@ larsman I've had the same experience. Having recently upgraded my analog end, I find vinyl to be my preferred source for listening.
What is the actual percentage of people exclusively listening to vinyl vs digital?
I well remember in the ‘80s when we were amazed and thrilled by CD.
Wow, no more pops and clicks and all the physical benefits.
Seems so many abandoned vinyl.
But now, with so much convenience, available content and high SQ seems even dedicated vinylholics have again abandoned vinyl and embraced digital. However, there is clearly a new resurgence in analog.
But I look at, for example, whitecamaro’s “List of amplifiers...” thread and no one seems interested in analog!
To me, it seems strange when auditioning “$100Kish gear, that vinyl doesn’t enter the picture or conversation.
Wow, no more pops and clicks and all the physical benefits.
Seems so many abandoned vinyl.
But now, with so much convenience, available content and high SQ seems even dedicated vinylholics have again abandoned vinyl and embraced digital. However, there is clearly a new resurgence in analog.
But I look at, for example, whitecamaro’s “List of amplifiers...” thread and no one seems interested in analog!
To me, it seems strange when auditioning “$100Kish gear, that vinyl doesn’t enter the picture or conversation.
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I used to listen to digital exclusively for many a decade; had records, but they just didn't thrill me on the system I had. I recently upgraded my analog system, and it's like listening to those records again for the first time, they sound so different and so much better. So now I listen to digital on my headphones for iTunes on my computer or streaming, and listen to analog on my speakers.... |
@sokogear That's very nice that you enjoy listening to music and don't obsess about the type of delivery. I don't obsess over having "too many" recordings or how many times I listen to them. I've heard AJA about a dozen times and collect most of Steely Dan (I like rock as well as my aforementioned opera, classical, jazz and ethnic music-I don't like rap or hip-hop or most post 1995 pop music). Apparently, 45 car players were available (especially in Chryslers) https://www.hagerty.com/media/automotive-history/obsolete-car-audio-part-2/ https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1CHBD_enUS891US891&sxsrf=ALeKk01J3K-NhZJ4rIe-yHM-MbaOmlMCLA:... Techmoan is a terrific YourTube site with thoroughly investigated electronics of the past (mostly music related) which I find fascinating https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5I2hjZYiW9gZPVkvzM8_Cw |
@fleschler No time to get to know any album. I am more like @mahgister than you, but not to that extent. I don’t know how many hundreds of times I’ve listened to “Kind of Blue” or”Aja” or dozens of others and noticed new things sometimes, especially if I’ve changed a component or better yet, put in a tweak. to each his own...whatever makes you happy and enjoy the hobby. Like I said, I am 100% vinyl, but I can see the attraction of SACDs for a younger audiophile than me by 10-20 years who grew up with no vinyl coming out and their new music only available on CD. I can even understand those who listen to compressed streams in order to explore lots of new music. I’m very picky and very biased towards albums that came out when I was in college and high school and classic (mostly) jazz I discovered 20 years ago. I will say that in listening to Sirius in my wife’s car, I rediscovered a few people/groups that I knew about but never got into and bought some albums that I like. I play CDs in mine because I hate switching stations. Therefore, I guess nobody can be 100% vinyl since you can’t play a turntable in a car. |
@sokogear What's wrong with listening to an entire collection once through every 20 years? I don't of course as only 18,000 LPs are in my adjacent room for current listening and I intend to dispose of many 1,000s over time. My 3,500 ethnic records (LPs and 78s) are not just for listening pleasure but I serve as the recordings librarian for a conductor of a symphony and choirs. I make CDs/digital transfers of audios and videos in my collection. I don't view having an extensive collection as a liability. Just as I don't view having 3,500 books as a liability although I rarely read more than a book a month (I peruse books for items that interest me-my late wife's 500+ fiction books are unread by me). Lastly, I've had 60 years worth of listening pleasure which would mean at your calculation, at least 3 plays per LP per my life. I hope to have another 40 years worth of plays. |
I listen in a period of few years thousand of times the same cd with variation for sure with other cd... Am I nut? Some music like the art of the fugue or orchestral suites of Bach cannot be listen a few times... Some other music ressemble any other and i dont want to listen to it more than few minutes.... There is always the deep moving music, few hundred of which we return each day, week, months, or year.... The other are only a temporary curiosity without great thrill save the change... I listened for example Heinrich Schutz "Geistliche Chormusic by Mauersberger each day for few years one hour.....I dont fathom till this day this absolute choral masterpiece like very few at the same level even Bach work hard to create....A pure synthesis of German heavy grammar with baroque italian harmony fusionned perfectly.... It is so great works that even Schutz never repeat this.... Like, nevermind his marvellous 500 other concertos, there is only one "four seasons" in all Vivaldi... |
