Solo streamer

@rvpiano that’s funny…I’m in the same boat doing the integrated amplifier shootout. Good you were able to get out of that mode. I’m making enjoying the music part of the amp shootout. It’s one of the criteria for me - how engaging it is. Easier said than done once you’ve got the analytical hat on. Nit impossible though 

Spent most of the day listening for sound. Very unfruitful. Ended up not knowing which end was up.
Thankfully, tonight listening to music. Much happier, and really enjoying the sound.
​​​​​.

@ghdprentice 

I’ve thought something like this repeatedly over the fifty years I pursued high end audio, right before upgrading something only to find it sounding much better. It’s one of the reasons this pursuit is so addictive.

Bingo! (Bango Bongo)

@rvpiano you got lucky and maybe got the last piece. They are out of stock and now the shipping happens directly out of Shunyata.

@rvpiano 

There will be some differences and improvements right out of the gate but it really takes at least few days to start appreciating everything thar the new component or cable has to offer. That’s why a quick A/B never works.
Plus you’re dealing with break in. Give it time and enjoy the music. You will know if the new cable is an improvement. 

@audphile1 

Well, after playing all day, it’s breaking in and the true character is starting to emerge. To answer your question, I can tell how the stock cable sounded because it was almost identical to sound of the coax cable which I still have installed.   There are two main differences. The Shunyata sounds fuller and also more detailed.  At this point, the differences aren’t huge, because the stock cable sounded really good.  But, differences there are.  The new one is more focused and clear. 
We’ll see what develops, but I think the Shuniata is a keeper.  I’m liking it more and more as I continue to listen.

@rvpiano what’s it sound like? What are the differences between it and stock cable?

Manu,

Got mine from Music Direct. It arrived two days after ordering. I don’t know what the problem was on your end.

Good luck.

@rvpiano where did you order your Shunyata cable from? I called a couple of sites in the US (Cable Company, Music Direct) - gave me a lead time of 3-4 weeks. I have a friend traveling over to Dubai from NY end of next week- so trying to see if I can snag one for myself.

regards,

Manu

Have to be patient for break-in.  
Hasn’t yet reached or surpassed the magic that was there previously.

Yeah the stock usb is decent. I have been using AQ Diamond and just tried Audience StudioOne. I’m a big fan of Audience cables but the AQ Diamond is excellent as well. In case Shunyata doesn’t work out, some alternatives…

Keep the streamer queue on repeat 24/7 and your news usb cable will be ready to go in about 10 days

Again, preliminary observation:  I’m hearing details I never heard before, but I think the cable has to break in more for me to make a fair assessment of the overall sound.

@ghdprentice 

It’s the Shunyata Gamma USB cable

@audphile1 

I was using the stock USB cable

@rvpiano were you using stock usb cable?

Which level Shunyata USB cable? I assume not Omega… although I am sure that is impressive.

Well, I finally got it close to seven PM
My very first impressions are that, as excellent as it was before, it is better now.
It’s spectacular on pop/rock music. Really unbelievable!
On classical it’s also very impressive but not quite as stunning. I’ve just been listening for a very brief time and I won’t be able to listen again until late tonight as my listening room is also a TV room, and I can’t ban my wife.

Im looking forward to really digging in and I’ll give a more complete report tomorrow. The trick is not to listen hypercritically, but enjoy the music.

Still waiting for delivery.  UPS Stops at 7:00PM.

~” it sounds so good I cannot imagine it sounding better”

I’ve thought something like this repeatedly over the fifty years I pursued high end audio, right before upgrading something only to find it sounding much better. It’s one of the reasons this pursuit is so addictive.

That’s very good to hear.

The set is sounding so good this morning I can’t imagine how a cable is going to make it sound better.

As I commented earlier I replaced mine a few weeks ago and I am still marveling at the improvement. I hope that you have a similar experience. 

The set is sounding so good this morning I can’t imagine how a cable is going to make it sound better.

Sure.  It might take a little while to break in.

Interested in your thoughts. 

Tomorrow, Thursday.

@rvpiano when does the new USB cable arrive? 

@newbee

Thanks for your suggestion and your good wishes.
I had actually forgotten about the Loki. You have a good memory. It was removed years ago because It didn’t get much use at all.
I spoke of the brightness when the Aurender was first installed. I can’t remember it happening lately at all.   The Shunyata cable should enhance the sound even more, I hope.

