Struggling to spend 13k with three dealers

I just looked at Paragon's web site. Looks like a top notch retailer

I think for the price of Wilson’s, finding a certified Wilson dealer would be the best bet for used gear.  Especially for parts, service, etc. 

I bought and received a pair of Wilson Sabrina from Larry Marcus at Paragon and hooked them up yesterday. Fantastic ! The right combo of musical and detailed with tons of new micro detail in music I've listened to for years - great soundstage and imaging - everything I'd read about. I've sold  all the trade equip privately with exception of the Klipsch Cornwall 4 and have someone interested in them and will probably sell them too. 

Thanks Larry for a great experience, thanks Wilson for some great speakers.

If you buy full price retail for the speakers your problem will be solved. 

I recently traded in my amps and my dealer really did not want them, but he took them as I have been a customer for twenty years. I am such a small client to him as he normally deals with deep pocket customers that have too much money. 

Business is way up for these dealers as well due to Covid and the holidays.

Best of luck.

A pass 250.8, Pass xp10 pre amp, PS Audio DSD Jr set up. 

@cowan217 Congratulations on securing a pair of Sabrinas and experiencing a good transaction.  Glad it worked out and you found a good dealer to work with. 

If you don't mind the ask, or I missed it, what amplifier(s) are you planning to use to drive the Sabrinas?

@mofojo 

Thanks. I don't spend much time on forums.

Perhaps better to attempt humor than to be overly forum serious. 😎

@metaphacts 

Lol, since you only have 3 posts you may not know that anything tubebuffer says is a joke. Like literally this is an old probably white dudes alter ego at an attempt at humor. 

@ tubebuffer

Unless it is Certified Authentic, no WATT/Puppy 8s remain under Wilson Audio Factory Warranty.

That said, using a speaker in the environment you describe does not necessarily void the warranty. However, any failure or damage that can be attributed to the issues caused by the environment would not be considered manufacturing defects and would not be covered by the warranty.

Some idiot west coast, was charging customers 175.00 to setup listeningbrooms..if you purchased it went 6o purchase price..if.not your out 175...extortion

@twoleftears 

Miracle is a noun. He used it as a noun but (intentionally erroneously) failed to type "it's a miracle". 

@ghasley I think he was using "miracles" as a verb.🙂

I have question warrany. I consider pair use watt puppy 8 for boat dock system. We have gather and I need clean sound. I install in waterproof box that I keep thing like rod and reel in when not use. Is this good warranty is buy through dealer? Speaker be outside but never wet. Would be disgrace get Wilson wet that disgrace do that. I power with Escalade alpine mono amp system.

@cowan217 

Congratulations on finding your speakers! Welcome to the Wilson family.

Larry Marcus was instrumental in the development of Wilson's Trade-In and Certified Authentic programs. His experiences taking trades and treating customers fairly while doing so gave us insights into the best ways to serve Wilson owners and potential owners. 

Since Sabrinas are officially discontinued, technically your speakers are Certified Authentic Factory Tested. If installed they carry the full 5 year warranty, If not, they carry a one year warranty. IMO, the warranty is not why you want them installed. Matt Chapman is. Matt has set up more Wilsons than just about anyone outside the factory. It doesn't get any better.

Enjoy your Sabrinas!

@tubebuffer the real miracle is you used an “s” at the end of miracles. You actually used a plural.

@cowan217 you will appreciate doing business with Paragon. Every step of your transaction will be smooth. Congratulations.

@metaphacts 

I bought a pair of Sabrina (new in box), leftovers of the original version today from Larry Marcus at Paragon, fast, easy transaction, great price and completed in 30 mins. Looking forward to breaking them in...

This holy Christmas miracle this guy Wilson stumble this thread on Sunday night after this guy complain like grinch since begin time. Order real speaker stop be cheap look for best bargain from non spec back alley thug. Bring tear to my eye to see this connection it miracles

@metaphacts 

Thanks for your note- I talked with Trent at Wilson last week in fact for advice on Sabrina X vs pre owned Sasha 1 or Sasha 2 and you're right the Chicago dealer is of course only selling pre-owned. Happy to call you this week regarding the new dealer experience. All I really want to do is secure a pair of Wilson, and if new, get the full Wilson set up experience which the dealers I was talking with were not committing to do.

thanks  

Well..that was crisp and on point ! 

Jim

Hello Cowan,

As someone who works for Wilson and wrote the Wilson Audio Certified Authentic Handbook, our dealer guide to treating the customer fairly while actively seeking, taking, and reselling trade-ins, I hope I can help clarify some details for you. I'm a bit concerned over the responses you are getting from dealers, some of whom do not appear to be actual Wilson Authorized Dealers.

First, an authorized US Wilson Dealer MUST set up every new and current Wilson loudspeaker he sells in the customer's home using WASP as a part of the purchase price. If a dealer offers not to do so, he is in violation of his Dealer Agreement and could be terminated.