@fleschler Sorry for the mistake - I multiplied by seconds instead of minutes and didn't see the word POTENTIALLY, but you are making my point even more clearly. If you listen to 15 LPs a week, that's 780 per year or about 5% of your inventory, even less if you hit your goal of 3 listens per year. At that rate, you would listen to your accessible ones that you intend to play once every 20 YEARS! (I don't look at anything other than LPs since they take up way more space). @chakster - I have a real passion for listening to music that I am passionate about, live or on records, not collecting records. In fact, I really don't see the point of collecting anything you don't use/enjoy unless it is gives you pleasure to look at it, like art or maybe baseball cards, stamps, coins, etc.unless you are using it as an investment vehicle. I doubt fleschler gets pleasure out of looking at 28,000 album covers, but maybe I'm wrong. It annoys me that I may never listen to maybe 20-25 of my 300 records. No sure what I was thinking when I bought them a long time ago. Maybe they were part of the Columbia Record Club I was a member of for their initial shipment. I don' think I've bought a record in that group in 40 years. When I was a kid, I collected baseball cards because I was and am a big sports fan, and was always told they'd be worth something some day. That is only true if they are in mint, almost untouched condition. That's tough for a kid who traded and flipped them. I have a few years of the entire series' in the early 70s and in total they're worth about $15! I've heard of Maria Condo, never read or saw her, but she is into simplicity and organization and I agree with what I hear she preaches: if something doesn't give you joy or you don't wear it or use it, etc, get RID OF IT! I get anxious anytime I look in a "junk" drawer or closet and feel the need to throw out 90% of it. My wife doesn't want me to ever look in one. She won't throw out an empty pill bottle. Opposites attract I guess. I hate wasting anything - time, space, money, etc., and I think of collecting anything never touched as organized hoarding. Worse is if it is not organized - it's just hoarding. Anything not fit for the house or "overstuffed", put in the garage if you have room. If you haven't touched it in a year or two, throw it out or sell it or give it away, or put it in the shed or crawlspace or attic and start the clock over. |
You misread my post, "if I won't POTENTIALLY listen to three times annually, out it goes". for the purpose of determining to keep or discard the record. I just got 3,500 LPs in the last two years and moved to a new home. I intend to cull the extra opera and vocal LPs and redistribute them. I always have new records to hear. I've heard about 80% of my CDs (virtually all the single CDs, working my way through the big box classical music sets). I listen to about 12 to 15 LPs weekly, possibly more and 12 to 15 CDs, in part or entirety. That's 1,248 to 1,560 CDs and LPs per year. Your math is off by millions of minutes. I do listen for at least 20 hours weekly. My work permits me to listen late at night and get up at 9am. I also, pre-pandemic, was a local recording (engineer) for a chamber group (Viklarbo), several choirs (that I sing in) and occasionally for a professional orchestra. I've recorded concerts at Disney Hall, Ford Theater, Royce Hall, etc. irregularly over 30 years. It's not my job but for the love of music. My prior home had me mix wall storage in a listening room 25' X 20' X 11'6 + equipment area, custom built but not to as high a standard. It wasn't a small home (3,700') but overstuffed. |
Though I've taken great care with my albums over 50 years and still treasure them, nowadays I find myself listening to music via Qobuz at least 90% of the time. With a great DAC and hi res streaming, the sound quality along with an exponentially larger selection and convenience of swapping between artists instantaneously has won me over. |
At 68 I'm flipping vinyl and cleaning every record 98 % of my listening time , the only reason that I have a CD player is because the music was not released on vinyl ( like Poet a tribute to Townes Van Zandt ) or because the very limited release created a very high price ( like $300 for the Eagles Hell Freezes Over ) . I have up to 6 copies of some albums , different pressing from different countries because there are some sonic differences making listening even more fun . |
