Would you spend you money on modest brand new car or rather buy top notch vintage one?

Easy, daily driver, modest new car. Awesome collector car, for fun only.

If it were a daily driver,for sure a New car.

@tannoy56 Seems the car analogy lost on some. You do mention vintage in the analogy, can understand vintage, used and new audio components being mentioned in thread.

I have purchased and used vintage, used and new equipment over many years. Vintage can be very good, electrolytic caps and other parts can be problematic, as others have mentioned good idea to slowly power up with variac.  Used equipment is is probably greatest value proposition, don't have to suffer depreciation, rather like cars here. As mentioned previously, I also like to go for point to point wiring, if possible with vintage or used.

With streaming and digital in general, usually go new, many innovations here.

By the way, with cars I've nearly always owned at least one vintage vehicle. At the moment, 1970 MGB GT I'm considering morphing into Sebring version.

Indeed the Z is free, just pay for the vintage Telefunken s that come with it….

I'm not asking for help.  My intent is to spark an open minded discussion on the subject which in terms may lead to different points of view ( as we can see here) and better understand  our rational motive when it comes to purchase new vs. used. 

Hello,

No need to use an analogy here. Also. The variables are endless. Tell us the specifics of the gear you want to buy and typically the group here will voice their opinions. My biggest concern is the caps. How old are they and if they were replaced then by whom and with what caps. The next thing if you buy vintage then have it checked out by a shop. One of the biggest things is setting the bias and using a Variac to slowly charge up the gear and caps in the gear. Usually this costs about $50-$75 per component. Believe me you don’t want to buy a vintage car that has value but can cost a fortune to fix unless you have it checked out. I hope this helps. 

@clearthinker in literature,  it is called - creative writing.

Let someone else take the depreciation hit. I’d buy used if possible. But then it’s all dependent on what and how much? As a side note, I love restored vintage gear. It has more resale potential then new.  

Ask Jay Leno

I wish vintage cars were as reliable as my vintage audio gear.

Oldest 1958: all electro-voice drivers, 64 years old now (horns and woofer) crossovers, L-Pads within my main speakers. Recone kit and L-Pads competitively available. 30 wpc mono amps thar drove them originally. Crossovers tar filled cans, but replacement also readily available.

mx110z Tube Tuner/Preamp from 1964, 58 years old now, full service available, parts scarce.

2 Pairs of AR2ax from say 1968, 54 years old, rehab parts readily available.

R2R Tape Deck Teac X2000R, Orwellian year 1984, seems and behaves fairly new to me, only 38 years old

Vertical Turntable, also 1984, style looks more dated.

Hmmmm, 1984 was a good year, JVC Turntable/Plinth TT81 going strong.

...............................

Favorite car, still miss it, 1994 Jaguar XJS Convertible, Kingfisher Blue. I totaled ours in an auto accident, what a shame. I could buy another, it’s ’only’ 28 years old, but that age stops any daydreaming. link below, click ’images’ near the top of the page

https://www.google.com/search?q=1994+jaguar+xjs+convertible&rlz=1C1VDKB_enUS1007US1007&sxsrf=ALiCzsYwuZRu-3DcEh38aNaU35impD7r9Q:1660125713955&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi_h9Wbgrz5AhXKg4kEHdHqApgQ_AUoAnoECAIQBA&biw=1707&bih=849&dpr=1.5

magical metallic color: looked blue if blue sky, looked green if near grass

@tannoy56   Why mention cars if you are not talking about cars?

I have bought a number of items ex-dem,. amps, speakers.  Arguably they have been lightly and carefully used and don't have too many miles on them.  A warranty can be negotiated.  They will probably still be in manufacturer's guarantee.  The discount is substantial, if not as much as used.  Worked very well for me.

One issue to watch is they may have travelled a bit.  Look out for small knocks etc.  The original packaging is sometimes damaged.  My Martin Logan CLX Anniversaries were original packed in cardboard even though they are delicate and heavy.  It got them from UK seller to France but was disintegrated by then.  So I had trouble getting them back to UK again when I returned.  COME ON ML, PACK YOUR COSTLY STUFF PROPERLY.

Anyone who want free Mcintosh MX-110Z, please contact @tomic601. Thank you for your generous donation. You’re the  real Dude.

IF anyone needs an MX-110Z…get in touch…

Dude, lighten up…. @whart is a major dude and CAN afford the “ gears “…. and the gears and a $1m policy on audio is easy as pie…..

@yoder Every thing we learn in live comes from long and accumulated knowledge. When it comes to audio, where do you think, todays best learn from? That’s why, as an audiophile, it might be important to learn from older, well engineered electronics as well. Now days, they are a lot of classic vintage gears priced as low as 20 cent on the dollar and this is before the inflation factor. When it comes to dac’s, I currently have modern Lampizator DAC/DSD but I still keep and like my Wadia from 1992 - still stock and working great. So, the moral of the story is that if you have knowledge and shop carefully one can find a gem among the see of just used gears. History is important and can be very useful as well.

@wart That is fine if you don’t get it. You don’t have to respond back. But at least you should get the message that we are NOT TALKING ABOUT CARS as you can tell from the subtitle. The title was constructed as a catchy phrase in order to get your attention. When it comes to WE, Studer, Nagra EMT etc., they are not affordable used equipment option for most of you and we should ignore them for the purpose of this discussion. So, you see, it is not that difficult to get it unless you want to be on top of things and control the situation. Relax and smell the roses - can you get that?

