The tough thing with efficient speakers is they tend to be larger. But I would check out Omega and maybe Zu's standmounts. I just ordered a pair of Odeon Midas speakers on closeout but haven't received them yet. They're floorstanders that are 95 db efficient and are not huge and may work for what you're looking for. Not a ton of info on Odeon but they are german and use quality parts throughout. I saw a standmount Odeon for sale too and someone chimed in that it's the best speaker they've owned after owning many top brands.
Requesting Your Expertise - Best Options - High Sensitivity Speakers For A Smaller Room
As the title says, I am looking into the best options for higher sensitivity speakers for a somewhat small room. The room itself is 12.5 feet by 9.5 feet. The speakers would be placed along the 12.5 foot wall. Amplifier power is 8wpc.
The system will be used for a variety of music, including folk, instrumental, rock, jazz, and singer songwriter offerings. Budget is a max of $3k, used. And a quality subwoofer, chosen specifically for the room, and use with whatever speakers that I choose, is available to employ.
I already have some ideas, but, clearly, none of us are aware of everything, and, in the higher sensitivity space, things can get a bit tricky. Your experiences, thoughts, recommendations and expertise would be appreciated in terms of outlining all the worthwhile options available. Thanks.
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I had Omega SAM and while they sounded very good I started to miss not having a tweeter. They were in my second system which wasn’t tube , it was a 40 watt integrated I thought I would rotate them with my Forte IV which I use a few different amps with. Never got around to that. I did run them with a few PP tube amps but never my 300b. The Omega sounded great but fell apart at moderately loud levels. And that was with several 40 - 50 watt amps. I sold the Omega and went with a medium efficiency speaker and got a more powerful amp. For that room it was the right choice. Unfortunately with a 8 watt Amp you are limited to highly efficient speakers. I would look at conventional two ways 93 dB send or more in a small room. Something like a British monitor or Sonus Faber at 86 or so I think will cause any low power amp to run out of steam fast. You only want to use the first watt or less , if you push a 300b to half power you are really asking a lot of it. I’m 58 and I hear well enough to really miss a tweeter not being there. The Omega claim 18 or 20 k but they are really lacking sparkle. You can’t have everything with a single driver and I’m glad I tried a pair but they ultimately were not for me.
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I once considered these to use with DH/SET amps, but my listening room is too large. Had I gone with them anyway I would have added 2 small Gallo subs located under the speakers. The link is to the current version (before they had the original and then a signature version was added). https://stereonet.com/reviews/audio-note-ax-two-standmount-loudspeakers-review
DeKay |
As Grinnell and bigshutterbug other have posted, the Reference 3A from DeCapo is a great candidate. My audiophile nephew has this and drives it with 300BSEt Tubes which is about 8 Watts. his room dimension is very similar to your room dimensions too. I heard this and I am impressed with sound staging, palpable and sweet sweet highs. great for Jazz and female vocals are very surreal. for me, highly recommended. Also, i like to point out that Bass from this speakers are very good, well balanced and satisfying, but.... One thing that this does not do well is deep and strong bass if you like strong deep bass, you will need to supplement extra subs. In my nephew's case he has subwoofers that do this.
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@nightfall - high sensitivity, small room, and limited budget is a tough ask. What’s the brand/model of your amp so we can get a better idea of workable options? |
Wavetouch Antero V2 speaker. V2 is the most accurate speaker (closest to the original music). Below is their sound. The room is 14' x 22' x 8' with 35w int amp. Price is right on your budget. Alex/Wavetouch audio |
I realize this isn’t the ideal situation, as a few of you have noted. Smaller room, high sensitivity speakers is a tough ask. These speakers tend to be large. But then I wouldn’t need to come here for expertise and recommendations if it was something easier. :)
The power amp is a Coincident Frankenstein 300B MK V.
