Is OPPO worth the inflated price?

What about where prices have gone now?

Interesting comparison between the OPPO 205 and PS Audio.

I was lucky to get one of the 205's from the last production run. Sounded excellent. Sent it to Ric Shultz for mods and it sounded even better, more open, spacious, lower noise floor.

Last month I splurged on an open box Marantz SA-10. Have to say, on my system,  it betters the OPPO across the board. Smoother, richer, more natural sounding. Deeper soundstage. Deeper, more solid bass. I'm using both with their analog outputs.

So, I'm happy with the Marantz, but will be keeping the OPPO for playing all the media the Marantz can't play, including video. So, you can get better sound than the OPPO 205 for (CD and SACD), but hard to beat the versatility of it.

PS AUDIO DIRECTSTREAM DAC WITH NETWORK BRIDGE 2 2019 VS OPPO 205 2017

I got my first SACD player about 20 years ago. I was immediately taken by the superior sound possible with that technology, and for many years used only that medium for home listening. 

It is only a few years ago that music streaming quality got to the level that I would consider pleasurable for home listening. Now that high-resolution files are available for streaming, I became curious about using an alternative to my OPPO-205 as a DAC. 

After some research, I settled on PS Audio Directstream player as a possible candidate. That DAC is well regarded, and I was able to find some favorable comparisons to OPPO-205, with the reviewer commenting on an improved level of detail. 

Most music lovers will agree that the speakers and the listening environment (room) are mostly responsible for what you hear. The amplifier(s) have to be of decent quality and have adequate power for the speakers. You have likely selected your speakers/amplifiers/preamps or lack thereof/interconnects, based on the sound/tonality you like. Upgrading the source would be least likely to affect tonality, but may make a big difference in the level of detail. By detail I mean such terms as soundstage, placement of instruments, “presence”, the “air” or “rosin” quality of the violins, etc.

If you can easily tell the difference between tremolo (same note with rapid alternating direction of the bow stroke) and legato (same note, same direction of the bow stroke) of the violin, the drums played with sticks vs brushes, acoustic vs electric bass, if you have a stable soundstage with good separation and localization of instruments, you likely have good detail. Not all recordings will have such level of detail, but, when present, it will be easy to notice. Your room and speakers will greatly affect your soundstage. And, if your speakers/amplifiers cannot reproduce detail, you will not hear it, no matter the source. 

Many commentators mention “harsh” or “fatiguing” sound of some digital sources. I find harshness to be mostly the function of the recording, not the DAC. Even the best DAC will be able to do only so much with a clipped, distorted recording, although some DACs make such recordings slightly more tolerable. But a DAC will not be able to create detail absent on the recording.

The terms such as “warm”,  “bright”, “bloomy”, etc. are used to describe tonality. I think the DAC is least likely of your components to affect tonality. If you are interested in changing the tonality of sound, your goal would be better achieved by changing/adding other components. 

Personally, I subscribe to “no preamp is the best preamp” philosophy. In my opinion, the more elements are in the system, the more detail is lost. 

I set up the OPPO for the comparison process, while waiting for the PS Audio to be delivered. Previously, I was using the OPPO for SACD playback; Tidal streaming via asynchronous USB and the app on the PC; and TV streaming via optical in, all in stereo, 2-channel configuration. After setting up OPPO as a UPnP player, it was immediately apparent that the sound quality thus obtained is clearly superior. Even after tinkering with driver settings, the loss of detail with the use of PC/USB connection is not subtle. Taking the PC, with its USB card and player driver, out of the chain is a clear benefit. 

It also became clear that SACD disks were far superior to any other data source, followed by DSD downloads, followed by Qobuz stream, followed by Tidal. I downloaded the DSD file I already had on SACD for comparison from one of the commercial sites.

Interestingly, MQA did not seem to make any difference compared to non-MQA in sound quality (as streamed from Tidal). Yes, I checked - it was on, and working. 

