I installed a SR RED Quantum fuse in my ARC REF-3 preamp a few days ago, replacing an older high end fuse. Uhh ... for a hundred bucks, this little baby is well worth the cost. There was an immediate improvement upon installation, but now that its broken in (yes, no kidding), its quite remarkable. A tightening of the focus, a more solid image, and most important of all for my tastes, a deeper appreciation for the organic sound of the instruments. Damn! ... cellos sound great! Much improved attack on pianos. More humanistic on vocals. Bowed bass goes down forever. Next move? .... I'm doing the entire system with these fuses. One at a time though just to gauge the improvement in each piece of equipment. The REF-75se comes next. I'll report the results as the progression takes place. Stay tuned ...
Any comments from anyone else who has tried these fuses?
Jim, I think to a degree we have. Thankfully, knowledgeable,perceptive and Honest Audiophiles have clarified for all that this 'talk' or should I say "cheap promotion" of Synergistic Red fuses and Synergistic Quantum Black fuses was the spewing of "nonsense" (childish and idiotic nonsense) from the beginning. geogelofi analysed it all very nicely and in an summed it up it very succinctly, in an intelligent and balanced comment -- "
I just don't get shysters, preaching this sort of voodoo". Cheers ....................
Good things will be coming your way soon. I'm in the process of putting together a package for you. Included will be the Milt Jackson "Second Nature" album that I mentioned above. It's early Jackson when he was at his best in my opinion.
Hello Frank, I genuinely appreciate you taking the time to prepare and send these recordings. I can’t wait to hear them. The last batch of recordings you sent me were excellent and a pleasure to listen to. Charles
No matter how technically astute or insightful my explanation of how aftermarket fuses work you don’t have to look too hard to find some pseudo skeptic or knucklehead who disagrees with me or who says, this cannot be or science won't allow it. This is stacking up to be just another sad episode of 12 Angry Men. Don’t worry, be happy.
Geoff Kait Machina Dynamica We do the difficult with ease, the impossible takes longer
for those of you that are interested in the audio magic beeswax shd fuse compared to the synergistic red fuse, I have had mine going for a couple days now. At first there wasn't much of a change in sound than with the red fuse. After 2 longs days of burning in the beeswax fuse though I now think that the audio magic fuse is going to be something special. It expands the soundstage, relaxes the presentation and most of all it just makes music sound more natural and real. I only have 2 days on it so I need more time to evaluate it but I prefer it over the red already. I have not tried a black fuse yet but may in the future.
Try this. Leave the listening room and have somebody swap your Special Fuses out (or not) and replace them with un-special fuses like something from Littelfuse or maybe Bob's Discount Fuse House…come back and listen to your rig…do this again a few times to see if you can tell when the fuses are different. I'm assuming the Special Fuses don't lose their "broken in" status when briefly removed (damn…there goes 170 hours!)…note the results. Did cello's feel less cello-like? Did the soundstage seem less soundstagey? I doubt any Fusers are going to do this experiment, but hey…you could claim to do it and fake the results to gain credibility among Real Audiophiles. Win win. Also, paint Jujubes silver and replace the tiny SR "transducer" dot things with them and try this experiment again, although this version may be flawed when it's discovered that painted Jujubes work really well in that role. I just think the damn things stick to my teeth too much.
Hi kedoades, The differences you note between the Red fuse and the Beeswax fuse is what I and others hear comparing the Red vs Black fuses. I honestly believe that both (Beeswax and Black) are terrific and will always be listener and component/system specific. Enjoy! Charles
wolf garcia, we get it you think that fuses are snake oil, I have nothing to prove to you, believe what you want, but have you tried a beeswax fuse, probably not.
Ear wax fuses are even better, as they have a more humane sound to them, they don't buzz like bees-wax ones, give them a go. I promised not give the suppliers name as he doesn’t want to rushed with orders. As he can only suck enough out of his families ears for one fuse a week. So you’ll have to search for it, but keep it to yourself.
"
Hello Highstream, Although I’ve had no blown Black fuses (slo blo) in my components I believe as others have stated, moving up 1 step for ampere rating is an acceptable practice. Charles"
The question I have at the moment whether or not it's necessary - or very prudent - to go up based on people's experience. I only pose it this way at the moment because I've come across a pair of used Blacks at a good price that match the specs of soon to arrive bi-amped active speakers. Thanks,
I want the moderator of Audiogon to get rid of Wolf-Garcia and Georgelofi from this blog. As he or she can clearly read, they add nothing to the discussion, only disgust.
moving up 1 step for ampere rating is an acceptable practice.
Moving up in amperage with mains fuses, is unsafe.