And yes, in a perfect world, I would love a pair of Volti Razz! Granted, but, as mentioned, they don’t fall near my price range, even used. I’m also not positive how they would play in this size room. I am considering Omega’s. I am a fan of the Fritz speakers, but never thought they would work with 8wpc? |
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In January I added a 10 inch KEF sub. Why if the de Capos have a pretty good bass response? Well I went to Aural Audio in Denver and heard a pair of Devore O/96's. so full of sound. Can't afford those so i added a sub. I have it so low on volume that half the time you dont notice it but it does add a subtle fullness and it can rock out :)
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For Fritz speakers, I think it depends on how loud you like to listen. In my room, I compared them to other standmounts with the same sensitivity and the series crossovers make a meaningful difference. Fritz does in-home auditions and can tell you about his speakers on 8w. |
Below video is 2A3 amp (4 watts) with Wavetouch v2 speaker. 8w tube amp is excellent match with v2 spkr. Alex/Wavetouch audio WT v2 - The home entertainment show 2021 - Long Beach, CA
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+1 ZU, they make several speakers in your price and size range, new. I drive my ZU ODS’s (I'm not recommending these for you there 55” tall and 105lb ea) with a 25 watt pass labs XA25 amp in a 24x21x8’ room easily to concert levels bringing in 2 15” sealed Rythmic subs at 40hz no cut to the ZU’s. They make several speakers in your price range and more appropriate to your room size. I think the ODS’s are 98 db sensitive their smaller platform units are 95 db’ish I think. They have a return policy so very little risk. Build quality is excellent, these are likely my last speakers, for my listening room anyway. |
Wharfedale Evo 5.2. 88 dB is high enough, and you shouldn’t overemphasize sensitivity over sound quality itself. High sensitivity does not guarantee either superior SQ or good sound at low volume. The host below compared the 5.2 with the 4.2, which I owned for a short while and absolutely loved—except for its low end. This younger brother greatly enhances the weight and punchiness in the low frequencies that Terry was raving about. |
My 87 db speakers with series crossovers work and sound great with low powered tube amps including my 8 watt 300B, single EL34 SEP amp with 5 watts and my single EL84 2.3 watts per channel Decware amp in my 14 x 22 ft living room. Series crossovers use much smaller and far fewer parts than regular crossovers that have many components that suck up power and sound.
Google any loudspeaker and see if they have a Stereophile review. Go to the measurement page & check out the impedance & phase curves. They will look like mountain ranges with peaks & dips. No other loudspeakers will have smooth curves unless they use series crossovers. Series crossovers sound much better in loudspeaker designs than old style regular crossovers.
Here's a link to my Carrera BE loudspeakers with Dan Wright Modwright's 6 watt 300B tube headphone amp at the Capital Audio fest a few years back-
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georgemunn20 posts +1 ZU, they make several speakers in your price and size range, new. I drive my ZU ODS’s (I’m not recommending these for you there 55” tall and 105lb ea) with a 25 watt pass labs XA25 amp in a 24x21x8’ room easily to concert levels bringing in 2 15” sealed Rythmic subs at 40hz no cut to the ZU’s. They make several speakers in your price range and more appropriate to your room size. I think the ODS’s are 98 db sensitive their smaller platform units are 95 db’ish I think. They have a return policy so very little risk. Build quality is excellent, these are likely my last speakers, for my listening room anyway. You have a truly exceptional amp there, in your XA25. The only power amp I would consider if I decided to go without tubes. I do know the Zu speaker line well. I have previously owned the exceptional Druid MK IV’s, I have had many discussions with Sean, and have tremendous respect for the speakers they make. I once also owned the first generation of the Perfect Sets, from Tekton. I would seriously consider the current version of the Perfect Sets, but Eric has told me that really need at least 12-15 wpc, to truly perform well, so that eliminates that option. |
Zu speakers are very dynamic and detailed speakers, but this comes at a price of being quite sibilant, lean, and harsh sounding. If you like the Devore O96, I seriously doubt you would like Zu speakers. You must hear them first. Someone above mentioned AN-Js which would be terrific and would be reasonably priced if you can find them used. I have not heard the Tekton Perfect SET, but the other Tekton speakers I have heard would suggest that they are contenders. |
There are Dual Concentric Drivers that are extremely efficient. These are designs able to substantially impress and many options for how the Single Driver is used. An Open Baffle through to a Transmission Line are options. I use a DC TL Speaker with 5 Watt Output SET 300b and just love the moment that is created. An uncomplicated OB design should not cost much more than the Drivers Only @ approx' $450 - $800 Add $500ish if a more complex Cabinet becomes of interest. Have a look at Joseph Crowe he recently commission produced Don Sachs Speakers, of which Don states "never has better been ecperienced" or words similar?