Second, an authorized US Wilson Dealer will typically offer an actual current market, used retail value for a trade-in. If it is a Wilson speaker being traded, it may even be higher than the range for which legitimate used Wilson speakers of the same model are selling. Wilson Audio will actually buy back used Wilson speakers taken in trade by the dealer.

Third, an authorized US Wilson Dealer almost always sells used Wilson speakers as Certified Authentic because Wilson offers a Wilson Factory Warranty on Certified Authentic Wilson speakers. The goal of Certified Authentic is to offer a new Wilson buying experience with a previously owned Wilson speaker, including the opportunity for in home WASP setup. Only an authorized Wilson Audio Dealer can offer a Certified Authentic speaker. Every Wilson speaker ever made is eligible to be made Certified Authentic. The original WAMM, Serial No 001 is in the process of being Certified Authentic right now.

Now let me address some of the concerns you mentioned:

The dealer to which you refer in Chicago is not, nor has he ever been a Wilson Audio dealer. Whatever he does has nothing to do with Wilson Audio and everything to do with how he does business. But he appears to be a fit for many people and has been in business for a number of years. You pay your money and you take your choice.

I cannot speak to the other two dealers as I cannot tell who they are from your posts. 

Currently Wilson Audio is delivering SabrinaX at a greater rate than ever. However, a SabrinaX ordered this week will be delivered to the dealer (or to the customer if drop shipped) around mid April.

If you have any questions regarding Wilson Audio and our policies, please call our office at 801-377-2233 and ask for Jerron or for me.

Best of luck whatever you decide to do going forward.

Bill

I guess that dealer doesn't care about sales. Find another one.

Some dealers will not take trade ins no matter what. A very highly respected guy local to me recently unloaded $225K of gear to a wholesaler after he got sick of it. He is very knowledgeable by not patient enough to deal with the used equipment complexities. He used to do it, but doesn't need to now.

Another guy is sitting on tons of stuff and will only take trades he knows he can sell and with him it is only on consignment. And he forgot to pay me once when he sold something of mine. Oops....never bought anything else from him.

Sorry if I missed it, but who is the Chicago dealer you are talking about? If it is the one I am thinking of, good luck buying anything from him...It's a lost cause. There is a current ad for a Rea G1 sub offered for sale by him that has been rolling over for at least 3 years. I know as I tried to purchase it back in 2018. All of his ads roll over continuously whether he still has the item or not.

Yah, weird though. The Chicago dealer constantly posts Wilsons on Audiogon- today he must have 8 ads at least for various models. Call him and try to buy a pair and he denigrates them immediately making you feel like an idiot for wanting to buy them. I really wonder if he has any in stock at all or it's a bait and switch move. Same thing when I then asked if a JL woofer would integrate well- "why would you want JL, it's too boomy" (def not the case with an F113 V2), have you tried REL? I'll never shop with him again (I did buy a couple of things from him a couple years ago). 

I live 3 hours from the Chicago dealer your talking about and couldn’t get him to respond either when I had interest in Wilson’s he had.  I ended buying from my local dealer with setup included.  Some of these dealers have deep pockets and big ego’s to go along with it so it’s a hit or miss when trying to buy expensive audio gear.  

If you really want them, don’t give up.  Sell the Klipsch on your own and remove from the equation.  You will save money and reduce a complication for the dealer.  Verdantaudio’s post is right on point.

However, do agree that many dealers are clueless about the products they sell or lazy or forgetful.  Hobby or not, I wonder if some dealers get into it without any real knowledge on how to run a business.

Cowan217,

I can vouch for the high shipping costs. When I started looking at the KEF Reference 5’s, the shipping costs we’re about $350 to my door.  When I bought a pair just two months later, the shipping cost went up to $1200! 
so for them to ship to you is expensive and who’s paying to ship your trade-in back to the dealer?

All the best.

JD

This is sad.  We are busy too.  Sales are up 300% this year and I have never been so busy.  That being said, my day is not done until all calls and e-mails are returned.  Additionally, an estimate for used gear should not take more than 72 hours if really complex.  It is unfortunate that you are being forced to deal with such poor service.  

That being said, those freight quotes are not crazy at all.  They may seem silly but freight costs are just insane and those sound like legit costs.  I can easily pay enormous amounts of money for shipping, even short distances.  A huge part of the cost is in the pickup and drop off along with handling at the depots at both ends.  

Is the car market so friendly as has been mentioned a couple times?   You are blessed in America.  A couple hour transaction?  Wow.

In the country where I live things are/were very tight.  Quite often there were simply no second hand vehicles available, and if there were they were what nobody else wanted.  Second hand car dealers were going out of business the last year.  Not sufficient stock.

If you're trying to squeeze the last nickel out the Cornwalls,

why are you trying to trade them in? Sell them on your own.