This hierarchy presented an immediate problem. SACD stream cannot be transmitted to an external DAC without some dubious hacks. PS Audio used to make a DirectStream Memory Player, which, ironically, used the OPPO transport, and output SACD digital stream over I2S to the DirectStream DAC. You can still buy them used, but you would not be able to return them, and I was not ready to commit. Even used, the player is 3 times what a new OPPO used to be - and it does not have an internal  DAC! You can install an aftermarket board into an OPPO-203, but, after reading multiple forums regarding this, I very much doubt you would achieve satisfactory results. Enthusiasts attempting the modification were relying on indicator lights on the board to determine whether they were outputting DSD signal or a downgraded signal. So much  for sound quality! There is no room in OPPO-205 for aftermarket boards in any case. McIntosh has their own thing going. There are some other, very expensive solutions, but there was no easy way for me to test them. 

So, unless you are planning on purchasing a used Memory Player, or hacking some other player at your own risk, there is no reasonable way to use PS Audio for SACD playback. 

PS Audio changed to a direct distribution model. They will send you the DAC for a 30-day trial period. You can return the DAC during that period for a full refund. They will absorb the shipping costs.

When PS Audio arrived, I have set it up in parallel with the OPPO, as a UPnP player. Both have ethernet jacks (with PS Audio, an optional board called Bridge II is required), digital volume control, obviating the need for preamps, and XLR out. I used both mConnect and BubbleUPnP apps for control of playback. Neither DAC has built-in apps to work with content providers, so one of the apps above would be required for playback. Both are somewhat buggy, but useable. 

Straight out of the box, while the quality differences between different sources were noticeable on PS Audio (I could not play SACD through it as mentioned above); compared to OPPO, the detail on PS Audio was blunted. This was also true for DSD files, even though PS Audio is supposed to be specifically built for DSD. I vaguely remembered that the OPPO “opened up” after about an hour of play, so I waited an hour… then two… then I put it on a loop and went to work. After over 100 hours of “burn-in”, it sounded exactly the same as it did when I first plugged it in. PS Audio recommends 200 hours of “burn in”, but I was worried about going over my 30 day return period. Also, one would think, I would notice some difference after 100 hours, but there was none at all. 

Lack of detail on PS Audio compared to OPPO was noticeable on multiple tracks, varied kinds of music, varied sources, and varied encoding. I do not listen to regular CD’s, so, even though I could output digital signal from CD’s via OPPO coaxial digital out to PS Audio, I did not attempt that. 

As expected, the tonality of both DACs was very similar. 

PS Audio does not have USB A input, except for software upgrades, so USB sticks/drives cannot be connected to it directly. OPPO has 3. It is very easy to play files from NAS on either DAC, using the same mConnect or BubbleUPnP apps you would for streaming; and, during testing, I did it for both DACs. I did not try to check if it is possible to play music off the PC/Mac hard drive(s) via asynchronous USB on PS Audio. OPPO is capable of that. 

One of professional reviews mentioned that connecting both RCA’s and XLRs on PS Audio is not recommended, so I did not use my subwoofer for testing. There is no such limitation on the OPPO, so, once the testing was done with,  I plugged my amplified sub back into its RCA’s.

I used PS Audio for some TV viewing, using optical input. I thought the dialog sounded clearer with it,  than it did with OPPO, but the difference was marginal. 

PS Audio folks asked me why I was returning the player, promptly issued an RMA and a return label, and issued a refund one day after receiving the DAC.

Does any of this make any difference? No matter how wonderful I think OPPO is, it is no longer available. Who knows what the process of repairing a discontinued product would be. The value of a used OPPO-205 is a matter of vigorous debate. What are its competitors? Even so, I would take a used OPPO-205 over a used PS Audio transport/DAC combo with the asking price of 8K.  If you have the OPPO, and it works, and you like the sound, I would not worry about upgrading it. Do not get confused by folks talking about OPPO-95, OPPO-105, OPPO-203, etc. They have different, inferior DACs. Consider upgrading your speakers/amps before upgrading the source. If you are happy with the rest of your system - forget about upgrading, and enjoy the music!  