I do not want to hear about politics, religion, or sex on this forum - it is about being an audiophile, and frankly, this forum is contentious enough without injecting that junk into the conversation. From my point of view, although the demographic of this forum may be mostly older individuals, the members have a quality that younger people do not - they have decades of accumulated knowledge. There is no single correct way to reproduce music - 78, 45, and 33 rpm records can be great, CDs (SACD, UHQR, HDCD, XRCD, UHR-MQA, Redbook PCM, etc) can be great, DSD, ALAC, AAC, FLAC, AIFF, WAV can be great. Enough already! How many of you are trained musicians? As in actually attending a music conservatory as a student, playing an instrument as a performer (including your larynx), or taught music to others (e.g., music theory or musical performance). Listening is a skill that combines innate genetic qualities combined with years of focused experience, just like the best musicians combine prodigy with practice. It trumps training as an electrical engineer in the context of evaluating audio reproduction - when I see the so-called "objectivists" who only look at measures produced by devices I know they are wrong. My advice is that everyone go back to listening and fight with each other on Facebook or somewhere else. |
@fleschler Good that you are keeping track of the majority of your records. My brother in law probably has 1500-2000 records and ends up buying the same record twice (not to get a better pressing, usually the same one). He also doesn't dust them with a brush when he plays them, which drives me nuts when I see him do that. I guess all vinyl enthusiasts have to be at least a little OCD. He only listens to vinyl. So you listen to at least 45,000 records a year. Average length - 40 minutes = 1,800,000 minutes = 500 hours a year, just on records, assuming you only listen to each record exactly 3 times. Assuming you have some favorites and listen to them more often, that leaves little time if any for listening to CDs and 78's. I bet there are plenty of the 15,000 records you don't get around to listening to, in addition to the other 13,000 stored elsewhere. If you never listen to them, why not get rid of them? I am sure you are reading while listening to the stereo, which is usually what I do. Glad that you are enjoying life now, I am lucky that I did about 10 years earlier than you, when I started my business after my kids finally moved off the payroll a few years ago. Didn't move into a mansion though....If anything, I would downsize a bit, but I think we are staying put despite never using 4-5 rooms. |
1. A. I have 15,000 LPs/4,500 CDs/2,000 78s categorized (not on file cards any longer) on my computer. B. I do not own a record store. I have sold 18,000 records in past. I have a rule once I hear a record, if I won't potentially listen to three times annually, out it goes. If it has low musical merit and mediocre sound, out it goes. 2. Also, the LPs, 7,000 CDs and 4,500 78s are stored in a climate controlled, storage room located adjacent to my main listening room. The remaining records include are stored mostly in stable temperature storage shelving in a storage shed and several garages. They are kept dry and clean. 3. I listened for 2 hours on Friday and 2.5 hours Saturday. I switch off between CDs and LPs on the same day or alternate days, depending on what I want to listen to. I have become lazier and listen to 78s less often. 30% of my 78 collection is ethnic music which is mostly unavailable on LP or CD. 4. A. About 75% of my LPs and 50% of my 78s are in NM condition. Nearly all my CDs are NM and play M. As to being junkers, I don't collect junkers. I do have in storage, NM condition multiple duplicate opera LP sets (1000?) which probably have a value of $1/LP. They were either gifted or purchased really cheaply. I have for example, a collection of 300 RCA Living Stereo and 100 Mercury Living Presence, 150 London/Decca, 100 Audiophile Label, 100 MGM LPs which I have not cataloged and are on shelving across from the main collection. I pull out listening LPs from both the cataloged and uncataloged (but in numerical order) sections (and put them back where they belong). I don't know when I will get to the non-listening room records, B. I listen 2 to 2.5 hours per night to music, sometimes more on weekends and now able to share music listening post pandemic. That's a lot of fun as well as reading. I have 3,500 books and periodicals in two libraries and read/scan three newspapers daily along with TheDailyWire and FoxNews (I used to be a Moynihan/Jackson "liberal" in the 60s and voted for Clinton and Gore but that changed with Obama/Biden). C. I am married with no children living at home. My wife is usually busy with her toastmaster hobby (an former international governor of the year) teaching and on zoom meetings while I indulge in my music listening and reading. D. I began collecting/listening when I was 2+ years old with 300 records by age 5 (my parents indulged me with "junkers" and cheapy records. E. I moved two years ago to a nice size home (5,600 ft) to store and enjoy life now that I'm 65. No congestion with separate rooms and libraries. |
