How Do You Live The Audiophile Life

I'm not sure there is any secret to the "audiophile life" other than to create a sound that pleases you. Many people strive to reach what the music would sound like live but for me at least that is a difficult standard to reach. I have been to numerous concerts involving well established artists and I have never found a constant sound since all music environments are different, the sound equipment at each concert is always adjusted to the taste of the sound engineer and the instruments can themselves sound different based on the brand, age, speakers and amplifiers used, etc.  The result of all of this is that I don't really know what certain instruments SHOULD  sound like since there just isn't a constant sound for any instrument to emulate. Strive for what you imagine the sound would be like and what pleases you. Quite frankly, I believe some of our music systems could easily sound better than a live performance of that same material by that same artist given all of the vagaries mentioned above. I have walked out of concerts based on poor sound - there just isn't any reason to think that live sound is always perfect and recorded music necessarily always inferior.

Visit living stereo in NYC....mike is a great guy! 

Lots of good advise.
 I agree with the guy who:
find a group of audiophiles. We have a group through meetup.com Lots of guys willing to share and help.
 Robert Harley's book is helpful to get the audio neurons going. So is Smith's.
 Check Craigslist for some good buys if want to explore a bit.
  But, probably the best advice is to ENJOY THE MUSIC- not the equipment so much, unless that's your goal. 
 If the music moves you, you are there...
Makes no sense if your moving, you can't be "there"...
See millercarbons video- he's moving and he's there. The Dude of audiophileness.

larry5729,

"A lot depends on where you live and the dealers there.  Reviews are misleading because it depends upon how much the manufacturer discounted the equipment to the writer.

Audio  shows are helpful.  However, how many years before we have one due to COVID.  Thank you China for not telling the world you had it for 2 1/2 months."


No, no!

I was hoping, just maybe September. 
You can't live the audiophile life without taking in the odd show or two.

No amount of money, understanding family members, or Dire Straits/Steely Dan/audiophile Jazz albums can make up for not attending shows.

Shows are the pulsing life blood of this hobby.

Maybe someone can post in-depth online guided show tours? How about Munich, Can-Jam, Axpona, Bristol, Montreal, Rocky Mountain etc on Netflix, Amazon.. anybody?

I'd pay to watch.

Disgusting that someone has to sell their kit to pay for cancer tests.
Anyway, you don't train to become an audiophile. It just happens as you're driven by what turns you on. Dig?

@zerobias, yea I know, just yankin your chain. Enjoy the music

You were recommended to subscribe to TAS and Stereophile and go to some high end shops. I read both magazines and went to high end shops when I could get around well enough. I have never or will never want to be considered an "Audiophile". Most of the ones I have talked to in person were busy listening to equipment and not music. Now I don't know  very many "Audiophiles" but the ones who told me they were never talked about the music just their equipment and how much they paid for it. As for me, I had to listen to tube equipment to find out what it was all about and fell in love with the sound. In the past I had to sell my Integrated amp built by Paul Grebeck (hope the spelling is correct) at Tube Audio Design outside of Chicago to help a friends mother with paying for her cancer tests. Just an amazing piece of equipment. I'm hoping to get back into tubes again.  This just what I found out about Audiophiles myself.Ron

I am in NYC.  I started in 2008, after a few years at my first corporate job, had some cash, and was always into music and gear. I went to In Living Stereo, demoed a pair of Dynaudios and liked them a lot. Prior to that I listed to a pair of Totem Model 1 Sigs at Stereo Exchange. As good as the Dyns were, they didn't quite sound like the Totems. But I was talked into buying them anyway and paired them up with a Peachtree Decco which was an wonderful integrated under $1K. But quickly realized it ran out of steam driving the Dyns at moderate levels.

Then bought a 250 WPC McIntosh power amp, using the Decco as a pre, which improved the sound significantly. There has been many changes after that, but I like minimal, urban setups, so I really like high end integrated amps.

My view is, you should really audition speakers and buy based on the size of your room. With dacs and amps, there not much option to listen, so you have to take some chances.

There are decent dealers where you can go and demo equipment. 

