dac recommendations for turntable listener?

I have the direct stream dac and it sounds exactly the opposite of how you described it. I’m puzzled. But…another dac to consider that’s warm and has body is Bryston BDA-3. Out of curiosity what interconnects and power cables have you tried with the ps audio? And what firmware version are you running?

we have had the lab 12in house it is very warm and lacks resolution

just looked at the Mearson it doesn’t have USB so it cant handle high resolution files so I would also pass on that one,

the lampis are excellent sounding.

We would recommend you look at the Aqua hifi Lascala:

It is very musical, tube based: and r2r so very analog like.

plays all high resolution files.

the dac is built on a modular, upgradable, platform so as technology improves the dac can improve as well

Dave and Troy

audio Intellect NJ

Aqua Hifi dealers

@audphile1 that's very interesting, the only other external dac ive ever had is the denafrips aeries ii, I thought it was nice sounding and relaxed, but still lacked midrange body compared to my entry level turntable at the time with a 2m blue cartridge. the ps dsd is very shouty in comparison to the denfrips and my turntables, it doesn't have that effortless sound to my ears. the high frequencies are very sharp and I cant listen for more than an hour at a time. I feel like I always have to turn it up in order to get that lower midrange presence, and then the highs are too loud by that time. there is also a lot of sibilance with female vocals, going from sunlight to the one before it reduced this sibilance a tiny amount, and also going from usb input to optical also helped a tiny bit too, but its still there. my turntable throws a huge soundstage not only is it 3d but the images within that soundstage are 3d, this is where the dsd sounds flat in comparison (even though its soundstage is deeper than my turntable, the images themselves are very 2d). the turntable is also very effortless like music just flows out of the speakers (its really a hard thing for my to describe so please bare with me) and all the details are there they're just very smooth. the dsd is lacking that body and weight. 

im streaming from Qobuz mostly, and regular cds, as well as some local dsd files. rcd's are bluejeans or silver serpant, and power cord is ps audio ac5. I will look into the bryston.

@audiotroy thank you for that suggestion I will look into it! 

also the merason does have usb to my knowledge and can play up to 192 👍🏼

What are you using as a streamer? Is it just the network card in the dac? If that’s the case it’s not the best. 
I had a pretty good analog setup - MoFi Ultradeck with Hana ML into Sutherland 20/20 with LPS and it was nice but it didn’t match up to my Bricasti M3 DAC that I had at the time. The PS Audio DSD DAC actually sounds warmer than the M3 did. I’m using Aurender N200 streamer. 

@audphile1 mostly laptop for streaming Qobuz, I tried Qobuz via Airplay just to test the optical with something other than cd player, and I actually preferred the sound this way. however its still night and day different compared to my turntable set up, I don't think ill be able to achieve the sound im looking for in my room by changing things like cables and transports/streamers. 

its certainly interesting you've had a very different experience than me, maybe due to differences in room, or perhaps personal tastes. I feel like your analogue setup of that caliber would blow away this dac in almost every way. 

I recently upgraded from a Schiit Gumby to the Merason Reuss DAC, which is their new mid-range, though hardly mid-priced DAC. I do not have experience with enough DAC’s to compare, but my overall description of the sound would be natural. A friend has the DAC1, and he has heard a lot of DAC’s, he is sticking with the Merason. I would give one a try. 
 

And they definitely support USB!

Get yourself a used MHDT DAC, very nice analogue sounding, tube DAC

mostly laptop for streaming Qobuz, I tried Qobuz via Airplay just to test the optical with something other than cd player, and I actually preferred the sound this way. however its still night and day different compared to my turntable set up, I don’t think ill be able to achieve the sound im looking for in my room by changing things like cables and transports/streamers.

I respectfully disagree — you likely won’t be able to achieve the sound you’re looking for streaming from a laptop, or at the very least it will be a significant bottleneck and your cheap interconnects aren’t doing you any favors either. These things matter significantly in streaming just like every piece in an analog setup matters. So you can spend $$$ on something like a nice Lampizator DAC, but feeding it with your current setup would be an insult and counterproductive to achieving your goal.  The fact that you and @audphile1, who has a very good streaming setup, are hearing very different results from the same DAC tells you everything you need to know here.

It took a Valve Rectified Power Supply / Valve Output DAC to really get me weaned onto CD.

Admittedly, the DAC was also Bespoke built for me to have a sonic I have been able to be endlessly impressed with.

I checked out ’Abbas Audio’ a recommended on the Gon, DAC producers site recently and could not but help draw parallels on this site, to the experience I have had getting my DAC produced.

A D.U.C.C Wire used as a COAX will add a hint of Richness that will tame anything with an edge, that draws attention.

