Paradigm Persona series

Just reread my post and would like to apologize for my analogy lol...had a few beers.

The Personas were toed in but even if they were not properly spaced I should not be able to detect the crossover between the midrange and tweeter. As far as cables go, they were probably just using some run of the mill Monster wires. The source was off the guy’s phone streamed to the Mcintosh integrated amp. Maybe I am not a fan of Mcintosh. You know David Belles is right down the road I should see if he would be willing to loan and integrated amp to this store. I actually have yet to hear one of his amps but they have a small following.

On a side note, Audio Doctor I checked out your website and see you cary Exposure amps. I am a huge fan of their sound signature and I was wondering if you have had any experience with the difference between the 3010s2 and 3010s2D?

I love the Belles stuff.  For SS gear Belles is at a great price point and punch high.  Aesthetix gear is like that too in the Tube range (that new integrated is a game changer for tube gear in that price range).  

The new Ayre 8 Series stuff is just unbelievable for the cost.  Real meat on the bones and plenty of the Ayre micro and macro detail.  

Sorry to go on, but this is some of the new stuff I've really liked a ton.  The Ayre stuff is sick if you go afford it even withe a stretch.  

Heard the Persona 9's again at a dealer who has them set up in a great room and with top gear.  They sounded the best I've ever heard them sound.  They are still way too top heavy for my tastes, but I see why many like them.  

My experience trying to put together a greater sounding stereo has pretty much mirrored what audiotroy talks about. I don’t dispute their reality I just don’t like it because I cannot afford to play there. I had hoped that using audiogon and patience I would be able to assemble a class a system for a fraction of the cost. Unfortunately AT is spot on when they say you can’t buy a bunch of components that get great reviews and count on great sound, for me now it’s the chicken or the egg? Do I buy an amp/ pre amp and find speakers that like them? Wtf, seriously. I’m interested in great music not fancy boxes. There’s a lot of companies offering active speakers and to audiotroys analogy when you buy a Porsche it already has a sota tranny, tires, suspension, etc they don’t bankrupt you and then say what did you expect your garage doesn’t have a lift! I know they didn’t make the model but they support it.

Steve, this is one reason why we should rely on brick and mortar guys.  Even guys who sell out of their homes, like AT does.  It's important that we know what goes good together.  Most folks listen blindly to what folks tell them and chase their tails.  They aren't confident in their own ears or they aren't out listening to a lot of other gear.  When I go to audition for real, I use a paper and pen either during or afterwards.  I make copious notes as I can't remember if I don't.  use the same recordings that you personally bring in.  That way you can make notes about the same portions and then you will at least be closer than if you go by memory.

The best dealers I know as well as the top audio companies who I know well say the same things about system building.

Both ends are equally important.  The end product will only play what it's fed and how it's fed.  As good a source as you can buy is best.  Then the second for me is the preamp.  It's not a control unit.  It's the heart of the sound.  Most speakers will scale pretty high, so you can go a line lower if needed in order to get the best pre you can afford...Then it's the speaker and last the amp.  Teh cables etc... aren't for fine tuning IMHO.  They are the last part of the process (and important), but you can have a great system with mid level cables and cords if you have to.  

If you need to 'fine tune' with cables, then you've done something wrong in putting the system together.  

Again, it's my opinion.  If you are close to AT, then go to the other stores in NJ as well as some in NYC. You will figure out who you like best as well as what you like best.  If there is a speaker that you fall in love with, don't think it will sound just as good if you use the lesser pre or amp or source.  It won't adn you may not be happy adn will chase the tail.  

All just my opinion of course.

you start with the speakers always with the speakers first

...The reason we start with the speaker is because it will determine the electronics,

Amplifier choice forces speaker choice. Speaker choice forces amplifier choice.  Either way is instructive yet limiting. What's the difference? 

(This is generally directed, not at you specifically audiotroy) 

David Ten, the only way you start with the amplifier first is if you are in love with an amplifier that you allready own and have to then go the backwards route of finding a set of speakers that will work optimally in the room with that amp.

We start with the speaker selection first as the speakers are based on room size, output spl required, finish, physical size, asthestic design, of course sound quality.

So we start our clients with the speaker selection first then move to the electronics, then digtial.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ

The problem with the typical B&M is price. I'm not going to spsnd hours of their time learning whats what only to buy everything used on AG. but if I buy new i'll have to settle. 3f instead of the 7. f228be instead of the salon2. Yes a dealer can make the more affordable system ferform at its best but it disregards the val,ue of AG and buying used.