Bright Home Theater is a very small cozy store, friendly. Audio Doctor in Jersey City, he has a lot of equipment, and you can take your time.  And there's one in upper east side, may be Park Ave Audio, which is pretty good as well.

There are some high end dealers in NYC where you have to make appointments and the attitude is geared towards a very wealthy clientele only, I would skip those.

For the record this is me, playing Jeff Bridges playing the Dude, a character  based on me, driving my actual car. What happened was when they asked about the possibility of using my car I said sure, but only if I get to drive it. Because its a very special car. I didn't cut my hair for three months, kind of like now, and this being Hollyweird a few special effects makeup hours and ... this is me.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jo11SqLmuGc   This post really ties the thread together.

@tooblue  

Yes, I know.  I'm just humoring him.

I find that making as many audiophile friends as possible and listen to their systems. And sharing your experiences with them too.  Sometimes letting each other borrow gear to try. I used to belong to a club that met every weekend. Heard a lot of systems back then. Once you listen to a lot of gear, when you read reviews and forums you get a better understanding of what people are talking about. Then these forums become a great source of info.

Now you realize thats not really millercarbon, thats the DUDE, right?

@millercarbon

"Actual video of millercarbon living the audiophile life."


Priceless!  The Dude Abides. 

I read a sh$t load of reviews, and because there are so few audio boutique stores within 100 miles of me, I buy blind. However, due to my own research, I've been lucky and have assembled my best system to date, at least to my ears and taste. I think it's all about synergy and how one component compliments another, but what do I know ...

A lot depends on where you live and the dealers there.  Reviews are misleading because it depends upon how much the manufacturer discounted the equipment to the writer.

Audio  shows are helpful.  However, how many years before we have one due to COVID.  Thank you China for not telling the world you had it for 2 1/2 months.

Glupson, you really think Johnny Rotten will move out when he's 17 and someone less obnoxious—like Justin Bieber—will take his place? Thank you for the ray of hope. If I hear "Pretty Vacant" one more time . . .

But I'm not sure. Luke, my son, adopted his Johnny Rotten personna very easily. And, like the kid in the Exorcist, not someone who is going to give up easily.

Speaking of music—Pretty Vacant! Never gets old.

I echo what @freediver said about becoming familiar with live music in real spaces. Live acoustic music is priceless for understanding tonality/timbre, smooth vs grainy sound, soundstage, rhythm/pace, other issues you’ll run into in audiophile systems; electric live music is priceless to assess dynamics, dynamic range, and bass.

An equally important piece of the puzzle is you developing your research skills...learning how to amass and triangulate the streams of high end audio reviews (Stereophile, Absolute Sound, HiFi+) and user comments in threads like this. You learn to sift through all this, looking for clues as to how a given audio product sounds.

The only way those clues will make sense is if you understand your own sonic preferences--really know (just one example) that you really appreciate, or really don’t appreciate, lots of detail, "accuracy," and resolution (which some hear as bright, etched, clinical). Or whether you appreciate, or don’t appreciate, the same natural weight in the lower midrange and bass that you will consistently hear in live music.

Early on I learned to snatch knowledge from unexpected places: a recording heard on the radio (which became a trust demo CD); a friend’s audio system (I liked something I heard & checked out what was in the chain); and of course, visits to high end audio stores.

If it happens again in the fall, I recommend taking a weekend trip to Capital Audio Fest (conveniently located on the red line of Washington, DC Metro so you do not even need a car). It is a quick and simple trip and it is a fairly large show. Much better than the one in New York City. Nice experience even if you are not in the market for buying something.

Identify what your goals are be honest with yourself - there are no wrong answers, whats most important to your needs.

Come up with a budget, and work towards sticking to it.

READ, READ, READ and then READ some more. 

It took me a good five years to understand what my goals were. I read a paper on how Humans Process Sound. I used it as a guide to come up with a plan to make sage purchasing decisions, moving me forward towards achieving my goals. 

Before that I was making purchses based on brand recognition, paid for reviews, and bragging rights on the latest and greatest. At best I was making purchases that were lateral moves. They did not propel me towards achieveing my goals. 

