😀 Totally agree excellent response. We could do the same with taste and smell. Do we get an analytical report on food before we choose restaurants- No!
What was the first power cable that you noticed a difference in the sound?
I have bought six or seven different power cords, none over $500 and have noticed little or no change in the sound of my system. All the cables are 12 gauge or bigger. Without talking about cables made with unobtainium, where did you start hear a difference.
Thanks.
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When I went to buy my first aftermarket cable I dragged my Cambridge Audio Azur 640C V2 CD player into a dealer and he let me connect it to a very high quality Simaudio Moon/Dynaudio system with all Shunyata cables and he let me switch out different power cables to see which worked best with my gear. Maybe it was because the accompanying gear was very good, but the differences were not subtle. Here is what I found: Shunyata Anaconda > Shuyata Diamondback >> Shunyata entry level cable > 14 guage printer cable I grabbed out of the recycle bin at work. What was surprising was how much better the Diamond back was compared to their $100 cable, and how close it was to the Anaconda in performance. I bought the Diamondback. Now I assemble my own power cables. kn
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I found this to be helpful to understand the pros and cons of AC wiring: Integrating Electronic Equipment and Power into Rack Enclosures Optimized Power Distribution and Grounding for Audio, Video and Electronic Systems See below page 11-13 for different types of AC power wiring. Good luck with your new room! 😎 Mike |
@knownothing Bingo. You nailed it. Comparison on your own equipment with other good equipment and good power cables. When done as you did, the difference is truly not subtle. I didn’t believe it until I did it myself after my equipment had improved to a reasonable level. |
@hickamore It definitely made a positive improvement compared to using only one power bar for my setup. I had purchased the Chang Lightspeed with the intent to upgrade from my original Furman. I tried bringing everything over to my newly acquired power bar, which did make a nice difference. But then I’d remembered other threads where this was mentioned and put just my digital components on the Furman. Everything was even better. |
My first experience with upgraded AC cables was with the Synergistic AC Master Couplers in the nineties. I use a full SR loom in my $100k system, many purchased used as others upgrade. They continue to innovate. I'm extremely happy with their offerings, especially at the more entry level. Very high value if you have a sufficiently resolving system... |
Some disappointment expressed here with Pangea power cables. I have used and built a lot of PCs. The best low cost bargain I have found recently in an assembled cable is the Audiomeca P-90 OCC power cord single crystal copper hifi power cable. You can get it for a little over $100 from Aliexpress. China, I know, but it is super well made and it’s performance beats some of the cables I’ve built with parts costing five times that much. Not much to lose in trying it. kn |
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I have no dispute with the methods used by some to gather their info and conclude their investigations. If one chooses the route of discussions being had, or reading about PC Triple C Wire used as the Signal Path in a Cable, that is their choice. What I do have at my end which is at least one stage further on as an investigation is the experiencing the Wire in use in my Home System, with the outcome being that I have exchanged nearly all Cables and the Wire PC Triple C is now the most common Wire in use, where it has superseded the use of OCC Copper and Silver. The PC Triple C Wire is not the chosen Wire for the Digital Source, after further investigations and extending this to being an experience. The Cable used has D.U.C.C as the Signal Wire used between CDT>DAC and is the umbilical type I regularly offer as a suggestion to others. Additionally, all Cables I am using are not assessed from my own experiences, as a social individual within HiFi, there are Demo's and Loans made of owned Cables to be used in other systems. I have also received feedback from adopters of PC Triple C Wire within this Forum Threads, where it has been made known something was present that was an added attraction over the previously used OCC Wire. I am yet to be confronted with anybody suggesting the use of PC Triple C in place of OCC has been a experience where some sort of betterment has not been perceived, when the PC Triple C Wire has been used for the Signal Path or Power Supply. As stated before, I attempt to step around adopting any attitudes shown from myself, where the forming a evaluation without a direct experience is the intention. I avoid if possible any attitude that can relate to the following: "There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which can not fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance-that principle is contempt prior to investigation." |
@carlsbad2 Jerry, intuitively it makes sense that the low power requirements of DAC's & Streamers wouldn't benefit by upgraded power cables, but my experience proved otherwise. I had my Shunyata dealer send me 3 Shunyata power cables, including the lower priced Alpha v2 NR, the medium-priced Sigma v2 NR and the higher priced Omega QR-s. All 3 power cables were burned in for a minimum of 250 hours. Of all of my equipment that includes a Gryphon Antileon EVO amp, Gryphon Pandora pre-amp and dCS Rossini Apex DAC / Streamer, I heard noticeable SQ improvements with the highest-end Omega QR-s power cable connected to my dCS DAC / Streamer, which I wasn't expecting. Furthermore, you would think that the massive Class A Gryphon Antileon EVO amp would also benefit by the QR-s cable, but I heard no noticeable difference between the highest end Omega QR-s cable vs. the medium-priced Sigma v2 NR power cable. This seems to suggest that you need to ignore any assumptions and field test various options to find the best overall system synergies. |
You don’t mention what you have for equipment. I recently did the same and borrowed 5 different power cables in the $300 range. on my mid-level high end system I heard differences for each cable. the winner then was Pangea 14XL with Cardas copper. recently someone Facebook turned me on to Ataudio power cables from aliexpress here a $60 cable bettered the Pangea 14XL .
so dunno what you have for an audio system or what type of music you listen to but if you hear no differences than you will at least save $$.
