$27,500 for whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat???
"I don't know if Wilson runs an in house paint shop (expect that they probably do)"If my memory serves me well, I saw a Wilson ad some years ago. It had a story about a man who does the paint work. It was one of the ads from a few that put faces of people who actually manufacture their speakers. I remember a father and son but do not remember what their position was. |
Anyway, on a side note that maybe related. McLaren supercars and Ferrari supercars tend to have similar MSRP. But a used Ferrari will tend to keep its values very well and in some cases, rises in values. On the other hand, McLaren cars do not keep their values very well. The point here is it's the market that determines the value of something, not the manufacturer. I mean you can say your product will cost an x-amount, but it will only worth that much if the market decides to pay for that. If nobody is willing to pay Wilson 20K for a paint job, you can bet your little johnny Wilson is not going to charge that next time. |
@andy2 , "The point here is it’s the market that determines the value of something, not the manufacturer. I mean you can say your product will cost an x-amount, but it will only worth that much if the market decides to pay for that." Yes, and working out just how the market will react has occupied some of the best minds (admittedly with only limited success) for the past century. Brand image and marketing both go a very long way to establishing value and prestige. The manufacturer does has some control over these and will readily realise that neither are immune from the benefits of omission or misinformation. Time will tell whether Daryl Wilson is able to keep all the wheels on the wagon his dad built. In the meantime when people are willing to pay $27,000 for a loudspeaker paintjob - it tells you more about them than the company willing to provide it. |
Come on guys that not a lot to spend on a paint upgrade. You know you drop that much on a weekend with a few wild women so why not take a weekend off and put it where it counts. The paint offers a great improvement on acoustics which is fairly audible, I'm sure. If that is not the case then you're screwed! |
Only a fool with too much $$ would spend that . For $10 k I can get my car painted in any color base coat,clear coat with a seamless finish. To paint a speaker for almost $30k proved that companies know there are suckers out there .as an ex Audiostore owner Ithink this ritzy snobbery BS is truly taking a wizz on the consumer in whatever the market will bear. .even in electronics a fantastic looking case but with average parts then asking $20-30k that is why I mod most everything I own the much higher quality parts give you on average 3 x in $$ spent in value . That is why buying a few years old reference piece then upgrading it makes total sence .This is why Dan Modwright decided to offer this. Any very good tech can upgrade go to a specialist.myself know through experience the best of parts including Loudspeakers speakers are a a Huge offender using low to med quality Xover parts which is the heart of the speakers .even in $80k speakers life example ML stats, using low cost mundorf evo capacitors, where their supreme line is the best white evo ,= cheap harbeththe owner slammed the phone on me when I questioned him on using Taiwan caps,since they are made in the U.K. where I sold Hifi Clarity caps are made just down the road.inthere newer SE models they finally got the hint. rule of thumb ,if they don’t state the Xover quality it means not much to brag about 90% of the time. Doyourself a favor and ask questions,like if buying a car. |
The thing was $65. So i don’t know what’s worse, a $27,500 paint job, or putting in a $65 mid in a six figure speaker, even worse, both!You can look at it both ways: 1. The SB woofer is way underpriced. 2. Or the Wilson is way overpriced. Or both are way overpriced. Or looking at it another way, the cabinets are smoking killing hot. Or may be Wilson is using top of the line Mundorf silver gold oil with a mix of Vaseline for lubrication. |
I posted once in the same vein about $30,000 cables. Boy was I flamed for rattling the cage. I’m now a lot more zen about what folks want to do with their money. Even when it’s patently obvious value is not evident. The only thing I can’t help feeling is that somehow someone somewhere is suffering or being ripped off in the process of manufacture, distribution and transaction. |
Can't understand why people care how or what others spend their hard earned on. I too own Wilson speakers. Yes they are very big, and heavy, and expensive. I love the way they sound, and I also like the look. Not for everybody though, but good for me. You spend your $$ your way, and I'll spend mine my way.Cheers, and Happy Thanksgiving to all of you on the south side of our border.(we had ours a month ago and I'm still full) |
Funnily enough i sometimes get the impression that quite a few here think a sum such as this would be chump change. Not that my opinion is relevant but in my tiny mind i would consider that anyone who would spend over 27k on a paint job for their speakers would be just plain silly. I could see maybe 7k - 8k for a really fab paint job, but 27k is looney tunes territory. |