@audiotroy   

We start with the speaker selection first as the speakers are based on room size, output spl required, finish, physical size, asthestic design, of course sound quality.

All of the above remain the same whether starting out amplifier first, or not. 

It doesn't answer the question of why speakers first (over amplification).

Do others have perspective on incontrovertible reasons / rationale on why speakers first (over amplification)?

David here is the rationale.

Loudspeaker choice is determined by a few factors:

1: Room size the larger the physical amount of air to be moved the larger the loudspeakers need to be, ie small room, small speaker, medium room medium sized loudspeaker, big room big speaker and gigantic room really big speakers. For the medium to large room a set of subwoofers may augment the mains in place of larger displacement woofers, subs pro and con are another discussion.

2: Physical look: for many people especially with a signfiigent other, the look color, size, shape, wood or painted finish may be part of that factor

3: SPL requirements: There are gigantic loudspeakers that don't play that loud for their size and smaller speakers that will play very loud, so it all matters to the design, efficiency and power handling/heat dissipation of the drive units.

4: Bass output, midrange flavoring, or treble clarity, ie loudspeaker voicing is strongly dependent of the overall design

5: Imaging abilities: some loudspeakers image better than others.

Therefore the loudspeaker has way more variables in terms of finding the right loudspeaker than the electronics do.

We will say that finding the right matching electronics to a particular set of loudspeakers will require auditioning a number of amplifiers, then cabling and source interactions until the system comes alive but again, it is much easier to schlep in an amplifier or dac then to physically move large speakers in and out of your home.

Therefore for all of these reasons we recommend that when someone is starting this jorney the loudeakers come first as the initial decision.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ

Agree with the "pick speakers first" advice. So much more variability with speakers and resulting in so much greater sound presentation differences with speakers versus anything else.

It takes a long time to do it right because you need to listen to a lot of different speakers, narrow it down to a couple, and then ideally listen to those couple on different styles of amplifier (tubes, solid state, hybrid, separates vs integrated) - not necessarily specific brands of amplification at this point (unless you have tons of time), styles is good enough to pick the speakers.

Once you pick the speakers, then dive into the amplification revisiting types and specific brands. By then hopefully you’ve got the speakers in-house, and easier to bring home a couple of amps to demo than transporting speakers (which I guess was already mentioned just agreeing).

All that said, often plays out differently in real life, especially if you don’t have unlimited resources to make all purchases at once. In my case, I got an unexpected fantastic deal on an integrated amp that was so much better than I could have expected for price range I knew I’d be in that I acquired integrated amp first. Although I did get to extensively hear a 1.5 hr demo of the amp with the eventual speakers that I’d end up getting before purchasing the amp, and even then I knew those speakers would probably be the ones (had probably heard 10 speakers by that point), though still ended up doing months of demo’ing of at least a dozen further speakers above and below in cost to cement the speaker choice.

Bottom line is that it's still all a system and needs to be chosen as a system.  Regardless if you chose a speaker or source first, you need to set a legit budget and figure out where to spend it.  

I have spent a lot of time with a few high end manufacturers recently and they all said the same thing.  A good line of speakers will scale.  Way too many people purchase a speaker that is one above what they probably need and don't have the budget for the better source which is where it all starts.  Preamp is next in the electronics jungle and then amp.  

Begin with the most you can afford and then end with the best your budget will allow, but make sure you have enough for a great pre and then amp.  

If you like Vandersteen, Magico, Wilson, B&W, ML, Maggies or whatever, then go with that line, but if you are going to spend a lot more on one part of the chain, do it at the source is what most are saying.  Most folks don't get to hear the lower price in the line with better source and maybe even a step up in electronics (over what they would be left to afford if they buy the next speaker up in a line).

AT, I agree with your speaker thoughts for the most part.  That said, I was at a dealer last week who had Wilson Alexia's in a small bedroom and they sounded incredible.  Overkill?  Of course, but with the door open it didn't even have a standing wave problem.  Had a pair of large ML's in another bedroom and I was shocked at how good it sounded.  It just proved that you can get great sound with varying size speakers in most listening rooms if you set them up properly.  He did it to prove a point.  

Good thread. 

@audiotroy @kren0006 Thank you for your detailed responses. I appreciate them.

However, I still don’t find (in your posts) convincing rationale that points to and informs the necessity and importance (and criticality) of speaker first over amplification, or any other major component, for that matter.

