None! What say you?
Most recent speaker you audited in room and returned? Why did you return it?
Just as the title says, what was the last speaker you got hyped by, purchased and returned subsequently? If you returned it, what did you not like about it in your room? What equipment did you try matching it with?
Hearing about such experiences of unmet expectations could be an interesting topic.
41 responses Add your response
None! But then I don't buy speakers just hoping they will just happen to sound good. If my research suggests (absent an actual in home audition) that the speakers have the characteristics that are important to me in the first place, which are supported by user/professional reviews, I buy them and I will dedicate a considerable amount of time, in some cases years actually, to dial them in by finding the appropriate electronics and carefully setting them up in my room. No small feat I think, and I can always sell them if I can't make them work for me. |
All the speakers i bought may ha ve been returned save the mythical Tannoy dual concentric gold which were the best i ever owned ... I did not know for most of my life how acoustics impact the speakers working and could serve the speakers or impede them... Now if the speakers are relatively good, nevermind their price, specs, design , i will make them shine because i learned basic acoustics ...I will not retrurn them back save if their design is too limitative and cannot be optimized ... I did it very well modifying my low cost powered book shelf ...I use them for music now in an acoustic dedicated to them .. I am happy with them now ; before optimization ( redesigning of the porthole ) i hated them for 10 years and i had put them for computer trivial use not music ..... Most people own top speakers as my past Tannoy and never learn how to make them shine at their optimal level ... Then returning back the speakers , if they are not trash to begin with , is an error by ignorance of acoustics if not most at least half of the time ...😁 For sure half of the speakers if they are not trash are not interesting ... Acoustics cannot save speakers which are badly designed to begin with, not well balanced or harsh etc ... The self powered low cost speakers i modified were universally acclaimed to begin with even they were not enough for my taste right out of the box ...I succeed to modify them because they were relatively well designed and balanced ...My modification consist among other thing to give them a better porthole , with which i go from 85 Hertz to now near 50 hertz clear not boomy at all ... 85 hertz is not enough for music ....I prefer my modification going 50 hertz instead of buying a cheap sub ... i dont need boom -boom ... I need clear layered bass ...
Costlier price tag dont replace acoustics basic knowledge and basic acoustics knowledge can elevate a low cost speaker to a more higher status ... ... |
mahgister: I’ve read some of your posts and see that you like to improve speakers. I just wanted to mention a couple of things that also make a big difference and are not very costly, just in case you haven’t already done so. By the way, I began building speaker enclosures, reconning, designing and building crossover networks in my mid-teens, over 40 years ago and also used to build the cabinets for the home line of speakers for the late engineer Dave Prophit. If you are not familiar with him, he patented the Bazooka speakers that used to go behind truck seats. He later sold the patent. I later pursued many other audio related endeavors. I got into speaker building because I could not afford what I wanted and my father thought that stereo equipment was a waste of money, so he wouldn’t buy me any, although he could very well afford it. he preferred to see me active in outdoor activities. His stereo system consisted of a YORX receiver, which I eventually burned up by trying to boost the wattage by cutting, stripping and connecting an extension cord to the speaker terminals-lol! If you are not familiar with YORX, they were about as crappy as you could buy, but sounded pretty trippy after the consumption of "certain chemicals"! When he came home from work he smelled "burned electronics" throughout the house and just laughed it off after I told him about my latest experiment. Bless his heart! I learned abou speakers by checking out books at the library and saving my allowance to buy speaker building books whenever a new edition came out at the local Radio Shack. This was before the internet existed. I continued with the "speaker building" hobby for years, until I finally got tired of it. It became a "been there done that thing". Now I prefer to just buy something already made, age has made lazier, and my finances are no longer what they used to be back then. Anyways, I am getting sidetracked here... If you haven’t already, try using self-adhesive sound dampening material and line all the interior of the speaker cabinet with it. The heavier/denser the material the better. The same stuff they use to line car interiors for sound dampening. If the drivers are stamped steel instead of cast, also cut small pieces of this material and stick it to thin areas of the frame of each driver. Also wrap the outer perimeter of the port/s. This will cut down the unwanted resonances dramatically and the difference will be very audible. You can also use heavier gauge wires between the crossovers and each driver, preferably oxygen free thinned fine pure copper stranded wire. Siver begins to get expensive, unless you make