Building a second, vinyl focused system. Speaker advice needed! (<$10k)


Hi folks, I'm in the early stages of planning a second system that is going to be nearly dedicated to vinyl playback. I realized recently that when I listen to music, it  is hardly ever through streaming, I'm almost always spinning something from my vinyl collection. I'm also trying to take a longer term view by planning to save (for an extended period of time) to actually buy an endgame system. In this post, I'd like help putting together a shortlist of speakers to research and demo. Obviously the ratio between the universe of all speakers vs what I can feasibly try is very high, so please leave me some breadcrumbs that I can follow up on and help narrow it down as much as possible! With that said let me walk through my priorities.

  • I am definitely looking for full range speakers. I could also be persuaded to add a subwoofer if it's really needed (e.g. for electronic music) but would vastly prefer a two channel system, especially at this price point.

  • Immersive, holographic soundstage and imaging. This is usually what tickles my ears the most when I think back to the best listening experiences I've had.

  • Lifelike, engaging, and fun musical presentation. Obviously I appreciate pure fidelity to a degree, but some of the most boring speakers I've ever heard measure "perfectly flat." At this point in my journey, I value a fun experience over 100% truthfulness.

  • Non-fatiguing treble and overall sound (no shoutiness). Not to pick on them but I've heard several Klipsch models that I would call shouty and it's a quality that I really disliked. Maybe that's all horn speakers, idk.

  • Tight, controlled, and accurate bass (not wooly or boomy). Also as with the shouty treble, wooly and fuzzy bass just takes me out of the experience entirely. I usually attribute this sound to older speakers from the 70s.

  • Excellent microdynamics and ability to reveal musical “texture," especially in electronic music, think albums like Jan Jelinek's "Loop Finding Jazz Records" with lots of pops, clicks, and quick transients.

  • Strong performance at both low and high volumes. I listen at night a lot and still want a good experience without disturbing others. The speaker shouldn't get congested at higher volumes though since I do like to play em loud as well.

  • Excels with jazz (especially live combo recordings), classical, and detailed electronic music. I listen to a lot of live jazz combo recordings so imaging and timbre are very important here. My litmus test is whether Scott LaFaro's bass on "Live at The Village Vanguard" actually sounds real or not.

  • Real wood, furniture grade cabinetry. I really value speakers as pieces of functional furniture that should blend in with a space as much as a couch or a table. This is a bit more subjective, but I'm looking for something that fits the aesthetic of my home, being a mix of Scandinavian and MCM, clean lines, natural wood, nothing overly ornate. I think this rules out speakers like GoldenEar that have more of a home theatre aesthetic (no hate, I've heard this speaker and it rocks).

  • Should play nicely with tube amplification as that is what I am planning for this system. I have a lot to learn about amp and tube matching so I'll probably be back with this as a separate question. I imagine these speakers will be fairly high sensitivity with good nominal impedance figures.

  • Budget of around $10k, since I'll be saving for a while, I want something with serious staying power. Will consider used options too.

My current system is a pair of Dynaudio Contour 20 stand mounts, driven by a Parasound HINT6. I really love these speakers but the lack of deep bass, low volume performance, and low sensitivity make them a poor match for this system, so they'll be added to a home theatre setup in the future. What I do love about them is they are totally non-fatiguing to listen to and strike a nice balance between analytical and laid back listening. This is a quality that I'd also like to retain. I'm happy to answer other questions y'all might have but this is getting a bit long winded at this point, so I'll cut myself off. Thank you for the advice!

primarist

They’re a little polarizing, but I’m a big fan of the Rethms.  The Trishna started out @ $10k, but may be up to $12k now.  Perfect for virtually any tube amplification, even SET.  They use a full range driver combined with a powered low end featuring 4 woofers in isobaric configuration.  I love the immediacy of the sound, and my understanding is they’ve addressed a mid-bass issue associated with previous design.  IMHO, their look is very consistent with a Scandinavian vibe, though I wouldn’t necessarily say “furniture grade” the way my Audio Notes can.  Full disclosure:  i’ve only heard them twice in show settings, but was impressed both times, the second when they were being driven by a Synthesis integrated, which is a brand I’m deeply familiar with.

One approach would be to build from classics.  Such as:

*  A JBL Paragon (beautiful modern cabinet, unsurpassed dynamic full range JBL woofers and "potato masher" mid/high end.  Alternatively, two older JBL Harkness speakers, also with the D130a woofers and D75 "potato-masher" as used in the Paragon.   

* A modest-power tube preamp with a great phono stage, such as the ARC 6b, 6d,or 6e.  No better phone stage for moving magnet cartridges or high output moving coils.