I understand that the majority of audiophiles fall into (practice) the speaker first camp, but so far (based on the above posts) it seems more about comfort level, familiarity, history and preference rather than specific deal breakers should one choose not to go with a speaker first approach.

Audiotroy’s point on the hassle factor relating to speaker size (unpacking/repacking, movement, positioning, shipping costs, etc.) is certainly a factor, though one focused on convenience (and not a disqualifier).

I think the point about cubic feet, and room acoustics is valid and waf. But I think if somebody’s in deep with a mark levinson or any other ‘premium ‘ brand i would definitely avoid starting over. Thats where audiotroy just plows straight ahead, they talk like the average audiophile has unlimited funds and to that logic everything else they say makes perfect sense. Why they preach it so furiously on a used gear forum is probably why they get a bit of attitude from time to time. 

I had a chance to listen to the Persona 7F for a little while today, playing some audiophile-approved tracks.

Yeah, those speakers just leave me cold.   They certainly can sound clear especially in the high frequencies.  But overall I had the same impression as the last audition - they just don't sound timbrally organic or convincing to me.   Everything sounds "canned" or slightly glazed, and when I close my eyes there are all sorts of "clear/clean" sounding acoustic objects presented to me, guitar, drums, percussion, etc.  But they have the same grayish tonal "color" and my mind has to really work to untangle one instrument timbrally from the other.

A competent speaker, and I understand anyone else enjoying it, but my subjective reaction is just..."meh."

@prof  Excellent description!  Aligns exactly with what I heard/how I felt when auditioning the 5's.
Also, though to a lesser extent, applicable to my impression of the Dynaudio Contour 60.

twoleftears,
*bro fist*

@prof  What's up with the masochism? Despite the ongoing protestations, is it that you enjoy the self torture? : )

It's abundantly clear these speakers are not for you. The repeated insistence appears more an imposition and declaration of your experience as primary and superior to that of others. 

david_ten

I'm just fascinated with speakers.   When the opportunity arises to listen to a high end speaker, I take it, even if I've heard it before.

I'd been seriously considering the Persona's early on, with a somewhat positive first encounter (though with caveats), so I gave them another audition not long ago and it gave me a better handle on my feelings about them.   Though I noticed things in the last audition - e.g. about the tone - that didn't stick out the first time.  This was another opportunity to see how they sound in a different set up, powered with different amps etc, as another data point.  It solidified some of my impressions, and since this is the Paradigm Persona thread, and we audiophiles like to talk about our speaker experiences, I'll report mine in a thread like this.

And nothing I've said - zero! - implies my experience is "superior or primary" to anyone else's.  In fact I have been careful to say it's clearly my own subjective reaction.  The speakers leave ME cold, and TO MY ears they sounded X.   I clearly stipulated this was my SUBJECTIVE reaction, rather than just declaring some objective condemnation, like a number of audiophiles tend to do.    I said, as I've said before about the Persona series, I understand why  OTHER PEOPLE like them.   So I have no idea why you are imagining otherwise.

Prof, 

Again we get that these speakers aren't for you, but have to ask what was the gear, electronics and source driving them?

We have found that with the right electronics and digital the speakers can sound extraordinary, but with the wrong gear they are not going to be a good sounding speaker, 

The Paradigms are very particular in what you use them with, we have found using them with warmer electronics, and or a dac will bring them alive.

Based on your previous likes with Devores which are very organic but highly colored loudspeakers we would think that you would not find the Personas to your taste.

It is like the Vandersteen or Harbeth guys, they are not going to like a Rockport, or  a Persona. 

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ Persona dealers

Yes I know audiotroy. As I said, I disagree. I’ve heard the Persona’s in 4 different set ups now, all different gear, and a speaker’s "personality" does not radically change (unless you put some incredibly colored tube amp on it or something).


They are really excellent speakers. But this is a thread in which to discuss them, and if I have further encounters or thoughts, I post them.  If you think for some strange reason I’m posting too many comments on them, compare the number of your posts continually extolling your opinion, vs my meager contribution ;-)


And btw I don’t just like "colored" speakers (and the Persona’s certainly aren’t the most neutral measuring speakers out there - that top end peak!). I also love the Joseph Audio speakers which, especially the Pulsar, measure more neutral than the Persona floor standing speakers.


I was a fan of Dunlavy, again measured very neutral. I also own Waveform speakers (very neutral), Thiel, even the Harbeth SuperHL5 plus I owned and enjoyed, and despite some like to disparage their cabinet design, JA said of the measurements: "measured performance is beyond reproach." And an Aussie mag stated they had the most evenly balanced frequency range from bottom to top than they’d ever measured. And to me even those made instruments and voices sound significantly more natural to me. (Again, I don’t make any claim that anyone else should feel the same).


