Thanks everyone for the responses. I am currently set up with my new gear in a temporary fashion. Long term I will need longer cables for my (yet to be upgraded) streamer. At that time I'll add balanced to both the pre amp and streamer I would imagine.
Come to think of it I don't love that as I know you should only change one item at a time. So maybe do the balanced preamp cables (1M or more 🤣) well before the streamer arrives.
So far so good on this upgrade though....thanks again!
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I have a totally differentially balanced system from phono cartridge through amp. It is quiet even with volume turned high.
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@mtbiker29
There's a fair bit of misinformation here. Since we've been doing balanced lines longer than anyone else, perhaps I might set the record straight:
1) the advantages of balanced lines have nothing to do with length whether 6 inches or 60 feet.
2) there is a balanced line standard called AES48. If the equipment does not support the standard, you may hear differences between cables; this is why balanced vs RCA is a debate, which really shouldn't happen. But most 'high end audio' equipment does not support the standard hence debates...
3) In a well designed balanced system there isn't extra circuitry- in fact you may have less stages of gain than single-ended. For example our balanced preamps have only 4 stages of gain (despite passive equalization in the phono) between the LOMC input and the main output.
4) balanced, if properly done is better than RCA connections and if you get to hear that difference there's no going back. Balanced lines ushered in the golden age of high fidelity in the 1950s. Prior to that everything was single-ended requiring the recording equipment to be right beside the musicians.
5) phono cartridges are balanced sources. Since balanced line gives you more neutral connections, this is a big incentive since if there's anywhere in the system that the cables have to get it right, its between the tonearm and phono preamp input. No matter how good the system is it can't make up for colorations that RCA cables inevitably cause.
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- I personally have decided to go with balanced interconnections are minimal distances.
- My system (Moon) is designed for balanced interconnections are this results in a 6db gain for the signal.
I have decided to use shortest distance. It saved costs on my cables.
The additional consideration for me is I don’t want built in optionality for my ‘next upgrade’ to my system. I want to enjoy now versus pine for the future. (I know myself and have gone through 3 sets of preamps, amps and DACs and 2 sets of speakers over the last 5 years.
Your mileage may vary, enjoy the music!
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I’m making the jump to separates and as such am thinking that balanced is the way to go.
When I got into separates the amp and preamp I decided to go with were balanced. I didn’t think much of it at the time and ran everything unbalanced for about a year. I had some balanced cables laying around so one day just for poops and giggles I decided to set my system up to run balanced. I wasn’t expecting much change if any…well, I couldn’t have been more wrong, to this day and several changes and upgrades later, going balanced remains one of the top two most significant changes in sound quality improvement that I have made. Now having said that, all of my gear meets the AES 48 balanced protocol or the British equivalent. If your gear does not meet those standards you may get different results.
As far as cable length, I also would go with the longer cable. It seems that for me one units output is always on the opposite end of the next units input, so you not only have to contend with the distance up and down between units, but possibly left to right also.
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mtbiker29
Here is what I've settled on after a bunch of trials: RCA 1 to 1.5 meters, XLR 1 to 1.5 meters, power cables minimum 1.5 meters up to 2 meters, HDMI I2S 1 meter or less, SPDIF 1 meter, USB as short as is feasible
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Definitely 1 meter or longer. You never know what your arrangement will be later. My preamp and power amps are 7.5 meters apart. Nice to have sources close to the sitting position and the amps close to the speakers. Speaker connections are short with this arrangement. XLR is ideal for long runs.
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There’s no definitive answer. Typically with balanced components you will get lower noise floor using balanced cables. The XLR output is usually higher than SE. using matching preamp and amp helps with synergy. If you use different brand preamp check to make sure the output gain and impedance match well with your amp.
And +1 on 1m length. I actually have a 2m set going into the amp - gives me more flexibility.
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To me the decision is also dependent on what sources you have in your system, and if they are providing balanced connections or not.
For example my Moon 310 LP phono stage provides 6db more s/n ratio using a balanced connection to the preamp than if I use a single-ended connection.
To me, that is significant given that it’s upstream (close to my turntable source), so it made all sense in the world for me to use a balanced XLR connection, and then it felt natural go for the same between the preamp to the amp (and from the streamer/DAC to the preamp).
Also, with separates and a large number of power cables that by necessity- at least in my case - runs from each separate and it essentially practically impossible to keep away from the interconnects, balanced interconnects feels like the right way to go.
For me, that is.