* A Dual 721 or 704 turntable with an easily-adjustable VTA mechanism and either an XLM or ZLM body with an ADC OEM Shibata stylus.  The stylus shape is why you need the easy VTA adjustment,,,,,when you get it just right the sound just "pops" into accurate and full dimensional character.

***************************************

This will take a while to assemble, but when done you will have a "state of the phono art" system from the early '70's, the peak of the phono period history.

I am going to second @chayro and recommend Audio Note speakers. They play well with tubes and they have numerous finishes. They work best when placed in the corners of your room. Here is a nice pair of Here is a stunning pair. I have the Audio Note AN-E LX HE Hemp in my system currently with Sysnthesis tube amps and they love jazz. 

My second system is the Yamaha CX/MX1000 combo, Yamaha NS1000m with a Gustard X26pro Dac.  This cost me less than 4k and I love it. 

I’m still using the Audio Physic Virgo speakers I bought around 25 years ago.  I would say they meet all the criteria you list, and all types of music on vinyl sound great played through them.  Used Audio Physics could be a good way to go.  Someday I’ll upgrade, probably to something from DeVore Fidelity.  I understand John DeVore’s approach to speaker design was influenced by his appreciation of Audio Physic’s. But obviously I’m in no hurry at all to upgrade.

Legacy Focus SE or Focus XD. These are incredible speakers. Check them out. Bill Duddleston is an incredible designer. These speakers are full range (no subwoofers required), have incredible cabinets, with incredible sound. I flew from Alaska to Springfield Illinois to audition these speakers. Bill came in on the weekend to audition them for me. I was totally blown away by the sound. These are the real deal. Check them out. These speakers have incredible sound and beautiful cabinets. 

"Real wood, furniture grade cabinetry"

Aesthetic+ sound= Sonus Faber

Too bad you're not open to used. Something like this could be in your tolerance zone:

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lisbe2j1-sonus-faber-elipsa-se-floorstanding-speakers-maple-76861-full-range

A little  brother of the Stradivari @$50K

https://www.sonusfaber.com/en/products/stradivari

Below the radar Italian brand in your price zone. I have a pair of lower line from this brand.  Tube or SS friendly.

https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/650103330-opera-grand-callas-ii-superb-and-rare-3-way-italian-loudspeakers/

 

How big the room?

  • Strong performance at both low and high volumes. I listen at night a lot and still want a good experience without disturbing others. The speaker shouldn't get congested at higher volumes though since I do like to play em loud as well.

I also listen late at night and tun off the 2-channel systems to go to my RAAL SR1a earphones. This is better than my Magnepan Mini system in the office. It is not as good as my Yamaha NS5000 system in the Livingroom,

I mention the SR1a or SR1b (the same thing) because it will give you a 2-channel representation of the sound. Your Parasound Hint6 would be great with the SR1a or b. It is a much better listening experience than almost all 2-channel systems at low volume. Not even considering room issues.

There is another RAAL headphone (not earphone) that people are freaking out about, it is the RAAL 1995 Immanis. It cost about $10k and it is an experience. Not 2-channel like the SR1a but close. I am thinking of getting that for a bedroom late night listening only because I am lazy to carry the SR1a from my office to the bedroom. 

 

Good to avoid Klipsch and their unpolished and overly present upper mid rage and lower treble harshness @primarist 

    What tube amp are you using ? Wattage will matter too. I have a 12 wpc tube amp and some 180 wpc mono blocs, big difference. My 12 wpc is a Had Inspire , and Dennis is a big fan of the ProAc’s. I found that with my small amp I needed to run KT-120’s or KT-150’s to get enough bass from my ZU’s to avoid a sub. I don’t think the ZU’s would meet your needs. One of the tube friendly speakers I’ve heard positive comments on but I’ve yet to audition is Tannoy. Happy Hunting , Mike B. 

@Primarist - What is your combined amp and speaker budget? It really doesn't make sense to be buying a pair of speakers and then trying to match an amplifier to them.

In fact, really you should be buying the amp and speakers together.

This particularly the case with contemplating a tube amp since its power output and output impedance will have a big influence on what speaker you choose.

Omega Speakers High Output Alnico Monitors, w/ a matching sub. The drivers have absolutely gorgeous, non-fatiguing tone with a soundstage that is wide and very holographic. They are very efficient and pair extremely well with low powered tube amps. Plus, they are handmade with furniture grade veneers right here in the USA.

KEF Reference 1 Meta, they will be very close

to what you are seeking for. They are a perfect match for the Hint 6.

Try and audition some Paradigm Founder 100Fs. They're well within your price and check all your boxes. They are beautiful (our floor demos right now are midnight cherry) and sound sublime. No sub needed. I work in a hi-fi shop and we have towers on demo that cost four times as much. The Founders are my favorite at $2,799/each.