And of course I’ve heard a great many other speakers that measure everywhere from colored to extremely neutral. So I have a pretty good yardstick.


It’s ok if someone doesn’t fall in love with the Persona’s. It really is :-)

@david_ten ,

That's cool, to each his/her own.  I wasn't trying to convince you. 

I was just saying that I think in ideal world better to get speakers first, if possible, although I didn't do it that way either for various reasons.  Maybe the next time I go through the ordeal I will try to follow my own advice, haha.

Cheers

AT, you are very wrong about VAndy guys not liking some of the Rockport speakers.  I've heard the Personas many many times with great gear.  They are tipped up on the high end and even dealers who sell many have said the same.  That's the sound that you are selling and many are buying and enjoying.  There' room for everyone.

That said, someone I know has a pair of Rockport Lyra's paired with over 400k worth of source, electronics, cords, cables etc...  They sounded very inviting with the reel to reel.  They weren't fatiguing in teh way the Persona's are to MY ears.  Do I still like Vandersteen's Sub Nine system with his own amps?  Yes, I do especially when paired with the Ayre KXR preamp or the Audio Research pre or the D'Agastino pre.  

What you have to realize is that many of us enjoy a specific speaker line or two, but can still enjoy a different flavor of sound.  I just don't like things that fatigue me and hurt my ears (not picking on the Paradigm's, just that type of sound in general).  Heck, I love the Harbeth's.  Can enjoy them all day long, but they don't do many things that I need on a daily basis when spending this kind of money.  JMHO 

@djverne

According to the NRC anechoic measurements the Persona’s 7 inch midrange starts beaming around 1500hz. The driver is crossed over at 2K. The Harman anechoic chamber also measured a sound power drop of about 5db in the 1.5-2k range in their measurements of the Persona.

https://www.soundstagenetwork.com/images/stories/loudspeakermeasurements/paradigm_persona_b/fr_456075.gif

A lot of companies won’t mate a 1" tweeter with a large woofer because of the directivity issues it causes.

This graph is of the bookshelf B model. Are there measurements of the larger models available somewhere?

I could be wrong but I thought the mid and tweeter were the same thru out the range? same with the front baffleAre we still talking about these speakers? They HAVE to be something special for all the attention they get.

They are the same except for the bookshelf Persona, as it has to act as a mid bass and not just a midrange.  The crossover points on some of the various models are a little different as well.

As I always say, anyone who thinks negatively (usually aggressively negative) of the Personas has heard them set up terribly, or are just against the Paradigm name.

Although there are also a group of industry people who are competing with Paradigm who troll the forums and create false negative buzz intentionally. 
I pity people who have not experienced the Personas properly.  

Contuzzi,

I feel strongly that you are way off base.  We all hear differently and therefore enjoy different speakers and gear.  

I get sick of hearing about terrible sets up, poor sounding rooms etc... I've heard them set up in very good to poor rooms and always with good gear from all of the top manufacturers.  I hear a fatiguing speaker as do many listeners and lot's of them don't ever post on Internet boards.  Even a few of their dealers feel the same way privately, but Paradigm is a larger company who does extensive marketing so they sell a lot of it.  

I'm also not competing with anything or anyone.  When the grandiose claims kept being made by a dealer who posts on anything he sells (the boards are his main source of advertising), I called him out.  I then even went to said dealers home where he sells his gear and hear the same sound.  He made claims of his gear not being set up properly, because of a photo shoot the night before.  Maybe it was, or maybe not.  Either way the other guy I was with disliked them more than I did for the same reasons most of us have shared.   Sorry, not an industry guy as I'm friends with many and that includes some folks at Paradigm.

No one is looking for, nor needing your pity.  We've heard them set up properly and they aren't our cup of tea.  Nothing wrong with that and it's not even a knock on them.

BTW, I have owned JM Lab speakers back in the day and just sold them a few years ago.  I also have owned a few pair of Paradigm speakers and subs over the years.  One set is with my daughter and they are perfect for what she uses them for.  I got my brother to purchase a full audio/video surround set up with the older Paradigm's.  I've helped many of my friends set up system with them as they like them.  Maybe that makes me a Paradigm home or 'industry' guy.  I just don't like the new offerings for MY ears.  

