Pass labs krell parasound amps

Interesting thread. I can also vouch for Pass. previously had a Classe and now own a XA25. Built like a tank but sounds like silk. Very fluid, non fatiguing. I am intrigued by the Coda 8 after reading about the shared experience. Not sure I would venture with Krell right now. My cents!

In terms of design, component and build quality I too would have to give the checked flag to PASS LABS (Nelson Pass "FIRST WATT")

If a tube amp, was your preference then the award would go to AYON for the same reasons. Performance in both cases would excel, paired with virtually any of the top-ranking loudspeakers, both past and present,

The other amplifiers you have mentioned, and also several that you have not mentioned would fall closely in line, especially if your budget has limitations.

Another aspect that I rarely see mentioned is resale value. You rarely see a PASS LABS amplifier or other component on the used market. That in itself, says a great deal about NELSON PASS'S designs. Furthermore, you almost never see any of the PASS LABS products obsoleted or updated. They remain a standard year after year. If you have the funds, hopefully this will help in the decision making. 

I would also lean in the direction of a pair of monoblocs and their top tier preamp (That's if I could afford it)

One final passing comment; - - - Quite recently, based on performance for the buck, I recommended to a close friend, a pair of PARASOUND monoblocs and their top tier preamp. Paired with DYNAUDIO "SPECIAL FOURTY" Floor standers. After 30 days his appraisal was absolutely, and totally " incredible realistic sound."

My friend also happens to be a musician.

And much less expensive!

            .

Parasound JC 5 is the best bet for you imo 

I don't think enough people have heard it so the comments here are not in line with its value ... and it's definitely not an A21, far superior 

@invalid Yep.  They were ranked as one of the ten most influential amplifier designs of all time.  I don't really compare mine to anything else - I am just deliriously happy.with it.  I also use it to drive KEF Reference 1 speakers.

My Krell replaced a Quad 100-Watt 405-2 which uses a very clever design where a small class A amplifier "tops up" a beefier amplifier.  This idea was later used by Devaliet.  Peter Walker of Quad defined a perfect amplifier as "a straight wire with gain".

The KRELL DUO amps are ugly as sin, but I would love to have one again since they sound so good.

@richardbrand I'll bet it's more than 80 watts into 8ohm, most manufacturers that claim this doubling underrate the 8ohm measurement, still the krell ksa amps are as close as you can get to a perfect voltage source.

@richardbrand I bet they are good! And i also bet some people find them beautiful. 

@gano Krell were first to introduce beauty in the form of blue power-on LEDs.  My KSA-80 with its massive external fins protruding way beyond the facia must be the ugliest of all!  While it is rated at only 80-Watts into eight Ohms, this doubles for 4 Ohms and again for 2 Ohms where it is rated 320 Watts RMS per channel.  For decades I used it to power Quad ESL-63 and ESL-2509 electrostatics which protect themselves from over-high input voltages by presenting as a short-circuit to the amplifier.  I tried powering them with a Luxman valve amp, but it put out high voltage spikes when switching on, which caused the speakers to clamp.  Could never get the amp and the speakers to be powered up at the same time!  No such issue with the Krell.

I'm using a Coda #8 V1. I was using it with a Holo Audio Serene KTE preamp with excellent results but now have it paired with a new BAT VK-80 Tube preamp. It's a magical pairing especially with my Magnepan speakers! The V1 amp has heatsinks for a 400-watt amp (Very cool running) but is a 150-watt Class A/B with the first 18 watts Class A and a 10-year warranty and 5-year transferable warranty. 40 output transistors, 150 AMPS peak current and a massive 3Kva toroidal transformer. The amplifier can be upgraded by Coda free of charge (Minus shipping costs) to a V2 at 250 watts into 8 ohms or a V3, 400 watts into 8 ohms. All these power levels Double into 4 ohms. Highly recommended amp.

totally subjective but

when I look at Krell, i always think that they made it look so ugly ON PURPOSE  to challenge their buyers to get over the aesthetics and just focus on the sound.