The same Wire will also be very revealing when used with a device that has a perception of Richness to the Tonality. 

guys I think I found out what my issue is!... for the heck of it I moved the dsd to my bedroom setup, which consists of heresy iii/forte iii diy speaker and a sabaj class d $100 amp, this set up was strictly used for watching movies. I think the room is the issue. the main listening room is a big L shaped room. 14 ft by 22 feet in the bottom section of the "L" where I listen, the other section of the L is 13ft by 30ft. my bedroom is 13 by 16ft. 

the bedroom sounds 10x better. I knew the room was important, and mine had suckouts in the bottom frequencies but I didn't know it made THIS much of a difference. all that fullness with the dsd is there! im listening at 80db instead of typical 90db, as I don't have to turn it up to feel loud, I think the better balance is helping out with the over sharpness/fatigue I was getting in the other room. 

the turntable in my main room I would say is barely passable when it comes to being enough fullness in the lower midrange/bass, but my worry now is If I move it to this room its going to be way too mushy/syrupy and full, as the dac sounded anorexic in the main room but sounds amazing in my bedroom. 

this has made me rethink of everything , completely eye opening experience. I may move my room, or try to close off the "L" shaped room somehow so that the listening area is a rectanglular room. 

id also like to add that there's no subwoofer in the bedroom and the bass is bigger fuller more sustained more decay. these diy heresy/forte speakers I originally had in my main room but purchased elysian 4's as the diy speakers were very very thin sounding in that room. now im questioning my elysian purchase as even though they sound fuller in my main room than my diy speakers (and better in almost every other area) , I feel I might not have needed them had the room been better. im very confused overall , bare with me lol 

Mojo Audio makes some real good natural

sounding Dacs I’ve owned a few and would put them up against anything!

Good! The hustle paid off and now you know. 
I will also tell you, +1 @soix 

Streamer will improve things even further. I used mac mini for a while and didn’t believe a streamer can make this much difference but alas 4 streamers later I’m getting the performance I was expecting from my system…but the important part is every one of the streamers sounded different and better than the computer. 
 

@audphile1 I have a bluesound node coming in the mail tomorrow I figure that’s a good inexpensive place to start. I turned this bedroom system up to 90db just to have a comparison with what I wa listening to in the main room, still a tinyyyy but sharp to my ears, but this is going through the diy horn speakers, and not my primaluna tube amp, and no room treatment, but the point is it’s at a level now where I can definitely see streamers/cables making a difference and getting me to where I want to be. I definitely don’t need to turn it up to 90db as 80 in this room feels louder bigger and fuller than 90 in my main room. I’ll report back once I listen to the streamer! 

+1 for the Bryston BDA-3.

  It’s particularly great with DSD.  I find that most analog lovers prefer digital as DSD

"I respectfully disagree — you likely won’t be able to achieve the sound you’re looking for streaming from a laptop"

@soix +1

If it’s not just all about the warmth ,detail counts then 100% , the T+A 200 dac,preamp you can get a good deal for under $6500 and will compete 

very well with anything 2x it’s price and has a true resistive ladder ,relay preamplifier hat is very good if you chose to use it .My brother owns one and visiting many in audio clubs in and outside New England it’s a very natural sounding dac with excellent balance all around , read the Many accolades and get  a dealer to ship you one to audition.

The Node will be a nice improvement over laptop. Just use a good usb or coax. 

You didnot mention your budget.I already mentioned a Big crowd favorite in

the T+A 200 dac- preamp  at retail before discounts $7200,

if you cant affor thatLinearTube Audio brand new dac I heard briefly 

has a lot to offer the 6sn7 tube it uses are very natural ,even better with good nos tubes just under $4k .

Definitely audition the Merason DAC 1 

I haven’t listened to the MKII, but I love the MKI :)

https://parttimeaudiophile.com/2023/03/12/lab12-dac1-review/

https://parttimeaudiophile.com/2023/12/02/2024s-best-digital-playback-buyers-guide-2024/

I listened to the Merason Freot and original Merason DAC 1 . They were good. The Lab 12 DAC 1 Reference is what I took home that day. I really like this DAC.

From what I’ve read, the WADAX Reference is the closest to vinyl…

thanks for all the recommendations everyone! I plugged in the node to my system and I cant believe the difference it made. everything is a lot smoother, a lot fuller, more weight, more scale, and more effortless sounding. pretty much identical to my turntable in those regards, except the turntable is a little smoother in the upper midrange (the ps audio is still a tad bit sharp here with female vocals) , and still gives a better illusion of the musicians being in the room, I think this is due to the images being more 3d. the dac is better at soundstage depth, and imaging (placement within the stage especial form left to right) 

im very happy that the dac is way more musical now and far less analytical and 2d sounding. 