@fleschler - #1-do you have these 28,000 categorized in a spreadsheet? Is this part of a record store you own? #2- do you have them in their own special room or climate controlled garage? #3- how many do you listen to with any regularity? #4- how many are NM or audiophile quality and how many are $1 or less junkers you never listen to that just take up space and add to your totals? I have been accumulating vinyl over the past 40 years (of course with the break from the late 80’s until the early 2000s when nothing was produced really) carefully, 97% new, all in NM condition with very few exceptions, and I have 300. There are a small % 10 or less that I almost never listen to and still I may not hear an album for months. I probably listen 15 hours a week on average. The most I’ve ever bought at once is 3-4 with the exception of The Beatles MFSL Collection, which has 14. Just curious. I can’t think of anywhere over 1000 that I would even consider, but I have no classical, hiphop or rap, unless you count the Moody Blues Days of Future Passed on MFSL. |
@john1
There are verifiable statistics to guide us. In Jan. 2021 vinyl album sales were 27% of all record sales. It's only gone up since. That study also says that vinyl accounts for only 3.6% of music consumption. Which reflects the problem with tracking album sales the last couple of years - a lot of us who were buying dozens of CDs per year are now streaming and don't buy any albums at all. I even bought 400 Bandcamp albums (including a 200+ Buckethead Pikes set) within a four year period up until two years ago. Now we just rent a service instead. So it's not necessarily that vinyl sales are exponentially growing compared to digital, but that streaming rental is taking away its statistical competition. |
Well since I'm in both listening camps (records and CDs), I've accumulated another 8,500 LPs in the past 3 years by buying two estate collections and being gifted another (all from deceased collectors). I rarely seek records in stores any longer as I have 28,500 LPs/7,000 CDs/7,000 78s. As to CDs, I occasionally go to thrift stores and often buy on line, mostly jazz and pop with many bargain cost classical music boxed sets. Life is too short to go after one or two records in stores. When I shop, I go to a store with good turnover and inventory and luckily live in Los Angeles. NYC's record stores were mostly gone in 2018 when I last visited. Most L.A. stores are very reasonably priced unlike NYC which profited from tourist buyers. |
Several years ago I knew two audiophiles that both played vinyl, and they also had the same speakers and amplifiers. We'll call them #1 and #2, and #1 sold his entire record collection to go 100% digital. Several months later #1 was over # 2's house listening to vinyl, when he realized he could not get the same quality of sound with his digital system.. Needless to say being a true audiophile #1 bought another turntable, and started collecting high quality records again. For many years now #1 has purchased the highest quality reissued records from Analogue Productions, The Illusive Disc, Music Direct, and high quality used records when reissued ones are not available. In the last fifteen years #1 has purchased about 200 records every year for an expense of about $100 dollars every week, or about $5K a year. You spend that kind of money on records so you don't have to listen to clicks and pops. On the other hand if you don't know how to take care of a high quality record collection, or do not want to put the effort in, vinyl is not for you. Back in the 80's there were thousands of audiophiles searching thrift shops and garage sales for Mercury Living Presence albums, RCA Shaded Dog albums, Decca, London, Lyrita, and other sought after manufactured albums , that were recommended in The Absolute Sound. It was a lesson in futility because when you did find a few of these recommended albums they usually were full of ticks and pops. Many times these records would appear to be perfect, but were noisy because they were played on a turntable that was set up improperly, without the proper tools. In the early 90's RCA and Mercury started issuing albums of most of the sought after music that was recommended by The Absolute Sound, but this time digitally on CD's. Big corporations were out to kill vinyl in the mid to late 80's by offering to buy back CD albums from record stores if they did not sell. Up unto this point record stores had to eat vinyl if it did not sell, so they had blow out sales on their left over vinyl, and that was the end of new vinyl for about five or ten years. So in the early 90's most audiophiles gave up on vinyl and started buying highly sought after music digitally on these newly available CD's. After all why wear out your car running all over hell and back looking for records that were not there. Some extremely stubborn audiophiles did just that, and sometimes found a few good records, but they mostly wore out their cars for no reward or very little. Mind you these guys were looking for records that cost anywhere from 25 cents to a few dollars. These guys would never pay the cost of these high quality newly reissued extremely quiet vinyl records, but did not think anything about the cars that they ran into the ground looking for a bargain. OK, so I was one of the fools that searched for used records before these high quality reissued records became available. Now for the last twenty some years I've accumulated a fabulous record collection just by getting on my computer and spending. |