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Balanced IMO is considerably better in my system. Granted I have a long run preamp to amps. Consider this: if balanced isn’t necessarily better why do companies provide the option knowing the unit will be more costly than single ended? Just another up sell?
Common mode noise rejection is no joke. 6db quieter compounded with each component (the next component has received and pushes out an even lower noise level and so on).This can be significant. The connections are more dependable and components can be placed with more latitude.
Mentioned above as being better in my system. Having a considerable sum invested in my system, until going balanced I sensed something missing (the rabbit hole is in play here), afterward a sense of completeness. Good luck. JMO
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Go with the longer cable. It's much easier to manage.
Balanced cables are used in professional recording because a balanced connection is much better at rejecting noise for long runs. It's not unusual to have cable runs that are 50 feet or more in a studio and even longer for live music. Professional gear doesn't have RCA connectors. Nobody would use them.
Balanced architecture in an audio component is more expensive to implement. I have vintage Krell components with balanced connections and I do run balanced cables on them. However, I only have two balanced inputs on my preamp and I have several sources with balanced outputs. I have compared single ended RCA cables (Blue Jeans) with balanced cables on a few different components into the preamp and I can't hear the difference. But my amp is a different story.
I have a Krell KSA 300S amp that has balanced inputs as well as single ended inputs. I have tried both (you need shorting plugs in the balanced inputs if you run single ended cables) and there is clearly a difference in this application. The single ended option is much noisier. I found this when I sent my preamp in to be recapped (I hooked up a different preamp that only has RCA connectors) and upon further investigation I learned that Krell does not recommend using the single ended connections on this amp. Interestingly, the new D'Agostino amps do not even include single ended connectors.
My opinion is that if you have equipment that has balanced connectors then you should use balanced cables whenever possible. The manufacturer spent extra money on this feature so you might as well use it. But I think you would be challenged to hear a difference between a source component and your preamp.
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It is "well accepted" that balanced is better by many audiophiles but not by people who understand science and objectivity. It's not.
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I have some equipment with the owners manual telling me " to get the best sound use balanced interconnects". And others with no balanced connections. And + 9 on the 1 meter length.
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Definitely go with a one meter cable. The amount of stress of the bend at the connector can and will become weakened over time .
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Max Townshend and Andreas Koch both feel that RCA's have more "pure sound" due to the additional circuitry of XLR's. So unless someone is going for long distance cables, I think good RCA's are better. I swapped out all my XLR's for Townshend F-1 Fractal RCA's.
Some components like Jeff Rowland's new amps only have XLR inputs. So the decision is made for all.
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You will not discern an audible difference between balanced and rca with an interconnect run of one meter ... now, six meters may be a different story.
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I’ll be the outlier; go 1.5M. You never know how the system will evolve and next thing you know you have the units next to each other and one set of outputs and the other inputs are on opposite sides from each other due to other system needs. Then, you’ll thank me!
Also, 1/2 meter cables are very hard to resell.
Have a great weekend.
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Balanced is clearly and technically "better" but in most cases the human involved cannot tell the difference anyway.
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Thanks all. As a follow up, is it well accepted that balanced is better?
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+3 on 1 meter. I did the .5m thing and needed to replace them eventually.
Some cables, esp power cables, perform better at 1.75 to 2m.
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Go with 1 meter. Some are not super flexible and shorter cables can stress the connections.
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Congratulations, great way to go. First a little perspective. Generally the biggest determinant of the sound of your system is going to be the sound quality of the components and their interplay… synergy or lack of synergy. By far. Then probably the room and setup and then quality and synergy of interconnects and power cords. Then which connection type you use… which will make a small difference or none at all depending on your equipment.
It is best to choose balanced interconnects if the internal design of the components are balanced and single ended if not. I have high quality components and the choice of balanced or not balanced made no difference in sound quality although the brand / quality of the interconnect sure does.
I recommend one meter interconnects. They need room to gently bend and only a small change in your system and you end up with a half meter being to short. I’ve tried it a couple times and it ended up being a disaster quickly. One meter is standard for a reason.
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I’d go with 1m interconnects so you have some flexibility to move components to get to connections, etc., and they’ll also be a lot easier to sell if you look to change/upgrade in the future. Although balanced is nice it comes at a price if implemented correctly, and personally I’d go with a better single-ended component over a lesser balanced component because I think that’d make a bigger overall difference than the connection type. But if it’s in budget to get fully-balanced units I’d say go for it. Hope this helps, and best of luck.
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