My system: OPPO-205, bridged Spectron Musician III’s x 2, Thiel 2.7, JL Audio f113.

My BDP 83 SE stopped reading discs.  I emailed Oppo and they sent an email detailing how I should clean the laser..    not sure how it got dirty from playing clean discs.
The downfall is the cooling fan is quite noisy.   I picked up a Pioneer Elite BDP 53 and it’s been excellent.   Toslink out to my Black Ice FX tube DAC.   Plays SACD, HDCD and Blu-ray for $100 shipped.

" You can get a fabulous second hand audiophile player for that amount of cash. I know what I'd pick"

Totally agree. Given the more limited Oppo support (vs. in the past) at this point a little bit over list might be OK and a new one (given the fact that support will just be for a limited time) isn't worth that much more than a lightly used one.  Certainly not $3,500.

You can get a fabulous second hand audiophile player for that amount of cash. I know what I'd pick

I have both a BDP-83, a UDP-203 and a pair of PM-2 headphones. After 7 years the tray on the BDP-83 got stuck and wouldn't retract. I contacted Oppo (by email) and they had me ship it back, at my expense, but they then replaced the tray mechanism and shipped it back for free. Who does that after seven years and for free! This was when they were still in the business and why I was bummed when they quit making them. Got it back in a week and I'm still using it as a CD player in my main 2 channel rig because it will play practically anything. Doesn't sound bad using the internal DAC but I can always use Coax or digital to another DAC if I want.

I use the 203 in my HT but for me the killer app is it's ability to play all my ripped movies on my NAS via SMB. I have 2- 40TB NAS boxes with about 1400 DVD, Bluray and UHD movies I ripped (mostly MKV) with bonus features and a few thousand CD's both in FLAC and WMD lossless formats, and they all stream no fuss over a wired network to an LG OLED TV. Some of the UHD movies are 60-70 GB files and I still don't have any issues. I have the discs but I rarely use them. I also have a Plex server on a Mac Mini with the same movies indexed. The interface on the Oppo is simply file folders and isn't pretty like Plex but it's just easier to use since I have them organized by genre so I can find things easily. 

I'm looking for another UDP-203 in good condition, I just won't pay the inflated prices some people want. I'll get one at some point so I can put it on another TV and use the network capabilities, I'm not particularly worried about the hardware supporting physical disc play. I don't know of another UHD player that has that network ability, does anyone else?

 I contacted Oppo Service hoping to acquire a replacement LASER sled in advance of a failure. They said "no". I hope the Oppo will last more than five years as this is when service will cease.

Oppo currently provides communication via email only (unless it changed recently which I doubt).  So if you have questions, there is a need to detail the problem and send them an email.  As noted earlier, I have an Oppo 203 that sees little use.  Considered selling it (and wouldn't ask what some are insanely asking and I don't think the players are worth it at the insane end of pricing - maybe a little premium).  Mine is just used for video in a spare HT with a UHD TV.  I hope to get a slightly bigger TV within the next several months and the 203 will be moved (along with the 55 inch UHD set to an upstairs bonus room which is basically a guest room).

Oppo Repair Service NYC/Long Island?

When it became clear that decoder boards were unavailable to repair my Cambridge 650BD player I purchased a used Oppo 95. The ad said it works fine and should arrive next week. I got the 95 because I presently need analog video connectivity until upgrading to OLED TV or better (otherwise I'd have jumped on the 105 and its neat headphone amp for monitoring movie sound quality). Oppo Support has no phone but said via email that they still service all Oppo BD players. Presumably therefore all of the most failure prone parts are still available.

 

But when repairs are needed rather than shipping to Menlo Park might there be authorized Oppo or otherwise highly experienced service companies in the New York metro area or Long Island? Ideally, they will also be knowledgeable and aggressive enough to quickly troubleshoot circuit faults to the (non-proprietary) component circuit level-which CA's outsourced factory service https://www.panurgyoem.com/ was apparently unwilling or unable to do with the now discontinued decoder boards they said killed my player.