It must sound incredible if people still buy them despite their looks. 

All of the amps that you and others have mentioned are great choices. I’ve had Pass Labs and now I’m using Krell. The Krell that I’m currently using is the Evolution 302e. It sounds very different to the previous Krell’s, even different than the non “e” evo’s, and closer to the Pass X series that I’ve owned. Which is better? That’s a matter of taste as they’re all extremely capable amps. The newer Bryston amps like the 4B SST3 are also very good. I was actually surprised at how good it sounded as I had owned an SST which wasn’t as good as my old Aragon 4004mkii. You get that awesome Bryston warranty as well. I’ve seen lots of love for Coda but have yet to listen to one. I also have a First Watt F3 which is excellent but it tends to run out of juice (18w iirc) when I get the urge to rock out 

i own the Krell Illusion pre along with the Krell Duo 300xd with the ibias tech

and the fans in the back never come on no matter how hard i am driving them

I usually listen to them at low volume with great reasults as they run Class A up trough there power curve due to the ibias tech I also use all Sil-tech cables for my interconnects and speakers I would think if you found a used Duo 300xd i would not pass it up 

I went from Pass to Coda to Parasound and finally settled on the original Parasound A21 (better than A21+ BTW) as my preferred amp for my separates (I actually prefer a Yamaha integrated to all of them but that’s largely a speaker synergy thing).

The Pass I owned was the XA25. A very nice sounding amp but simply didn’t have enough juice for my stable of speakers.

Subsequent to the XA25, I tried the Coda No.8 V1. It’s also a nice amp—very quiet and resolving and a little all around superior to the XA25. It would’ve been perfect had it been able to give me the same “effortless” presentation the Parasound does.

The Parasound is the warmest of those 3, but still decently resolving and sounds the least taxed at spirited volumes. Pairing the original A21 with a highly transparent preamp and source goes a long way in offsetting its otherwise dark character.

If the JC5 merely sounds like a better A21 (though it is arguably inferior in bench tests), then I think it would be an excellent choice if the other sides of your chain are highly resolving, which your speakers are IME.

I haven’t heard the MC312 specifically, but if it sounds similar to other modern MACs, I would save some cash and simply opt for the JC5.

Perhaps a better option would be to get a Levinson amp to pair with your preamp and keep it in the Harman family.

JC5, have owned a number of good amps..... this is fantastic for the money,  slightly used. ...it can be had for $5k or less.  of course it doesn't have the "NAME" of PASS etc.   but I'm talking about bottom end "sound quality", controlled bass, imaging, etc.     and built VERY well indeed.   run it with REVEL's and it is awesome.

I currently have 250 wpc and previous levinson Amp was 300. I like having the headroom and not strain the Amp like I did with a Rotel with 200wpc. To each his own but I play a little loud at times. I like to feel the music.  

250 watts is perfect for me. 

Curious why you think you need 250-300 watts? Your speakers are 90db efficiency.  I would think a high current 100watt amp would be more than you would ever need. 

For the same price, I would go with the Moon

Piebaldpython. I don't think my rack will hold the weight of the 350.8 or it could be an option. Thanks 

An extra thousand should get you a X350.8 used if not a bit less but when the deal pops up it will go quickly. Many have reported the 350 superior in many ways to the 250. I have the 350

@dcclone Krell = Krona?

I am very happy with my old Krell KSA-80 which has needed a couple of repairs over the decades.  Class A with no power saving gimmicks.  Good room heater!

Thanks for the input. I think I have narrowed down between the Pass Labs x250.8 and the Simaudio Moon 870a as both have great reviews and power range I'm needing between 250-300 wpc. Although the Mcintosh is interesting.  