Understand that dealers are in the buisness of sales. As a fellow New Yorker who has been to most of the places you are passively referencing - Their objective is to put your money in thier pocket period. 

As you know this is a lifestyle so this will take time. Cold call / e mail brand manufacturers that interest you and ask them questions. Most of them will take the time to explain their vision. Go to trade shows to check stuff out. It gives you a chance to meet and Vet the manufacturers as well. Be prepared to possibly take a day trip here or there to check out their operations if local. 

Most (80%) of my equiptment came from second hand markets. I have been doing this for 30 years and still going, not done yet. I put it into a balanced perspective that allows me to enjoy this HOBBY without putting a strain on my overall life. 

Good Luck Enjoy

jssmith,

"Start with Ethan Winer's The Audio Expert.

Like any other subject, you can go in blind, stumbling around, being pulled from one claim or review to the next, like almost everyone. Me included. Or you can educate yourself."


Stumbling around blindly in a state of confusion is where many in the business might want to keep you. 

As the above poster said, if you want to save yourself time it's better to educate yourself.

Another good book would be Sound Reproduction: The Acoustics and Psychoacoustics of Loudspeakers and Rooms by Floyd E Toole.

Either book is worth more than a lifetime's subscription to any audio magazine - and infinitely more informative and entertaining.

At the very least the smart audiophile would have a copy displayed prominently on their shelf.

How do we live the "Audiophile Life"?    Well if you have to ask.....

Actually, we all have more money than you do.   So much in fact that we can afford capricious purchases of 5 figure equipment, just using pocket change.

I hope you realize I am joking.

We all started somewhere.   If we started young, it was likely with limited resources.  If we started older, we likely had a base of HT or other generic equipment as a foundation.   Regardless.  We all had to learn what we wanted, learn how to evaluate sound in the abstract, and how to determine if differences are true improvements or just the novelty of something new.   It makes no sense to dive into the deep end and spend large sums of money to start your journey.

You reference living in NYC, and have a multitude of dealers in relatively close proximity.  GOOD.  Any reputable dealer will welcome your visits as you learn.  A good dealer understands that education is part of the high end sales process.   You live in a large market.  As a practical matter there is a large and dynamic market for used equipment in the 5 boroughs.   Craigslist, Ebay Local, Facebook Marketplace are your friends.   As you learn, you will able to sample just about anything, and likely be able to resell along the way to break even-  your only investment becomes time.   Don't be afraid to ask questions.   

Definition of expert. Someone who used to be a drip under pressure.

Start with Ethan Winer's The Audio Expert.

Like any other subject, you can go in blind, stumbling around, being pulled from one claim or review to the next, like almost everyone. Me included. Or you can educate yourself.

geoffkait,

Please. It has your name on it, sort of.

https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649624687-sony-pro-walkman-wmd6c/

Classic geoffkait.

Classic glubson. Classic glubson copy cat, too.

 they don't like the all cat-fighting here.

They have better things to do.

One question. Where are all the female audiophiles?

Find a dealer that gets good reviews and you trust. Let them help you. Trial and error can waste a lot of money.
if the dealer carries used gear... even better. Many dealers will offer trade up programs on speakers you buy fomr them. This can also be a good way to work your way up the speaker ladder.

You are starting with a good system it looks like.

If you are speaking to me........Yes, I know he plays a Fender Tele, which goes through an amplifier. All electrics, go through an amplifier....the use of a reverb, is to get a type of sound. I prefer, less reverb, which is my personal preference. 

I guess you missed the show I mixed for Jim Campilongo a while back. He uses a Princeton Reverb turned all the way up, and had he been unamplified...well...perhaps somewhat harder to enjoy...

Once a performer plays / sings into a microphone, or mixing console, you have lost all truth, all reality, all the accuracy, of said instrument or voice. Recordings are limited, and the playback gear, is purchased, to try to reassemble it, back to it’s beginnings. No matter how much you spend, no matter what you do to your room, no matter how experienced you are, as a listener, the sound, will never be " like the real thing ". So, knowing I am listening to a recording, I stay engaged, and listen to the " playing ", the " singing "......the " performance, the artistry " aspect, of my favorite musicians. PRAT, is a real thing. Dynamics, is a real thing. Fortissimo and pianissimo, are a real thing. Yes, tone is important. Coherence is important. Stage development, is important. These are all part of live, unamplified music. Determine what is most important to you, and if who you are listening to, engages you, and continues, to keep you listening....you are, on your way. Enjoy !