And thanks to Panurgy and Cambridge I also ended up initially wasting very serious money on a new transport mechanism which obviously didn't need replacing on this brick.

https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=K3b5XJvLFOeyggfw75ugCw&q=panurgy+oem&oq=panurgey+&gs_l=psy-ab.1.0.0i13l7j0i13i30l3.2173.6041..7757...2.0..0.116.824.12j1......0....1..gws-wiz.....0..0i131j0j0i10.twEWogap-sk#lrd=0x89c3097c4ac5fc35:0xee6485492353ef8a,1

Of course, I'll ship the 95 to Oppo if that's clearly the best move though it’s nice to have more local but very reliable options.

And please share any feedback and experience about Oppo US Service Support.

Please excuse me for breaking into this discussion.  Hearing this discussion about your OPPO 205 reminded me of my situation.  However, I do not know how to originate a discussion.  

I have an OPPO UPD 203 connected to an ARCAM AVR550 with a pair of Paradigm Prestige 85F towers.  When I set up my system I decided to stream TIDAL.  To eliminate signal breakup, I have direct wired the modem in my family room to my Apple TV in the family room by using CAD 6 cable and I direct wired the Apple TV using CAD6 to the back of my ARCAM.  Since then, I do not find myself using my OPPO to play CD's.  I wonder if anyone knows if I am sacrificing sound quality by streaming TIDAL as compared to playing CD's through my OPPO.  Also, when I do use the OPPO the dealer I purchased the ARCAM from suggested  I  connect the OPPO  with an RCA cable when playing CD's to improve sound quality.  However, doesn't this utilize the DAC in the OPPO rather the DAC in the OPPO?  This said, which has the better DAC, the OPPO or the ARCAM.  I also have the OPPO connected by HDMI to watch movies and I wonder when listening to CD's if I would improve sound quality by using the HDMI connection?   

There is the Sony 1000 that is very good ,and Yamaha has some 
very good players as well as Pionerr elite for under $1000

You can contact Oppo if you call them they were still making them 
in small lots you prepay and they send you one ,or they will tell you 
when you getorder one ,give them a call ,samepricing.

I own the 205 and use it several times a week watching 4K movies through a 4K firestick. The video is outstanding!

However, for Cd I use the PS Direct Stream player/transport to my PS DS Dac.

The 205 is great for movies but the PS unit is outstanding for Cd’s.
For an all purpose one piece component it is pretty good. Maybe not $3500 good but more than the original price of $1200.

That’s probably why Oppo dropped the line, not enough profit per unit.

ozzy

My BDP103 sounded better played through my Auralic Vega DAC than the BDP105D played straight to my preamp.  I have also owned a Modwright modded BDP-95 an Oppo HA1 headphone amp and now have a UDP203 that replaced the BDP103.  I don't think I've heard the 205, but find it hard to imagine that it sounds substantially better than the HA1 (which had the best DAC of the Oppos that I have heard) or BDP105/105D.

The thing I liked most about the Oppos was the streaming apps that came with them and when the UDP series came out without the apps I lost interest.  I did break down and buy a UPD203 at a slightly inflated price so that I could have 4K when I upgraded my TV, but I don't use it for music at all really and have a BlueSound Node 2 for Tidal/Spotify/Qobuz/etc. and Roku for Netflix.  The only thing I use the UDP203 for is Blu-Rays and 4K movies.

My Marantz KI-Pearl takes care of the little silver music discs and blows the Oppo away.

Actually deadly serious on the $130 Pioneer. That's what I paid used from eBay, not sure what it's original msrp was decades ago.

My point was that the OPPO as a top flight CD player from its analog outs ( RCA or Xlr) was not top flight at all imho.

Not common to be accused of having a sense of humour .... Lmao.


