Dealers hijacking the discussions

Thank You- Dave and Troy
Happy Listening!

went thru a set of tires while waiting to hear why it matters that Dave Wilson drives a Ferrari....

It's wicked annoying.....   I started a thread about a particular speaker i was interested in....  I was asking for fellow enthusiasts first hand experience,  not for dealers to contact me offering the product, at the same price as it is never discounted.   My post clearly asked for feedback from owners of that model.  

It was such a turn off that the next time I'm in their area I will NOT be visiting that dealer.   I travel for work a lot and visit any audio store in the area.  

Exactly what I’m talking about as OP.

Lol, what more bothers me is the execrable lack of correct grammar/punctuation in many posts from certain very opinionated and frequent posters.  I'm not sure if they are dealers or not, but it seems like it.  It makes me tired trying to decipher what they are actually trying to communicate.  Please, use decent grammar, sentence structure, and be clear, not obscure, about what you are posting.

spot on. i always think this guy must be drunk or really stupid in which case he shouldn’t post. 

This has bothered me for a while now, but one of the dealers' posts mention someone "halking" their products.

The verb is "hawking", which means to cry out in public about wares or products one is selling.

Dealers should pay per posted word. Lol.

Mark Twain said it best...
Keeping your mouth shut and being thought a fool, rather than opening it...
B

I should add that when a manufacturer posts,  and it's someone like Ralph of Atmosphere it doesn't bother me at all... his posts are often technical in nature and it's clear to me that he is doing it with the best of intentions.  Plus he is informative and maybe I'll learn a little something by reading his post.   Sure there are others ,  but he comes to mind because he is active here.   As long as a manufacture does not use the forum as part of their marketing strategy , it's ok with me.  In fact it shows me that they care about their products, customers,  and reputation.   

Well the carefully and wisely assembled rules that govern the use of this forum clearly and expressly allow the active participation of dealers and manufacturers in these discussions and my review of the rules indicates that the same rules here apply to all who choose to participate there is no particular favor granted to any class of participant that how the forum works.

I have no issue with manufacturers and dealers posting here as long as they identify themselves as such when discussing products that they produce or sell.  That way you can better judge the credibility of their opinions.

I love many dealers.  They are all trying to make a living and that now means figuring out how to use all social media to their advantage.  I get that and resect that as most on here do. It's when it become's blatant selling that it's a distraction from a thread etc...

Those of us who are 'fanboys' ( I do hate that term) of a certain product we own or want to own, will always post about it in threads.  Many folks are very active posters and are known for what we love etc..., but most who are fan boys have also auditioned a TON of gear to get to what our ears like.  We realize that others hear differently and will become fanboys of their own products etc...  That's what I love about the forums.  I have learned about so many other pieces of gear other than what I own and I've changed my system a more than I ever did before because of it.  

I haven't purchased one item, due to a dealer or manufacturer hawking it on this or any other site.  It's because I trust my ears (or even the ears of two close friends who I've met here) and know what I want.  When we all upgrade, that doesn't mean that we don't still love what we used to own, it just means we are blessed to be able to find something even better and can afford it.  

This is why I love the exchanges between average Joe posters like myself.  I know some, but not all the dealers or manufacturer's, so I'm in the camp that they must put into their signature who they are.  Many of you have mentioned folks who are just sharing to share and not to sell, I love it.  Charles Hansen was one of the best at doing that as well as guys like Ralph and others.  

It's funny, but I haven't read or posted as much as I used to and partly because of being turned off a bit.  LEt's see if some folks change their style of posting a bit as it seems like many would love that.

I am going to call out the next dealer that does that to me again...  it was such a turn off I didn't even buy the speaker in question.  Partly due to the fact I am in Boston and the closest venue to demo is in NY and NJ, but mainly due to dealers contacting me.  I travel all over New England and NY for work, if you sell audio equipment I will seek you out.   I will find you, I promise.

viridian

I am on the record disliking dealers.

That's just prejudice. As with all prejudice, it's rooted in ignorance.

Oddiofyl, what do you mean contacting you?  I thought they were only supposed to post and that they had some rules about selling directly from this forum.  Why would they contact you, unless it's to directly sell?  Please clarify.  Thanks.

