@melm It is very hard to feel sorry for them. I am against fake products but go look at Nordost price guide and it's hard to feel bad.
Counterfeit Chinese Cables
I thought that I would write this for those who are curious about one of the many counterfeit Chinese interconnect cables that are available these days. I know that there have been threads about the subject before, and I was always curious because they seem to be such a bargain. I don't really recall much about what any members actually said about the performance of these counterfeit cables, and I didn't look back and do any research, but a couple of months ago there was a thread that came around to discussing the quality of Chinese made components, and oldhvymec said something that made sense to me.
He said that people that say that what they are making is junk should consider that much of what is in our gear, and a lot of our American brands are actually manufactured there. I decided shortly after that that I would take the chance on a set of interconnects, because I suspected that the interconnects going from my pre to my amp were the weak link and needed upgrading. The interconnects going from my DAC to my pre were Kimber Select which are very good, but the other set were LAT International (now defunct) which had cost $500.00 when new, but I had reason to believe they were lacking because I have one of their digital cables that turned out to be very poor sounding in comparison to others I own.
I decided on a one meter pair of counterfeit Nordost Odin interconnects for a total of $104.00 from Aliexpress. I received them a couple of weeks later. They appeared to be well made, and the locking fake WBT rca's were very impressive and are very tight.
First impressions after installing them were light, thin sound, lacking bass. Each couple of days brought improvements, but from the beginning I noticed that they were quieter. Now, weeks later, I can say that they are drastically better that the LAT's in every way. Detail and ambience are much better, but it's the focus and separation of instruments that is most noticeable.
I have no way of knowing if they are really a copy of the Nordost design, but I am impressed enough that I am going to try a counterfeit Nordost digital cable.
Obviously, this isn't a comparison that is useful to most, because there probably isn't anyone here using the LAT's, and everything is system dependent. I just wanted to relay my positive experience.
920 responses
This is really wrong: https://www.aliexpress.com/i/1005002316681621.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2tha |
About 6 months ago I completely rewired my system using the Ali-E Nordost Odin 2 cables. I took a slow, one at a time approach. Each time my system sounded significantly better than with my WireWorld ($$$$) cables! As I recall, DIY HiFi (the vendor) provided the option (at a price) for boxes. I never did that, but I doubt they go THAT far. Although they use Nordost wooden blocks, and say Nordost on the cables, I seriously doubt they are true Nordost cables, just repackaged. The speaker cables are unlike the Nordost ribbon design, which IMO is a plus. Decades ago I had the Nordost Blue Heaven speaker cables (ribbon) and they were a bit unwieldy as they tend to roll up. HOT TIP: make sure you sign up for alerts. I would look at the cable offerings and save the ones I wanted for later purchase. Some 2-4 week later I would get emails with reduced prices. The best deep discount was for Odin 2 gold speaker cables, which were $180 off the first price! I expect them soon Now for power cords to my amp and CorePower 1800 power conditioner, a fellow 'phile gave me a tip for stupid cheap PCs from Amazon hth |
@tweak1 hth - Care to share the recommended PCs from Amazon? TIA |
I was curious enough to order some of these cables and took the power cable apart to see how it was constructed and to check out the wire and insulation. In general, the construction is quite good and well done, and the plugs are high quality. Here are some pics of what I found: Solid connections with insulation right up to the screws.
Another view of all three connections. Note three wires twisted for each channel, and a single ground.
A shot of the plug enclosure. This is very well done, the silver piece is all metal.
But, the deal breaker I think. The wire is silver coated and has a copper core as advertised. However taking some simple measurements using a caliper on the single ground wire, it is in the neighborhood of 1 mm. This equates to 18 AWG vs. Nordost spec of 15 AWG per wire for these cables. Combined, the three wires will give you a 13 AWG equivalent, not quite a firehose.
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@zlone Thanks for the pics. Nice to see the construction. I bought complete set of gold power and interconnects for one system and a complete set of odin 2 interconnects and speaker cables for a second system. The power cords didn’t stand out but were very nice for $35. Preferred my VH Audio DIY flavors and DIY Kimberkable tc12. BUT the interconnects and speaker cables (to a slightly lesser degree) were a jaw dropping improvement. Crushed my Morrow (MA3) and DH Audio (Q10). Incredible value for performance level. I just do not like that they use the Nordost branding. |
I bought a set of the Odin 2 balanced interconnects as well. Again, not a significant change in my case, maybe my senses are starting to fade with age :-). I plan to swap in my old interconnects to see if there is significant difference. I have a set of the speaker cables on order and will put them up against BJC, Mogami and Kimber 8TC (just bought used) to see how they stand up.
