I'm interested in what people who have heard the speaker feel about it. I currently run spatial M3 turbos and have an all tube analog setup ( line magnetic, hagerman ) with an oppo 105 being the digital front end.
Previous speakers have been acoustic zen, reference 3A, Maggie 3.6, and triangles. I am more concerned with a huge immersive sound stage than I am with pinpoint imagery. I have a big room and have plenty of space between the back wall and my speakers if I need it.
I had a demo recently and liked them well enough but in my room, my RP-6000's have a much stronger center image. They did sound great on well recorded live tracks, but didn't hit me in the chest like my dual HSU subs do.
Thank you Don! I'm very tempted to make that swap. Maybe I'll damp the midrange and take a look around. I may wait til the fall and the cold air hits Chicago, as summer is too short up here. I'm very, very tempted.
@Donsachs... Don I have used your line-pre for over a year now and absolutely love it! Seems like you really liked some caps out of eastern EU and used them on my pre. Should I consider the ODAMs an upgrade opportunity?
tubebuffer, What's the deal with the weird way that you write? Seriously, is that the way you write English, or do you think that you're being amusing? Your last post makes zero sense.
Why come these lefty at audiophile no review the Cornwall? What gives these reviewer that can’t see shoes after sitting around all day. Review the speaker and do job. Stop eating donut like robocop and work on getting Cornwall go to gym for year first or you hurt back need real man to do everything what this come to?
The crossover had an earlier iteration, but mine is the later one. A fellow posted the schematic on a klipsch forum, so if yours were made in the past year or so they probably have that schematic, but perhaps you should pull a woofer and check. If fairly recent, then you need a 2.75 uF and a 2.25 uF as these are directly in series with the tweeter. ODAM caps come in a 2.2 and a 2.7 which is well within the 5% spec on the original Klipsch cap. If you ask Chris when you order he will find you high measuring caps to get you closer to 2.25 and 2.75. The other key one is 7 uF which is directly in series with the midrange driver. I got a high measuring 6.8 for each channel, both are over 6.9 and again, that is well within the 5% spec. There is a 60 uF across the woofer that I didn’t change as it is already a poly cap and the VCap ODAM pair to replicate it would be expensive and large, and it is not in series with the woofer so probably not much effect. Lastly there is a 1.5 uF across the midrange. Probably not a huge effect, but I changed it because I use a lot of 1.5 uF caps and had them in stock. Also a 4 uF across the midrange. I also changed that one, but not as key. The key caps are the 7 uF, and the 2.25 and 2.75. The two resistors are 30 ohm in series with the midrange and 8 ohm across the midrange. It is 25 watt rated. The pathaudio resistors are 10 watt rated, and supposedly are very conservatively rated. If you do the math, a 10 watt resistor is probably adequate. Unless you are running the speaker at clipping constantly. The horns are so efficient I seriously doubt that resistor sees anywhere near 10 watts.. Remember that ODAM caps have conductive bodies so be careful in mounting.
Donsachs..... Do you mind disclosing the cap values that you substituted, as well as the 30 ohm sand cast resistor ( 30 ohms, but what “watt value”) that you haven’t yet replaced . I want to order them for a friend who has the necessary skills to do the swap out. Much Thanks....
Don’t know where you are but, to hear Voltis you have to go to 1 hour east of Nashville. That’s where they are and there are no dealers. He calls his business a speaker boutique and builds every one by hand using 1” solid maple including the bracing. I was impressed with the quality.
I would love the hear the Volti Rival.... I bet it is really good. Plus, swapping the resistors or the one exposed coupling cap is trivial. The Cornwall IV, when fully tweaked is pretty good though:)
Difference is you cant get a discount (Most likely) on the RAZZ. You should be able to get at least 20% off any Klipsch speaker from your dealer...if not shop elsewhere.
No regret on the Volti, just would like to have heard CW 4 due to some good reviews. I’m happy! The pricing I’m seeing for new CW 4 is 6k. The Razz with prem finish (Lightning) were 6k as well.
Well, I wouldn't say they were crap caps, just run of the mill MKP. I put the best caps I have ever heard in. That said, caps, like speakers, are a personal choice and others may prefer a different cap over the ODAM. They are a great speaker with the stock caps, but there are many better caps in the world than what is in there, and there one sand resistor is in a key spot and I am sure even a change to something like a Mills would be audible. I have not heard the pathaudio ones, but many love them so I will use them.
Cornwalls were MUCH cheaper than the Volti Razz (I have both). Not so much now with the price increase at Klipsch starting this week. Think my IV's cost a little over 4K (Picked up in person) and the Volti's were more 5-6K with shipping. If your happy with the Razz (Which has superior quality parts) why would you regret purchasing them vs something you havent heard??
I haven’t heard the CW4 and wish I had before getting the Volti Razz which is of similar midrange horn design. CW4s were only 1k more but there’s no place near me to have a listen. However, I did the Greg Roberts show and tell and fell in love with the Razz. Build quality is superb and they sound awesome driven by my Pass Int 60 SS amp. Choice of DACs though makes huge differences in musicality. No turntable yet, only streaming and cds ripped by Innous.