😇😇😇😇😇

@uberwaltz . Unless you’re possibly using a very old Pioneer receiver - from which everything sounds lush and mellow :)

@uberwaltz. Glad your sense of humor is in great condition : re $130 Pioneer ;)

Already been said but here's my views.

Having owned ( or still own) just about every OPPO bdp/udp ever made I feel I have a fairly decent perspective.

For video and movies any of the later OPPO are hard to beat. Fantastic soundtracks for movies over HDMI into a 7.1 processor.

As for music from its own analog outputs?
Even the much lauded 105d and 205 left me cold and an,older $130 Pioneer player bettered them.

Used as a transport over spdif it is fine,but then so is a $20 Samsung bdp in my system!

Value for money?

Obviously subjective but it was and remains a $1295 universal player so 2 or 3 times the price?

Heck no......

I wouldn't worry too much about the warranty, I have not heard of any widespread issues and I've owned 5 Oppo units and all worked flawlessly.  I just don't think they are worth 3-4 times what their retail price was, that's just stupid.

OP: nobody is going to buy an Oppo player when the company is no longer supporting it, regardless of how inflated the price. The price-gougers won’t sell to anyone besides fools. And the warranty is not transferable. Boom!

@junzhang10 .  That gives them a real way of comparing. Very good. 

I think it is worth the price. From 205 you will get a 4K player, a 32 bit PCM and DSD music player, balanced out (stereo), 7.1 (or 5.0 for DSD) out. An earhphone amp and pre-amp. I can’t name other play offer these @ $3000 range. If you spend $1000 to mod-wright it. It is a solid Strereophile class A music player. For best audio performance, I always use XLR balanced out at line-out level and use a pre-amp with balanced in-out. I also use XLR with variable out since 205 has a 32 bit DAC and won’t degrading 24 bit music resolution to some listening level. Did I ever mentioned MQA? Yes, the Oppo can decode MQA if you prefer Tidal. Or just go 192k/24bit. It can connect with your music library hard drive and play directly through it. The only missing on 205 is the Tidal and Netflix app.

@ptss,
Agreed. Oppo units last a long time. My 970HD from 2007 is still running.
Honestly I like what I am hearing. Folks do mention that the Oppo does not compare to a CD-only player. Problem is - I do not know how many of these folks have actually done this comparison Vs just bashing the NEW Oppo.

Interesting that I’ve heard no complaints about the 205 breaking down. And,again, good ac power conditioning allows one to hear what the Oppo 205 can sound like. I’ve been very pleased with mine. Another thought might be the maturity of the dac development and the unit in the 205 ..

@lalitk

Transparency doesn’t always equates to musicality.

Musicality is a non-descript term, might as well say “The sound was too orange.” No one knows exactly what someone else means when they use that term. I used transparency, which is easily understood, meaning it adds no colorations. I prefer no colorations/distortions (let me hear my music, not my gear), and I stated the 205 was one of the best on the planet for this purpose, I have no arguments on what you find “musical”.  
  
Now, I would not use a CD Player as a DAC, so the 205 doesn’t interest me, and even for its transparency, I wouldn’t spend that much (even the Chord Qutest or Benchmark DAC3B are question marks for me).

My money Invested on a CD player would go to Arcam (probably).
I've never heard the OPPO player.

Who are the buyers? People exactly like you. The reason "you had your eye on it for some time" is the same reason others do also. The price is not inflated, it is the market value.

I have a bunch of Oppo players.  Two 103Ds, one in the bedroom and one in the main system.  The main system is just used for video (it's an integrated AV system but I probably watch 10 movies/year and it has a projector and probably stuff like the Super Bowl and that's it).  I rarely watch a disc in the bedroom but sometimes used the Oppo app to play music outside as the bedroom feeds the outdoor speakers.  I also have an old (Modwright solid state) modded BDP-83 in the main system as it can output 192kHz via the coax digital into my DAC if I so desire.

