An audiophile is person with the pursuit of reproducing music as faithfully as possible by using hi fi equipment... Budget has no bearing. However, the pursuit can be quite expensive.
At what price is one considered an Audiophile.
Audiophilia, what is is it?
Is it the love of music or the equipment that presents the music.
Or is it both?
What is the cost of admission?
How much does one have to spend on equipment to be considered an Audiophile, if it is truly the later than the music.
What has membership to this perceived exclusive club cost you?
181 responses Add your response
You are an Audiophile when You wake up in the middle of the night to turn over and start thinking about Toeing your speakers in or out. If you should buy a different power cord Should I put more absorption on the back wall Should I change the hollow core door to a solid core door It has nothing to do with the amount of $$$
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There is no $ amount as a price of admission. For me it is about the rush I get when I hear something new or different in a record that sounds better. At times it may be from a minor change that has big impact or a relatively bigger change that may only has a small impact. If you appreciate reproduced sound quality, seek to have it in your house and realize you can always get something better and can live with that you are a sane audiophile. If you are on the never ending hamster wheel of upgrades, my condolences. At this point, I am happy with my system's sound and realize the limitations of my room acoustics and only change equipment when something breaks or wears out. I do seek out better sounding records of my favorite recordings however....luckily that is a fairly reasonable number. |
Exactly... Thanks...
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For myself, and most music loving friends...we have all heard expensive systems we did not like, and inexpensive systems we liked very much...certainly synergy and room acoustics are long recognized factors...but unfortunately, all the best systems we have heard have been expensive...though I thoroughly enjoy my much less expensive secondary systems, and could be very happy if that's all I had...exploring better equipment or room acoustic should never get in the way of enjoying what you have... |
Levels of electronic design perfection had a cost corresponding to each level ... Levels of acoustic controls had a cost too in money and in studies and experiments ... Optimal acoustic satisfaction threshold exist at a very high cost in price and in time and acoustics understanding ... Minimal acoustical satisfaction threshold experience exist also.... At a lower price but with the same time cost in consuming studies and experiments in acoustic ... If not by yourself homemade, it cost 100,000 bucks to give the job to a pro by the way ....Few costly panels is not acoustic control of a room ... |
Ridiculous claim... An headphone who is unique even today and top flagship 40 years ago is now classed as low fi because i pay it 100 bucks ?😊 A top amplifier 35 years ago is trash today because i pay it 300 bucks ?😊 And marketting dogmas and electronic design and costly components can beat acoustics basic knowledege for some ? I dont think so... Let me smile ... Price is not the last word in sound ... Acoustics and synergy between components are and at any price ...
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Wow, am I late getting on this question! — Nothing changed. I would say, as a budget-minded person interested in audiophile-level sound, that money does matter in this hobby. If you don’t spend at least to a certain level, you are just a pseudo-audiophile to many here. I base this on two things: I see questions that ask for suggestions for buying audio equipment. Before I can respond, I look at the other responses/suggestions. Oh my! I was going to say I was satisfied with my $3,000 amp, or my $1,000 pre-amp, or my CD transport that cost less than $1,000. But all these recommendations from others are for equipment many times more expensive than anything I have ever owned. I think I must be slumming it! And their listening rooms, sometimes custom built, dedicated rooms that are huge! All that — money, money, money! The equipment I aspire to, I can imagine these folks giving a skeptical look and “Well, if that’s ALL you can afford!” Yes, it’s all I can afford — sorry! The second thing — look at the pages on Audiogon that list equipment for sale. Especially the featured items: Speakers and amps that costs $30,000, $40,000, $50,000, some over $100,000 or $200,000. I glance over such things, knowing “never, ever”. Am I envious? Somewhat, but I also wonder how much of a hit these people take when they go to sell that equipment? Yeah, you list it on Audiogon or other sites, but how many people are out there thinking, “Oh, that’s what I’ve been looking for! And only $50,000! Bargain time!” And if you can afford to spend this much on the hobby, I imagine your house is worth in the millions, you have a boat, maybe your own airplane, scads of overseas trips and holidays, sauntering around the country club, martini in hand, saying, “Darling, please be a dear and have them pull around the Bentley”. I think that if you are talking less than $20,000 total for your equipment (not room), you aren’t really in the audiophile category on these pages. And maybe even $20,000 is disappointing. Seems that the higher you can go, the more you earn the title Audiophile. |