RV, FWIW, but as I recall, you have a Schiit Loki. A lot of 'brightness' folks seem to complain originates in the upper-mid frequencies, i.e. 1500 to 3000 hz. Mostly on sources. Your complaint seems to be (logically anyway) coming from your sources and/or the recordings).  I think your CJ may have a tape loop. If so I'd suggest that you put the Loki in the loop and when you encounter that brightness flip on the loop switch and fiddle with the 2K knob some and see if the brightness goes away. You could put the Loki between your source and preamp but that is something I'd not  do if I really loved your source. Maybe a better solution, and a lot cheaper anyway, than by shopping other sources or wires which might just bring you different problems. Good luck.

I owned an Aurlic Aries G2 and now several Aurrender. The Aurlic was glitchy in operation and its sound quality at its price point was not up to Aurrender’s lineup. I am constantly surprised at how good Aurrender are and they continue to improve. I have read that the new Aurlic Aries G2.2 has significantly improved sound quality, but I have not heard one. 

The brightness is an issue only very occasionally. I definitely don’t think it warrants a new DAC. Most of the time the balance is excellent. I’m replacing the stock USB cable with the Shunyata Gamma USB cable to remedy any remaining issues.

I haven’t heard the OP DAC but had some time with an earlier Benchmark DAC that I thought was fantastically detailed but bright, especially with my B&W 803D speakers.  Perhaps the upgraded streamer is bringing some of that out.

  It might be worth trying DACs from a different manufacturer but perhaps in the same price range as his current DAC

I used to have Auralic Aries G1. Never compared it with Aurender though but compared it with Lumin U1 Mini. 
Auralic sounded slightly tipped up in treble. It’s Roon ready but despite the slightly forward sound I preferred the Auralic Lightning DS over how it sounded with Roon(smoother but duller as well). It’s not a bad streamer with a nice UI that was a bit buggy. Lumin U1 Mini sounded smoother and was solid as a rock when it comes to operation. Eventually when I got the Bricasti M3 with network card I couldn’t tell the two streamers apart and sold the Lumin. 
I would rank Aurender at the top. Never tried innuos and have no idea how it sounds. Reviews are positive and owners love their innuous streamers. 

Does anyone has experience with Auralic products? And possibly compare to Aurender and Innous products?

@rvpiano the DAC3 must be darn good, it is letting you hear how special the Aurender N200 is. I'm interested in your thoughts on the new USB cable. I'm happy with the lowly Supra 2.0. I'll probably weaken and try their upmarket Excalibur one day. 

Thanks,

aldnorab 

@audphile1 

Thanks for that.  
‘you’re right!

@rvpiano stay with what sounds best to you. If you don’t hear anything that bothers you, just enjoy the music. 
There’s almost always a domino effect with each upgrade. If you can mitigate thar, you’re in a good place!

I believe the DAC3 and the N200 have excellent synergy, despite the deprecating comments.

@lalitk Most of these comparisons were completed on my reference system over the last 2-3 years, which is pretty much up to date on my virtual systems page, aside from additional accessories and tweaks that have been added since:

https://www.audiogon.com/systems/11410

DACs used are primarily the T+A SDV 3100 HV and the T+A DAC 200.

With the analog output series, I tested all A200, A15, A20 and A30 all with their DACs to preamps as well as DACs as preamps going straight into the amplifier.

Other amplifiers I swap in from time to time are Cambridge Audio EDGE M monoblocks, the T+A S10 Hybrid Tube Stereo Amplifier, and the T+A R 2500 R and Aurender AP20 all in ones. I have a few others on the floor, but they don't nearly get as much play time.

If you just listen to the music, the N200 exists in pretty rarefied air.

“whereas the jump to from the N200 to the N20 is fairly substantial”
@blisshifi 

For our readers, please outline the downstream DAC and rest of the system used for this comparison. Thank you! 