I have a 93 in the upstairs bonus room (basically a guest bedroom) with a hard drive filled with music.  I have an old DV-980h in my 4k system which also has a 203.  I own a whole 9 UHD movies and it is my back-up 3D system (have a 55 inch UHD TV).  So I've probably played no more that 20 movies on the 203 and when I was running some systems at an audio get together, it may have been used briefly to demo reading files from my NAS.  I've considered selling the 203 (and if someone wants to make me an offer even at 10% less than some of the insane prices go ahead)

@mzkmxcv,

Transparency doesn’t always equates to musicality. You are one of those folks that judge a component performance based on its measurement data and then forms an opinion. I bet you anything you’re one of those that defy anything audio or else unless you see the measurement data.

For you, listening experience is not necessary. That’s where we will never see eye to eye. And that’s ok with me 😉

Thanks, everyone, really appreciate your input!

I have a 105 and a 203, but no way would I pay that kind of money for it, especially just as a disc spinner..  if CD replay is your only priority, $3500 will buy you some several times more refined than an Oppo.  If you need a Universal Player, look to Pioneer and Sony.
  As usual, my recommendation would be to get a good DAC and and use something for a transport. Again, if spinning CDs is all the OP wants to do, a dedicated transport from Cambridge and a Mytek Brooklyn, for example, will cost them $2500 and be several times better than an Oppo.
  The beauty of Oppo was that they made solid equipment that would spin any format, be a killer Video player that could have apps added to it,, be used as a DAC, and even stream, all in one chassis at a reasonable price. That doesn’t mean that for CD replay alone it should merit being priced in the stratosphere.

@lalitk  
 
I stated it’s one of the most transparent DACs out there. That may sound boring to you if you aren’t looking to listen to your music as is truly sounds. Either way, if you can disprove my claim on it being one of the best in terms of transparency, I welcome it; I’m not gonna argue on your sighted+informed subjective opinion, as that’s your truth.

Is OPPO worth the inflated price?

NO

Is Modwright OPPO worth the outlandish inflated price?

HELL NNNOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!


My 85% deaf mother-in-law could tell the difference between the top of the line Modwright Oppo against an mid-level PrimaLuna in my room. She said: "Look at how your friend’s eyes lighted up the 2nd time (when the PrimaLuna was playing)". Now that’s OBJECTIVE review you should believe.

laktik 
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-oppo-udp-205-u...

@mzkmxcv

I was expressing my opinion based on my experience. As far as credibility goes, we know exactly your knowledge base in the area of digital. In fact, you are hardly a subject matter expert.

@lalitk  
 
As I’ve stated elsewhere, if you know you are playing that DAC, your evaluations are invalid from a credibility viewpoint.

Since I own both 203 and 205’s, I know exactly how transparent the DAC inside the 205. 

Which one of these you own? 

@hgeifman

They didn’t, that division of OPPO was shut down (the Hi-Fi 4K market is small).

The OPPO UDP-205 player unit is not worth $3,500 (IMHO). 

Why did OPPO discontinue the OPPO UDP-205?

@lalitk

average quality DAC.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-oppo-udp-205-u...

Try one of the best (most transparent) DACs on the planet.

I was fortunate enough to get one of the last production runs.

Then, I was even more fortunate to look at Ebay and see how much they were selling for.  I had 100% planned on keeping it and using it.

But, more than double my money on electronics?  Yes Please.  Sold.

I bought a 10 x Blue Ray Player less price $ of a very good High End older CD player and.... .... ... WoW !!!  May be the Oppo is quite good ?

Not worth the $3500 price tag with a average quality DAC. 

You can get the Pioneer LX500 for around $1000 and add in a Clones Audio power supply for another $450 and have one great performing unit.

If going digital out, it performs no differently than any other quality player. It’s DAC however is one of the best on the market.

for playing CD not close to worth the current asking price

You can either go for Pioneer  UDP-LX500 or wait for the  UDP-LX800. Paying anything over $1500 for a $1299 player is not worth it. I have the Oppo UDP205 and am plenty happy with it.