For the question as asked it would depend on if I'm trying to get best performance or a cool piece if history that still performs well. I think the value is almost always used for audio equipment,  just how used do you go, and what you consider vintage. Reliability can be better new with electronics, but I think you need to have a plan for good technical support either way.  You can hope for the best used, or you have to learn about the manufacturer, design, components reliability, support, and parts availability.  As mentioned depends on the type of gear. I just got a tube amp that's 25 years old. It's a great amp for any year built, and not a quality level I could afford new. It's point to point wired and will pretty much be repairable indefinitely by any good tube amp tech with no printed circuit boards in it to go obsolete. Mine's in great condition,  but you can be anywhere between like new and a fire hazard, so you have to be more knowledgeable to go vintage, which is a burden. I bought a great used DAC at one-third of new price about 5-10 years old, but I don't think I'd want a vintage DAC,  if they exist yet. 

This does not make much sense to me because vintage cars can be a multiple of a new model, assuming the marque still exists. In audio, some vintage equipment is highly prized and quite expensive- think WE anything, EMT tables, Studer mastering decks, vintage big horn studio monitors, etc.

What are we trying to focus on?- I was able to build systems more cost effectively in the period 1970 to say, the oughts of 2000 via used equipment. Once we got the supply chain whammy, no chips, existing equipment that you could get NOW became more expensive. I don’t think you can generalize- a specific piece of gear may be a grail or a trip to the dump. Ditto, certain cars. Old isn’t always good, but some history there too.

What are you really asking?

I have a buddy who is into vintage muscle cars. I have heard his horror stories about breakdowns. In my vehicles as well as my stereo system I want reliability. I have had friends over for a listening session and had something go on the fritz and ruin a great time.Having learned the hard way, I have built redundancy into my system so if anything goes down except for my speakers, I can quickly get us up and running again.
So let’s tackle your question directly. I have no problem buying used gear with some caveats. I will never buy a used phono cartridge. I will not buy speakers or amps more than 10 years old unless the capacitors have been recently replaced. Digital gear is changing so fast that last years best might not have the performance of the latest and greatest. You really have to look at the price. Something less than five years old at 50% off the original msrp I would consider. Same goes for speakers.Cables are in a different category all together. I have been delighted by some of the used cables I have purchased at terrific discounts.

Used or refurbished works well in my experience. It all depends on the source. Music room or Safe and Sound are excellent sources. 

A vintage car is very different than a top notch used car...

And vintage audio equipment is very different than top notch used audio equipment.

For me it depends - I've bought new equipment and have bought used equipment.  I have a good relationship with my audio dealer and have bought demo and used items that were on my 'some day' list including speakers, record cleaner and audio rack.

My cars are 31, 24, and 23 years old. SO MUCH CHEAPER to keep older cars!! For the difference in price of JUST ONE new car, vs 3 already paid for, I can keep all 3 going strong for another decade!

…..And, have money left over for great audio gear!!!

A couple of years ago I purchased a very low-miles 2010 Audi A3. Not only was the value exceptional relative to a new version, but I actually prefer that cars were not yet so wildly over-engineered at that time.

The comparison to audio gear is largely apples and oranges, but in terms of buying new vs. used components, I almost invariably choose the latter.

I did.  Read the elaborate explanation below the title. Can you?

Then you should have asked the question that way.

The subject here is not to compare cars vs. audio equipment, but rather buying new gears  vs. used.  

Well, try to insure 1M audio equipment.

The cars are not the subject of discussion.  The title of the discussion was chosen  for different reasons. The subject here is not to compare cars vs. audio equipment, but rather buying new gears  vs. used.  

Try insuring vintage cars.

@roxy54 Many vintage audio gears fetch more money if they are in the original condition. No, I don’t believe that the reason being is - collector of vintage. Personally, I don’t know even one collector unless he/she is an audiophile first and collector second. In addition, most of the updated used gears are not done right. The repair shop choice of replacement caps and wiring, in most cases degraded the original sound of the equipment. I rather buy for less ( or even more $$$) and do the upgrade myself. What is the point of buying something that works well but doesn’t sound as good as the original?  It's not that easy to get the right sound when changing caps, resistors, wire etc.

@roxy54 ..."he dropped it to a 9. I think that the best that you can call an amp of that age is a 7. What do you guys think?"

Functional condition and age matters too, not just appearance for ranking. It also depends on whether it’s been updated or not with 34-40 year old caps, and other updates. A local gent partially guts the amp, replaces caps, all wiring, bits and more at a cost $. While the SA 1,2,3 "E" Series can be interesting, some of the same owners also upgraded to Pass X150+ amps later on. Worth reading up on with other Threshold-Pass owners. The desirability may be more of a personal thing, and for me, I’d want to consider the upgrade costs as part of the total investment or perceived value of paying extra for an E series amp. All part of your own personal scoring and ranking for consideration. 

New car.

I’ve already lived with the feature set in vintage. Cars have many more new ones every year. And besides tires there is less degradation from just aging except for seaside.

On that subject, I found this ad on USAM listed as a 10. This amp is between 28 and 32 years old depending on when it was manufactured. He says it's perfect, but I can clearly see a few small stains on the faceplate which is really not the point.

I messaged the guy and had a back and forth about the grading being improper for a used amp of this age and in the end, he dropped it to a 9. I think that the best that you can call an amp of that age is a 7. What do you guys think?

Threshold Sa 3.9e Stasis For Sale - US Audio Mart

For a car, I would buy the new one.  I have had old cars and there's always something going wrong/breaking on them.  Mechanical parts wearing out, rubber aging, etc.

For audio equipment, I would consider good used electronics, just being mindful of tube life and capacitor age.  Minimal mechnical wear and tear.

I would always buy new. Vintage can mean lots of problems and lots of money to repair.  Besides, vintage is thrown around way too easily here. 

Agree with hilde45. It depends on the situation and what you're looking for.

The whole question reposes in the details, no? 

In other words, it could go either way, depending. In 3...2...1...