I demo'd the Merason dac1 today along with the dsd on bowers and Wilkins 800 d3, it was a tiny bit better than the ps audio in most of the categories (soundstage depth, midrange and treble air, vocal presence, bass and midrange fullness, and especially tone of the instrments). it really felt like in another league. however I don't think im going to upgrade or change at this time as im pretty happy with how the ps audio sounds now other than the tiny bit of upper midrange sharpness that still remains.

next step is figuring out how to make my main room sound as good as my bedroom.

thanks again everyone for the suggestions! 

I agree with the Aqua LaScala. The closest I’ve come to analog sound when streaming. I have heard a few DAC’s and am very pleased with my LaScala. If budget is an issue the Bryston BDA3 is excellent. 

OP,

What power cord is currently on the PS Audio DAC? What interconnects and speaker cables are you using? The PS Audio DAC is transparent and resolving. Using high quality cables should improve the sound. 

im pretty happy with how the ps audio sounds now other than the tiny bit of upper midrange sharpness that still remains.

Your very cheap interconnects are doing you no favors with this and should be the next thing you explore.  As you found with adding the Node, everything in streaming matters and matters a lot.  You should also consider adding an upgraded LPS (Teddy Pardo, etc.) to the Node at some point as it provides a nice performance boost for relatively not much $$$.  In any event, glad to hear you’re happier with your streaming performance but there is more to be had there.

@palutena, what you needed from day 1 was a dac or streamer with a parametric eq (PEQ) feature.

Fo example, the Wiim pro plus is a 200 dollar streamer with a 10 band PEQ feature. Use it to bump up the mids, lower the highs, etc all with very wide Qs, adjust to taste, create your vinyl sound. From there, run it to your denafrips.

It will become the best sounding ’vinyl’ you ever heard with no pops, crackles, no running back and forth between turntable and couch like a ceaseless laborer, etc.

Otherwise, the squirrels in your head will keep bouncing too much everytime the recordings change (I used to be a vinyl guy too).

Good luck.

I went through a similar search and stumbled upon the Electrocompanient 1 MKII.

It does not get much press but does offer a nice warm rich sound.

Worth looking into.

Good luck.

Ha!, I was going to suggest the Directstream MK1 closeout sale, and then I see you didn’t like it, and then I see the change with a different room and setup. Truly, this is a subjective experience and synergy matters. Everything’s connected.

I do not think an entry-level DAC and streamer or even a step above that will get you close to vinyl.  I have a Simaudio Moon 780dV2 with an outboard Moon 820s power supply which is driven by the Roon Nucleus+, and the sound it produces is excellent and rivals vinyl, and the convenience is amazing.  One of the newer Moon North integrated systems that includes a DAC and Streamer would be worth looking into or the dCS Linea or Bartok.  You will need a budget of roughly $10,000 - $20,000 new or used to get what you are looking for.

I recently upgraded my streamer to a Innuos Zen Mk3. I'm using it with a Gustard R26 r2r dac. I'm quite happy with it. I think the Gustard is excellent for the money.

My vinyl playback is decent, but not crazy expensive. Marantz TT-15S1 turntable, Hana ML moving coil cartridge, and Sutherland TZ Vibe phono stage. It sounds really good, but I mostly stream now. 

I had been playing cds and SACD through my Denon DCD-1700NE, but now that I have the Innuos streamer, I'm not using it much. 

Check out Audio Mirror Toubadour V. Sounds as good as a lampizator pacific for a lot less. I have had one for several months and it’s been very analog sounding. It also has some DDC technology within (similar to if you added a Denafrips DDC to the chain for example). 
 

I also have the merason DAC 1 MKII and has a different sound from the Toubadour V. I think I prefer the AM Toubadour V by a shade. 

@audphile1 @soix im currently using the ac5 power cord, I have swapped with the generic power cord and admittedly I don't hear much of a difference, I think the ac5 is airier, even though its subtle im pretty confident I would pass a blind test. 

currently using skw optical cable and bluejeans rca's to the integrated. 

I have a pair of occ neotech rca's on the way hopefully they arrive next week. and looking into getting a good usb or coax to go from node to dsd. 

Blue jeans are decent cables (I keep a set of RCAs as a spare) but you can improve upon them.
So my recommendation is…You have to start from the amp/speakers and work your way upstream. 

I would tackle the speaker cables first. For the horns I’d try something from Cardas or Acoustic Zen Satori. Smooth and detailed - no brittleness in the mids or highs. 
Then interconnects from DAC to amp. Then USB from Node to DAC. 