I have one friend who listens exclusively to LPs (he has over 10,000 in a $850,000 audio system). Another who also has that many LPs only listens to CDs for the last 10 years (ease of use for him). Another who has about 4,000 CDs only burns them to big thumbdrives and listens exclusively to his own CDs. Most of my friends have extensive collections of both LPs and CDs. None stream. We are all over 50 years old. I also listen to 78s (7,000) occasionally to go with my 7,000 CDs and now 28,500 LPs (added 5,000 in past 3 years from 3 collections-deceased estates). |
There are verifiable statistics to guide us. In Jan. 2021 vinyl album sales were 27% of all record sales. It's only gone up since. We're all audiophiles on this forum so we don't care about the invented "Album-equivalent unit" term marketers use to determine the listening habits of those who listen to music on their phones or computer speakers but audiophiles have always been a very small % of the overall market. Of them however & that group adjacent, buying records in physical forms, vinyl's growth is literally exponential & is on track to eclipse CDs (in the next couple or few years somewhere). Downloads & streaming complicate things of course but there is a fundamental attraction to the physicality of records & ever larger numbers that once they've heard analog done right cannot easily suppress & deny the reality of the depth of the experience being greater. |
By the time I was old enough as a kid to buy music, cassettes and boom boxes were the thing and cd’s were just a couple years away. So I never got into vinyl. Now, back into audio last few years, vinyl just seems like too deep a rabbit hole right now with digital so good and so much further for me to explore on that trail now. But maybe some day when I get older and have more time. Interestingly, my younger brother (low 40’s) has had a $500 Audio Technica TT for 15 years, and now has about 500 LPs. He doesn’t have a high end system (B&W 20 year old speakers line below the diamond and just a top cuurrent Yamaha AVR). I talked him into getting a Mani phono pre at least. Anyway, at Christmas I sent a Cambridge 851n streamer dac that I wasn’t using home with him to play with. Went to visit him a few weeks back and brought one of my unused power amps (Edge W) with to swap in. First we listened to his setup, and even with my more expensive 851n digital his TT sounded better through the AVR. When we ran the 851n dac direct into the Edge W, bypassing the Yam, the digital pulled ahead. For some reason the TT through the Mani thru the Yam as preamp to the Edge W didn’t really click. But anyway, to wrap this up he said for convenience he listens to 80% digital but when he is in the mood for analog the 20% of time he enjoys that most, but carving out the time to be in that mood is the issue |
Judging by pictures, only a small amount of systems have anything but the most basic treatments, and only a small percentage have serious acoustics. This is supposed to be the pinnacle of high end. I have always felt that is why all the tweaks. It is just different colors of the same wrong.To accentuate and confirm your position, i will say that when people speak about acoustic treatment they think about some passive absorbing, reflective and diffusive surface balance.... Even rightly done this is not enough to tap into the essential sonic quality of a system...it is necessary to complement it... There exist also a more active way, where a grid of resonators fine tuned and precisely located could increase extraordinarily the benefits of the passive treatment by a better timing between the reflected wavefronts of each speaker in the room...For sure it is not possible in a living room...These resonators are tuned in relation with the speakers behaviour in the room and modify it for the better....But contrary to electronic equalizer they work with a large bandwidth response for the fine tuning and because it is our ears who did the work and not a mic they work for all the room and not only for a very precise location in millimeter....They are part of the speakers/room and not an external tool.... I dont call that a "tweak"....It is a control working over the acoustical dimension....Same thing goes on with vibrations/resonance control, or decreasing the electrical noise floor...These control devices are not secondary addition but necessary precaution to reach optimal S.Q. All that may cost nothing and cost me nothing by the way.... The reason why people upgrade endlessly is because they ignore how to improve and install their system.... When rightly done upgrading appear like it is: a marketing mantra...Anyway good sound is not a variable " taste", it is a musical perceived phenomenon, a musical natural voice or instrumental "timbre" is an objective experience because there is musicians or acousticians consensus around it... And to contribute to the vinyl and digital format wars, i am pretty convinced that vinyl resist more to the degradation of S.Q. in bad acoustical room than digital... But digital greatest potential take advantage of very controlled room to shine... Then the 2 format are differently perceived in different environment....They are way less different than people imagine... |