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mihorn712 posts Below video is 2A3 amp (4 watts) with Wavetouch v2 speaker. 8w tube amp is excellent match with v2 spkr. Alex/Wavetouch audio WT v2 - The home entertainment show 2021 - Long Beach, CA I was not familiar with the Wavetouch models, and the video was worthwhile. However, it appears those speakers start at $6k, per their website. |
I have a demo set (actual set in below video) and they are in your budget. Alex/Wavetouch audio Eric Clapton - Tears in heaven, Krall - Temptation My Favorite Picture of You - Guy Clark, Wavetouch audio live recording. My Favorite Picture of You - Guy Clark
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Ascend Acoustics Sierra 2 EX V2. Small, mid weight, wonderful timbre, astonishingly deep bottom end, low priced, easy to drive... I think they’ll send you a demo pair, but not sure about that. Ask and see - if not, what’s the return policy. You’ll be amazed. Sensitivity is 86, but I have used them in a 12 X19 room with that sized SET amp and they filled it very well.
BMR Monitor is another great option. Read the accolades, including Stereophile Recommended: https://philharmonicaudio.com/products/bmr-monitor?variant=44392808612084 Sensitivity and my experience with these? Same as the Ascend Acoustics above. Both of these models are real jewels. I own several pairs of $50K+ speakers and the BMRs and Ascend Acoustics continue to get a lot of listening. I would not consider selling either. |
The notion of speakers being too big for the room is just one of those unsubstantiated statements or claims that has no evidence to back it up. It’s a non-issue. Choose the speakers you like and don’t reject something that you would love. Audio Note has been mentioned and I concur and suggest a used pair of Snells. Devore are just lovely and do make smaller units that may fit your budget. The route I would go is to high-pass the mains relieving your low powered amp of transformer saturating low frequencies. If the speakers you choose have ports plug them rendering them a sealed box in performance rolling off at 12dB/ octave. You mention a sub but it is not clear to me if you own one or intend to. As far as I’m concerned subs are a necessity for any audio system regardless of room or speaker size. Even megabuck speakers need them because of unavoidable room modes. When sealing ports on a speaker you are removing additional bass sources which complicates set up. Now some will argue that you will lose bass and you will and that is the point which is to get quality over quantity. Full spectrum balance is achieved with subs (2 always better than 1) and for subs 2 parameters are paramount: must have variable phase and they must be sealed boxes and will therfore match the XO slope of the mains and provides the most seemless blend. Todays subs come with high damping factors unlike a low powered tube amp so there is no worry there because most but not all speakers are designed around solid state amplification. If you are wondering why any subs are needed it’s because of room modes, that nasty phenomenon that plays hell with your sound. The only way to avoid this is to listen to your speakers in an anechoic chamber or mounted high in the air in an open field. Fact. When you position the speakers for a nice soundstage and precise imaging the bass will be compromised but the 2 subs will smooth that out. No more nasty peaks or nulls Regarding high passing the mains this can be simply accomplised by inserting a PLLXO in the amp’s tape loop or soldered into the interconnect cable you just need to know the amps input impedance obtainable from the manufacturer. It consists of 1 capacitor and 1 resistor. Look up passive line level crossover. Check out the link below and look for my 2 posts which goes into more detail on setting up multi-subs |
fritzspeaks45 posts My 87 db speakers with series crossovers work and sound great with low powered tube amps including my 8 watt 300B, single EL34 SEP amp with 5 watts and my single EL84 2.3 watts per channel Decware amp in my 14 x 22 ft living room. Series crossovers use much smaller and far fewer parts than regular crossovers that have many components that suck up power and sound.
Google any loudspeaker and see if they have a Stereophile review. Go to the measurement page & check out the impedance & phase curves. They will look like mountain ranges with peaks & dips. No other loudspeakers will have smooth curves unless they use series crossovers. Series crossovers sound much better in loudspeaker designs than old style regular crossovers.
Here's a link to my Carrera BE loudspeakers with Dan Wright Modwright's 6 watt 300B tube headphone amp at the Capital Audio fest a few years back- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbroWg_cwCQ
Fritz, I would not have guessed it remotely possible that speakers of that sensitivity could be played with 8wpc. So much for what I know. Your speakers in that video are performing simply incredibly well. I am more than impressed. And I know Dan a little, and for him to be as impressed as he was, is really something. Kudo's to you for some brilliant speaker design. Do you still offer the Carrera BE's, a shown in that video from some years back? Or are they now known as the Carrera 7 BE's? Apologies, but I am struggling to find the answers on your website. |
Coincident Invictus at $3k USD should be a great choice for a stand-mounted monitor if you intend to keep it for a long time. You're paying for a very high-quality speaker with Coincident. I've kept my small Partial Eclipse for a couple of decades, now. If you are thinking this might be an interim speaker for a few years, consider a Tekton Design Lore Reference ($800). The cabinets are not fancy, but they have a small footprint, high efficiency, and are an easy drive for an 8 watt amp. And they are way better than their price suggests. I gave my pair to my son-in-law to use with a Coincident Dynamo 34SE (6 wpc) in a room much larger than yours, and it works spectacularly. |
longplayer26 posts Coincident Invictus at $3k USD should be a great choice for a stand-mounted monitor if you intend to keep it for a long time. You’re paying for a very high-quality speaker with Coincident. I’ve kept my small Partial Eclipse for a couple of decades, now. If you are thinking this might be an interim speaker for a few years, consider a Tekton Design Lore Reference ($800). The cabinets are not fancy, but they have a small footprint, high efficiency, and are an easy drive for an 8 watt amp. And they are way better than their price suggests. I gave my pair to my son-in-law to use with a Coincident Dynamo 34SE (6 wpc) in a room much larger than yours, and it works spectacularly.