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It is true. There are some here who think being an audiophile is about how much you spend in your system, while some of us are about how much we can save!" I'm in it for the music & sound quality. That said, I wouldn't spend $27K on paint... but could care less if someone else does. Really to say I could care less is an understatement. It's none of my business. |
I'm personally disgusted by conspicuous consumption and vanity products and that's all this is. It has no redeeming qualities. The 27k for paint is just an especially egregious example of it. I think it's something we should all avoid. Almost anyone can feel good by having something others can't. Even if you're just the homeless crackhead with the fanciest pipe. It's not that the pipe somehow performs better, it's that the other crackheads in your group can't afford it, and you make yourself feel superior by being better than them. There's no higher level goal like a better crack high. It's the most base instinct. Moving up in the pecking order, like a chicken. |
Hi end,is just that,HI END. Folks that buy these products are in a different world than most. Some look at these people with contempt. If you have the means,God bless. These people aren't taking money out of their kids mouths. As crazy as it seems spending $27k on a paint job for a pair of speakers,there (I'm sure) just as many people that can not pay their electric bill,think it's crazy to spend 2k on an amp. It's just the way of the world. If I earned 7 figures a year,my system would definitely be different than it is now. Also,my house ,cars,and motorcycles would probably be different too. |
jon_5912 I’m personally disgusted by conspicuous consumption and vanity products and that’s all this is.It confounds me how anything purchased to be used exclusively inside a home could be considered "conspicuous consumption." Almost anyone can feel good by having something others can’t.They can? Even if you’re just the homeless crackhead with the fanciest pipe. It’s not that the pipe somehow performs better, it’s that the other crackheads in your group can’t afford it, and you make yourself feel superior by being better than them. There’s no higher level goal like a better crack high.Ahhhh, now I see where you’re coming from. Addiction is a terrible thing, so good luck with that. |
@jon_5912, "I’m personally disgusted by conspicuous consumption and vanity products and that’s all this is. It has no redeeming qualities. The 27k for paint is just an especially egregious example of it. I think it’s something we should all avoid. Almost anyone can feel good by having something others can’t. Even if you’re just the homeless crackhead with the fanciest pipe. It’s not that the pipe somehow performs better, it’s that the other crackheads in your group can’t afford it, and you make yourself feel superior by being better than them. There’s no higher level goal like a better crack high. It’s the most base instinct. Moving up in the pecking order, like a chicken." Good points. I totally agree a 27k paintjob is something any decent human being should try to avoid, but perhaps it’s a little bit strong to feel disgusted? For sure ostentatiousness via possessions doesn’t really help anyone in the end. Not when you’ve long passed the point of any detectable (sonic) improvement. I guess you might still inspire envy, gain some hollow attention but you still get old, you still get sick, you still going to die. Like it or not we are still a competitive lot, aren’t we? I’ve got working-class cousins who are semi literate but who still seem to live their lives by the labels they flash around, Hugo Boss, iPhone 11, Timberlands etc. I guess such things must give some kind of meaning, comfort, feeling of one-upmanship. A feeling of aspiration, of belonging to some superior group, or of attaining some desirable hegemony perhaps. At least for a short while. Perhaps in a similar way that owning good Hi-Fi might give us? No it can’t be that, we’re in it for the right reasons, we’re in it for the sound quality alone. Aren’t we? |
@jon_5912, you've got me thinking now. Anyone living in the West who has travelled much must have inevitably encountered people living in such dire poverty that they would make the poorest of us here seem affluent in comparison. Against such a background $27,000 for a loudspeaker paint job does seem a trifle obscene, and not to mention sonically quite unecessary. My entire system, including music must have cost me somewhere around $5k. Outside a couple of audiophile friends I personally don't know anyone who has spent anything near that amount on audio. Having said that, it's probably my only comparitive extravagance in life. That's how much music means to me. Probably also explains why the price/performance ratio of audio products matters so much to me. So you'll never see me paying $27k for a Wilson loudspeaker paintjob, however unlikely that I will ever be in the position to do so. Even if I was, and my accountant advised it as a tax avoidance measure I'd much rather simply give the money away. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price%E2%80%93performance_ratio |