@dletch2 in poor acoustic environments (most audiophiles rooms) If they're spending $100K on a system I'd hope they'd have the common sense to spend $3K of that on room treatments. But judging from some of the pictures I see of high-dollar systems surrounded by floor-to-ceiling windows and others with wood floors and bare walls, you may be right. |
Hey @millercarbon - you're wrong. In my home, I have only one source plugged in. Turntable. Car & garage - CD. Unplugged the Nakamichi CD player about 15 years ago when vinyl started back up again. Never tried SACDs, but I've heard they are quite good. Also heard streaming and HiRez DLS compress files and don't sound as good as SACD, but I've never heard either on my stereo. I think it is now tougher to get titles on SACD than vinyl. +1 to Fagen-Morph the Cat @mwinkc - been looking for that on vinyl for less than $200 used. Forget about new. 2 fantastic songs and I hate to say, in all of his or the Dan's catalogue 2 of the only 3 songs I would ever skip over (other was WB's tune on Everything Must Go which is also not available on vinyl) - RIP Walter. I think Donald has had licensing issues and complains about constantly getting ripped off. I'm just glad I snagged one of the last copies of Sunken Condos. Regular pressing on undyed vinyl that sounds phenomenal. Plus, it's on 2 records (just 3 sides) so it doesn't go close to the very inner part of the record. They really need to reissue/master Royal Scam and Pretzel Logic and press Tow Against Nature, Kamakiriad and Everything Must Go. They'd probably sell out in an hour. I would guess if your OP asks about all people, the number is <5% if they have an indoor stereo setup for anything other than background music being piped in. For self described audiophiles it's probably higher, maybe 15-20%. |
I listen to all LP & CD, SACD, DVD & Blu Ray. I have no streaming equipment and will not invest in any. To old and not enough $$$. I love vinyl, I'm building a collection of Blue Note Tone Poet Series. If I want to listen to any of the LP's, I'll buy 2 LP's or I'll buy the CD to listen to it. Just my way, crazy or not Ron |
I listen exclusively to analog, Vinyl or R2R only. I turn 75 later this year and although I dabbled a bit in digital when it first arrived I never left my analog world. Some of this might be due to the fact I deal with 1400 computers, 2000 Chromebooks and 5 servers all day long and when I get home a nice single malt and some analog is the way I go! |
The room acoustical bad controls of most users reinforce the choice of vinyl because vinyl S.Q. format resist more to a non optimal acoustical room settings...Digital to shine ASK for optimal acoustical controls more than vinyl, because of the technical aspect and measured potential performance of this format... Please allow me to rephrase for you Mahgister, because what you wrote is potentially import (even though this thread didn't ask what people like). The are unique properties in what we could call the signal processing of vinyl, whether that is channel cross talk, increasing distortion at frequency extremes, added noise, etc. Some of those, like crosstalk, could be conducive, in poor acoustic environments (most audiophiles rooms) to higher satisfaction. Similarly, the distortion and background noise can give a sense of space, or even realism that some may find lacking in digital. What are perceived flaws, can be an advantage, both overall, and for particular listeners. |
Because, from a capability standpoint, vinyl is technologically inferior to digital.Interesting post... I use only digital myself... But you forgot the main reason why vinyl subsist with success for many people owners of the 2 system, digital and vinyl... The room acoustical bad controls of most users reinforce the choice of vinyl because vinyl S.Q. format resist more to a non optimal acoustical room settings...Digital to shine ASK for optimal acoustical controls more than vinyl, because of the technical aspect and measured potential performance of this format... And unbeknownst to most, almost all rooms are not optimally acoustically controlled....It is impossible to realize for ourself this fact if someone had not experience it first hand...Acoustic is the true key to audiophile experience especially for most people who dont own a million dollars system ... Anyway some one million dollars system sound bad it is easy to look for some example in youtube.... In a room acoustically well controlled if the difference subsist it takes very refined audio system to detect the difference if one exist....And this is a minute difference....Mike lavigne experience and testimony for example....For ordinary mortal with average system the key is acoustic controls not the choice between these 2 formats.... I own thousands of files.... It is impossible for me to own thousands of vinyls in a room dedicated only to the object....And most music that interest me is not on vinyl anyway.... Iranian-Indian-and other people music for example or non commercial or not well known jazz music.... If you listen pink floyd mainly no problem to keep also only few hundred of vinyl on repeat..... 😊 the choice of music is way more extensive in digital format and more accessible... |