Thanks for the suggestions. I once owned a pair Total Victory speakers for a much larger room and setup, and they were exceptional, with great build quality. I gave some thought to the Invictus, initially, since they should play beautifully with the amps, but cannot find any reviews, or even forum comments associated with them. This is odd, since they appear to have been available since 2022? I am definitely looking at this is a longtime speaker to last through my retirement. That is the major factor (other than sound) which makes this a critical purchase. |
"doodle674 posts Ascend Acoustics Sierra 2 EX V2. Small, mid weight, wonderful timbre, astonishingly deep bottom end, low priced, easy to drive... I think they’ll send you a demo pair, but not sure about that. Ask and see - if not, what’s the return policy. You’ll be amazed. Sensitivity is 86, but I have used them in a 12 X19 room with that sized SET amp and they filled it very well.
BMR Monitor is another great option. Read the accolades, including Stereophile Recommended: https://philharmonicaudio.com/products/bmr-monitor?variant=44392808612084 Sensitivity and my experience with these? Same as the Ascend Acoustics above. Both of these models are real jewels. I own several pairs of $50K+ speakers and the BMRs and Ascend Acoustics continue to get a lot of listening. I would not consider selling either. "
Appreciate the recommendation and found the BRM monitors very interesting, especially the higher end speakers that you own, until I read the Stereophile review where the owner of the company recommended 40-60 wpc for use with them. |
Surprised no one has mentioned the Daedalus Muse ( used of course) - May be more than your $3k Budget but they are stunning to look at as well. . I use 8 watts now and they sound wonderful . I do not have any Rap or Heavy Metal in my collections so unable to confirm with that type of music. I also have Heresy's 1's that are excellent with 8 watts. They are updated with Crites crossovers. Lastly I also own a pair of Ascend Acoustics Sierra 2 EX V2 which I love but for me I believe they need more power to shine. I use them with 100 watts or more of SS. so others recommended them but I am not in the low power SET camp for them. |
kennyc2,085 posts "I have the Coincedent Frankenstein Mk2, what’s the difference vs the mk5? I’m debating upgrading. Thanks. Wishing you the best of luck on finding workable speakers."
I talked at some length with Israel Blume on the phone. He didn't divulge what specific upgrades and/or changes were made for the Mk V. However, very tellingly, he did comment that, for the first time, owners of the MKII's, and MKIII's who have experienced the MK V at dealers are trading in their older versions, they were so impressed with the Mk V. He said it was a major step up from previous models. |
Had a very interesting listening experience today. Some weeks back, an audiophile friend of my audiophile friend had heard about my search for speakers to meet my needs. He called and invited me over to listen to his system, which matched what I am looking for. He was using a low powered SET amp and pair of high sensitivity speakers just as I am planning to. The only issue was that he lives a few hours away. I had to make an unexpected trip that took me over to near where he lives yesterday through this early evening. I stopped to check out what he was using and give it a lengthy audition. His room was slightly larger than mine, but not that significantly. He was using 6wpc to power the Heretic 614 speakers and the sound was just superb. These are not sleek showy speakers by any means, looking more like an industrial wood project. Though not unattractive, in their way. But the sound coming out of them was remarkable. Unfortunately, the founder and speaker designer of the company has apparently passed away, the company is no longer in business. This makes the speakers even more difficult to find, used, and prices seem to have gone up to $4500.00-4700.00 a pair in that market. Otherwise, I would be extremely interested based on what I heard. |
dwest1023309 posts You might look into the Goldenear BRX. They are rated 90 db.
Thanks, and I realize they have received quite a bit of acclaim, but I have never heard any Golden Ear speaker that I was at all impressed with. I have, while in stores carrying them, listened to quite as number with two good friends who are seriously into audio. None of us have ever liked a single Golden Ear model. |