I second the above. I’ve heard the Persona two separate times, in different rooms, one with my solid state amplifier and another with a beastly Plinius SA-103 in pure Class A. Both times they sounded immediately impressive, but became grating and annoying after 5-10 minutes. Awesome resolution, but not worth the trade offs.

That Plinius is by far the best amp I’ve heard, and I’ve heard it on at least two other pairs of speakers to great effect. Resolving, relaxing and powerful. 

I can also confirm that I’ve spoken with someone who sells Paradigm and has a pair of Personas at home. They said they are usually done listening to them after a record or two. They are not the kind of speaker you can listen to for hours and relax. This person was probably around 60 years old and I’m in my early 30s. 

I own Paradigm Studio 100 V5 speakers and have had significant time with the Persona 9H’s. To me they are anything but fatiguing. In fact, just the opposite. They are smooth and the drivers are seamlessly integrated. There are a lot of great speakers in the $17k range and I’d put these up against any of them. Also, they are pretty easy to drive. I heard them well set up at Axpona 2018 with Anthem electronics and it was one of the best presentations of the show. 

Very interesting Rionvondale, that a guy who sells Paradigm, bought a pair of speakers that he  feels sound fatiguing and can only play a few albums. 

Could it be that the speakers are showing weaknesses in his system, could it be his cartridge is tipped up, or he may need a better phono stage,  or that his current line up of gear isn't working for the Paradigms.

Many times when you add one new component you must re-balance the system to keep the good new things and minimize the things that you are not liking. 

We tested five or six lines of amplifiers before we found the electronics that really made our Persona 9H come alive all of these amplifiers were fantastic pieces from great companies, it is called synergy.

So just because this person has a warm sounding SA 103 doesn't mean that the rest of his components were working with the speakers vs the previous set he was using. 

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ Persona dealers

I alternate between the Persona Bs and Harbeth 30.1s in my dedicated 11x18 room. To my ears, the Personas are significantly more sensitive to upstream equipment but very rewarding with the right match.  For example, the Personas can be a bit fatiguing with the LTA MZ3 but fantastic with the Don Sachs pre and LS-28.  The Harbeths are very good (but different) with all 3 preamps but slightly better with the MZ3.  As far as power amps, the Personas love the Pass XA-25 but are indifferent to the VT-80SE whereas the Harbeths work well with both amps, but with slightly better imaging and soundstage from the VT-80SE.

Troy, you constantly try to poke holes in so many who feel they are tipped up adn fatiguing regardless of upstream equipment.  

You sell them so of course you are going to make excuses.  I went to your place to hear them with Jeff (RIP buddy) and no matter what you played with them, they were terrible, pure and simple.  Then came the excuses of how you didn't have them set up properly, because you had a photo shoot etc..  Then it was your DAC wasn't fully burned in and then it was the dog ate the homework.  

Jeff and I both left quickly when you put on the Legacy speakers and you constantly moved them to try and position them properly while we were listening.  We both said to each other that the 9H's and the Legacy's sounded the same as they have at other places we heard them regardless of how you had them set up.  

Ct you have a problem understanding we went through this with you before.

We said multiple times that when you heard the 9H on that day the system did not sound like it normally does.

In fact we agreed with you and if you remember we didnt want you to visit that day.

Later we found out that the tone controls on the preamp were engaged with the treble beIng raised along with a few other issues.

It would be entirely different if we thought the system sounded great on your visit.

No problems at all.  Jeff and I didn't always agree on things we heard.  We liked some of the same gear, but not all.  Both of us know what we heard with the 9H's and have heard at others places.  

This is now the first time you have brought up the tone control issue.  Didn't even realize the pre had tone controls.

Maybe you told Jeff not to come, but I never got that message as I wouldn't have bothered if I had know in advance.  

Those speakers have sounded the same in every room I've heard them in.  It's their house sound and if you are into that, it's awesome.  This is why we have different flavor speakers and gear.

You sell them and like them, or like the fact they sell (most probably both).  That's fine.  MANY of us find them very bright regardless of what you play them with and in what room.  

Again, not a big deal.

I went to listen to the 7F. I really wanted to like the persona series being Canadian at all since I am Canadian. But that beryllium Tweeter and midrange are so bright and edgy sounding they don't sound natural at all. the monitor audio Platinum series is much more natural three-dimensional sounding. And the width and depth of the soundstage is also much better with the platinum's. Paradigm has never been a high-end company they're trying but they still got a ways to go with that Tweeter and midrange.

How the F$&K is this child not banned? 
Searching for any thread (this case, the latest reply being almost two months old) just to randomly bash persona and praise Monitor Audio.

