I will confess that I have never heard $1 million speakers. I am sure that they sound amazing, paired with equally amazing electronics, room, cables, etc. But the point is that there are plenty of very wealthy people in this country and in the world, and if they have $1 billion+, or hundreds of millions, dropping $1 million on a pair of speakers is nothing . . . it is meaningless to them, just like buying a Bugatti Veyron for $1.8 million is meaningless. Do you think someone that has a 200 ft. yacht gives a hoot about yearly maintenance? Or someone who has a Gulfstream 550, that costs more than $1 million a year just to maintain and for pilots, not to mention fuel? They have the money to indulge in whatever they want and cost is irrelevant. I don't think that the existence of these folks impacts the industry as a whole at all, other than the "trickle-down" effect of the technology that went into building the audio equipment.
The new dynamic in speaker pricing
Yesterday I received the latest issue of the Absolute Sound mag. This issue has the round up of the varying speaker manufacturer’s wares along with the retail pricing. One thing that struck me is the number of speaker manufacturer’s who have a speaker in their line up that cost close to a $1M!! There are good number of speakers now available with prices in the $700K+ range. A few manufacturer’s are also a little ’glib’ with their top model pricing, such as Oswalds Mill--who state- price upon inquiry only!
This new speaker pricing dynamic is interesting, as it clearly indicates that there are buyers out there who are happy to pay these prices and presumably enough buyers to make these products viable. A trend that is certainly interesting and yet questionable as to how it will impact the hobby as a whole.
Opinions on this trend?
In most cases with ultra high price speakers one thing (many things) you are certainly paying for is a very large number of drive units. Sensible speaker designers who realised that bling is not the way to go for good sound discovered many years ago that above two a proliferation of drive units worsens the sound quality. This is easily explicable by the number of interactions between drivers: 2 drivers - 1 interaction. 3 -3 4 - 6 5 - 10 6 - 15 and so on. Don't think about the designs with 10 or 15 drivers. Multi-way cross-overs don't help either. Keep it simple, good design and build quality is the way to go. |
+1 @facten |
Look, if anybody wants a million dollar speaker come to me and I'll do you a custom tuned speaker system and charge you a million bucks. Solid concrete no rattling whatsoever, custom crossovers and custom tuned TO YOUR EARS after a thorough audiometry hearing test to find out exactly the extent of your hearing loss. Name me ONE speaker company that would go to that trouble. These charlatans are selling you mass produced overpriced junk. If you charge even $50k a pair, I expect a custom tuned system hand made and hand tuned to MY EARS and MY ROOM and nobody elses. I expect diamond woofers for that level of cost
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@kenjit … “The issue is that, if one idiot buys a million dollar speaker, all the speakers companies will raise their prices and make them unaffordable for the rest of us.”
👍 Good one! 😊 |
I don't mind that there are mega buck speaker systems. They give me something to day dream about when I sometimes buy a ticket for a multi million dollar jackpot lottery. Right now I've narrowed it down to either the MBL 101 Extremes or the Living Voice Vox Olympian. I plan to drive my new 911 to locations where I can hear each of them. |
@barts, many who can afford Ferraris (not all) can also afford to take them to the track and live with the consequences of their screw up. Who is going to take their speakers to a different room if they don't have a custom one? Of course, who has their own race track :-)
Almost no one young dreams of owning a 7 figure speaker. There are an awful lot of people who dream of owning a Ferrari (or some equivalent). |
The thing about Ferraris is that unless you belong to a track club there is really no where to stretch them out. It's an acquired taste that crazy need for speed is! I've driven enough Ferraris and Lambos in my day, fantastic cars, just get ready for $10k service appointments. I've never gotten cited for playing my music too loud...but have plenty of speeding tickets to my name. Regards, barts |
My personal opinion, and really, it is only that. I have a sneaking suspicion that the average person who spend $500K+ on speakers is not an audiophile. I am sure some are, but I expect many are not. I would even question how many of those speakers end up in the very necessary to extract full performance highly customized and tuned room. (Of course I would also questions whether these are really as good as the cost, but that is another discussion). For some people, these are truly audiophile items, but I suspect, again purely opinion, that for many, these are simply luxury items for those with very very large disposable incomes. Without the fully customized room and all the tuning associated, other than visually, the audio experience you will have will be no better than someone who spent far less, but has an acoustically proper setup. This would extend to crazy expensive turntables and electronics as well.
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This (of course) speaks to my own persona....but I'm thinking if a person has $1M to spend just on speakers to flesh out the rest of the system is going to be several million if not many millions including software. And I doubt that is their last millions. So, I would just buy the Fillmore East or create my own venue and bring in top performers. Regards, barts |
Nothing wrong with it, but we know they aren’t getting say 500X "better" sound than from a pair of $2000 Polk R700 for their $1M. What they are getting (hopefully) are speakers that are a work of art, beautiful beyond imagination, ones that will fit into their similarly priced living room and all its expensive appointments. |
"its not a question of whether they have stolen their earnings. The issue is that, if one idiot buys a million dollar speaker, all the speakers companies will raise their prices and make them unaffordable for the rest of us. Why is that so hard to understand?" You and some others act like manufacturers haven’t been making and selling very expensive speakers for some time now; and yet there are still plenty speakers being made at all price points. Not hard at all to find speakers to fit anyone’s budget.
