@jymc but given this:
You are well aware of the role "synergy" plays in a particular system of assembled components, not to mention the effect of the room itself.
why would this matter?
Buy a couple of plane tickets if necessary and audition for yourself through a competent/honest dealer.
Unless by chance the dealer has the exact same other components, which is a long shot.
Without these...
The most people on these sites can offer is a simple opinion/statement that likely amounts to, "I like my expensive DAC very much"
...according to you, "shallow non-substantive" opinions there would not be much on any of these forums, would there?
Also, perhaps someone mentioning a DAC they haven't even heard, but just read about, that may not be as popular on this side of the pond, like the Aries Cerat for example, may not have been on the OP's radar at all, and it may turn out after demo'ing it to be the perfect DAC for the OP, so "shallow non-substantive" post turned out to be very valuable information.
Most importantly, like so many other threads the OP just disappears and never returns so valuable/useless posts aside, it is all for nothing.
I hope we can both agree that here is an example of a great thread: 
DAC advice needed
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@ghdprentice - You are well aware of the role "synergy" plays in a particular system of assembled components, not to mention the effect of the room itself. On that basis alone, it becomes short sighted to "root" for one's own component choices.
Was the original question a fair one?...."dCS Bartok Apex vs any similar priced DAC". Sure it is, however, it is also an invitation, for often times, shallow non-substantive opinions. And don't forget there's lots of rich guys who purchase high-end audio who know very little about the subtle nuances and differences. (I've never heard a $100k system that sound BAD.) When one is spending $25k-ish on a single DAC component, don't 'cheap-out'. Buy a couple of plane tickets if necessary and audition for yourself through a competent/honest dealer. The most people on these sites can offer is a simple opinion/statement that likely amounts to, "I like my expensive DAC very much" while thinking, "I'd be damn lucky to re-capture 60% of its cost if I listed it for sale on A-gon".
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After almost a years time the OP most certainly made a choice- @seadog137 what was your verdict?
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dCS is horrendously overpriced and represents some of the worst value is audio equipment. There are many DACs that are built even better and sound as good or better than the dCS like the Bricasti Design M1.
The ATC speaker you are interested in retails for 24,500.00. It uses analog active crossovers between its amps forgoing the huge advantage doing this in the digital domain. There are things you can do in the digital realm such as subwoofer management, room control and EQ that are impossible to do in the analog realm without adding distortion. I also hate the idea of amps closed off in loudspeakers were they have no ventilation and get the crap vibrated out of them if there is a woofer in the box. I have seen connection work harden and break. I would get the passive version of the speaker and triamp it using a DEQX Pre 8 and you can add subwoofers seamlessly down the line if you care. You get a preamp, a digital processor, 8 channel DAC and high res streamer all in one Australian Box. Then you can get whatever amp you like best in each position. One more thing about DACs, they followed the same path op amps did. Over a period of 40 years the DAC chips now handily match or even improve on the function of discreet units. Using them allows the manufacturer to save serious money and be able to offer 8 channel DACs at a reasonable price. The Pre 8 is not cheap at $15,000, but if it had 4 discreet DACs (8 channels) it would cost $55,000. For people who like the idea of an active loudspeaker, and I am one of them, the Pre 8 is a game changer.
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@jymc “why do so many people on these types of threads simply "root" for whatever DAC brand they already own?”
I suspect that pretty much regardless of your technique, experience level, financial means, or tastes, what you have is the culmination of your search and is the best to you. Which, of course, can mean a lot or nothing. So it makes sense you would have the best sounding DAC (given your circumstances) and would recommend it.
I bought my first DAC (a two box cd transport / DAC) around 1990. I used separate DACs for travel, my home system and my office system since that time. I have a good system and have had DACs of the $3.5K - $22K in my system. So, big surprise, I recommend my DAC provided you want a detailed natural sounding musical DAC. I will admit if you are a “detail trumps all” kind of guy or in a much lower price range I will recommend something else. But typically I try to comment when I believe I can add value.
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why do so many people on these types of threads simply "root" for whatever DAC brand they already own??....wow these guys really know their stuff, huh!!!
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If you’re seeking a richly musical and thoroughly enjoyable experience, Aries Cerat offers exceptional options. With each model, you'll find significant enhancements in transparency and dynamics. However, if you prefer a more clinical and analytical presentation, DCS stands out as the ideal choice.
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@OP, the N-05XD is really better used into a preamp. It is an absolutely top notch DAC and it is significantly improved by its matching clock.
The Apex Bartok is much better than the previous version and is a good choice in the application you are considering.
Personally, I would favour it over the CHORD and I am familiar with all three.