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@riccitone |
It was the Shunyata Delta NR. Frankly, I was shocked over how a cable could make that much of a difference. But I did not like all of the changes (enhanced mids but at the cost of toning down the highs, i.e. less bright), but changing the fuse to a Rhodium fuse and then again to a Synergistic Purple fuse addressed that! |
@sudnh , I have a Hegel H390 going to KEF Reference 5 speakers by way of either AQ Rocket 88 cables or Audio Art’s Statement E cables with the lockable Rhodium bananas. |
I never expected power cords made a difference. Then I got a used 2M Audio Art Power I Classic cable, used with a big class D amp. Immediately heard subtle but worthwhile differences. Got a 2nd one of these (1.5M) and put it on a tubed headphone amp. Heard a slight but worthwhile difference. These are budget cables, bottom of the line in Audio Arts lineup, but they made a positive difference for me. |
@curiousjim "I have bought six or seven different power cords, none over $500 and have noticed little or no change in the sound of my system" correct! good quality equipment must supply sufficient power cable, some brands like Esoteric have “upgraded” power cable option available for extra charge. if someone can “hear” sound improvement after replacing power cable, before claiming power cable problem I would in details, for example what cable was replaced, outlet degradation issues etc. In many cases de-ox spray fixes contact issues, w/o changing need to replace cable. |
My demonstrations for the following cables were performed in a local dealers showrooms. Since then I have owned and auditioned many different power cables. My first experience was with Shunyata Research’s Black Momba power cable demonstrated on a Naim Audio Classic series seperates system. The Momba was powering the amplifier driving Thiel speakers. My second experience was the Nordost Vahalla powering an Ayre Acoustic Ax-5 integrated amplifier driving Aerial 7T’ speakers. In my system aftermarket power cables along with Synergistic Research Purple fuses considerably enhances the performance. ymmv N |
What I find really interesting is the number of times the subject of power cables comes up, and the response the subject seems to get every time. This post is already on page 4. And before someone points out that "you're reading it", yes I am because I'm always looking to find something new, but in the case of PCs it looks like there really is no new ground to cover. Still, this is one subject that just gains traction every time the same question is raised. Not sure what that says about us? (me included) . |
With the exception of my DAC and a VTL power amp, none of my gear has IEC connectors for power cords. Most of my amps are vintage SS and tube, but a few of the comments regarding power supply reserve as a way of reducing impact of power cords piqued my interest. Has anyone here done research along those lines, whether measured or subjective? Virtually all of the fixed power cords on the 60s/70s gear I have is 18 ga. |
"What was the first power cable that you noticed a difference in the sound?" As stated, A Power Cable with a PC Triple C Wire. Not much to be discovered, not sure my recollections have any thoughts worthwhile reporting on, in relation to my experiences between OFC and OCC Wire used for this purpose. Wire Gauge differences have been known to create a difference to a sonic, but I have not worked with type of investigation, even though I am aware the link to the PC in my earlier Post in this thread has wire that is a different gauge to the Wire I have in my PC containing PC Triple C Wire. |
I once went to an apple pie contest. The panel of experts, some with 30 years experience in apple networking, took samples of each of the pies, put them in a blender, and then tested each sample for colour, lubricity, light transmission, density, ph, and of course percentage of sugar, fat, carbohydrates and fibre. Their conclusion? Within the experimental errors of the measuring devices they were all the same. The gave the blue ribbon to the cheapest pie.
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My audio engineer feels that it was a current spike that shorted one of my tubes, and so after 55 years I finally caved in and bought a Furman power conditioner from Crutchfield, on sale from $1000 down to $599. It provides a “current reservoir” of an extra 45 amps for the amplifiers and that has made a big difference with regard to the texture, detail and authority at the bass end. So that seems a worthwhile investment. I still use chain-link fence for my cable interconnects.
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For the DIYers out there...
They get a little on the expensive side when you get into the OCC copper, but you can try them using plain old romex house wire first for a more affordable approach just to "prove the theory" Read what other Audiogon members think about the Helix DIY cables here... Enjoy the read :-) Regards - Steve |
@williewonka Steve, I just read through the entire THE HELIX IMAGE" Power Cable guide and will likely make a few power cables to try out. I too love a good DIY challenge (and saving money). Any meaningful updates since the article was written in 2015? |
@tubeguy76 , what's on there is the latest. Just read the section on the AIR adaption as well. Unfortunately the app I use to maintain the site does not track when changes are applied, just created date. Let me know what you think and if have questions just ask. I'm here to help - steve
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Welcome to the forum. Thanks for your comments…
However, without context it is hard to gain any insight. What are your components and venue. There is a place under your user ID to put photos and identify your components. A bit of context is also helpful to understand the conditions of you observations. I have also tried numerous after market power cords from $100 to $2,500 and found the lower end to have no impact and the upper ones to have something between excellent improvements that were very nuanced to startling improvement. |
Its honestly a mixed bag On the flipside the biggest difference i ever experienced was when i upgraded speaker cables a while back.I went from plain installer grade wire to a used pair of AQ Volcano. it was such a massive difference that i reinstalled one speaker with cheap wire and the other with upgraded wire to demonstrate to some cable denier friends i even made a video about it where i would go back and forth between the two. It was such a huge difference that even playing it back on my cellphone the gap was so large it could have single handily ended the cable debate as anyone not deaf could hear the difference
now i run stealth audio cloude 99. Once again this is a big difference. They use a helium dielectric and are ridiculously fast and airy silver cables it affords me the ability go with more “chocolate” upstream |