I do also agree that the N200 is worthy of a DAC $5K+. This is what I mentioned at the very beginning of this thread (not the $5K, but that this may result in the search for a better DAC). I’ve seen this journey pan out so many times with my clientele, it doesn’t surprise me anymore. :)

@lalitk I agree between the N20 and N30SA but I’ve spent time with all of the analog output series DACs except for the new A1000, and I heard pretty big steps between the A200, A15, and A20. You have experience with the dedicated streamers, so likely you know the improvement of the N150 to the N200 is there, and worthwhile, whereas the jump to from the N200 to the N20 is fairly substantial, with the N20 adding richness, density, refinement etc. With the analog output series, the DAC and analog stage play a large part in the overall performance, and while synergy in the combined unit is very good across all products offered, the performance gains are notable and audible. Depending on the system it’s going in, results may vary.

“The difference is pretty substantial, sonically.”
@blisshifi

I respectfully beg to differ. For example, the difference between N20 and N30SA were subtle at best. They were compared in my system for extended period of time with DAC’s that costing $45K and $30K respectively. These are my findings and others may disagree and that’s ok.

Staying the course (n200) and finding a competent DAC is not a viable option for @rvpiano unless he is willing to spend upwards of $5K in DAC’s. I am now going to sit back and watch OP’s journey :-)

@lalitk The difference is pretty substantial, sonically. I don’t think the A200 would deliver any better than what he’s got going now. The DAC3 is a good DAC at its price point, and the N200 is a more transparent and engaging streamer than what is in the A200. 

Overall, Aurender’s analog output units (with DACs built in) are an attractive way to have a single box for digital, but being the critical listener that I am, I think there are better solutions out there to solve for what the OP wants to accomplish. The DAC in the A15 is quite good, but very linear and detailed, much like a Mola Mola Tambaqui, vs focusing on the natural harmonics and refinement that makes music emotional and tangible. This is not a criticism so much on the Aurender, as the A15 is an incredible value as a combo. It’s basically the $6,300 N200 paired with a ~$3,500 DAC. The $15K A20 is much more realistic sounding, in my opinion, as it should be given almost double the price, and I have a high affinity to that.

My suggestion would be to stay the course with the N200 and find the right digital chain to complement. I think of it as matching a phono stage to a cartridge. The N200 is a stellar source, and the DAC needs to complement the N200 in ways the rest of his system can benefit from. 

@blisshifi 

Thanks for chiming in…..on a scale of 1-10, where would you rate A15 vs A200. Given @rvpiano system, I suspect he is likely to hear appreciable differences between A15 vs A200.

I have gone through 5 different models of Aurender ($2300 -$24k) over last 10 years and all streamers (transport) from N150 to N30SA are built to very high standards. I recognize the subjective nature of our hobby, no two systems are alike and then there is room acoustics and end user listening skills. My experience lead me to conclude that the differences in streamers are subtle at best and degree of separation between streamers is greatly dependent on external DAC and rest of your system. 

At OP’s price point of $2K - DAC, I believe A200 represents a great value and performance and alleviates him from the headaches of auditioning DAC’s for minimal gain, especially at his price point < $2500. 
 

@rvpiano or anyone else is free to choose the best path as there so many different ways to accomplish a good sounding streaming setup without loosing your sanity :-)

I just ordered a Shunyata USB cable that my dealer says will improve the brightness problem.  Hopefully it will and I’ll have no need for a different DAC.  

I mostly love the sound of the N200 the way it is.

I like separate streamers and DACs for the same reasons I like separate preamps and amps.   
 

The N200 is an awesome machine , you should have no regrets     Enjoy until you can really better the Benchmark because it is a good DAC.  It will also be 2x what the DAC 3 goes for …..  Enjoy it and only replace it if you can do a home demo and it is far beyond a lateral move when you do. 

Noting that you had a Gungnir in the past, I recently upgraded to a Merason from my Gungnir, it has been a positive experience. Also noting the comment upgrading digital cable, I just replaced my Transparent USB with a WireWorld Platinum, a very significant upgrade. I owned a Benchmark preamp, and liked it, but it might be worth sampling another DAC vendor. 

I know I mentioned “best under $15K”, but many of the DACs I mention make models in the $4-7K range that are worth considering. Not inexpensive as you just paid a good amount for your streamer, but it’s something to consider as you move forward in your journey.

@blisshifi 

Thank you so much for your detailed reply.  I don’t want to break the bank with a DAC , so it’s a difficult choice.