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I have the Dcs Bartok apex and have been very satisfied
I upgraded my Bartok to Apex version and found the improvement significant
I have Sonus Faber Il Cremonese speakers and the Bartok East Apex has been a very satisfying match
there are undoubtedly a lot of great choices in this price range- hard to go wrong -but I think you will be very satisfied with the Bartok Apex
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Hello @seadog137, I have directly compared the Dave to my Tambaqui and easily chose the Tambaqui. but it does improve with a great preamp, and I agree wholeheartedly on the Makua w onboard Tambaqui. The volume control on the Tambaqui alone is not the best (digital). This makes the T+A 200 or the one above it interesting if I were starting again. I am not familiar with the Bartok Apex direct to amps. Also, the Tambaqui benefits from a good streamer, I have the Grimm MU1, and it is great with the stand alone Tambaqui or the Makua w Tambaqui. I do not know if the Bartok Apex needs a separate streamer to excel.
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Aries Cerat Helene, 40 Kg of sonic nirvana. I was only able to compare to non-Apex DCS. FWIW, DCS was very clinical and digital sounding. The AC Helene sounds like a $50K analog rig—two DACs at the opposite ends of the spectrum.
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Is the Esoteric N-05XD worth a look too ?
The matching Esoteric G-05 Master Clock Generator can be used as an upgrade later on. That combo should be a killer ?
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Honestly, if you're just running an ATC, I don't see why there's a need for a top flight DAC
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My Dream system
your speakers and Playback Design MPS-8
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Several folks I know and myself drive ATC SCM50ASL(T) speakers directly with the Weiss DAC501. Most find the many DSP features useful. As far as I know, none of us are planning any further upgrades. One auditioned the T&A 200 and preferred the Weiss. Most folks out there that have made the comparison with Dave, prefer the Weiss.
If you are considering something as expensive as the Bartok Apex, also audition the new Weiss Helios which is in the same price range.
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you should also try the Wyred4Sound 10th anniversary dac it's about $4,500 US, one of the reviewers put it up against his VPI turntable with a $5,000 Japanese cartridge and he said that the 10th anniversary DAC sounded just as analog and it also comes with a 30-day trial period, on that review I decided to try it and I totally agree this is one of the most analog sounding DACs I've had in my system, no need to spend $21,000 or $80,000 on a DAC, that's ridiculous.
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@seadog137 I used to own the DCS Bartok Apex and as some people love it for me it was to clinical and you need to work around a lot to about brightness
I switch to Lampizator Pac2 and I am the happiest ever. Amazing DAC way more analog, it’s not as detail but you can always work around with the right streamer to make it sounds more detail if that’s what you want.
Lampizator is more forgiving also and open the possibility to use SS or tubes on the front side
my 2 cents hope it’s helps
good luck
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The Playback MPD-8 lacks the on-board streamer. That said, I had a customer do a direct compare (in-home demo) of the Bartok Apex vs the MPD-6 from Playback and he opted for the Playback. His perspective was that detail was a push but the staging on the Playback was superior. The MPD-6 has a streamer option you can add for $3k. MPD-6 with Stream-X is $18k.
I would look at the Weiss Helios, not the 501. The Helios is better in just about every way and is right in the same range as the Bartok in terms of price at $21,995. Incredibly detailed and some of the best instrument separation I have heard in any DAC.
I love the Chord but it is 10 years into its life cycle. Depending on how long you plan to keep it, or how upset you get about new gear coming out, this could be N issue. That said, I think Chord is one of the very best DACs direct into a power amp or powered speakers. The volume control/preamp stage is great but does not have a streamer built in.
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The best DACs I have heard recently are the Esoteric’s. If you can stretch to the Grandioso it is probably top 3 DACs period.
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I’m super happy with my dCS Bartok Apex, great soundstage, very musical thru my Wilson Alexx V’s.
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If you can be ok with just a dac , by a Big margin the T+A 200 dac beats or competes with anything 2x it’s price or more. At $7k a steal. I know 3 people personally and 5 in our multi state north east Audio get together .
I have heard dacs up to $50k and it depends how deep your pockets are.
innuos or other SS drive streamer combos make a great complement to this .
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I've heard that the Mytek Empire has an excellent DAC within it's streamer/DAC....
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You may want to look into The Premiere DAC by MSB Technology. I believe it’s in the same price range as the Bartok. MSB Technology is a California based audio company with highly regarded DAC’s. I have their Discrete DAC after 2 years of owning a Lumin X1 and I strongly prefer the MSB DAC. I’m not familiar with your speakers and how they’d match up with this DAC. Regardless, try to find a dealer that will let you demo any of these DAC’s at home. I found A/B testing in my home the best way to compare components. Good luck.
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I haven’t considered the Mola Mola. I’d prob just go with the Makua and add the optional DAC/Streamer board if I went that way.
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I tried the Mola Mola Tambaqui in my system. In my system I prefer the soundstage,and tonality of the Chord Dave. The Dave's bass is significantly better than the Tambaqui...at least in my system.
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Have you considered the Mola Mola Tambaqui?
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