your own. I've made many. Silversmithing is another of my countless hobbies. You can also replace all of the capacitors and resistors with as good as you can afford, while keeping the same values. Same with the coils. You can even buy quality solid wire and wind your own coils instead of buying them premade. There are charts and formulas out there that will tell you what gauge of wire to use and how many turns around a specific diameter to achieve a specific value, but you will need to have test equipment to know the original value of the coils first, since these are usually not marked with their values. You can also brace the cabinet by gluing wooden dowels inside. To some this may sound like snake oil, but doing these simple and inexpensive modifications will make you a believer. There are other modifications that you can make, but getting rid of resonances is the most important! I thought about starting a new endeavor and starting a solid concrete speaker company, but life's short and there are too many other things I want to do with the rest of my time now that I am retiring. |
@newbee , I don’t fall for that innuendo, i.e., "It’s never the fault of the speaker and the guy who made it. It is always the fault of the guy who bought it". Such innuendo generally emanates more from guys who sell things in higher price brackets. And no, i won’t be sitting around for "years" to make it work. I have a couple of different legit rooms and a few different types of legit electronics. If it underperforms or doesn’t meet expectation, I send the speaker back to speaker’s daddy and move on to something else. It’s quite simple and life’s short. |
Well, it’s a free country. If a cow wasn’t all that sacred in your experience, you should be able to say so freely and without any reprisal (i.e., it is the purpose of this thread), " I did not like that cow...A different beast worked better for me"...No problemo.... |
Thanks for the story and advices ... This will be useful for all .... I already damp mine and isolate them and i modify the port hole design ... I modify my headphones too ... Damping against vibrations is important ... I also used my own homemade plates against EMI ... It is so effective that there is no relation between before and after .... But unlike you my craftmanship ability are not very good ... I dont modify the crossover and the electronics and i dont solder ...😁 I taught reading all my life, not manual craftmanship .... But reading acoustics help me a lot to create S.Q. without money ... I am inspired by acoustics or mechanical concepts not so much electrical one ... Anyway i am happy with what i own , speakers and headphone , modified ... My very best to you and my warm welcome here ...
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Although I didn't return them, I was very disappointed in my KEF LS-50s, in my living room, both with and without a subwoofer. I even put them through a thorough break-in to make sure that wasn't an issue. They just just sounded small and lost. Then I realized they were indeed a nearfield monitor, and the critical distance in my room worked out at about 3 feet, my listening distance almost 3X that. So I packed them up and replaced them with a pair of Monitor Audio Silver 300 7Gs. I really wanted a set of Maggie 1.7s, but they are totally unfeasible in my room. I absolutely love the MA 300s. They have the dynamics of a JBL and the character of a well executed British speaker. As for the KEFs, I thought about selling them, then decided to build a nearfield system in my office Consisting of them, a Bluesound Node driving one of Adcom's Nelson Pass designed MOSFET GFA-5200s. In here, they sound great. |
my list is not bought and returned but speakers I’ve been disappointed in and offloaded probably longer than I should have. So excuse me… little different than your question. Dynaudio Contour 20. Tried for a while and really tried to like them. Maybe didn’t have the power they needed but just way too smooth and no real dynamics. Loved the little Dyn focus 140s years ago, they were super fun and refined enough. Pioneer S-1ex. Man did I try to love these speakers! They did some things amazing. They are definitely not for a rock guy of any type. Great bass! …… 0 mid bass punch , like nothing. Ahhh.. When I lived in Shanghai I bought a Chinese brand HiVi pair of towers that were toughted all over the internet as “ good as BW 800 series”, giant killer yada yada. What a piece of Sh.t that was. Tried to return them the next day but …. Yeah American probably overpaid for their POS speaker at the fancy mall they ain’t takin it back. Tried to sell them for penny’s on the dollar on the Chinese market and finally basically gave them away. Those were the worst. |
I think the short version of it is: every company wants to make and sell good speakers. So it's a bit harsh to single them out. But it's also constructive feedback. btw Dynaudio Contour 20s are my dream speakers. Not for the foreseeable future though, it's about 5K over my budget. But I have heard them many times and they sounded fantastic to me. |
Having enjoyed Klipsch Heresy IIIs for a while I had to try the IVs. The mids in the IVs (after plenty of break-in) had a peaky upper mid issue so off they went. Tried a pair of Sonist speakers that just paled when compared to the superb Silverline Preludes I had then so sold those away, and a pair of Zu "dirty weekend" speakers were just not close to my Heresy IIIs in coherency and tonal accuracy so back they went. The IIIs have earned their place and are staying...for now...Volti Razz...hmm |