Consider some Legacy speakers. Very efficient, full range and very nice cabinets with 3 grades of finishes. Outstanding bass and ribbon tweeters and Mids.

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Hi, talk with Ze'ev at Pure Audio Project about their open baffle speakers. I own their Quintet 10's with AMT Heil tweeters--excellent!. Many choices/permutations from dual to quintet,10" or 15" woofers, three tweeter types with future crossover and wiring upgrades if desired. Will match most electronics and room sizes.

Cheers,

David.

Check out Volti speakers. I’m not a horn guy, but these have sounded great at several show demos. I am a ProAc fanboy, but they need some power to sing. I have Tekton Lores in my bedroom system, they are a great value, but may not be the furniture grade you are looking for.

I do like the value of tekton and the beryllium option.its fantastic beryllium pushes the distortion cone breakup past 20k hz out of the human hearing range.its light and quick,responsive,fast,definition and known as the best speaker building material but hard to work with as a manufacture. You would not be disappointed.enjoy the search.

One of the few speakers I can think of that could tick all your boxes is the ProAc D30RS, especially with its ability to disappear and produce a voluminous and holographic 3D soundstage that appears to be very important to you.  Very few speakers pull this off as well as ProAc and even fewer that can do it and meet all your other criteria.  I’d suggest you find a dealer and go give them a listen, and best of luck. 

https://www.basilaudio.com/products/proac-d30rs/

https://pt.audio/2023/06/23/proac-d30rs-loudspeakers-review/

Don’t overlook the Audio Note AN-E.  They cover a lot of the bases you list and are designed for low-wattage amplifiers. They come at many different price points, depending on options, but you may be able to find something at your price point, especially used or demo. 

@primarist  The lower the wattage, the higher speaker sensitivity required.  My 100db speaker can barely run 2 watt SET amps.

What’s the lowest tube amp wattage?

Tekton Perfect Set, designed for SET and other tubes...should check all your boxes, i suppose. There is also a version with a 15 inch driver. If you want to get all fancy with it and get your 10k's worth, ask for a custom with all Beryllium drivers, some fancy finish or whatever.

  • I am definitely looking for full range speakers. I could also be persuaded to add a subwoofer if it’s really needed (e.g. for electronic music) but would vastly prefer a two channel system, especially at this price point.

  • Immersive, holographic soundstage and imaging. This is usually what tickles my ears the most when I think back to the best listening experiences I’ve had.

  • Lifelike, engaging, and fun musical presentation. Obviously I appreciate pure fidelity to a degree, but some of the most boring speakers I’ve ever heard measure "perfectly flat." At this point in my journey, I value a fun experience over 100% truthfulness.

  • Non-fatiguing treble and overall sound (no shoutiness). Not to pick on them but I’ve heard several Klipsch models that I would call shouty and it’s a quality that I really disliked. Maybe that’s all horn speakers, idk.

  • Tight, controlled, and accurate bass (not wooly or boomy). Also as with the shouty treble, wooly and fuzzy bass just takes me out of the experience entirely. I usually attribute this sound to older speakers from the 70s.

  • Excellent microdynamics and ability to reveal musical “texture," especially in electronic music, think albums like Jan Jelinek’s "Loop Finding Jazz Records" with lots of pops, clicks, and quick transients.

  • Strong performance at both low and high volumes. I listen at night a lot and still want a good experience without disturbing others. The speaker shouldn’t get congested at higher volumes though since I do like to play em loud as well.

  • Excels with jazz (especially live combo recordings), classical, and detailed electronic music. I listen to a lot of live jazz combo recordings so imaging and timbre are very important here. My litmus test is whether Scott LaFaro’s bass on "Live at The Village Vanguard" actually sounds real or not.

  • Real wood, furniture grade cabinetry. I really value speakers as pieces of functional furniture that should blend in with a space as much as a couch or a table. This is a bit more subjective, but I’m looking for something that fits the aesthetic of my home, being a mix of Scandinavian and MCM, clean lines, natural wood, nothing overly ornate. I think this rules out speakers like GoldenEar that have more of a home theatre aesthetic (no hate, I’ve heard this speaker and it rocks).

  • Should play nicely with tube amplification as that is what I am planning for this system. I have a lot to learn about amp and tube matching so I’ll probably be back with this as a separate question. I imagine these speakers will be fairly high sensitivity with good nominal impedance figures.

  • Budget of around $10k, since I’ll be saving for a while, I want something with serious staying power. Will consider used options too.

While I've never had a chance to demo them,I read good things about Daedalus Audio.. I have heard 3 different models from Focus Audio & I have to say,if I had the room & they were not so damn heavy I would have bought a pair years ago!