Every time I visit another city I find the high end audio stores and go for a visit.  Kick their tires and get a line on why they promote the products they promote.  I find it very helpful

"If the 16-year old boy would have to go, it’s worth thinking about."

Depending on the actual birthday, one more year and you are done with that one.

I think it's important to take everyone's advice with a grain of salt, especially the ones that are the most heavy-handed.

I would say that it is important to listen to a few good separates in the shops and also (if possible) at home.  There are too many possibilities so know from the start that you won't be able to listen to them all.  Also, real-world budgets and real-world listening spaces will not achieve the "nose-bleed-high-end-best-of-show" sound that you might aspire to.  Overall, take a test drive on a few components based on reasonable reviews and find what you like to hear (not necessarily what others say you should hear).

In my experience, speakers make the most difference and needs to be tailored to your listening tastes.  However, one needs to be mindful of budget and space constraints (e.g., speakers you dream of may be too big for your space).  Amplifier needs to be matched for your speakers.  DACs need to be accurate.  As for connectors and speaker wire, my ears do not let me hear the difference between decent entry level items and the really expensive esoteric stuff: for example, there was a big difference between crap speaker wire and the cheapest Kimber Kable speaker wire, but I couldn't distinguish between the different Kimber Kable wires in blind testing.

Personally, I wasted a lot of money in my late 20s and early 30s looking for better equipment based on others' opinions (sometimes even letting those other opinions sway me away from what I liked).  Then, I found a reasonable amplifier and a pair of speakers that matched my musical tastes and have been concentrating on the music (that was 25 years ago).  DACs and preamps have been upgraded over time to take advantage of the improving technology (particularly DACs).

Hope you enjoy your journey and the music.

To the OP...

The best advice I've ever heard (and I wish I heard this years ago), was:

It all sounds fake. Just pick your favorite kind of fake.

This room has me losing the game before the opening kickoff. A lack of decorating options that forces the speakers too close together and aimed directly at the dining table or empty wall/window space, leaving all the comfortable sitting positions in front of one speaker or the other. 
Plus, the room is too small to allow for any serious rearrangement. When I got the new NAD stuff, the clarity demanded that I give the speakers a few more inches of distance from the wall behind them. A few inches! All of my books had to go to make room.

Every year I ask the kids if they’d like to move to the suburbs. Their own room, a yard, room to run! Every year they threaten to beat me up if I even think about it.

The serious audiophile would get rid of it all, put one chair at one end, the two speakers at the other (one blocking off the hallway), forming the perfect isosceles triangle, and the hell with everything else. If the 16-year old boy would have to go, it’s worth thinking about. 
The biggest joke of all is how much I pay for this place. Ah, NYC living!

Not sure about the Audiophile Life; I'm definitely on the outside looking in on that one.
Just as a "by the way" - SkyFi Audio in Glen Rock NJ was born of the ashes of the old Stereo Warehouse on Broadway, so there's one less hifi store in New York (wink). SkyFi have the SW neon sign blazing in side their store, and a boat load of new and used equipment there too; all, well most, way out of my price range. I do get a lot of joy out of listening to them though.  (that wasn't a plug for SkyFi, it was a plug for NJ high-end hifi stores - shout out to Audio Connection and Audio Nexus also).

Someone mention love of the sound as a contributing factor (and I guess the pursuit of that sound), while I do love the sound, I love good music even more. I have a few albums that to my ears were shoddily recorded but had contained fantastic songs...I sometimes get frustrated that those songs weren't presented in the best light (sound) possible, but I'll never not play them because the sound isn't right; the songs are just too good (to me)!
I met a guy in a Best Buy of all places who figured me to be a kindred spirit based on the handful of cables I was about to purchase (go figure, in Best Buy; tells you a lot doesn't it...LOL).  We proceeded to have a lengthy discussion about audio and audio equipment and audio engineering, this conversation went on for ages (we closed the store!!).  My take away from that was, I am me and that guy is an audiophile (when you're familiar with the designers and the movements of the various engineers ("...yeah, he started out here (company A) before he got his own thing going (well known company B).  You are in deep my friend, thanks for the education but unless that lottery win comes my way (and that will like the virgin birth as i don't play), I'll be scrounging near the bottom of the barrel for scraps (decent mid-fi sounding scraps mind you - nudge nudge, wink wink).