Martin Logan XT-B100 ($1600+tax) Picked them up last year on a whim when I was trying to put together a digital system in my living room..A streamer/TV 2.1 system. These bookshelves had just come out, user reviews were minimal but great, I didn't even listen to them in store. Online purchase. Gloss black and I felt they looked pretty nice. Not overly big in size, rear ported, hair over 20lbs., nice bi-wire binding posts. 6 1/2" woofer but with their new folded motion ribbon tweeter which is what the "people" were raving about. Listed at 4ohm with a sensitivity that is rated semi high for a bookshelf..93 or 94db. Which I think that is off a bit. I'd say high 80's after comparing them to my Polk's & Lintons with the same gear at the same time. I tried the Logan's with an Elac Alchemy, a Van Alstine ultimate 70, and an older B&K mosfet amp. My intentions at that time was to use the Elac due to the size, which was perfect for a minimal set up and it had good power. Right away I thought the Logan's sounded great. That tweeter is pretty amazing and sweet. Very extended and airy. Articulate & detailed. I could really crank it up and it never lost composure or got shouty or sibilant. The more I listened though the tweeter & woofer j |
just didn't mesh well. While very clear and detailed it was a little to hot for me. I think a lot of people prefer this type of sound but it just wasn't for me. I used a sub with the set up and brought the highs down a bit with PEQ functions in my dac which definitely helped a lot but ultimately the speakers just didn't work for me. I don't really have anything bad to say about them, just not my type. I see that they still get glowing reviews. |
@nitrobob , I had the double impact in one of my rigs for a few months before i offloaded it/gave it to my nephew. Of course, the Youtube reviewers/advertisers were singing christmas carols about it. It’s a nice concept in theory....trying to manage the midrange with the tweeter array (small drivers --> improved impulse response, etc), which should technically give a high level of resolution, clarity, etc in the midrange. But, it didn’t.... It could be tricky trying to optimize a crossover network for that type of design.
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@panzrwagn , +1, the ls50 could indeed be ideal for near field office/desktop audio (no worries about where separate drivers summed or not).
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Revel M16. They sounded good but I think they rolled off too steeply on top for my room. In any case, I like what I now have built with compression drivers, waveguides, and 10" mid-woofers on open baffles. One thing that I've noticed is that I almost always prefer higher efficiency speakers. I might say horns too, but my current setup is horns on top and bottom, but open baffle on the midbass, with absorption on the wall behind. I theorized that the open baffle with rear absorption might be a way to get some pattern control in that range in a more compact and easy to build package. Whatever the case, the 10" woofers are rated around 94dB, are on active crossovers, and seem to be keeping up and integrating very well with the bass and tweeter horns. |
@noromance Ahh, Gale 301s. I so lusted after those in the early 80s! So freaking gorgeous. But they were way out of my limited finances at the time. |
Von Schweikert VR 33 speakers. I purchased them based on reviews and reviewer Greg Weaver totally gushed over them. Was going to order a new pair but someone on the Gon was selling his pair, 6 months old for a tiny bit discount, so I bought them. Had I waited for a new pair from the factory, the lead time was minimum 9 months. These speakers were designed to be a couple inches from the wall behind them. I was so sorry I bought them within 10 minutes of setting them up. I was using an Audible Illusions 3B preamp and an Odyssey Stratos amp. The bass was there but thin and the midrange was quite shouty. I thought they needed more break in so for 1 month, I played the Isotek System Enhancer CD 8 hours a day, fairly loud while we were at work. Nothing helped. I stopped listening to the system and only listened to my office system upstairs. 6 months later I bought GE Triton One’s speakers and sold the VR33 speakers to someone in New York. He called me after setting them up and thanked me over and over as he loved them. Maybe his room was more friendly. |
I've been listening to the same Hartley Reference speakers since 1980. Yes I have changed all the drivers as I have found them (always looking). Changed out the 24" woofers just a few years ago (they came from Masterdisk studio NYC). Hard to change what you love. Although I have been through three sets of three amps in the tri-amp arrangement. To answer your question directly: NONE! Regards, barts |
Dynaudio contour 20’s, PBN-B741 scan speak. Both were way to smooth like @mofojo said. Complete lack of dynamics. A small part in a long lessen that I still couldn’t groove on low sensitivity loudspeakers (yet) it’s a fun learning experience (journey) for me, and we all have different taste/perception making the hobby much more interesting! |