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Of course we can have great sound with much less, but the question is whether any of us would commit if we had the funds.
I believe potential buyers have more than 3 Ferraris, and i expect that if it was for me i would initially want to impress myself not others.
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its not a question of whether they have stolen their earnings. The issue is that, if one idiot buys a million dollar speaker, all the speakers companies will raise their prices and make them unaffordable for the rest of us. Why is that so hard to understand? |
I do not in any way feel this was directed at me. I do not have a system remotely in this category. I have heard some. I have known dealers that have installed high end systems. Typically, the installer is given limited carte blanche with limited to make the system sound great. What I am offended at is folks that put down categories of other audiophiles, whether their budget is small… or in this case large. We should be respectful. Folks with little money or lots all share the same values… the best most enjoyable sounds. |
+1 @baylinor |
Strange reply for someone who is usually well spoken. I can only guess you felt like this implied to you. Of course, no one is stupid or ignorant for buying such speakers, but few go the extra mile to get the most out of them like Mike LaVigne by example. Love the commitment he made to his listening barn. Had fun learning from his design. The ones who don't care about room acoustics just don't get to enjoy their equipment to their full potential is all I was getting at. Sorry it upset you. |
So there is a thin line between moron and maniac LOL. Anyone can spend money how they wish, it is their perogative. I guess my point was pretty much missed across the board. It seems to me a majority of those willing to spend high 6 figures for speakers end up spending about one percent of that on their listening room/acoustic treatment, if even that much. And to me that makes zero sense. If any of you are one of those lucky enough to have been spending high six figures on speakers and 5 % of that on your room acoustics, I apologize. |
Everything in this world is worth exactly the intersection of what a willing buyer will pay and a willing seller will accept. I expect that any enthusiast with the means would have the finest system available to him/her, cost no object. So they may be making THEIR value judgements with speakers with 6 figures, while others do so with 5 figures, or 4 figures, or 3 figures. Its like driving … we all think someone going 10 mph slower is a moron, and 10 mph faster a maniac. |
There will always be folks who earn seven figures or more. If these folks haven’t stolen their earnings, why on earth would folks begrudge what they purchase? If I earned more, I certainly would have a bigger house, better system, better cars, better clothes… and the list goes on and on. I buy what I can afford. They buy what they can afford. Why do folks have such an issue with other’s spending habits? It’s life. There will always be winners and losers. Everyone doesn’t get a participation award. |
" These manufacturers know that the people who pay these exhorbitant amounts are almost never audiophiles. They also know these buyers are the most easily sold a bill of goods in terms of value. " Kind of a broad statement don't you think? Plenty of serious audiophiles with big ticket systems over on WhatsBestForum; and elsewhere. |
These manufacturers know that the people who pay these exhorbitant amounts are almost never audiophiles. They also know these buyers are the most easily sold a bill of goods in terms of value. I saw this ALL the time when I worked in audio...guys who bought the most expensive gear and barely knew how to turn it on. |
I think one is always paying a hefty premium for "statement" design and esoteric materials with a "luxury" product, not necessarily better performance. As a subscriber to the FFF ("Form Follows Function") philosophy, I generally avoid such products. When the function is audio reproduction, the visual aspect of the equipment, including design, fit and finish, and "unobtainium" materials may contribute nothing. Given the same level of performance, I will generally choose the less expensive product over the more expensive prettier one. However, if the more aesthetically appealing one is priced only marginally higher, I will sometimes pay a little more for that, but not so much an order of magnitude. |
Another factor in speaker pricing for the top-end models is just branding and marketing. While they may or may not sell a few of the most expensive models to a billionaire here and there, a bigger goal may be to simply add caché to the more ordinary products in their lineup. Consumers can become very entranced with the brand name of the products they buy and like their more modest purchase being associated with something fancy and exclusive. That's true whether one is talking about stereo gear, cars, clothing or whatever. |
A top level speaker company needs to advance the art. To do that they constantly refine and build the very best, cost no object speakers. They are critical in showing off what they are capable of. Then they substitute compromises to build speakers that are much less expensive, where they can sell many. These cost no object speakers come with installation to make sure they sound their very best. I doubt they sell many, but they are priced to be profitable. A set goes to professional reviewers. About thirty years ago I spent a couple hours with a set of Wilson WAMM… I think about $350K at the time… currently $685K. The experience was revelatory… I understood what Wilson was about and set in my mind what Wilson can do. It doesn’t happen to be the sound I am going for… but it is for many. I am happy to sample them. I do not think they are over priced… some people have a lot of money… good for them. Most don’t care about audio, a few do. |
"the number of speaker manufacturer’s who have a speaker in their line up that cost close to a $1M!! There are good number of speakers now available with prices in the $700K+ range. " If I counted correctly there were 3 speakers in the $700-900K range,, none above $900K . Not seeing a plethora of them as suggested. In the $150K-500K range there were 54; not sure that this is new news. Total speakers in the listing 769. Those who can afford the higher end ones and the associated equipment/rooms I suspect thoroughly enjoy their listening experiences. Good for them! Those that can’t or don’t want to spend to the same level should just focus on maximizing the listening experiences that their equipment and room will provide; and just sitting back and enjoying the music . Seems like that would be time better spent than worrying about why some manufacturers are building and pricing certain equipment that one is never going to purchase |