A lot of people like Steve Guttenburg love those things.

There is a an entire website dedicated to the annual 

pilgrimage to Hope as well as the Museum. Tragic these

people are. 

Best wishes with the sale @cowan217 

cowan217

Keep me posted on this development.

Happy Listening!

cowan217

PM sent.   Happy Listening!

The Chicago dealer doesn't always respond to actual offers. He continues to list items that never sell. I cant quite figure him out either. @cowan217  If you are going to pay full retail they should be falling all over their self to set them up. 

If you are willing to trade/sell your Klipsch Cornwall 4 at 40% below market value, you should be able to sell them without issue.  Heck, at that discount, even the gear flippers will be tempted. 

The klipsch are Cornwall 4 so big and not likely to sell easily and ship hence my intent to do a trade. 

Exactly how the dealer feels 🙄

I just can not understand the US market. You are having problems spending $13K, I had problems spending $150k until I gave up. My dealer in Spain was all too happy to get me what I wanted in a week.

As for speakers I would seriously look at the Tannoy Kensington, I have 2 pairs. The only thing you need to look for is the manufacturing date. The ones I bought in the USA were manufactured almost 3 years before I bought them for new  and the distributor not even saying a word about it. The warehouse they were sting was not climate controlled as the wax that they come with was completely melted and came out of the can and soaked into everything.

@ghasley We will soon find out! I'll be posting them in a day or two! 

thanks 

No free setups unless you $$$ Wilson's 

You live in the Tri-State area....you will be surprised by how many people will pick them up...gear is selling well and at fair prices....you will clear more on your used gear and the shipping of your Sabrinas will seem like a rounding error.

Hey thanks for the advice, yeah, I'm familiar with the internet and buy and sell on Audiogon and US Audiomart. The klipsch are Cornwall 4 so big and not likely to sell easily and ship hence my intent to do a trade. And not complaining about price, complaining about lack of responsiveness from dealers. And not complaining about trade in prices either- I recognize the dealer needs to make a profit on the trade. Thanks everyone, I'll keep my gear and sell it locally if and when I can. I'm thinking Rosewood Harbeth HLF5 Super Plus, Bel Canto REF 600 m should be no issue to sell quickly. The Klipsch I can continue to use as big end tables and speakers ! 

So, there’s this new thing called the ”internet.”  You can buy your used Wilsons here or on other sites and sell your speakers through the same.  If dealers aren’t giving you what you want you have every opportunity to do it on your own and stop whining here.  Jeez. 

@decooney well said. In short, it makes no sense to complain about $$ when you are trading something in.

@ghasley "Buy the new speakers, sell yours on your own."

Exactly. The dealers are in business to make a profit. That’s how they exist. And, you have to ask yourself what’s in it for them, too. Driving out, sending out two people, doing a Pick-up, returning to the office, unloading, unboxing speakers, checking, testing, any reconditioning, advertising, haggling with tons of new questions on trade-ins dealing with new non-buyer customers, dealing with return policies, all takes valuable time. It’s gotta be worth it for them too. Pre-purchase free advice is not free, actually $100-200/hr+ or more. Time is money. We are lucky to have any audio storefront dealers in business any more. Or, go sell it to TMR Audio, they might buy your stuff. Good Luck.

@cowan217 which Klipsch would you be trading?  I'm near CHI and the dealer here I'm guessing you are working with might be able to make this work.  I'm intrigued by the heritage lines.  

Buy the new speakers, sell yours on your own.

Why would a dealer react the way that you say...

A few thoughts come to mind, they are so busy that they couldn't care about their business and particularly new customers like you who they have never dealt with before. The dealer is so flush with cash, that a $13K sale is peanuts to them, as their typical buyer is spending millions of dollars every year...or maybe they are doing the business as a hobby, and the same thing applies with their customer base. Lastly, you are asking for a trade in, which means they have to write an ad and try and sell your traded in gear, that takes some effort. 

I think these guys are doing you a favor with their responses ( or lack thereof)...they are telling you to take your business elsewhere and give it to a much more deserving person. They are also demonstrating to you what their after sale service would like IF you made the mistake of buying from them in the first place. 

I guess but I'm just not up to the struggle to spend my money. I was just quoted $800 to deliver a pair of Wilson Sabrina- new- no set up and to have the delivery people take back my Klipsch and Harbeth- a round trip of 200 miles - I could literally send an Uber for the equipment for half that price. 

Exhausting process. I cancelled it all and will continue enjoying my current system and keep 12k in the bank (the difference in the trade prices vs the new, full list price Wilson I would have bought- with no set up). 

Infuriating for sure. 

Sorry to say it but I suspect this has or will become the new norm for shopping. FWIW I'm  sure glad to be retired. The present environment is ridiculous and getting worse for the business & the consumer. Plus you have the Christmas holidays which always causes issues for business and consumer alike.