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My biggest concern with Ali, and this also applies to many of the non knock off products as well, is my doubt of the claims they make. For example, bulk power cable that purports to be 9.999 OCC (not just OFC) copper. Either it's complete B.S. about the wire being used or, and I hate to think this, we are getting royally screwed by North American supplies who charge 10 times the price for the same product claim. Not sure which one makes me feel worse. 🤣 |
Bigtwin...i bought some furutech wire just to see if its...well you know.I did buy some connectors direct from japan.Wasnt quite ali $...but didnt hurt as bad either. Does it make me more comfortable knowing i payed for "real" product.The north american furutech distributor i talked with said that is really hard to tell these days. |
I am a cable manufacture and make very good cables. I know a lot about cables. Chinese fake cables and genuine brand cables are all made by people who don’t know how to make high quality audio cables properly. Yes. They will make strong and unnecessarily high current capable computer power cords but no audio cables. I know this because every same model cables sound different. No two cables sounds same in thousand of same copies. There is no control in sound quality. I know why this happen because I make properly made audio cables. It is very hard to make audio cables properly. All my cables are sounding same with the perfect quality control. **I won’t tell secrets. So, please don’t ask. In same model the fake one might have cheaper materials even if it looks same to genuine ones. The cheaper ones don’t mean worse sounding. It is matter of luck the fake or genuine sounds bit better than other copies in one’s audio system. The veiled sounding audio system can’t show a cable’s veiled sound. To evaluate cables a perfect reference sound is needed. Where is this perfect ref sound? There is none. Though my audio system (and who bought my system) is closest to the perfect reference sound. There are few very distance 2nd reference quality systems. I know they put their life time to make those audio systems. My hats off to them. No. My audio system isn’t perfect and the best sounding. The freq balance will be changed by thickness and shape of cables. The sound quality can be better with better parts. And taste of sound varies with people. But to evaluate cables, mine is the best for right now. Alex/Wavetouch |
1st off, I am sure many audiophiles will agree on "varying performance of cables (or audio equipment) on copies of same model." They all are sound different. It is one of audio myths. Yes. there are some similarities to ID them at least, but they sound all different. 2nd, listen to my audio system below. Every one (even to non-trained ears)can hear any little changes in my system. There is no glare or veil. The sound is closest to the original music that I can hear/feel the moist of lips and tongue of singers. I believe that the video supports my claim. Alex/Wavetouch |
@milhorn The very fact that you believe that an audio system can be evaluated over computer speakers with YouTube as a source discredits anything else you could say. As far as all samples of the same cable sounding different, well maybe the ones you make have that problem, but I don't think that you can give any proof that this is the case with other brands, and I haven't heard other members complaining about it either. |
Captain Obvious here. Counterfeiting, proper, is the deceptive manufacture of something under another company’s mark without their knowledge. It is fraud. There is no grey area. Reverse engineering and shared sourcing, by contrast, is a common modern practice. It can be challenged in courts as copyright and patent infringement but the burden of the plaintiff is different. As a marketer, I understand the goal of many brands as being a guarantee of certain quality and/or value to purchasers. Just IMO, a savvy buyer may well be making a good value purchase with a lookalike cable…just as they may pay too much for the impression of brand quality that is not counterfeit. Make sense? |
OP, about @mihorn . I try to be positive… but yeah… you are 100% correct. Indicating you can’t tell the difference on a YouTube video does completely discredit a post. Actually pretty funny. |
Please post which YT videos you watched to hear the sound difference. Please listen below videos if you can hear the sound difference. Alex/Wavetouch |
@ roxy54 OP Now you can hear the sound difference clearly. That’s good. Still you are not sure about the room and a microphone.Many rooms in these videos are same and an only 1 mic is used for recording. A’phile Junkie (YT ID) recorded many rooms (with a camcorder) at the Home Entertainment show (2022). ** In 1st video (my room at the show) the human voice and audio sound are same tone and timber. My room audio sound (singer’s voice) is very close to real human voice. This was 8 months ago with an old 25 watts amp. Nowadays, the sound is much more improved and the new amp (35 watts) is used for new videos. Listen to human voices and audio sounds in every videos.