mambacfa, in order to compare sources like that you have to switch back and forth concentrating on one detail at a time. Over the years I have noticed that what people think sounds best has much less to do with accuracy than one would think. In some situations "accurate" actually sounds worse! This is very relevant when it comes to room treatment. As always beauty is in the eye of the beholder. A system that "sounds good" playing everything is most likely stamping it's own signature on everything it plays. There are plenty of terrible recordings out there both digital and analog. The vagaries of speaker performance far outweigh any differences between digital and analog playback. The preference of one format over the other is most likely due to other factors besides sound quality. Number one would probably be convenience. Insisting that one format always sounds better than the other. Very few issues are "always." |
I recently went to a direct ethernet connection streaming to my Devialet Expert 400, figuring this is about as good as digital gets, at least for my money. I am delighted I can finally listen to digital as a source instead of just background music. Still, when I play an album on my old VPI HW-19 Mk IV with Eminent Technology 2 tonearm and a Monster Cable Sigma Genesis cartridge, it blows the streaming version out of the water. No contest. I admit I now listen mostly to digital because of its convenience and selection, but when I want to be enveloped by the music, I fire up the turntable. Digital is becoming a closer second, but it is still second. The good news if I don’t know what to expect/listen for, digital sounds great. It’s come a long way since the 80s. |
I suspect youth are a large part of vinyl resurgence. For those who've grown up with digital, vinyl is a novelty. The large format of vinyl, album covers and gatefolds with unique art and words of interest make music contained within more personal and important. I recall these feelings flowing through me from back in the day. Would Sgt Peppers have been so important and magical without all wonderful art and words on cover and gatefold. The large format allowed me to connect and gain insights into artist. I recall gazing upon art and words even as I listened to music, vinyl was a total immersive experience. And then you had the advantage of intrinsic value of vinyl, something to hold and touch, something of value, something to care about. Perhaps all these feelings are what is drawing in new converts to vinyl. And for many of us older audiophiles, the advent of digital and cd's became a novelty. I recall the technical allure of digital, all this convenience, small format perceived as advantage and more magical equipment to purchase and experience, I was all in! And then along comes streaming, wow, the technical allure was even more intriguing for me, so much to learn! Over time as I gained some mastery over this format, I recall the feelings of great accomplishment as so many complex problems were solved. The diy experience of this format has been a great allure for me. And now that I finally have an optimized streaming solution, I'm loving the amazingly wide variety of music available to me from simply pressing buttons on a smartphone device! I've been exposed to far more music than I would have been sticking exclusively to vinyl or cd. I'd have to say streaming has turned me into much more of a music lover than audiophile. Rather ironic a format many think is less emotionally involving and immersive has turned out to be quite the opposite for me. |
@mglik "
To me, it seems strange when auditioning “$100Kish gear, that vinyl doesn’t enter the picture or conversation." Because, from a capability standpoint, vinyl is technologically inferior to digital. Additionally,
So it's not a surprise to me that vinyl wouldn't be a consideration. What is a surprise is that anyone would spend $100K on a system when Revel Salon 2s are only $20K. As for percentages, the most recent stats I saw show vinyl at less than 5% of the market. I think vinyl will follow the trend of other nostalgia and die out when the people who grew up with it are gone. |
dletch2, "Is the screen white when it is off or do I now have Wall color, white, black instead of wall color, black?" If it is about Samsung Frame TV, the screen is black when off, but there is more to it. It does not have to be on the stand. It can be on the wall. It can be programmed with whatever artwork one wants. Some is already in the TV, more can be purchased, or your own artwork/photographs can be used. Screen itself gets a frame, a few colored options. TV turns itself off if there is nobody in the room for some time. My nephew bought it and is very happy with it. That led to me having his previous, perfectly functional 4K TV boxed in the basement. |