Agree with @soix......

There are tons of streamers out there in very reasonable price range that will be better than the laptop.  As for DACS, the lots of Lampizator owners are usually looking to move up the scale to more expensive models.  Look for used Baltic or Atlantic if you're looking for more on the analog side of things.  And then you can do some tube rolling to tweak the sound to your liking even further.

Agree with @soix......

There are tons of streamers out there in very reasonable price range that will be better than the laptop.  As for DACS, the lots of Lampizator owners are usually looking to move up the scale to more expensive models.  Look for used Baltic or Atlantic if you're looking for more on the analog side of things.  And then you can do some tube rolling to tweak the sound to your liking even further.

@palutena

Bricasti is warm and accurate and detailed in a perfect balance

@audphile1 speaker cables are diy canare 4s11, and im thinking of purchasing a pair of occ cables I think the brand is 1877phono zavfino. the speakers are elysian 4, horns are retired and just used in bedroom for tv/movies. 

I let you know once the occ neotech cables arrive, then I will try to get a good coax/usb cable. 

thanks again for all the suggestions. still blows my mind that the entry level streamer made such a huge difference 

Well it’s all you. You kept at it and didn’t give up. 

And yes, streamers make a difference. 

The Canare 4s11 speaker cables aren’t terrible. I own a pair. They’re not resolution champs but they also don’t sound harsh. 

Work on room acoustics next. Treating first reflection point (side walls) usually does wonders to tame harshness. Bass traps behind speakers help as well - the bass is more focused and controlled which will help balance out the mids and highs and with better bass the sound will be fuller and not as brittle. 

Once you’re done with room acoustics I strongly recommend Acoustic Zen Satori over Zavfino. I owned pretty much all AZ cables and I can tell you they sound natural, don’t have the sibilance in vocals and have excellent details and warmth. On a used market they’re a bargain. 
Zavfino is just OK. I tried their interconnects and they were mediocre at best. A friend of mine had their speaker cables and didn’t like them. 
Don’t get too hung up on OCC. it isn’t a guarantee of perfect sound. Keep the neotech when it arrives but focus on good room then speaker cables.
 

The Sonnet Morpheus is a great R2R analog sounding DAC with very nice built in preamp.

+1 on adding a better power supply to the Node. This should help with the sibilance, tame harshness and add more clarity. I highly recommend Fidelity Audio in UK. Their Reference interface board and LPS make an exceptional difference. But the Teddy Pardo and PD Creative options are also good, and less $$.

DAC for phonophilers?  Good luck with that.

Glad you isolated the difference the room can make. It can transform the sound of any system, typically at a lower expense (and significantly less risk) than new electronic gear. Good acoustics will allow you to accurately assess your system and adjust it to your listening preferences. 

To your original question, I settled in on the Asthetix Romulus Eclipse CD/DAC unit. Being a tube hybrid, I was able adjust the top-end harshness of digital to my smoother "analog" preference by rolling the tubes to NOS Telefunken and Amperex Bugle Boy, and I found the process to be fun and educational. 

FWIW, my streamer source is a Lumin U-1 and interconnects are Synergistic USB and Transparent XLR,   

Good luck.

I know, this might not be your price range (and neither is it mine if I'd to pay list), but I just got a MSB "Discrete", the junior model in the MSB stable, and playing DSD256 it is almost indistinguishable from my analog versions of the same tracks.

I found mine on the Aussie AudioMart site for about 50% off (good present exchange rate helped): one of the best purchases I ever made. The "naturalness" , stage depth, and complete absence of the usual "in-your-face" DAC presentations (like the DirectStream, which I had five years ago, and most other ones in the sub-5K dollar range) makes my listening truly enjoyable and non-fatiguing. As an analog vinyl head, I can honestly say: this is almost it!  Up to now, I was quite happy with the Gustard R26, another resistor-ladder-DAC, which is now for sale at USAudioMart. You might want to check it out.

@reimarc

I have a Gustard R26 dac.  I've thought about upgrading, but I think it would take an upgrade like you made to make it worthwhile. 

Definitely a DAC with a tube in it. Audio Mirror Toubadour IV $3500.....Smooth as Silk!

I had a DirectStream I DAC with a network card that I was NOT happy with. It sounded like your description. HOWEVER I upgraded to a DirestStream II and added a AirLens and VIOLA! actual analogue sound. 

I have auditioned a number of DACs and the one that sounds better than the above upgrade (to me ) is 2.5X the price PlayBack Designs. The extra 17K price tag was as they say "juice not worth the squeeze".  If I had 300 million dollars it would be no biggie. However I'm still a working stiff so I'm on a budget.