Listen to my newer video with 35 watts amp. I hope you can hear the sound difference between my audio and others. Also, the true hi-end audio system should sound natural and similar to the original music & sound. Alex/Wavetouch |
I need a 75 Ohm digital cable to run from my streamer (CA 851N) to my Denon A110. I’m looking at the following. Anybody have any experience with these? US $36.96 8%OFF | Top quality NORDOST Odin 2 flagship sterling Silver Coaxial Audio Cable AES/EBU wire RCA HiFi signal line with WBT 0102 RCA plug US $28.27 5%OFF | New HI-END NORDOST ODIN 75 ohm RCA digital coaxial cable AES/EBU signal cable HI-FI audio with WBT-0102 Rhodium plating RCA US $22.55 18%OFF | NORDOST ODIN Fever Grade Audio Signal Cable 75 ohm RCA Digital Coaxial Cable AES/EBU Signal Cable NORDOST ODIN fever grade audio US $12.95 | NORDOST Odin Pure Silver Coaxial Digital Cable Fever Audio Audio Cable AES/EBU Signal Cable
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I use a single Odin 2 rca interconnect as digital cable from CD transport to DAC with good success. Wire looks same as the last listing on your list. I prefer the Odin connectors. Not sure how this works on a streamer since I use USB. US $17.15 30％ Off | High Quality Nordost Odin 2 silver Reference interconnects RCA cable Audiophile for amplifier CD player |
First line says NORDOST Odin Pure Silver Then they say Conductor: 10 strands of pure silver Then they say high-quality 99.999999 single crystal copper and 78 micron extruded silver on the surface of 7N OFC In the last claim they seem to mix the terms "single Crystal copper" which should mean OCC copper, with the term 7N OFC which is NOT OCC single crystal. Who know what you are actually getting? |
Chinese copy and manual instructions are frequently cryptic and confusing. The way these cables sound for their price I am not concerned what they are made of as long as they don’t set off a Richter Scale😆. I feel these must be OCC copper with pure silver plating with each of the 10 cores shielded as somewhat mentioned. Who know but my main concern is using the Nordost brand, not that anyone would confuse them as real Nordost. |
@phastm3 Wow! That is one amazing system I can’t even imagine how good that must sound. Any cable would sound fantastic in your house. Cheers to your set up! |
@phastm3 Nice collection of systems. I've posted similar pictures and had to explain I don't own all the equipment at the same time. What are those silver discs you have sitting on top of a lot of things? |
@bigtwin you are getting counterfeit garbage from China. Case closed.
Then they say Conductor: 10 strands of pure silver Then they say high-quality 99.999999 single crystal copper and 78 micron extruded silver on the surface of 7N OFC In the last claim they seem to mix the terms "single Crystal copper" which should mean OCC copper, with the term 7N OFC which is NOT OCC single crystal.
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@hdm Would you mind mentioning which Aliexpress vendor you purchased the Chinese Nordost Odin Gold IC’s (RCA to RCA) from, those are on my radar for purchase?
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@jetter Fyi- I purchased mine from Moonsaudio with excellent results. 1m rca-rca $35 |
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 @ps I PS my pants reading that post. |
@jerryg123 you are getting counterfeit garbage from China. Case closed. Based on the many many positive testimonials on this thread, your statement would appear to be incorrect. My own cables have all come from mainstream manufacturers and I have paid the price in $$$ for the privilege. Still, I wonder why I have paid $1000 for a cable that many here claim can be shamed by a $100 from Ali. The very idea of that just rubs me the wrong way. |
@bigtwin You asked the question:
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Jetter:
The first two pairs I purchased from Preffair and the remainder (4 pairs) were purchased from Moonsaudio. All Nordost Odin Gold rca to rca. They appear to be identical in construction/plugs etc. and perform the same. Anyone who says these are garbage has clearly never heard them. To follow up on my last post, I did go ahead and have all the sets I owned cryoed and burned in on an Audiodharma cable cooker (I initially cryoed and burned in 2 sets and then compared them to stock without cryo/burn-in) and they improved further and exhibited the kinds of improvements I've always had doing this with cables: notably improved detail, refinement and smoothness, a slightly larger soundstage, etc. They are very good cables and easily displaced some pretty good stuff I was using (and thought was a bit of a bargain) before that retails around the $300 mark. And, as I said, I compared them directly in a very good system to real Valhalla version 1 (before cryo and burn-in) and preferred them to the real Valhalla v1. phastm3 seems to have them hooked up to some very nice equipment. It would be interesting if he could comment on (generally) what he was using before and how the Odin Golds compare (it looks like he is using all Odin Gold as well).
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