I am "snob" about which i had myself created not about something i can buy, i am elitist because of the necessary embeddings controls knowledge, not about my wallet ...i am Proud of my ratio higher sound quality at the lowest possible price ... Music drive me not the plugged costlier upgrades which most of the times are on the side of great acoustic change because consumers read audio manual as science which is not at all , no more than pharma drugs characteristics and ccompatibilities are medecine knowledge ...... I am proud to care and improve my health state by myself instead of the proposed chirurgy because they dont know better in my case ... There is a club for each one, mine refuse me BEFORE i studied and experimented , and it is not the audiophile club it seems ... |
@roxy54 that was my goal, Yes,😎 |
@ghdprentice +1 I always enjoy your posts. There logical, informative and entertaining without any of the adolescent nonsense that pervades in many threads on Audiogon. |
This question seems to come up all the time and the posted answers always seem to be pretty much the same. I think something that seems to receive very little to no support is the idea that being an audiophile has nothing to do with how much equipment you own or how much you paid for it. I believe it has only to do with your appreciation for good music and the quality of the reproduction of that music. Even though one might strive to be able to produce high fidelity music in their own home, I have never thought that a requirement of being an audiophile is that you own the equipment you are or have listened to and that the equipment was ultra expensive. I think you could be an audiophile even though you only own a boom box but go to the local hi fi store on weekends and listen to good music on a good system. |
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Roger nails it here in this piece posted on Daily Audiophile today: https://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/viewpoint/1021/Are_You_Part_Of_The_Eighty_Percent.htm @bigtwin No one is holding you here at gunpoint, so go!
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Such an unintelligent falsity/ the common lie propagated by guys (dealers incognito) who try to sell sht that’s completely not worth the selling price. Deeper soundstage? Lower noise floor? Audiophile nuance? It all comes down to the competence level of the engineer...all with negligible/zero perceptible gains beyond a certain limit even for a golden ear bat. When one buys things from very intelligent guys like Andrew Jones, Peter Comeau, guys at Yamaha, etc, great things can be very affordable. When one buys things from dumb dudes like Daryl Wilson, mediocrity can be very expensive. Intelligent dudes will get things made by intelligent dudes. Dumb dudes will get things made by dumb dudes. Birds of the same feather tend to flock together.
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@waytoomuchstuff Appreciate the intelligent and mature reply! I agree with most of your comments but few if any will agree on what a deeper soundstage, lower noise floor, longer note decay or any other Audiophile nuances should cost. This is why any price/performance ratio standard IMO is nearly irrelevant. Another issue is most would disagree where the starting point(cost) for a true HEA system begins. My guess is it could range from $1k to $25K depending on the individual. On a side note I made a comment on an older thread that I never heard an "incredible" complete system for $4500 and got blasted for my honest opinion. FWIW "Incredible" is a very subjective word, quoting Paul Simon..."one man' s ceiling is another man's floor" can be applied to our audio journey/destination. |
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@carlsbad2 has a point here... I have a friend who asked me to spec out an audiophile-grade vinyl system for at/under $1k.... I thought I could do it, but it's really not possible. I've found that I need at least ~$1.6k ($400 for a decent turntable with something like an Ortofon 2M red, $400 for a decent amp/avr, $500 for decent bookshelf speakers and stands, and $300 for rack, surge protector, and basic cables) to get to a very entry-level "audiophile setup." while there are plenty of people that wouuold turn their noses up at a system like this, with the proper acoustic treatments and room positioning, a system like this could sound pretty good. I think there are plenty of audiophiles that are super interested and enthusiastic about audio reproduction, but aren't ready to spend the kind of money it takes to unlock true hifi sound. So I guess your question breaks down like this: anyone can be an audiophile, but an "entry-level, audiophile-grade system" will cost you ~$1.6k-$2k. Finally, as @designsfx points out, just because someone spends a lot on a system, that doesn't automatically make them an audiophile. Thoughtlessly throwing money at gear is the antithesis of what this hobby is all about in the first place!!! |
Then: ARC SP-11, D-250 servo, Acoustat 2+2 med, full blown Linn and quite a few high priced peripheral equipment. Total then about $40g Can. Still an Audiophile … Don’t need extravagant set ups to enjoy music. |