Doing this is a very unsafe practice. It will very likely burn out more than just the fuse. EG: regulators, rectifiers, or maybe even the transformer. + whatever caused the fuse to blow in the first place. The worst is it could start a fire, and take out your house.
they add nothing to the discussion
That’s because it’s snake oil and as the above states playing with mains components like this is a very unsafe practice, and very dangerous.
Just to point out that in the twenty or so years since aftermarket fuses first hit the scene, you know Iso Clean and HiFi Tuning, to name two, most likely the first two, there has never been a single documented case where a failure of one of those persnickety little things caused a house to burn down. Are the trolls out of ammo? What’s the next silly claim - that they cause cancer?
Georgelofi 2-7-2017 Moving up in amperage with mains fuses, is unsafe.
Doing this is a very unsafe practice. It will very likely burn out more than just the fuse. EG: regulators, rectifiers, or maybe even the transformer. + whatever caused the fuse to blow in the first place. The worst is it could start a fire, and take out your house.
On the other hand, though, given the various reports we’ve seen in this thread of SR fuses blowing when they shouldn’t it could be argued that going up one or even two rating increments with SR fuses is likely to result in the fuse having a melting point (as measured in amps squared x seconds) that is **closer** to that of the stock fuse than an SR fuse having the same current rating as the stock fuse.
Although admittedly the basis for such a contention is muddled by the fact that some (although by no means all) of the reported false blows have occurred at turn-on, when very brief "inrush" current surges, that are expectable in many designs, may greatly exceed the rating of the stock fuses.
In any event, given the lack of meaningful technical data on the SR fuses I don’t think anyone can provide an answer to this question with any kind of certainty, and it is a question about which the opinions of reasonable people (and technically knowledgeable people) can differ IMO. Also, given that some have reported good results with SR fuses that are rated even a bit lower than the ratings of the stock fuses, the answer certainly figures to be equipment dependent.
FWIW, my opinion on this question was stated in a post in this thread dated 1-14-2017, near the top of page 64 (if posts are sorted most recent last). Which was to the effect that I personally would have no qualms about going up one or even two rating increments.
In any event, given the lack of meaningful technical data on the SR fuses I don’t think anyone can provide an answer to this question with any kind of certainty
Given this when playing around with mains voltages, I’m saying it’s better to be safe than sorry. I understand that you have "no qualms" personally yourself doing it as your capable of monitoring it. But surely your not giving the go ahead to other to do it as well, as it is mains safety issue were talking about.
The reliability of any fuse is something you should ABSOLUTELY be able to count on, as well as trust that the manufacturer of any fuse is sophisticated enough to accurately rate what is essentially (or only) a safety item. If they're not able to at least do that they should get their act together or take the product off the market. Qualms…I got qualms...
See the mods have seen fit to delete the voodooists posts that were sticking it to Wolfy, for preaching the safety aspect that’s been grossly overlooked by the fusers, or maybe they are also starting to see the truth/fact behind this snake oil.
Uh, Georgie, sorry to burst your bubble but there is no safety issue for fuses. If there was don’t you think UL certification for aftermarket fuses would be a requirement? Hel-loo! The question is still hanging out there - has anyone’s house ever burned down due to a fuse? Answer at 11.
Al, your silence is deafening, are you getting splinters?
Hi George,
At this point a multitude of opinions and experiences have been stated that are relevant to choosing the current rating of an SR fuse, including opinions from technically knowledgeable people such as you and I. Those reading the thread who intend to try SR fuses can and will form their own decisions as to how to proceed.
For those who may be pondering this question, though, I'll add the following question and answer to my previous comments on the matter:
Question: Are the protection characteristics of a stock 5 amp fuse, especially the combinations of current and time that would cause it to blow, most closely approximated by an SR Black 5 amp fuse, or by an SR Black 6.3 amp fuse, or by some other SR Black fuse?
You need to answer this question Al, for safety sake, as many here hang on your words.
Are you or are you not advocating that anyone else replace a manufacturers given fuse value with something higher, especially if they have no technical background, so they can monitor any problems like you can
The point to the Q&A in my previous post is that we don’t even know if an SR Black 5 amp fuse should truly be considered to be a 5 amp fuse, as opposed to a 4 amp fuse or something even lower. And the reports we’ve seen from a number of people of blown SR fuses would seem to suggest that one of the latter possibilities could very well be the case, for many if not most or all ratings. Also, fuse derating (the margin between the current rating a designer has chosen for a fuse and the amount of current it conducts under normal conditions) is not a precise science, with designer preferences, the limited number of choices that are imposed by standard rating values, and turn-on inrush currents and other characteristics of the particular design all factoring into it.
So my basic intention is to provide food for thought, rather than advocacy. Although per my various posts on the subject I would not consider it to be an unreasonable course of action for someone who wants to try SR fuses to choose values that are one or even two increments higher than stock, and in the end perhaps avoid wasting several hundred dollars as a result. I respect the fact that your opinion differs, and as I said earlier, given the lack of meaningful technical data on the SR fuses I don’t think anyone can provide an answer to this question with certainty.
