$39K for the Linn Klimax DAC/streamer?
Linn's Klimax DAC/Streamer is an interesting product. When I think of Linn, my immediate thought is about the turntable and I'm aware of their long history with digital music. Linn has a great customer base with complete Linn systems - folks spending $6K to well over $60k on a complete system which can be 'camoflaged' into the room or big on display. Their decision to design their own chip may be a way for them to get high-end audio philes to consider Linn digitial sources as well. |
I used to work for the company that made the Ariston RD11S and remember having a conversation with Mr Tiefenbrun one night at a hi fi exhibition and I broached the question to him if he would ever get into digital. His outburst was unprintable and the upshot was if digital ever started taking over then that was it for him and he would instantly put up the shutters. Well digital is now the major force in hi fi ( my opinion ) and Mr Tiefenbrun still hasn’t put up the shutters and I think 39K for a Dac is daylight robbery just as in the Eighties the Ariston was just as good as the LP12 for less than the linn. |
Folks- My apologies for the initiation of this wayward thread! I was just responding as a scientist who has worked with computers in biology and medicine their entire life. As a lifelong amateur musician, having played in almost every type of ensemble ranging from rock bands to string orchestras, it is my view that there is little sonic room left to improve music reproduction beyond the best of what is available now. I am lucky to have such a system, but I remain suspicious of expensive new products (and reviewers in audio magazines and on youtube) that continue to claim that every new gadget that comes along is the best thing since sliced bread. As a scientist, and thankfully not an engineer, I realize that most of these recent claims are specious, but I will try and stop posting incendiary topics. Thanks... |
I didn't ask if you thought all DACs and amps sounded the same. I asked you to consider why they sound different (if you do perceive a difference) and then consider if some of the same factors might apply to streamers. Based on your response,I gather that you haven't actually tried any upscale streamers. I won't change your belief through this discussion. May I suggest you try one in your system? If, after then, you decide there's no benefit, then you'll have a data point on which to base your opinion. |
I don't really see how this would be different from an amp, a speaker or a turntable. Do you think those can extract more than there is in the source?
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I have been in audio for some 45 years, so am by no means a newbee. I never did claim that all amps, CDPs, DACS ect. etc. sound the same, just that you can not extract more from any streaming source than is there - regardless of how much money or magic you throw at it. SO Basically, with this $39K Linn Klimax, you would be buying $500.00 worth of streamer with a $38,500 DAC....Jim |
Which specific streamers have you actually auditioned to reach your conclusion? Are you able to hear differences between DACs? Have you perceived differences between amplifiers? To what might you attribute those different sonic characteristics? Why would that not also apply to a source? It turns out they do. Though you may believe differently, with any reasonably decent system (golden ears and/or golden wallet are not needed) those differences are readily apparent. Yes, a cheap streamer will play music with fidelity. Better units will do so with more spatial information and resolution which are pretty easy to hear. Perhaps you should try one - you might be pleasantly surprised. This is an audiophile forum - a place where people who are interested in bettering their sound (within their budget) come to discuss and explore. It's interesting how many come here with preconceived ideas of what "must" be (i.e. bits are bits so digital sources sound the same, all class D amplifiers are lifeless, etc.). I'm not suggesting that more expensive is always better sounding. That clearly isn't the case. But, a good system will be well rewarded with moving upstream on the source. BTW - I didn't believe it either before I tried it. Nevertheless, I gained more sonic benefits moving to a better streamer than I did by significantly upgrading my DAC (and I spent 2x on the DAC relative to the streamer). I think I may have gotten that backwards in hindsight. |
No matter what rediculas price is put on any streamer, it can only capture, reproduce and sound as good as what comes from the source and stream. Right now about any $500. streamer on the market will faithfully and acuratly do that. Above that, audiophiles with deep pockets and golden ears are hearing something that isn't there.....Jim |
It needs to be remembered what this is, is the CD12 technology completely upgraded to the nth degree. There were 2 major revisions of it over a no. of years, the mk2 giving it substantially more dynamics & more & mk3 bringing it to an entirely different & altogether better level overall. This would be at least the equivilent of a mrk4, 5 or perhaps a higher level. A pretty SOA streamer any way you look at it. Scarf doesn't mention what other streamers he's heard at all, so that conspicuous absence if anything, points to the fact that there are likely others competitive he's pointedly not referring to. The audio magazine business is always a touch precarious, not least of all now. So the fact that Linn is such a heavy advertiser (2 full page color ad in the issue where this is reviewed & the only photo on the cover in addition to on an ongoing basis) has zero relevence, a touch more or somewhat more then that? You tell me. |
I have a ND 555--I recall that it is more than $24k, with the 555 PS added in (not an option) and the UnitiCore ripper and hard drive). I would consider it to be in a comparable price class as the Linn. I like it, but, I cannot say how the two compare . I would expect the Linn to sound good, given their track record with digital gear. |
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The NAIM ND555/555PS (the 555PS is an external power supply) is considered a superb streamer, in fact, Hi-Fi+ awarded it 'the best streamer on the market currently.' It's $15K cheaper than the Linn ($24K). Still not cheap by any means.. I have also read a very glorifying review about the Linn. Both are out of reach for me.. One great alternative for a great streamer is the moon SimAudio 360D ($9K). |
Linn have been following the same marketing strategy since the early 1970s.
