dry in two or three years by overloading it with debt service that precludes R&D and further development. Cash cows don't exist in sharp end businesses like hi-fi. But we all know of many great smaller companies that have been run by their initial proprietors for decades. Stick to these and steer clear of the Harmons and Samsungs that mainly look to maximise short-term profits by shafting their customers with poor service and non-working freezers (see above). |
Thank you all for the "revel"ations and insights. I guess I may have dodged a mahogany veneered bullet. Sure helps to interface with others and gain new insights on a changing high end hi-fi landscape. I have wonderful memories of listening to Revel products down through the years, but I think, luckily, there are still many highly motivated, committed and amazingly knowledgeable people and manufacturers of audio products out there. I look forward to many more years of listening to and supporting them. High end audio is alive and well! |
The place I work has had been a Revel dealer since the company's founding as a Harman Luxury brand. To say the least supply chain issues have plagued them worse than most due largely to their total reliance on Indonesian manufacturing. Design is shared between Northridge, CA and SB Acoustics in Denmark, but production is all Indonesia. And yes, Salon2s have been discontinued so the non-fulfillment of a new order is not surprising. Did the dealer receive assurances it could be before placing? A 50% deposit on a dubiously obtainable item for which the dealer would not be invoiced until the item ships is also questionable. We are taking 10% or 20% on orders for hard to get items like McIntosh and Magnepan with predictable 8-12 week backorders. |
Interesting thread indeed. Sorry OP for your experience. I can feel your frustration. What I found really interesting about this thread is that I never thought about how these big corporations buying out these highly valued brands and completely shift their focus on profits instead of qualities. Definitely something to watch out for on my next purchase. |
I personally auditioned Mark Levinson equipment. I absolutely will not touch their new equipment for the same reason that you canceled your Revel speakers for. That Harman group aka Samsung ruins everything they touch. As an authorized servicer for many years repairing all of this stuff, it is not what it once was. They are purely living off of the names of these once fine companies. And they figured out how to cheapen them up while maintaining stupid prices. And most importantly, their service is poor at best! |
English and US premium audio brands owned by a US conglomerate within a Korean conglomerate. A 2 year world-wide pandemic, supply-chain disruptions, employment disruptions, a less than peaceful transfer of power and now another humanitarian crisis caused by a crazed autocrat. I'll be happy with uninterrupted electricity to power my modest stereo system. |