We did an article based on a quote that I heard at AXPONA this year from an industry executive who said "Anybody with a pair of earbuds can be an audiophile". |
You start with the room 1st. I built a room within a room in a custom house and the room plus treatments were $60,000, before spending 1 dime on electronics. When you are designing a custom home with a custom audio room, it’s cheaper to do things in the beginning than to retrofit it. I have friends that spent more than that on their rooms. As for equipment, money spent does matter. Everything in the audio stream matters: the microphones, the cables for the mics, the artists amps/guitars/piano, mixers, the recorders, just before it gets recorded on the medium. Engineers do not use $200 pioneer reel to reels to record a song. I don’t think it matters if you like music or you like the equipment, if you just like the music, get you a pair of beats headphones and call it a day. If you want the best sound quality possible, then it’s going to cost you. $500 speakers modified to the hilt will still sound like $500 speakers, same goes for amps/dacs/etc |
@deep_333 I do think guys are more motivated toward the gear aspect of audio. However with steaming available I listen more than I ever had. Back in the 1990's I built a system modeled after Cory Greenberg's (stereophile) poormans hi end rig and it seemed no matter how many cd's I bought I never seem to have enough to listen to that wasn't tired. So here I am 30yrs later just loving the endless amount of songs through streaming and with a better rig. But my live in girlfriend thinks I should spend more on our house which I admit is more practicle. She will always mention it if there is a song playing that she likes but will never mention how good it sounds through my system. |
@jacobsdad2000 Just had Dylan Mulvany delivering my free Bud Light. 🤣 and she/he asked what an Audiophile was. Bud light comes in real handy when you need target practice. 🎯 |
We will call prime meaningful sounds, natural sounds, music or speech... Guess who by design must be sensible to ANY sound detection for reason of care and protection and for a best socialization of his offsprings ? Female hearing is more sensible to high frequencies recognition for this reason ... Then they listen music and are less prone to go for marketing gear fetichism a disease among audiophiles who ignore any acoustics basic embeddings and anything which is not gear bragging ... I exagerate to spell my point but that is my observation in all audio threads...And who call me "tin foil hat" because of a low cost tweak ? Grown men hypnotized by marketing and obsessive about price tag , oblivious of any mechanical,electrical and acoustical embeddings and about psycho-acoutics, obsessed by possible costly upgrades ... 😊 |
There are plenty of women who spend a considerable amount of cash (atleast up in the 5k ballpark) and have rigs that sound very good. At that point, they are satisfied and tend to focus more on the music, discovering new artists, growing their music collection, etc, which is the whole point of great sounding gear in the first place. In other words, they seem to be more of the "music first" audiophile... It’s the "dude" who thinks that a 15k cable will fix all his setup errors and his lousy room, i.e. continues to spend up the dum-deedee tree. Blame the cable for everything in the end!! 😁 It’s the "dude" who generally sits around with a 300k rig that still sounds like sht in spite of all the glitter in his room....living in a state of constant disgruntlement.
"All that glitters ain’t gold!" - Prince |
@grh1958 You are all good man. Just had Dylan Mulvany delivering my free Bud Light. 🤣 and she/he asked what an Audiophile was. Though I do know a couple of ladies that enjoy our hobby, I go 4 wheeling with them. @jacobsdad2000 Sorry and I don't mean anthing bad about anbody and at this site I have never noticed (and not saying there isn't) any obvious females talking about audio gear. But I do suspect behind every audiophile that is married or lives with a women will get the LOOK 🙄when spending money on thier Audio System. |
It is not how much one spends, but rather, how important is good sound and how much effort one puts into pursuing that sound. I have a young friend who has not put in nearly as much money as I have, but, in his relatively shorter time as an audiophile, he has put in way more effort. He finds stuff at junk and estate sales and does repairs/refurbishment. He hunts down some quite odd items, like rare Japanese speaker drivers, to make various speakers. Some of his junk finds are almost unbelievable--like a Garrard 301 turntable that was in a stereo cabinet where the whole works was purchased for $50. He use to work for a local stereo shop from the time he was 17 to just a few months ago when he took a tech job at a test instrument company. While at that shop he was involved in the installation of a system north of $1.5 million in another country. THIS is WAY more than I've ever done, and I am pretty dedicated to audio pursuits. |