It's just now they're targeting the so-called 'ascendant class' that the socialist (Ha!) Joe Biden seems to be assisting.
Clever strategical move on Linn's part, not so clever on crazy Joe's. Pretty soon he won't have any supporters left, not even fictional ones.
Let's go Brandon! |
why not ? y'all realize there is a forum discussion somewhere talking about how crazy and financially irresponsible a $1 k cartridge is.... a " consumable " at that...which is how you should view...wait for it.....your turbocharger... Hilarious how all the magic stone " you must hear it to criticize it " crowd are quick to pile on Linn.....
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I am betting the OP has not heard of most of the extreme gear out there that makes the Linn server look like a budget model. A local dealer installed the top end CD transport/DAC combination from Audio Note in a customer's system. I got to see and hear it while it was being tested and broken in for a few days. I declined to purchase one myself (yeah, like I have the $302k for that setup). I saw the Wadax at a show, and I will get a chance some day to hear it in a friend's system. It is a wild looking piece of gear. |
+1 @stibi I also wonder why op is not upset about the Wadax top dac? |
Linn makes great sounding gear on the leading edge of tech that is plug and play and looks fantastic in a home. Add to that, made in Scotland, small and runs cool. I can't afford $40k for a streamer, but I also can't afford a McLaren either and lots people buy those too. For some people $40k isn't a lot of money. Stop acting so jealous people - if you want to piece together a rig for less money, go for it, Linn's not necessarily chasing after your part of the market. |
@mahler123 I’d be most interested in reading that article if it is available. I did a search with no success. Would you be so kind as to pont me in the right direction? I think that the quite sustained increase in inequality (in both relative and absolute terms, generally since about 2008, but most certainly and dramatically in the last year or so) may also explain certain aspects that have been explored recently in a recent/current thread about bricks and mortar stores and sales practices. |
@lanx0003 is your conjecture henry53 hasn't donated $20k to the needy? |
@millercarbon I really appreciate your post. |
The person being quoted said it is the best server he ever heard. How do we know that this is a lie or hyperbole? It might be that, and whether or not it is worth $39k is a different matter. I have not heard this latest Linn server. But, many years ago I did hear their top of the line CD player and it was a truly fantastic player. I also heard their early servers. They were in this game sooner than most companies, so they have had plenty of time to up their game. As to the "value" of such a server, I won't get into the big picture philosophy which is pointless to argue here. As an audio component, it is worth that price if it performs up to the competition in sound quality, build, convenience, utility, etc. I did not see any of those here criticizing it mention what they heard and experienced with the product vs. their experience with other competitive products. |
Strange post and even more stranger responses, I should say. I thought we are here to discuss audio and not spending habits. The fact that one is not ready or not able to pay certain price doesn't mean the price is necessarily crazy. Anyway most if not all of the audiophiles seem strange (not to use stronger words) to the rest, so do obviously some of us, ready to pay big dollars in the quest for the perfect sound and the grande listening pleasure. |
Nothing Linn is worth $39k. Especially not a DAC/Streamer Linn is mid-fi in today's marketplace, trying to project as high-end or even state of the art. Trading on a naim only. The top LP12 turntable costs $15k. in the mid 1970s it was $600. OK they say they've improved it but really all they've done is up-priced it to match the ludicrous prices being asked for turntables these days. And they're still pigs to set up and keep set up.
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