Contact me. I am in Northern New Jersey and I manufacturer DACs, phono stages, preamps and amps. I can demonstrate what things sound like to help educate you. These ae reference component. I also have a few good dealers that can help you if you are serious. Maybe even take a ride to Fremmers.

Happy Listening,.

1st thing you need to do is bring out GIK or ASC (or someone similar) to your house to treat your room. If you have a terrible sounding room, no amount of money spent on quality gear will overcome a sh$tty sounding room.

Go out and listen to friends, dealers, or at shows gear to determine what kind of sound you like. Do you like tubes? Solid state? Mix of tube pre and solid state amp? Do you like smaller monitors or the bigger floorstanding speakers? You going to listen loud? Soft? Near field? Once you get a taste of what you like, then you can start narrowing it down to specific pieces of equipment.
Also, don’t evaluate any equipment for a final decision is a dealers showroom, bring it home into your room and your system to hear how it sounds.

I can't believe how many respondents fell for this "Pauly Folly".
You've been played!! 
Well done 6001!

Here is my two cents based on my experience. First of all identify kind of music you love. Jazz & Classical, or Rock & Pop or Rap & Country, etc. I assume you have your favorite music on CDs.

Select the 4 or 5 CDs. You may want to focus on voices Male & female, certain instruments electric guitar, acoustic guitar, double bass, kick drum, etc. Then take these CDs to nearest hi fi audio stores. You are in NY and there are a plenty of these.


Play these CDs on a number of systems focus on things such as how letter "s" and "t" sounds, is there enough bass or whether bass is boomy or soft. Pay attention to imaging from left to right and front to back. See if the soundstage goes outside of the speakers depending on how your CDs are recorded.

Some of us have CDs that specifically emphasize certain aspects of music. If you want to know if the system has good bass, then you should have a CD ex: One Night in Vienna. When you play this track, you should hear good solid bass right in the middle of the speakers with piano back in the soundstage.

Pay attention to the high frequency reproduction. Crashing symbols should not be ear-piercing. When system sound bright, listening fatigue will set very soon. Main idea is to listen to music all day long without any hiccups.

First thing is to identify the speakers you think fit your taste. KEF Q150 is a book shelf speaker. You may want to decide if you like floor standing speakers. With Uni-Q drives, I know KEF speakers can perform at a very high-level granted you are not dying to hear below 51 Hz. Your room play a big role in accurate reproduction of bass. If you think you can live with Q150, then see if you can find an amp to drive these. I think there are good tube amplifiers as well as SS that can bring magic out of these speakers without having to take a second mortgage.Hope this helps.

Commented on lather audiophile th8ngy!

 If you like it, if it sounds great, that’s it, enjoy, and your an audiophile (if u think you are)

 am I one, no, I don’t think so, I just love music!

A response to MillerCarbon and some general observations.

I will refer to MillerCarbon as MC going forward. And he may well be the MC of this forum.

First, a soft shot before I begin to gush. MC, you seem to not to think highly of the "quality" of my original question. As I said upfront, I’m a stranger in these here parts. But aren’t there rules of etiquette? Is that kind of cheap criticism what I can expect on the Audiogon forums?

Also, judging from the response, it provoked a great deal of interest. Been the number one post all day. Maybe not such a bad question, after all.

Next, you ask me what I’m doing on this forum. Am I a spy? Am I just lurking about?

I came to this forum to find an answer to a very specific question: Can I leave my NAD integrated on all the time. I found many, many answers. Both sides were equally well-reasoned, well-presented. No winner. There were, however, a lot of posts from guys who had left their amp on for decades with no problem. There were no posts from anybody saying, "One day, it just blew up."

