Maybe this has something to do with it...
"The dynamic range of an audio system is a measure of the difference between the smallest and largest amplitude values that can be represented in a medium. Digital and analog differ in both the methods of transfer and storage, as well as the behavior exhibited by the systems due to these methods.
The dynamic range of digital audio systems can exceed that of analog audio systems... An LP made out of perfect vinyl would have a theoretical dynamic range of 70 dB. Measurements indicate maximum actual performance in the 60 to 70 dB range."
and,
"...the dynamic range of a 16-bit / 44.1 kHz CD is over 90 dB — slightly greater than the range of human hearing."
Is it possible that you need to turn up the volume on your analog source to replicate what you typically hear from your digital source?
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My TT Drive system has been down for 2+ months. I’ve listened to digita exclusively. I am a vinyl fan for one reason. It makes you get more involved because it must be physically handled. You must get up every 20 minutes to change the record. This involvement in general, makes you get more involved in the music itself That involvement may be the reason you have come to the conclusion you have. Digital is convenient.And yes, it sounds good. That convenience allows for more outside activity to take one’s attention. It becomes more background music than the main event
@mitch2
Is it possible that you need to turn up the volume on your analog source to replicate what you typically hear from your digital source?
How would that replicate the dynamic range? Wouldn’t the difference in range still be the same?
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Your point is technically correct since dynamic range is the ratio between the loudest and quietest sounds, yet I have had components that made me want to "chase the volume control" and it always seemed to be related to one component sounding more "dynamic" than the other. In addition, you may still enjoy the sound of the analog equipment more since digital can have its own issues.
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You might want to consider that for best sound quality your digit streamer is inviting you to turn down the volume.
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Lot's of variables including the quality of source components (obviously), but my take on this is, that vinyl is natively analog. No DAC. No square waves converted to sinusoidal. So it sounds better, especially loud.
Case in point - I recently listened to a $350K Nagra system with Wilson speakers. That price included a Nagra TT but we were listening to the DAC.
It sounded super detailed, crystal clear, and effortlessly powerful. But after a few minutes I thought this is cool but no way I'd listen to it for a long session at home. Never mind loud.
Just my 2 cents.
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When it came in printed format, I used to read UHF Magazine (originally Hi-Fi Sound), a Montreal-based journal. The editor had a bee in his bonnet about the idea that if you constantly felt the need to turn up the volume there was something less than ideal in your system. Well, just as a cigar is sometimes just a cigar, I think that sometimes it just sounds so good I want more!
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Either vinyl or digital can be optimized for superb sound. No way a basic digital rig can compare with an optimized vinyl setup, and visa versa.
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Different sources sometime play louder, or, less loud, at the same volume levels, just like sometime volumes levels change from track to track. I found that streamed music on my audio rig sounds just as satisfying to me at loud volume levels as my CD or vinyl set-ups ever did. Happy listening.
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The overall presentation characteristics are created by your equipment not the media. Each leg, digital or analog is a chain of electronics that produce the characteristics you hear at the end. One can sound exceptionally better or worse or different depending on that chain.
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@ghdprentice
The overall presentation characteristics are created by your equipment not the media.
Sorry, but this is only partially true. The media (digital vs. analog) matters.
EDIT: Whether you prefer one or the other is a matter of personal preference.
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+1, @mitch2 on dynamic range.
There is a +/-10dB difference between my analog and digital output. I don’t listen very loud since I am only 8ft away from my speakers.
I believe what you have missed is tactile nature of vinyl playback and its unique sound characteristics that often invites this kind of engagement - turning the volume up and fully diving into the music. I find it very fascinating how the different media formats can shape not just the sound but also the way we interact with and enjoy music.
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@macg19
I am not trying to be argumentative, but add some detail to my comments. While the very significant shortcomings of digital equipment lasted until… well let’s say the last ten years. Now digital can sound pretty much as the designer desires. I have used many phonostage, turntables, DACs, cartridges, streamers and CD players over the last fifty years.