Amazing how many posts on the Cornwall IV.... anyone who has heard the III or IV properly set up has to admit they sound great even if they are Klipsch haters. I bought my Forte IV based on the sound of the Heresy IV and Cornwall IV. I could not hear the IV in person but bought them sight unseen after hearing the were voiced like the Cornwall. I could have easily justified the Cornwall if I had the room , maybe some day.
I did indeed swap out the caps except the big 60 uF one between woofer + and ground. VCap ODAM. It is not a trivial job as the VCaps are larger physically, but with a little planning it can be done. I managed to glue cable tie bases to the board and mount caps. You have to insulate leads because cap body is conductive. Also put some double stick tape between cap body and inductor to make sure there is no contact. I didn’ t like caps so close to inductors and was worried it might sound worse. No. The difference is not subtle. The speaker goes up to the next level after about an hour. For the first 15 minutes you think you have destroyed them, but I know those caps and how good they are and that they need to run in. I use them in all my amp, preamp, and phono builds because they are just amazing caps. After 15-20 minutes you can hear the difference. After the 50+ hours I have on them now, wow. Slightly more 3D, but it is the tone and timbre of things that changes strikingly. That little hint of brightness in the speaker is gone and the vocals and instruments sound much more realistic. Yes, it is a very good speaker stock, but it improves considerably with the ODAM caps to my ear.
Again, I am not telling anyone to do this. It will undoubtedly void your warranty! I am also about to swap in pathaudio resistors. There is a 30 ohm and 8 ohm basic sand resistor. The 30 ohm is directly in series with the midrange driver so it will matter. The 8 probably not as much, but I will do it anyway. I will probably swap them next week. As I said, the speaker is now much better at all the hifi stuff, but it still has the same punch and drive and all the horn things going on. It just images a bit better and the portrayal of everything is better. Sound stage is massive, but it was pretty good before. The little hint of brightness is now gone and only detail remains. A trumpet sounds more like a trumpet. A piano more convincing. Vocals to die for. I know those of you who love the stock version will think I am nuts, but if I could flip a switch on your speaker so you could hear the ODAM caps I bet you would notice right away. To my ear you don’t lose any of the thing things you love about the Cornwall IV, it just gets better. But that is MY ear and again, I am not telling you to do this. It isn’t that hard, but I have built 1000 pieces of tube gear and modded many a crossover, so my concept of not that hard is different than that of a novice.
My significant other came into the house about an hour after the cap swap and she immediately noticed things sounded better. God bless that woman:)
This speaker big like my biceps. I going try it in my den where there is man space. I have Maggie in the gym and wife friend jump through other speaker taking the acid. I get these Cornwall and rock and charm the lady to.
I’ve owned these speakers since December 2020--Ozzy really motivated me because I respect his opinions and measured views. I was coming from Forte IIIs. Here’s what I’ve experienced:
Break-in . It was real, but at about 75-100 hours everything settled in nicely.
Positioning. They are NOT fussy about distance to the front wall. They are, for me, fussy about toe in and width between them. Also, it’s the first speaker that I’ve owned that can be listened to in a closer sitting and farther away. I can’t say which is best--both are good and different.
Dynamics. Amazing
Imaging. Decent--say B+
Soundstage. Unreal for me. They sound like live music.
Treble. Crisp, clean and never fatiguing with the right gear. Be careful. They pass signal like no other so everything matters.
Midrange. Seductive with the right setup.
Bass. Honestly I expected more, but they are tuneful and taught to about 38 hz. I augment with 2 REL subs--not for boom, just to get the feeling of space, dimension and to fill out that lower octave.
This speaker is so darn sensitive to gear swapping. It’s fun and addictive. You just cannot feed them junk.
They sound effortless. Here I am in my late 40s owning Klipsch speakers running tubes throughout my entire system. I’m that guy now and happier than ever. I don’t think I can go back to different, modern designs.
Finally, I did damp my Forte IIIs midrange drivers. I’m wondering if I should do that here to. I would think Delgado did a great job, but....I’m curious!
Ive got around 15 pairs....4 more incoming shortly (Cube Audio Nenuphar's/Spendor Classic 100/Fleetwood Deville/Rosso Fiorentino Certaldo 2). I'll get around to all of em eventually....if I live long enough. I like collecting depreciating assets that consume all of my free floor space :)
Congrats BJ....Good to know the Coda works welll with them. Recently picked up the #8 amp and the 7 Pre combo so look forward to trying them out on them down the road. Enjoy your new toy!!
I have around 100 hours on the Cornwalls. I never thought I would be sitting across from a pair of Klipsh speakers but I’m really impressed with them. They are engaging and dynamic with great subtly and articulation. I have them aimed so if I’m sitting in front of them I can barely see the inside plane of the speakers. I’d say this is almost directly firing. I like them better with the grills off. The grills are unfortunately some sort of cheap rubber that feels like outdoor furniture. That’s probably the only negative thing I can say about them at this point. So far I don’t find them bright at all. No falling asleep from boredom, no twitching or beaming or ears ringing. Very impressed at how they are so lively without taking it too far like so many speakers. Using a Coda CSIB and it’s doing a wonderful job driving them. Will likely switch over to tubes at some point but I’m in no hurry. Thanks for the recommendations, I would have never tried these if it weren’t for some of you sharing your speaker journeys.