By education and tradition but also by physical genetical and biochimical design woman are tailor made and conditioned to passionnately mind about children and their male possible consorts and men are designed and conditioned also to be occupied by objects which may help dominate and help the tribes survival ... We have all in each man a feminine part of the soul and vice versa in the case of woman for sure...This is a balance between these two genetic but also symbolic forms in each of us ... But in general woman loving music are not focussed so much on gear variation as men with similar interest ...And in general man loving sound are not so much focussed also on music for its own sake as much as woman with the same inclination .. Ideologies opposing these simple general facts are just that, ideologies... |
@jacobsdad2000 Sorry and I don't mean anthing bad about anbody and at this site I have never noticed (and not saying there isn't) any obvious females talking about audio gear. But I do suspect behind every audiophile that is married or lives with a women will get the LOOK 🙄when spending money on thier Audio System. |
@grh1958 you had to go there? |
@jacobsdad2000 I think one of the qualifications is that you are a man, I don't know any women that fall prey to this addictive habit/hobby of ours. Maybe transgenders do but I don't know of any. |
It's a made up term. It is simply people who enjoy listening to music where the equipment is an important part of the experience that hopefully improves their enjoyment of it, but for some, it's a never ending chase to improve that end and that end is never satiated. For some, it's a fun hobby, they get real enjoyment from trying, and using different equipment. You can love music and not be an audiophile, or someone who has an audio system built around a pair of $100,000 speakers may simply want something nice and has never heard of Stereophile, HiFi News, or even Audiogon or Care. His passion might be cars or art or anything. I have one acquaintance whose system is so over the top, stuff that I have never seen or heard of b-4 meeting him, never reads the journals. He just likes what he likes. Another who owns JBL Paragons supported by, Jadis, Futterman OTL's, and Marantz Nines really doesn't know much about the stuff he owns and learned about them from visits to Japan of all places. |
The problem is that the way you present the diminishing returns observation ( it is not really a law) you present it as a MERE objective computation... But this "law" is related not only to objective design improvement with time but also to the subjective status of the customer who must be ready and knowleadgeable enough to perceive the change and accept it... This border separating objective design improvement and the listener status imply at the frontier near this border a MINIMUM ACOUSTIC SATISFACTION THRESHOLD or M.A.S.T. related to each acoustic factors to be objectively improved and to be subjectively perceived as such... The M.A.S.T. is different for each of us not only in subjective value but in his objective perception ... Acoustic factors for their determination and evaluation are related not only to our history in audio, in our audition personal learning and history, in our musical education , they are related to technical gear design imptovement but also to many embeddings controls in the mechanical, electrical and especially room acoustical dimensions and also to psycho-acoustics basic knowledge ... Then to understand how work the diminishing return "law" we must be able to perceive the M.A.S.T. and learn how to CONTROL IT AT WILL and not only go with upgrades spree... ....Because half the times at least, upgrades are meaningless, void of any oriented acoustic improvement and induced by marketing...In the opposite learning how to know ourself and our auditory history by learning acoustics basic concepts ( no it is more than room acoustic here ) and experimenting with low cost mechanical , electrical and acoustical experiments and simple devices, will make us able to know how to stop upgrading without being frustrated by the soundfield qualities.... We will had learn how to reach the minimal acoustic satisfaction threshold but minimizing our money expanse ... Each acoustic factors are related for each system room /ears/brain ...This relation is in some orders because each factors are directly or indirectly related, then we must learn what to do to improve the most important one and to which level because too much may be a defect... This is why the Diminishing returns relation between the subjective perception of an improvement and the objective design improvement cannot make sense without the minimal acoustic satisfaction threshold for each acoustic factors separetely and together in a balance way... This is why my motto in audio is : Never upgrade anything BEFORE embedding all components rightfully in the three working dimensions... And psycho-acoustics science rule the gear component working first and last not the reverse...
Then opposing "music lover" to audiophile as the one ready and obsessed by sound quality to the point of throwing money without ever stopping , make no sense... This opposition is preposterous and meaningless... Learning is the rule not expanse... We must be music and acoustic lover not only gear focus lover...
Another forgotten important point is that there is no relation between the state of a system well embedded in his working dimensions before and after... No comparison at all ... Not knowing how to embed a system nor even knowing that a system must be embedded rightfully to be evaluated, most people had no other solution than buying costlier cables and costlier components to feel less frustrated... |