As an example, I configured my current systems (you can see it under my user ID) to very specifically sound like real music in detail and in gestalt. In preparation I attended the symphony in 7th row center seats for a decade… and acoustic jazz concerts. Then I constructed my main system, both analog and digital to sound that way. While vinyl can sound very slightly better or not quite as good depending on the particular pressing they sound the same. I could easily configure a vinyl system to sound less analog than my digital system simply with choice of phono stage and/or cartridge.
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Lots of things can happen.
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@ghdprentice
Thank you for coloring in your comments. I’m familiar with your systems, the main system is an amazing achievement.
Best wishes to you and your friends and family over the holiday season.
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@OP - very nice system. Differences in tonal balance between different sources may become greater at different listening levels. Perhaps the analogue source sounds smoother than the digital - that will be more apparent as the volume level goes up. Conversely, perhaps it is less dynamic sounding, encouraging higher levels in the search for more dynamics - though that's a fruitless pursuit. Lastly, maybe one was just reinvigorated by hearing the turntable having been away from it for a while, and surfing a wave of dopamine. It would be interesting to see if, playing both sources consistently and interchangeably the listening levels still vary or even out over time.
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I think what @ghdprentice is driving at--and I agree-- is that what you are noticing is not universally true for everyone who has both digital and analog front ends. I, for example, do not find myself generally playing one louder than the other. I do find that each piece of music has a volume where it sounds best, and that seems to vary by engineering/ mastering rather than genre or media.
You apparently have a system where one front end has characteristics causing the best sound to be at a higher volume than the other. I would not read into that anything inherent in the media. If you are wondering whether this suggests one front end is ultimately giving you better performance than the other, well, I think the simple answer is to ask which one you enjoy more when played at its ideal volume. You might also consider which of these volume levels more closely matches a live performance. My guess is the louder one.
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Think I tend to do the same thing. Crank up vinyl, not so much when streaming.
At times streaming does have more detail, more of everything. But it can almost sound fake, at times compressed, of course fatiguing.
Vinyl is like a warm blanket, you just get settled in, and enjoy. Will crank it up till the cartridge starts to pick up my speakers. yeah, I need a better isolation for my TT.
There is another big difference, with vinyl, I sit, listen to the entire album. When streaming, it's a playlist, a station, or some mix. bitrates are all over the place, volume is never constant, soundstage, detail, dynamics are all over the place. Every song has it's own "flavor" it makes it much harder to stay in the pocket, disappear into the music. It's not as engaging or intimate. Think that is the reason, why vinyl wins.
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I don't know why people are so resistant to accepting that vinyl has always been much more emotionally involving. Digital sounds very nice, and then you walk out of the room. You might not even be consciously aware of it. People make all kinds of excuses for the difference in listening habits. It's likely due to digital chopping the music into bits, then reconstituting it, with jitter, pre and post echo, phase shift, etc. There's a reason why vinyl records command so much higher prices than cds or even sacds. Sorry folks.
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I made the same observation that vinyl sounded more natural and was more emotionally involving in most systems leading up to around 2010 (since 1982 when the CD was released). But the advance of DACs and streamers and ancillary equipment has been huge and now only true when component choices make each leg sound the way they do. They could (with different component choices) sound the opposite.
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While certainly the equipment can introduce differences in sound, especially phono cartridges, there is also the issue of mastering. With streaming the provenance is usually unknown, while with vinyl it is usually possible to determine the mastering chain. The digital medium itself certainly has a wider dynamic range than vinyl, however this is not always reflected in the music if compression was used in mastering. I have done synchronized A/B level matched comparisons of vinyl vs streamed tracks. Sometimes they are quite different (in that case I usually but not always prefer the vinyl)....sometimes they are virtually indistinguishable. I put most of this down to the mastering.
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It’s simple. Vinyl is easier on the ears. I’m not sure if it’s the digital compression with high frequencies or the warmer sound of the vinyl but vinyl doesn’t fatigue my ears like digital.
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