Dedicated CD Transport vs DAC

Quality DAC first. Besides, you can use DAC with 24/96 streaming rather than CD transport limited to 16/44 CDs. Sorry, haven't owned CD transport for like 15 years, everything is long ripped into lossless files.

@no_regrets I think your questions on the transport were essentially answered in your 2 transport threads. That said, a quality DAC requires a transport that is on par quality wise otherwise you will not get the full SQ that the DAC can deliver. And, you need to understand which of the transport’s outputs has been optimized to also get more out of it. The improvements in SQ in both respects are very apparent and "worth" it. Ultimately only you can determine by listening for yourself which DAC suits your listening tastes. There are plenty of quality DACs but they don’t all sound the same, and/or have their own tradeoffs. Net net only you can decide which avoids the issues you described

DAC. It will depend on the rest of your system, how well you choose your components and the rest of your system. Provided you are doing your research and investing similarly for both, maybe ~ 70% DAC.

But you really want a great DAC since it is the foundation for streaming which should be available at comparable prices and sound quality as a good transport. Moving to streaming and skipping CDs and stored files makes sense today.

I have owned many DACs, streamers. My first very good dac was the Schitt YGGY. From there Denafrips, Pontus, and Terminator 12th. Streamer, every Eversolo model , Hi Rose 130,Aurender n200 and N20. My experience is this. The Dac makes the most difference. However I found it not about being better, it PRESENTATION. It’s what sounds good to you. For example the terminator is,more expensive than the Pontus, but I, preferred its sound over the more expensive terminator. Having said that I purchased a Holo May Kte and that was end game for me. It greatly improved the sound of my Cd transport and streamer. 
I preferred the the Eversolo A8 over the Hi Rose 130. I ended up buying N20 after purchasing the N200. The N20 was endgame for me as it was the best sounding to my ears then all the others. That’s my journey. 

DAC , absolutely but I just added a Teac VRDS 701T and it is much better sounding as the OPPO 103 I was using.   No comparison.    The OPPO sounded small and closed in , the Teac sounds huge with tons of detail.    Not subtle.  

I thought you purchased the LTA Areo DAC?  Aren't you also interested in the Jay's CD2MK3?

Assuming you mean a CD player and not "quality dedicated CD Transport " as Transports do not have much of a sound on their own as they do not have a DAC in them.  

From my experience if the Transport is decent enough not to put errors or other anomalies on the output then the DAC is the go-to place for sound quality.  

I f you have a good CD player or transport now, upgrading the DAC will be the largest improvement in sound quality. Do not skimp on a DAC cheap ones will not get you close to your vinyl rig. Good ones will get you there or beyond. 

In my experience, a better transport will simply extract more data from the disc. How much improvement YOU will hear, I can’t say. Consider the fact that the transport is first in the chain. 

With DACs, the sky’s the limit. The good news is that it’s not necessary to spend near as much on the transport. Buy something like a Jay’s CDT2MKIII and you’ll be set, no matter which DAC you end up with.

@glennewdick No question that the DAC is more important however if you have had a decent transport and then swapped in a better transport the impact is quite noticeable and shouldn’t be discounted 

DAC is the heart of the modern system.

I’m using a Vecteur L.4 cd player as transport through a great coax cable into an Audio Note Kit 3.1 DAC that was prebuilt but retubed by me.

Recently I purchased an Arcam CD5 transport because of the terrific reviews ("great with vocals" "great sense of space" "great bass punch" et cetera). And I wanted to see how the new Arcam compared to the 20+ year-old Vecteur.

Wow, after doing an A/B, I was SHOCKED at how anemic and thin the Arcam sounded compared to the Vecteur. Putting it into automotive terms, the difference was as substantial as comparing an old Volkswagen Beetle (the new Arcam!) to a new BMW (the old Vecteur!). The naturally airy lushness and warm musicality of the Vecteur completely outperformed the Arcam.

So, I would agree with facten above that transports can make a HUGE difference. I would also encourage you to get high quality and well-reviewed after-market cables and vibration dampeners. I’ve found that each component I’ve upgraded has opened up the sound, making it more natural and "magical."

I completely sold out to digital in 1989 and as time progressed, so did the quality of the CD playback I bought.  Sometime in the late '90s I was listening to three pieces of digital separates  (Rega transport, Genesis Time Lens, Muse Model 2 DAC) and about three or four years ago I took another plunge and bought a Maranzt SA10.  This is the best CD playback I have owned yet, and depending upon the quality of the disc I am playing pack, I am highly satisfied.  

@facten  Hello and thank you for your post!

How does a manufacturer optimize one digital output over another?

Why wouldn’t they want all digital outputs to sound great?

I would think that by only optimizing one output you would be limiting your market base?

Best wishes,

Don

@oddiofyl Hello and thank you for your post!

It’s great to know that you are hearing a much better sound from your new Teac vs the Oppo as a transport… that there is no comparison!

That helps give me more faith in replacing my old Rotel 955ax with a dedicated cd transport.  

Im curious, are you using an external clock in addition to the Teac transport?

Thank you and best wishes,

Don

@mesch 

Hello!

Yes, I did purchase a new LTA Aero Dac. 
I’m currently using and old Rotel 955AX cd player as a transport via it’s rca digital out. 
Im now trying to ascertain if spending another $2500 to $5000 on a dedicated cd transport will garner a “significant” improvement in sound and be worth the cash outlay.  
 