Besides, I can log onto Audiogon, can’t I? This is a free country, isn’t it? Oh, right. I forgot. Never mind.

Now, and perhaps most importantly, big points for the Big Lebowski quickie. Never viewed that movie threw an audiophile lens but that’s the beauty of it. Every time you watch it you learn something new. Right, Dude?

As to the Raven amp, I didn’t watch the video but I read the piece in Enjoy The Music. That article clearly drove home the care, the pride this guy took in his amps. I’m sure the video does the same.

I see things through a journalist’s eye, because I was one for many years. (Pretty much every journalist is "former" now. The internet leveled the industry like Vesuvious leveled Pompei.) Without even knowing you, I’m seeing a 5,000 word profile in the New Yorker. The audio stuff is great and something tells me that you’ve got more. The soldering gets us in, we open up from there.

But the poor New Yorker isn’t buying any freelance pieces. The new issue is like a pamphlet. No one is buying ad space. With good reason, I guess. And no one else wants a 5,000 word profile, no matter how good. The pay is pitiful these days. That used to be a $10,000 piece. Now, if I could get someone to buy it, they’d cut it down to 1,000 words and pay me $500. No thanks.

MC, there’s something interesting about you, something that stands out from every audiophile I’ve ever met/read/shared forum space with. Everybody says the same thing: It’s all about the music. Never think about the equipment. "I only care about the music. The gear means nothing to me," might as well be the audiophile’s pledge of allegiance.

That claim has always rang hollow. I’m a music-heavy guy. I listen constantly, still get in the mosh at a Nick Cave concert (a recent example), and I go years and years without buying any equipment. I still love the gear. An issue of Stereophile is pornography. I hide it under my mattress.

But literally 100 percent of the many responses I got today told me to ignore the gear. It’s all about the music. Really? What do you spend more time reading/writing about: A great new album or a great new DAC?

You didn’t say anything explicit to make me think that you’re any different, MC, but talking about the soldering the way you do—making it almost sexual—I can only imagine what you have to say about something like tube choice. You love the gear, and I’m guessing that you aren’t shy about admitting it.

And now, having pissed everyone off by raising the dread gear/music issue, the third rail of audiophilia, I will disappear. This forum is a great resource. A tremendous well of knowledge. I’m very glad that it’s here. I’m sorry if I’m taking without giving. I’ll go back to Pitchfork, AllMusic, and JazzTimes. Thank you, Audiogon.

@erik_squires  per 12:24am...+1K 👍

And most importantly have fun and enjoy the journey you have decided to embark on. 
Your opinion matters as it relates to you spending your resources (time, money, space)

I still envy my dogs life...but opposable thumbs are required for operating much my equipment.  

I live the audiophile life by producing my own homemade embeddings methods and tweaks... Very rewarding....Cost peanuts and gives more fun than buying ready made costly partial solutions only....

No one can impress me now with their system really, even if they are better in S.Q. than mine, and many are, but, for the price paid, thanks to my 3 embeddings solutions, my audio system+ room is without competition except for the look... :)

^^^cool site^^^......Man oh man I remember for YEARS waiting for the new(printed paper magazine)Equipment Buying Guides from Stereophile,TAS,Hi Fi News,Hi Fi Choice & a few others long gone now & digesting them over a years time till the next came out,each one dog eared & ink marked up with the wishlist...Now all that is readily available on the net making it much easier to live the audiophile life...

Well, you’re on the right track by coming to the forum and asking your questions.

The audiophile life is going to be different for each person as other members have stated.

I think going to different audiophile websites is definitely one way to learn more about it.

But there are so many that it can become overwhelming to stay on top off.

Fortunately I found this site (I am sure other members already know about it) called https://www.dailyaudiophile.com/, which combines headlines from numerous audiophile websites on one page.

It’s a nice way to get a quick glance at some new stuff and then you can spend hours by going to each site and browsing around.

I don’t know if it contains a link to every single audiophile website out there but it definitely is a good solid list.

Going to shows is also another great way to become more familiar with equipment from so many different manufacturers, unfortunately this year sux for that. Hopefully next year.

Hope that helps you on your journey.