So my basic intention is to provide food for thought, rather than advocacy
So your not advocating, increasing the fuse amperage from the manufacturers specified value/s.
This is good Al, for the sake of safety. As most here don't know if they're changing an ac mains fuse, dc rail fuse or speaker protection fuse. Maybe we've saved a future life, or at least a piece of equipment.
almarg: "So my basic intention is to provide food for thought, rather than advocacy. Although per my various posts on the subject I would not consider it to be an unreasonable course of action for someone who wants to try SR fuses to choose values that are one or even two increments higher than stock, and in the end perhaps avoid wasting several hundred dollars as a result."
Reads quite differently when not taken out of context, eh, Mighty Mouse?
Ain’t it a pisser when real technical experts like Al refuse to take your bait?
Bait for the sake of safety? I hardly think so. As I said.
"
As most here don't know if they're changing an ac mains fuse, dc rail fuse or speaker protection fuse. Maybe we've saved a future life, or at least a piece of equipment."
No one, unless they know what their doing with proper monitoring equipment, should up the amperage rating on a fuse.
Doesn't a fuse prove its reliability when it blows? I mean, what are we relying upon when we put a fuse into a piece of electronics? Surely not that it will never blow no matter what.
I have eight Black fuses in my system. I had one that was rated at the stock size blow upon power up. I got a free replacement, but went up to the next higher rating and have had absolutely no problems. Since then I have modestly up-rated the Black fuses I subsequently purchased for other equipment. I have had no problems, and I do not fear burning the house down as I am confident that anything approaching a dead short will quickly blow the fuse--at almost any rating of fuse well shy of the current capacity of the breaker. Yet all my Black fuses are in the 2-3+ amp range save the one in my power distributor.
As an aside, is it just me or does anyone else find the use of the word "Cheers" disconcerting at the close of any of George's Debbie Downer screeds?
Clearly a fuse that blows because it's NOT the manufacturer's specified rating is badly designed, or, more weirdly, improperly rated…would you put an improperly rated fuse in your motorcycle? Would you trust a company that designs and markets that fuse? It likely won't burn down your house, but at 10 times (or so) the cost of one that's rated accurately I'd expect a little more, unless I'd invested over 800 bucks in those fuses…then maybe I'd defend 'em too.
Only 64 posts and 53 of them on SR fuses. And they all started just after the SR fuse thread started. Good work contributing to audio in general on all these forums. Blind Freddy can see what’s going on here. And good on you
oregonpapa for backing him. Double Cheers to you.
I had a long diatribe all written out in response to you two guys ... four paragraphs long. It kind of reminded me of the last conversation I had with my ex-wife. During that last conservation she said that If I brought home one more LP or purchased one more piece of stereo equipment she'd leave me for good. After 35 years of being married and 22 years of being divorced, I still miss that woman sometimes.
I was wondering ... is there anything that I could do that would encourage you two guys leave this thread for good? I promise, I'll try to miss you from time to time.
Too bad there’s no Stereo Review, EarsR’goN blog site, to attract what must have been Julian’s fans. Such would at least divert some of the nonsense. Sneers!
Frank, No diatribe needed. Consider this, 71 pages 15 months Over 3500 posts Overwhelmingly positive vibe here Friendships formed A multitude of happy users of upgraded fuses Informative posts regarding recordings and musicians with new discoveries to explore.
All of that vs some redundant negativity from actually a miniscule number of people. Verdict? Undeniably sucessful and interesting long running thread thanks to you.. Rejoice in the sheer volume of listeners who’ve improved the sound of their systems and have heighten their enjoyment of hearing the music. Take a bow, you’ve earned it 😊 Charles
Re charlesdad latest comment ; " a multitude of happy users of upgraded fuses" ---not quite accurate that--- omits all complaints... Thankfully, knowledgeable,perceptive and Honest Audiophiles have clarifie that this 'talk' or should I say "cheap promotion" of Synergistic Red fuses and Synergistic Quantum Black fuses was the spewing of "nonsense" from the beginning. geogelofi analysed it all very nicely and summed it up it very succinctly, in an intelligent and balanced comment -- " I just don't get shysters, preaching this sort of voodoo".
+1 charles1dad and rodman99999 We can easily ignore the egg throwing, the tantrums, the harping and sort out the reasonable inquiries, questions, concerns and the positive comments that are shared to enjoy our listening sessions and to encourage others to enjoy their music. I think it can be seen who enjoy's this hobby and wants to share it with others. So please keep that going. Many have been very gracious in what they have shared which builds a fine respect for others thus adding to our enjoying this thread and our ongoing endeavors. Thanks for all that share a positive comment here, lives are to short to do anything else.
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