Best wishes,

Don

The better the DAC and transport usually the better.But not always. Dac and transport if you can match them with the right cabling and in your system, you will get 3D and good macro and micro dynamics.my Ares denafriifs and Yamaha s1000 with the wrong digital cable they won’t give me 3D , when I tried using my Audioquest diamond ic . It gave me 3D and dynamics.Gear can’t do it alone, you have to keep on trying different cables till you get what you want.By the way Iam using marigo apparition digital cable used.

I would also say DAC first, but transport also is very important...I also was not happy with my OPPO as a transport...agree digital cable also important as it's really a digital system you're putting together...and then there are power cords...some here always try to get others to stop playing CD's, which to me is very poor advise...and yes I enjoy streaming and have 3 streamers...

What are your impressions of the LTA DAC so far (I’m gonna guess it doesn’t suck)?  It’s clear a better transport can make a significant difference, and using a lesser one on a good DAC is like putting budget all-season tires on a Porsche.  Likewise, the digital cable also matters a lot, and at your level I wouldn’t spend less than $200 on one and up to $600 new.  Here’s a very good one (read reviews) at a nice discount if you’re in the market…

https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649210067-acoustic-zen-mc2-digital-cable/

Jay’s and Teac are obvious choices, but if your wallet’s still hurting from the LTA I’d definitely see if you can get a Shanling ET3 with a return policy as it’s getting very positive reviews and is much less expensive.  Either way, I wouldn’t cheap out on the transport (or digital cable) with a good DAC.  Just my $0.02 FWIW.

@soix

Hi,

I’ve only had it for a week so I only have very initial impressions at the moment.
Also keep in mind that I have only used my vintage Rotel 955AX as a transport.

I bought the Acoustic Zen Absolute “copper foil” true 75 ohm digital cable terminated in RCA. You can buy it at the Cable Company for $552. My whole system is loomed with AZ Absolute cables and to my ears do a great job.

My early impressions of the LTA is very positive!

It uses tubes, but the sound isn’t what I think most people would consider “tubey”.
I feel that many people might stereotype a tubed product to sound warm, with limited dynamics, slow or sluggish, thick or sryupy with mushy bass, etc. 

This dac is dynamic! Both in the micro and macro sense of the word.

It’s fast! It’s not slow or sluggish or mushy… not in the least!

The tonal qualities are outstanding! I’ve been a musician for 50 years playing tenor and bass trombone in jazz venues and my Montagnana cello in classical venues. Although I can no longer play at a professional level due to my strokes, I hear live acoustic music several nights a week. I feel that I know and understand the tone of instruments. I can easily discern the difference between Bach and King brass instruments; or between Steinway and Yamaha grand pianos, etc.

Listening to brass instruments, the sound is pure! It’s dynamic, it’s got density and weight to the sound without being thick.

Listening to Art Blakey playing the drums… my God! He can hit those toms and you can feel it! You sense the skin on the snare and the shimmer of the brass symbols is amazing!

Piano has great transient attacks but you hear the sound board beautifulness in the grand piano! Hearing all the fine details of the creaking of the piano bench.

Don’t even get me started on the sound of the acoustic bass! The fullness and resonance of the wooden body, but again, not sounding thick or muddy. Hearing the plucking of the strings or the bow gliding across the strings.

I am impressed with this dac. What surprised me is how good it sounds being driven by my lowly vintage Rotel cd player. Hence my sincere questions about, does a dedicated cd transport really make a significant difference in the sound?

I remember listening to a YouTube video where the reviewer had an $11,000 Ayon and couldn’t hear a significant difference from using a $40 Best Buy cd player as a transport. He was embarrassed and ashamed of his preconceived notions that the Ayon would wipe the floor, but it didn’t.

In any case , I trust the comments of my fellow forum members over a random YouTube video.

Best wishes,

Don

@no_regrets - I can'y give you the whys and wherefores as to why transports may have optimized outputs but for instance my SimAudio 260DT is optimized for AES/EBU. I got that 1st hand from SimAudio. I also read that for instance the top of the line Project is as well; certainly there are others. I don't see how any transport that has multiple outputs limits their market by optimizing one; the rest aren't poor sounding just not optimal.

If anything the LTA Aero potentially doesn't allow users to match it with the best capabilities of a transport because of its limited inputs.

@facten My apologies! I think I may have miss understood what you were saying about the optimization of one output vs the others. Totally my bad.

I was thinking that they optimize just one output; meaning the remaining output’s would not sound good. So, in other words, don’t bother with that transport if you can’t use the optimized output.

Im sorry I misunderstood, but appreciate you helping me understand better!

Yes, the Aero may indeed limit some people due to the relatively few inputs that it has. However, based on what I have heard from it so far, I’m enjoying what it’s doing with the RCA input 👍

Best wishes,

Don

Thanks for your thoughts on the LTA and not surprised it sounds great. I’ve also got a full loom of AZ cables so we’re definitely on the same page there. I also have an LTA MZ2 pre (with upgraded LPS) and know what you mean about their stuff not sounding overly “tubey.” The positive traits are there but just doesn’t scream tubes, which is what I really like about it and exactly why I bought it.

Anyway, I forgot to mention another cheaper option that would be to get DDC to improve the performance of your Rotel rather than buying a whole new transport. I bought a used DDC to try it out and kept it because it produced very significant improvements. Here’s a Denafrips Hermes that I believe you can return if it doesn’t transform the performance of your Rotel — my guess is it would with its excellent OCXO clock. Just another option again FWIW.

https://tmraudio.com/components/d-a-converters/denafrips-hermes-ddc-d-d-converter-4/

Strange the LTA has balanced out but no balanced in. That would be a more optimal choice if it did!