Always wanted to try a small speaker like the Dali Menuet. Picked up a NIB Dali Menuet SE here in the States, probably the only only left. After what I thought was a reasonable amount of breakin period, I listened and compared to other speakers I had. While it was smooth, had weight and controlled sibilant passages really well, there were sounds in the music that were either so subdued or alltogether missing that I couldn’t accept. In my opinion, it was overly refined. They had great resolution but lacked a commensurate amount of detail. Ended up getting Dali Opticon 1s NIB at half price, also last ones seemingly left at least at discount, and they work much better for me. Not as resolving as the SE but still sufficiently resolving and with the detail I was used to hearing with every other speaker I had or had tried. And works in nearfield or further away in a small room. Vinyl wrapped vs nice wood veneer but works just the same at a much lower price. A lessoned learned. Returned MA Silver 100 6th gen which was too much in your face and could muddle up the upper middle and high frequencies. Good control of sibilance but got congested at moderate SPLs and at lower volumes, had to constantly adjust volume to hear softer passages but then dynamic swings were just too much. Ended up with Martin Logan 15i and on a sub, gives you the best points of the MA without the issues. Easier to listen with both movies and music but still exciting. Quad S2, very resolving and detailed, fun with movies but sounding dull with music. It had a a fairly neutral frequency curve after the mid bass hump but I think what made it un-engaging listen for me was the flat stage (totally lacked depth) that made it so. They didn’t disappear in the room and imaging wasn’t all that great, my budget Triangle Zetas were far more desirable with music. The Zetas were far more musical but can have some glare during a sibilant passage noticed mostly with movies. So if a speaker performs well in most areas, I can give up a bit of resolution. Another lessoned learned. All considered budget speakers and even though I use good amplification, from a Keces E40 to a Hegel h160, doesn’t make sense getting a much more expensive speaker at the SPLs I typically listen too given I have neighbors and no longer want to listen really loud. Not enough to gain for the money, unless I can find something far less than retail. Sent other speakers packing as well over the years.While better speakers can give more inner detail, texture in notes, finding that in a small speaker is harder to do and as long as tonality is good enough, it works. All three speakers I have are different but nice for me to listen to. Part of the experience i guess.
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Most speakers , especially magnepan , are sensible to amplification and work accordingly but so important amplification must be , the source dac could be too... All that so impactful it is , compared to acoustics of the room and location , as for all speakers, but especially them, fade into importance ... I know because i listened already magnepan 1.7i in a bad room ... I can assure you than it is not better than my low cost active small speakers well embedded ... Acoustics rule the gear workings and even design, first and last not the reverse .....
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Spendor D9.2, I listened to them in a fully treated smallish room at the dealer. they sounded better to me then the others i listened to. Then i got them home in my larger room and less room treatment. They sounded bright, lacked midrange depth and tone, they had almost zero low bass. the speakers are spec'ed at 27hz to 20khz and I'd think they barely made 50hz in the bass. I'll give them the detail level top to botom was outstanding but that's about it. Sold now thankfully. Even the distributor later told me they are not for everyone as they focus on detail and lose out on the musicality and tone of real music. I do not recommend the Spendor D line at all if you like music. |
I have had more than a few pair sound good in the showroom, that left my house after a short stay. Most were not returned. They were sold to friends or on sites like this. Some sounded good in one or more of my systems, but I could not make them work in the room that I had purchased them for. These include Martin Logan Motion 60's and KEF R700's. Interestingly enough, the smaller Motion 40's sounded great in any room that I tried them. I have also had LS 50's sound good in all of my systems and keep a pair in the house. I currently am in the same situation with the Mofi Source Point 10's. They were fantastic in the showroom, but are too large physically for the room that I purchased them for. They wound up crammed into the corners. I can't use them in my other systems (WAF or same size problem}. I view this as my problem, not the dealer's. In the past dealers have worked with me, but I never expected more than store credit. I never asked for a refund if the product was not defective. |
@agwca , nice post/great chunk of info. For the past 10 years, I have been set up in a 1600 sq.ft basement, which i finished to get 2 large listening rooms, storage space, etc (got banished from floors above by the sorceress upstairs). Small speakers have always sounded lost in my space and are not my thing. For the type of music I listen to at my spl levels, they all cry and demand to be sent back to their daddy. Most reviewers (advertisers) on YT review way too many small speakers (easy to get them in and out, I suppose!)...and I’d be shocked if those tiny flacid speaker wielding cowboys said anything other than, "it was the best thing eva!". Lol Cool that you’ve got a Keces amp.. I have been using some of their power conditioning solutions for a bit. It’s not a name you hear around here much. |