@testpilot I am sorry to say that I have not got the opportunity to listen to the new XD series. In Sweden there is no hifi dealers that have them for demo so there is no chance to listen before buying and it is to much money to just buy without having the chance to evaluate. Krell had a "dark" period, I think it is after the Evolution series, with some series of, according to me, bad quality and sound. I am reffering to some KAV products and multichannel gear. I believe they now are back on track with the XD and i series. I prefer my older gear even if the are enormously powerhungry and gets hot because they work in class A and, my Infinitys sounds wonderful and needs huge class A amps. One must be aware of that they all need a recap and renovation but with that done they will sound amazing for another 25-30 years.

@dclone , have you tried any of the more current Krell products?  Most of your Krell products were made in Krell’s heyday period some 20+ years ago.  

@jl35 I haven’t had the opportunity of trying out Pass amps in my set up.  Their reputation though is stellar.  Nelson is a legendary designer that uses high quality parts with top notch engineering.  If you like their sound signature, hard to go wrong with Pass.

Parasound, I’ve had the A21 in my set up.  The A21 + is a great value, punches above its weight class for sure, not really in the same league as Pass, Krell or Coda which was referenced in the thread. 
 

I had a Coda CSiB integrated that I was able to compare to both the Krell 300i integrated and the Krell 300XD Duo amp.  The Coda was fantastic, uses the 8’s amp section.  The Krell XD gear has a magic, liquidity, sweetness to the sound while maintaining the drive, control over the speaker that made Krell legendary.  Important to clarify it’s their latest XD gear.  That said, their co-founder, Dan’s ex wife recently passed away, Krell’s future is a little cloudy.  
 

I recently brought a Coda 07x Pre into my system, had me thinking about replacing my Krell amp with either the 8 or 16.  Reached out to Coda to see which amp would be comparable to the 300XD and they said the 16 was the amp to look at.  My thought process was as good as the Krell sounds would the Coda Pre sound even better with a Coda amp.

For my system, the Krell is special, to my ears bested Coda and Parasound.  Build quality, parts used, Pass or Coda is likely a bit better though I’ve never compared them on that level.  The Coda 16 is likely a game changer, beast that should deliver the best of SS with some of the attributes those who favor tubes.  If it’s me, I’d take a long look at Coda, if I could find a good deal on a used Krell 300xd or the integrated 300i I wouldn’t to hesitate to jump on either.  Good Luck!  

@dclone I have to agree on the krell 300s, I have one and it was too bright until I put a good tube preamp in front of it.

I have had Pass Labs, Parasound, a lot of Adcoms, Gryphon, Classé and probably some more. Then I discovered Krell for about 20 years ago. Started with KSA 150 then five more KSA 150 (have a total of six), one KSA 250, two FPB 300cx and four KAS2 monoblocks. I also have had Krell 300S but that was a short visit in my house. The Krell S series sound does not suite me. I only use Krell preamps like KCT, a couple of KRC-HR, KRC 3, KSP 7B etc. My speakers are solely old Infinitys IRS series (Beta and Epsilon) and RS Kappa series (a couple of Kappa 9 and 8) They are hard to drive but my Krells that I use every day have absolutely no problems with them. The sound is warm, detailed and the Krells can deliver very much power. Very important is that the Krells manage to sound warm, detailed etc even at low volumes with my speakers. I think they are the only ones of all poweramps that have manage to do that. For my main system I use four Krell KAS2 monblocks, second system I use two FPB 300cx, third, fourth system is different combinations KSA poweramps. (bi and tri-amping. I used to have a pair of Revels, dont remember which ones, medium size and price, and every single one of my Krell poweramps (except the S series) handled those easily. Probably nothing wrong with Krells S series but I found those to analytic and lacking a bit of "warmth". Within Your budget I would go for a pair of freshly recapped Krell FPB 750 MCX. I hardly think You will be disappointed. Good luck! (I have absolutely no interests in the Krell brand or company. I am a Swedish lawyer who just love the sound of Krells)

Of what you listed I would choose Pass labs.  Excellent products and support.

