Yes.
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“Lately the digital thread themes seem to revolve around "nothing matters in digital other than a 0 and 1 making it to its destination". It's as if no one has ever listened to the differences between digital gear.” Agreed, that seems to be trend lately. For most folks, when it comes to digital, it’s all about getting ‘there’; how you get there is pretty much inconsequential. |
@sfseasy You're mixing things... The raspberry pi has more than enough CPU power to send bits to a DAC. That's what i use to play through my DAC. The sound quality comes from the DAC and the DAC is using asynchronous USB so "timing" has no meaning here... The industry is even trying to sell "Digital IEC" powercords... what a complete rip off... Same for the supposedly "better USB cables", plain stupidity... |
I’ve been upgrading my digital coax cable slowly, for a couple years. THERE ARE BIG SOUND DIFFERENCES IN DIGITAL CABLES. If you can’t hear the difference: 1. You aren’t a good listener 2. Your system is not revealing enough. 3. You made a lateral move in your cable “upgrade” instead of a vertical one. |
Digital audio is rapidly growing. Besides servers, streamers, DACs, players, and transports, there are more and more products that lower noise floor within the audio chain. There’s also a growing number of Ethernet related audio products including audiophile cable and switches. Some have reported sonic benefits from using multiple switches. A few of these products benefit from switching to linear power supplies (LPS), external master clocks, which in turn each require cabling. In addition to my digital audio chain (server/streamer, upscaler, DAC) I’m still debating how far to go down this digital-upgrading $ rabbit hole. |
One’s and zero’s in Ethernet are detected by the voltage transitioning through zero volts in a positive going, or negative going direction. The twisted pairs in an Ethernet cable, (Tx+ and Tx- for example) are balanced and the voltage swings from +2.5V to -2.5V, not 0V or 5V as in other digital circuits. The timing of the pulses is critical and anything that interferes with the timing will introduce jitter in the receiving device, and smear the resultant sound. RFI is a culprit here. Filtering out RFI in Ethernet cables adds so much to improving sound quality. It’s a similar Sonic result to filtering out RFI on your mains input to your system. Network Acoustics ENO does just that. So called ‘Network Isolators’ are a waste of time. |
I like learning the engineering level, but logic alone will lead you to conclude that digital will always introduce loss, unless and until science is able to measure, deconstruct and reconstruct EVERY characteristic that causes us to experience (not just hear) music. There's clearly more to the analog content than the waveform, let alone the density of its deconstruction and the precision of its reconstruction. If this weren't true then the makers of the better audio equipment wouldn't all use listening tests as a primary driver in design choices. |
The main things that matter in digital are the source files the ADC that converts and the DAC that converts. If your DAC isn't up to modern specs in regard to isolation, filtering and reconstruction then these other superfluous items can make a difference but if everything between works to spec it's not that important. Consider how much time and money you have invested in your internet modem the device that reconstructs the analog to digital signal. So yes everything matters some more so than others. |
djones51 If it’s digital in and digital out why do you have a modem?C’mon, are you really claiming that your ISP provides you with an analog signal? I suppose it’s possible, but it’s difficult to believe. Modem = 𝗠𝗼dulate𝗗𝗲𝗺odulate. My cable modem (Netgear CM500) takes a digital cable input and outputs it in a proper format for the router. There’s nothing analog about any of it. |
The QAM is sent in an analog carrier wave which is where your MOdualteDEModulate comes in. Yes my ISP is sending me an analog signal which my Modem will modulate to digital that can be read by my network. Yours might be different if you don't use a DOCSIS based system. QAM (quadrature amplitude modulation) signals are comprised of sine waves with varying amplitude and phase shifts, which means even though we call them digital signals, they are actual analog signals carrying digital data. |
That's what's so hilarious about worrying over freaking cables and switches the signal is no better than what your $100 modem gives you. If you want to know if wires and switches etc.. make a tinker's damn measure the analog out on your DAC or the distorion of your amp and see how much any of it changes with audiophile cables and switches. |
Waste of life to argue it. Chintzy people don’t want there to be a difference. The wallet rules their life, and what they "think" supports their proclivity to not spend money; too cheap to try. Statistically half of all audio systems must be inferior/mediocre, and the digital skeptics lead the way with their POS cables and cheap DACS. They deserve the sound they get for their arrogance. BTW, this in NO way disparages the budget audiophile who cannot afford; it's aimed squarely at the tightwads. |
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Djones, many two channel systems are not connected To the internet. Closed loop system I guess you could call it, but yes, people do hear differences, even after their 100.00 modem. How many times does this discussion need to be had. It’s so simple, if you hear a difference and it brings value to you based on the price, go for it. Don’t let anyone else’s bias dissuade you, also if you don’t hear a difference, or even if you do, but the price of admission is too much, and therefore brings no value to you, then there is no need for you to spend. Why can’t everyone hear what they hear, and chose what they wish, and let them be happy. While there are most definitely differences, different people perceive that difference differently. |
dougeyjones It’s a little maddening for people who are empirically minded to see others set money ablaze over the placebo affect.That's pretty colorful language, but there's no evidence that anyone here is setting "money ablaze." If you find this group "maddening," perhaps you are in the wrong group. |
Everything matters, IME, too. Even when I hope it won't (USB cable? yep) It is tiresome that the self-appointed "saviors" wielding theoretical logic come here to save us from ourselves. Their passion for riding their hobby horse seems telling. Why don't they just try a bunch of stuff out for themselves? Crazy, laughable idea, I know. |
Naysayers here and psychologically crippled forums like Audioscience inspired me to order an Uptone etherREGEN today. So far I have been impressed by "audiophile" innovations in the Ethernet/USB domain. My wallet is open to experiments-- within reasonable limits-- which are modest relative to the trend toward overarching prices in analog audio. |
Dougey seems to believe because he can’t hear, that others can’t hear what he cannot. Some believe the ones who don’t hear, do so out of bias, stubbornness, can’t afford and not willing to admit to hear because they can’t afford it. I’ll assume that at least some honestly don’t hear. And I bet that in the same listening that someone might hear something that I cannot, or something I think is so slight as to be meaningless, like when you get an eye examine and they ask is this one better, or this one. Ehhh, well, they’re both so close I can say one is better. Someone might think it’s night and day. I approach it with an open mind, I either hear, or it don’t. If I don’t, I’m obviously not parting with my money, if I do, then it’s a cost vs performance question. Is it worth the cost, to me. |
dgarretson, hey! How are you! Nice to hear from you! A wise position to take. My curiosity has led to some amazing things, one of the most notable being the Schroeder Method of IC Placement. I never would have built the systems I have if I were still a Chintiziphile. They do not build great rigs, regardless of the budget because their pride prevents them from using methods that are needed for superior systems. So be it. Are dougeyjones and djones51 the same person? |
I would argue that with the relative affordability and advancements in computer-based measurement technology, manufacturing equipment that measures particularly well is not a black art anymore. Take Topping as an example, and no I'm not implying that it sounds bad. But there's nothing to write home about either. I bought one out of curiosity and found zero emotional connection. It's now being enjoyed by a friend who absolutely considers it a steal at that price... I gave it to him at a 30% discount. Still in the market for a DAC. I still regret not buying a tube amp sooner because I always heard that they measured poorly, only to realize that they were talking about measurements taken in a lab. While in the real world, and to my ears, and my brain, that distortion brings so much joy and satisfaction that I cannot imagine not having tubes in my music. |
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