I certainly have seen specific brand or model threads being frequented by dealers or owners of the company on occasion, which can get bothersome.  But IMHO, the worst offenders are the fanboys.   

Let me say first, though, that there are great fanboys, knowledgeable and with much experience, able to help and offer great suggestions.  Then there are small minded, my-way-or-the-highway, everyone-else-is-wrong fanboys, that attack any critical view of their brand as if it was their personal identity being attacked.

Specific example.  I found the Tekton brand of speakers not to my taste.  I stated why in on of their threads, and after a few back and forth posts, became public enemy number one by a view of their fanboys who simply could not handle the idea that the speakers are ugly to some, for instance.  

Actually, I haven't seen this kind of nonsense for most brands, just a few.  And it's always an Internet Brand, oddly enough.  I'm not sure why this occurs, it's quite odd.  

at cleeds:  I believe it is a right of anybody on this forum to express an opinion ("I dislike dealers") without another member then referring to him as being prejudiced and ignorant.  That's just bad manners.

Nice posts dynaquest and 213runnin.
B

What if it is the beer that is ignorant and prejudiced? After all, we are what we eat, we were told.....(in this case - drink)

Guys, I think the thread is about dealers and manufacturer's who use the internet for all or most of their marketing.  It's pretty blatant that they do this.  Many of us are fan boys (I still hate that term), but are open and change our systems when we hear better.  I know I do all the time. I may not even own a piece of Ayre gear within the next 6 months as I have found other products I like more and it makes sense for me to change.  

That's called growth.  That's why it's great o be on here and meet folks and find out about gear I'd never know about.  I don't mind dealers doing the same, but not when they reach out on PM's to sell their stuff or when every post comes off as a commercial.  That's what folks are not happy about based on the feedback on the threads adn especially this one.  

+1 ctsooner.
Though I am surprised to see you here so soon after the Georgia game....
Bob

Bob, that sucked.  I can't even go into it.  Not on this board anyways.  

i started this thread and am guessing that “fanboy” means a person that rabidly supports certain brands? ctsooner’s recent post is pretty much where i’m coming from. 

Yes, that's what others call a fanboy.  Hate the term as 80% of the posters are fanboys or women then.  why buy your products if you don't love them.  

Ct. sounds like a divorce is coming up between you and Ayre.....

Hopefully no offspring will be affected.😆

lmao,  No divorce at all.  Love their gear and I may still keep the AX5/20.  It's about whether I can afford the 15k for the new Vandersteen amp.  I'd then also need a good preamp.  I have to see if there is one in the 5k range, but that is a subject for another thread.  

......and I am still waiting on the answer as to why it matters that Dave Wilson has a Ferrari.....

@ctsooner,
Sorry about the Georgia jibe, but you have to admit it was a good game.

And, as far as preamps go, wouldn't an Ayre be a good match for the Vandy amp?
@tomic601 
Though I wouldn't disparage anyone for buying a 6 figure car, I find it sad that Wilson speakers depreciate so quickly/badly. Well, I would be sad as a designer.
Bob

Be thankful guys that you have a dealer/retailer near your locale. Some of us have to road-trip it to get Audio wares.
Happy Listening!

somebody send me an Ayre preamp and I will be happy to comment on its sonic qualities relative to my REF5se......wait...Jafant, i am a mere 19 miles form an Ayre dealer with a demo KXR.....i can borrow....

IF i dont currently own any Ayre product could I be called a fanboy ?

Jafant - i used to drive 5 hours to Atlanta to my local dealer....i bought a lot of stuff from him, different brands.....integrity, trust, goes a long way....still gets my business when we have no local dealer....
and techically I drive 1,200 mikes to my San Diego dealer - see if ya can beat that in good fun....

I agree Tomic601.
 It surely doesn't matter what Dave drives.
It appears that Dave Wilson can buy a Ferrari because he makes a highly regarded product which sells very well. He runs a profitable business operation with a knowledgeable and dedicated workforce and he has good promotional skills. 
THE END 

Nice- tomic601

I am (3) hours from Atlanta. Whom was your dealer/retailer? So mnay Audio operations have come and gone over the years.
Happy Listening!