I moved from a Benchmark AHB2 to an Accuphase P4600. Yes the Benchmark had a sharpness in the lower treble but also a powerful base. It’s still a real bargain if paired with the right speakers that are very warm. Even with my Harbeths I still found it a little too cold for my taste The Accuphase is just very musical, live and refined. But expensive. If Accuphase is in your price range please audition. Plus their Class AB amps run only slightly warm. 

Personally, I would stay away from Krell until they get their house in order due to the loss of one of their founders.

Pass and Parasound are bullet proof with excellent customer service.  I have no experience with Mac.

Nelson Pass has a long history of designing reliable  & wonderful amps.  I owned a 
Threshold 4000 for 25 years before selling it and buying the X250.8.  Yes, they run hot & yes, the X250.8 does have the "Pass " sound, which makes it very easy to enjoy and live with.  Once you own it I cannot imagine an unhappiness UNLESS you are one who continues to compare A to B....on its own it is great....additionally, you will be hard pressed to find a company with better customer service, though I doubt you will ever need it...

@OP. The X250.8 is a great amp. It should work well with your Levinson pre.

One other brand worth looking at is Sim Moon which might fit your sonic preferences well.

McIntosh and Pass will both work well with your Revels. I had the 228be’s with both. I switched from Mac C53/MC312 combo to Pass XP32/X260.8 monos, mostly out of curiosity. The Mac gear is no slouch, despite a lot of haters out there. It is powerful, quiet, accurate, well built, and runs cool.

As others have stated, Pass has more depth, warmth, liquidity, better bass, and is less fatiguing. There is a slight lack of openness to the X-series which you should consider, however. There are always tradeoffs---the slightly veiled aspect of Pass is probably what makes it so easy to listen to for hours on end--it’s never bright or etched. This is particularly meaningful to me as I listen to a lot of Blue Note jazz. Pass takes the edge off. Running Mac, I had more days when I was one (side of music) and done. With Pass, I’m always tempted to play more---that matters.

I nearly went with the X250.8, but decided on monos. They run very warm as will the X250.8.

I am going to throw in Schiit Tyr based on others reports.

Pass, hands down.

Remember that Pass is MOSFET which is a closest solid state to tubes. It does have nice ’house’ sound which is on a warmer (just a little bit) side. There is also Accuphase which may be regular or Class A MOSFET, like Pass.

Coming recently from a Benchmark AHB2 with the same speakers that did that “screech” very often. 

I’ve had Parasound A21, Krell 250s, and now have a Pass XA30.5. Different speakers for all 3 so grain of salt. The 30.5 is the most satisfying amp I’ve owned. Krell and Parasound were both also really good but the Pass is just so liquid but still very dynamic! Ever get that screech from your speakers that’s piercing and hurts your ears? It’s like the Pass is incapable of doing that for me with these speakers. 

Pass gear has a natural, warm and laid back sound. You can listen to your system for hours without any fatigue. Soundstage is big but accurate.
Nothing is without compromise and Pass is no exception. It’s not going to have the surgical precision, separation, bite and dynamics. It’s not analytical. It’s going to make even less than perfectly recorded music very palatable and enjoyable.

It’s been a while since I heard a Krell amp so I won’t even assume what that particular amp sounds like.

However, one amplifier you should add to your list is Coda No.8. It has the warmth of Class A but is a more articulate and accurate than Pass without being fatiguing. It will also cost less than the X250.8

You can’t go wrong with either Coda or Pass. And yes customer support is excellent with both (Krell is not in a steady state yet after the passing of the owner).

I would not consider McIntosh - just personal preference as to me both Pass and Coda sound superior.

Pass Labs amps are incredibly reliable ( I have owned 4 the past 20 years), including the great sounding X250.8 .... they also offer great customer service - typically you will speak with a very knowledgeable person within a minute or two...