1/2" is pretty small, but placement certainly matters a ton. The impact from a change in toe-in is a significant factor too. There are a lot of variables, and your room and circumstances are unique, so everyone’s results will vary, but I’ve heard notable differences from small adjustments of an inch or so and minor angle changes.
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I make final adjustments by the 1/8th inch. No, I am not insane.
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I’d think it has more to do with eliminating toe in than the half inch one speaker is now closer to the side wall. You could simply just toe them in again in their current positions and see what happens, and my guess is the disappearing act will once again be decreased.
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@soix ... you are correct, as usual. Funny thing is I had them firing straight before futzing with them and there was some directionality. Perhaps the 1/2" is somewhat related to the small room size (10x9x8). In any event, it’s been quite a happy accident.
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I brought home 2 floorstanding speakers 1 month ago and put them next to my bookshelves on stands with the intention that I will switch. They were about 3 inches to each side and little bit forward ~2" from my bookshelf speakers. First however, I didn't switch but listened to my bookshelves one more time. The sound completely changed and became a lot more disciplined as if the musicians came together in a smaller circle. It was amazing how these "ear flaps" transformed the sound.
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In a small room every 1/8 inch matters, especially with toe in. When you find "the spot" it's magic. Until you get the urge to move them again to find even more magic.
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Well, that 1/2" made a difference to you and your spouse in your own listening room. So..................................
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@rlb61 , I am playing with speaker placement in a small room myself. What have you found is working best for you as far as distance from the wall? (Meaning the wall directly in front of the speakers that you are facing when you listen.)
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@immatthewj ... I’ve got the speakers a little over 2.5' from the front wall to the baffle.
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One other thought is that it’s not the difference on the sidewall distance in your setup, but possibly discovering the best distance between the speakers. If you shifted each in the same direction 1/4” away from the short measurement they would be equal to the side walls and maintain the current distance between. Do they continue to disappear? I have found small changes to the inter speaker distance can be critical in my system.
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@rlb61- thank you for posting this. Placement can be completely critical and small differences in horizontal or vertical placement can yield major differences in performance. You have figured out exactly the way to do it -just change the placement around until you find the magic one.
When I visit recording studios this is exactly the same principle. Stands (often ignored) can also make a huge difference.
Brad
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@lonemountain ... as I said previously, it was a happy accident. I had been so indoctrinated with the concept that all measurements had to be exact. I never thought that an ostensible mistake would be a solution.
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Did you futz with the cables? The change in sound could well be ’out of phase’ caused by the reversal of one set of cables to your speakers. If you return them to the original placement does the sound change back to ’directional?
Another thing to check - put on a recording which has a solo voice. Does the image sit centered between the speakers, or has it spread out to the rooms corners with little voice left dead center? If so you have inadvertently reversed phase in one speaker.
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@newbee ... nope, never touched the cables and everything is in phase with a strong center image.
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@rlb61
Acoustics is a black art! I've run in to many other situations similar to this one.
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@lonemountain ... Amen to that, brother.
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Since I have the same speakers, I'm curious as to how far apart they are? And, what are you driving them with? Appreciate the info.
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@doni ... the speakers are about 7' apart from front baffle to front baffle. I'm driving them with a BAT VK-33 preamp and a BAT VK-225se power amp (150 wpc).
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Thanks, different use case here. Running mine with Atma-Sphere Class D monos, nearfield. I’ll try no toein.
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Uhhgggg. I read this stuff and I’m the kinda guy that measures things out to basically the triangle and more or less leaves it. I need to play some more cause I’ve considered many different scenarios but too lazy/busy to try them. I absolutely believe the half inch made a difference. My wife also said an extra half inch would make all the difference.. 🤛
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The biggest pain in the a$$, but so worth it.
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I agree that it's the toe-in that made the change. I would move one speaker the 1/2" difference to the sidewall (so that they are both equal distance) for even better performance.
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@doni ... Jeff Joseph recommends no toe-in for the Pulsars.
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As @drrsutliff said distance between speakers may effect imaging.
And yes, 1/2 an inch matters. Even a 1/4 but I only measure to 1/8 cause I’m OCD.
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When I got my latest pair of speakers I was constantly moving them for about 6 months in very small increments. At one point I found that magic spot and it was after repositioning them only about an inch! Keep in mind that rooms are not really acoustically symmetrical, windows, an extra chair that is only on one side of the room so moving only one speaker can make a big difference!
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Same here. I've had mine for over a year and thought I had it down pat until I started binging on some Hannibal series blu rays. Mads Mikkelsen was very difficult to follow due to his accent and then I aimed my speakers just a tad more inwards and presto! I could now understand him.
It all boiled down to my tweeters being offset to the outside and I measured them using a laser centered right down the middle. What used to work for me resulted in the tweeters being a touch too much away from me.
It amounted to about 1 1/2" difference than my usual way of setting up but that's all it took for that turn for the worse. Even with music, the center is more fully realized and the music is a touch more dynamic even at the same volume.
All the best,
Nonoise
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Any opinions would be welcome. Thanks.