Is there ANY moderating that goes on in this joke of a forum?

Contuzzi, it's his right.  We all have products that we own, or enjoy that we use as a reference since we are familiar with them.  

I do think that listeners need to really LISTEN and stop taking anything we all discuss on a board as the be all end of of their purchases.  One of the main things that the Persona fans talk about constantly is their need for proper component matching.  Heck, that's fair for most speakers and why some are now making their own electronics.  

Got to see Richard Vandersteen this weekend and he said ONE thing that stuck out more than anything.  It's something I was taught as a kid by a great store owner.  Bring 5 albums (or downloads) that you listen to and know.  My 5 are always male vocal, female vocal, acoustic bass, piano and something 70's rock (where they really rode the board for radio and not hi fi playback (it needs a lot of help, lol).  

How do you not see that this guy is blatantly trolling and doing everything he can to bash persona and talk up monitor?  Do you not see that he is actively searching for old threads where persona is mentioned only to post random attacks on the speaker completely out of any context?

Its not about “his right” it’s about common sense.  This guy is basically spam.  I’m sorry you can not see that very obvious point.

Wrong. It's his choice.

it's his right

+1 @contuzzi 

The upside is all the renewed exposure for Paradigm. Most thread readers will effectively filter. BTW, Monitor is the brand being harmed.

Guys, there are tons of trolls on the boards. It's what many boards have turned into.  A few of the dealers who post are also pretty much trolls.  They use the boards to further their business/finances.  Again, contuzzi, why does it matter?  

It's still up to readers to make up their own minds.  I don't let things like boards bother me too much.  I've been irritated over the years by some (mostly my sports boards), but overall, it's still a fun place for me to hang out.  I often cant' get out of the housed due to my MS, so this is a fun place to read and sometimes post.  It's all good as long as folks are mean spirited or rude to others.  

He posts on a Canadian audio board as well...Under Havocman id....Same song and dance   ....

Bump, have the persona 7f in my listening room right now where the salon 1 & 2, usher be20dmd, Kanta 3, a couple 90’s kef Reference the VA strauss And Beethoven have spent time. These are easy to power, so I would suggest a quality 50 wpc over a powerhouse ‘affordable’ unit. I’m using my hegel h360 but I’ve heard these with a few pieces driving them and I wonder if the Pathos I liked them so much with at the shop would make the same magic here? Not bright, no sibilance, but I can understand why some folk say so as the detail in the midrange is uncommon and bass is tight. The speakers with the Hegel do seem more like surgical instruments than musical instruments, but its early days and I haven’t spent any time on placement yet, I may not they’re really fun as they sit.  I’ll add more as I spend time with them.

@steve59 Congrats that is a great speaker. You 360 amp is one that I have heard a few times and liked somewhat with the KEF Blade. However, I have heard the Persona 5F with an amp that sounds a bit like the Hegel 360, the neutral SimAudio 860A. I think the Sim is a bit better than the Hegel but I found that very long listening sessions with the Sim + Persona could be a little fatiguing. The short sessions with the Sim were amazing.

One reason I did not get the Persona 3F was that I wanted to buy the very neutral Benchmark electronics stack and I was assuming it would not be a good match with the Persona.

The Yamaha is still on my short list along with the blade and a couple others,but for now I'm just going to enjoy these.

The Blade + Meta is what I am looking at when I get the large living room for music. We will have to wait for the Blade + Meta future release. Covaid also needs to be managed so my kid goes back to school and I can use the living room (his playroom).

I will be buying a second AHB2 (maybe this week) and then the last item will be the NS5000 for my office. It should be good combo. I will do a home demo of the NS5000 with the Benchmark electronics (via Music Direct), so no risk. If it does not sound good the NS5000 will go back and I find something else for the Benchmark gear.

Looking forward to your comments on the Persona 7F. I am flipping back and forth between a big Persona or the Blade for the living room. Likely the Blade now with this Meta stuff.

I’ve only heard the Blades at axpona while ive had time to listen to the 7f with a variety of components. The R 107/2 and R105/3 had residence here, the 105’s for 25 years so I was ready for something different. There’s a few pair on my list including the blade is the VA ‘the musik and I’d like to hear the new magico A5, but these personas are really good and I have to sell them to move on. I just finished alice in chains unplugged and could play it again. Thats how it is with this system, the more time I spend with them the harder it is to walk away, fast, tight and dynamic bottom to top with a deep, wide soundstage. I get the impression the entire recording is laid bare, pretty cool. 3 weeks in.