Bob, I was over that loss within a few hours.....NOT.....:).   IT will always be there as a lost chance at a NC.  I take ribbing well btw, so keep it coming ;).

As for dealers, Hi Fi Buys in Atlanta is a GREAT dealer.  They offer many top lines and actually ask questions to find what best suits YOU and not THEM.  They don't think about how any points they earn when they sell gear.  Alan is a great guy I'm told.  Never met him, but have emailed with him.  Tell him Pete sent you and he'll laugh I bet.  If I ever have a chance, I hope to get there.  Lot's of my friends have bought all types of gear there.

Bob, as for an Ayre preamp with Vandersteen mono's, I can't afford it, lol.  I only need a balanced, remote volume control.  Very simple, but it's really not as few make anything like this.  I may ask someone I know who knows what they are doing to make one.  I really need to see if my The Memory Player's volume control will work. I know it's digital, but they implement this thing so differently than anything else I"ve heard so maybe it will work.  Heck, I PRAY it does as then I can afford to make a move to the Vandersteen amps or even the Gryphon amps that are exceptional.  

@ctsooner 
Why not see if Ayre can mod the integrated to split the amp and pre? I recall you saying they modded it to eliminate the M5-HP.
I think it was Paul McGowen- PS Audio, who said he believes a preamp is still necessary-after many years believing otherwise.
B

Bob, I asked about them separating them. They can't. Not designed that way, plus I need to money from the sale to pay for the new amps ;).....  I have never head a digital volume control sound nearly as good and dynamic as a good preamp.  That said, I've never heard TMP's volume control and Mark said that it's a revolutionary design. I"ve never heard of one designed this way.  I was told by a designer of very high end gear that IF it works the way he claims that it may just be as transparent as most of the higher end preamps.  If that's teh case and I don't lose anything, then it's the easiest way for me as I can just use the app to control it all and I don't need a connection (getting rid of the AQ WEL balanced cable and the Niagara one if so).  So many reasons for me to want to use just TMP for everything, but I"m skeptical until I heard it a bit for myself.

I second the distaste one can have about the ridiculous misuse of these forums to promote stuff…there are blatant examples of this with exaggerated and preposterous multi paragraphed promotional screeds claiming to simply be "sharing" the promoter's enthusiasm for a product. Note that generally these hard sell promotions are regarding relatively unproven (except for a hard core of supporters who repeatedly provide breathless overdone comments in support of this stuff) tweaks that are claimed to provide astonishing enhancement of a system with hyperbole aimed at the insecure audio geek.

Wolf!! BINGO!🤩

Hell hath no fury like a troll scorned. 

wolf_garcia

I second the distaste one can have about the ridiculous misuse of these forums to promote stuff…there are blatant examples of this with exaggerated and preposterous multi paragraphed promotional screeds ...

These are moderated forums. If you don't like the way they are managed, why not take your complaint to the moderators? 

I’m a very long term member and look at the forums most every day. I’m personally extremely irritated by dealers injecting sales pitches into the discussions which has never really been a problem before. Dealers are biased as it’s the nature of business and this is fine but I don’t go to audiogon to see shameless promotion. There’s one guy in particular that needs to go away. The fact that you’ll all know who it is says volumes about the amount of posting this guy/dealer does on audiogon. Does anyone feel as I do. Just curious. 4425
YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT!
Especially "audioconnection" and their associates

Jafant
when we lived in Charleston it was Robert Taylor in a suburb of Charlotte, he carried Ayre, Vandersteen and ARC and a few other things I was interested in. He retired so I shifted my business to Alan Jones at Hi-Fi buys in Atlanta - now Buckhead.

funny story - Alan did not know me from Adam but i showed up at door opening with a couple hundred pound McIntosh amp needing a light service, 70# Labrador and Spouse in tow. He let us take over his high end room for 6 hours listening to 5 power amps, took my Mac in trade on the spot and arranged for special finish and drop ship of amplifier to me by Ayre.
great dude, have bought a few pair of speakers, amp upgrade and a DAC or two from him.
love em