WILSON makes some very expensive speakers, they advertise them as a cost-no-object product, and one of the best manufacturers in the world. I'm sure the paint job involves many hours of prep work and their employees (in Utah) make a very good wage. For me, the contradiction comes from their stating how well the present line performs, while they are already working on re-designing them at the factory for the next upgrade. The availability of "newer technology", or some new cabinet material is already in the works, and so you're "obligated" to come by after 3-4 years and audition the V-2, then the 3, and so on. This all happens way too quickly while other companies stick by their designs for much longer intervals. You may want to know what was so wrong with the original SOTA speaker you paid so much for. As for the Chronosonic, I would have put the bass-speakers in a separate inclosure and re-work the Tower-of-Pizza design so it looks like it "might" look half-as-good as the original WAMM did. |
I just remembered something that kinda put things into prospective. My elderly neighbor had her entire house painted 2 years ago both inside and out, as well as her garage. The house is around 1800 sq. ft., 3 bedrooms, 2 full baths and the garage is a standard 2 car structure. She paid the painters $12,000. I would've done it for half. And Wilson wants $27,500 to paint 2 boxes. |
@french_fries , "For me, the contradiction comes from their stating how well the present line performs, while they are already working on re-designing them at the factory for the next upgrade. The availability of "newer technology", or some new cabinet material is already in the works, and so you’re "obligated" to come by after 3-4 years and audition the V-2, then the 3, and so on. This all happens way too quickly while other companies stick by their designs for much longer intervals. You may want to know what was so wrong with the original SOTA speaker you paid so much for." Great point, valid today as it ever has been. Some might say that the whole of audio is nothing more than a unhealthy mixture of the Emperor’s New Clothes regularly doused in very rare and precious snake oil. Nothing more - nothing less. Do today’s Wilson speakers sound any better than yesterday’s? Does anything sound better than the original 1959 Quads? Is the LS3/5 still the best bookshelf speaker ever built? Are box speakers (monkey coffins) now caught in the leaping frog puzzle syndrome where only increasingly minuscule forward leaps are possible? Are Harbeth the only company willing to admit their designs today are only marginally better than those from the 1990s? Are we all being suckered onto a never-ending merry go round ride? Eventually arriving to find we are hardly any further along than when we started. Perhaps the lucky ones were those who had assembled a system they could enjoy and then forgot about the quagmire infested world of audio. Perhaps they found when they returned to have a new look a few years later that nothing much ever changes. Here’s Daryl Wilson talking about where he’s coming from. My take is that he sounds more like he’s Tim Cook than Steve Jobs. Not sure what deodorant he’s using, but nice suit and tie, nevertheless. Should keep the shareholders happy. https://youtu.be/JTnaSrIIW2s |
Let me reiterate that it's not the cost of the paint and the labor involved that seems excessive. The Large unwieldy Chronosonic would have to be completely dis-assembled in order to get the paint applied properly, so I'm very sure they could justify the costs involved if they wanted to. But for me, I would mention that it's rather the fact that their premier product- the Watt-Puppy- made them what they are today. Only now it's called the Sasha. After endless years of using an inverted metal tweeter they switched over to a smoother-sounding silk dome. But they won't convert the Ver.1 to the 2, or the Ver.2 to the newest Ver.3. This is mainly over a tweeter and a modification of the crossover. The dealer ought to be able to buy the upgrade in kit and install the new parts in a few hours. The cabinet material was superb and virtually inert back when it was called the W/P 3/2 and cost $12K. I respect their dedication to cost-no-object, but the real night-and-day improvement comes from a great recording VS a poor one. Imaging and sound staging is a further step forward, and a valid one. But engineering a pleasant "listenable" speaker was attained many years ago by ADS, Acoustic Research, Advent, Dynaco, and so on. Flat Panels were also making tremendous headway in making the music sound "real". David Wilson is originally known for making a speaker that took up very little space and had impeccable build quality. But his greatest legacy in the long run may end up being the excellent recordings he made. I have THOSE since I could afford them. They should all be re-issued, because I could never justify buying one of their speaker systems, even if I had the money. Since they're never satisfied, the consumer in turn must also never be satisfied. |