Congrats @bjesien They are indeed fine speakers that do so many things right. I'm sure you will be even more impressed when you can spend some quality time with them.
Also, look at the various threads about isolation. Nothing fancy. Those cheap rubberized cork pads all over Amazon work great. I was only able to find 2 inch thick ones, but I sliced them down to 1 inch on a band saw. You can use Herbies dots, whatever, but I certainly found that isolating them from the floor tightened up the bass and really everything. You can do it really inexpensively. the cork pads cost me about $20 for both speakers.
Ah, so they arrived. Good. They change a lot in the first 100 hours and the worst is the first 20-30 so it is good you are playing them and not really listening much. They are fun:)
One initial impression that comes to mind with these is maturity. These speakers having a way of playing with stature and solidity regardless of the genre. Haven’t had a chance to sit and listen but will make time over the next few days.
Yes, I am sure the iPad was controlling some sort of server, but again, it was probably a Mac or some other decent grade thing, but maybe not top shelf. My experience with the Cornwall IV and the X5 is that they are up there in rarified air. They are that level of speaker. Of course there are probably better speakers, but both of these are very good. Every time I change a tube I can easily hear it in either speaker. Any subtle change upstream can be heard. So if I am demoing these speakers I am setting up a KILLER system in front of them. They are capable of micro detail and very 3D imaging. My opinion is that if you put a SS amp in front of them you will not hear that. Of course you want the customer to be able to play whatever music they love to evaluate them as well. I listen to a lot of poor recordings I love anyway, but I listen to my set of 50-100 tracks of all genres to evaluate the gear I build. I would never use certain tracks to evaluate a pair of speakers. Your list of tracks would be different than mine:)
Don offers good advice. I would never consider pairing klipsch heritage speakers with SS amps, although some do. I am listening to Deep Purple "Made in Japan" right now with 14 tube watts much louder than I probably should and it sounds awesome. Seek out another audition or try to get a pair in your home.
I think the IPad was most likely controlling a music server, but yes they should ask what you would like to listen to and leave you to listen without any interruptions. You are the customer, the priority, the one paying the bills. My experience is that for years many shops were focused mostly on installations to get by. It seems the more recent surge in people getting out to listen to 2 channel has them a little rusty. Hopefully we all get into our groove again.
I was surprised when the store employees started dialing in song selections from their iPads. There was a McIntosh turntable in the room and I had brought some vinyl, but at no time did the store emps ask about it or offer to play. They said they had a four song playlist that Klipsch recommended for a sound test.
They also insisted on playing each track at huge volumes. Nothing wrong with that, per se, but there were no jazz or classical offerings. They seemed really excited to play The Eagles and, considering the demographic most likely to buy these, I'm not surprised. But it turned me off completely.
Another listener suggested a Nils lufgren track and the 3D imaging was quite good, but every other iPad track was bombastic and one dimensional.
In reference to above.. there is no perfect speaker. What I consider perfect, or at least near perfect, you probably would not, even given the same room and system because our hearing curves and tastes are different. I would consider the X5 to be as perfect a speaker as I have ever heard. Ozzy had the X3 and bought Cornwalls... It depends on what you are after. Some people love horns and simply couldn't live with any other type of speaker long-term. Others cannot stand horns.
My preference is to always start with a tube friendly speaker design. I cannot listen to SS amps. I find them very two dimensional compared to a GOOD tube system. A mediocre tube system is flabby in the bass, etc... Given a tube friendly speaker you can put together all sorts of systems, roll tubes, etc.... You can tune it. As I said above, the Cornwall IV is a completely different animal than previous versions. I have them dialed in so I hear micro detail and a very 3D sound stage that is literally 10 -12 ft high and several feet wider than the speakers. They will do that in a good room with a very good system driving them. To me they image as well as any other top quality speaker I have had in here.
What you are seeing in the later part of this thread is that a dealer demo of the cornwall IV or any other speaker can turn you off them. Most dealers don't have the speakers well placed. I would never demo a tube friendly speaker with even that mac hybrid integrated. You are listening to a solid state power amp driving a very efficient horn speaker that cries out for tubes. If I were to demo the Klipsch heritage line I would certainly have a top notch all tube system in front and a really good source, not some iPad. A top notch DAC.
Others will disagree with me and prefer solid state amps. That's cool, that is what the hobby is about. I can build anything, but I only build tube amps because that is all I can listen to. Heck, I have serious preferences in capacitors, power supply topology, output transformer type, etc... But those are mine. Others have different tastes. Same with speakers... there is no perfect speaker. Given a budget you should try to hear a number of different designs and then hopefully demo something in your room with your system. Not always possible I know....
Just order them from a place with a 60-day return, and figure to cost of return freight into your long-term investment in the sound you want. This way you’ll really know. That’s what I did. The trial is up next week but I’ll be keeping them, which I couldn’t say for sure until I spent a lot of time dialing them in. Just one happy CW4 owner’s opinion.
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