Re-terminated?
power cord directionality
IF power cords do indeed have preferred directionality, and one is inadvertently flipped for a few hours, does it "harm"it?
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No harm per se but umbilical cord with male - female connectors can only be plugged in one direction. Now my mono amps with external power supply came with umbilical cords with same male speakon connectors on both ends, like the one below with no directionality marked on the wire. https://www.neutrik.com/en/product/nl8fc So when I asked the manufacturer, he said it should not make any difference which way I plug the cords. I heard no audible differences when I reversed the cord in other direction. I have yet to see a professionally made power cord with male AC and female IEC plugs marked with directionality. Our resident directionality guru @geoffkait may disagree with my assessment 😊 |
Is the preamp working properly? Does it sound fine? If so, don't worry about it. The wire doesn't care. Most commentators didn't know it was a wire between an outboard power supply and the preamp. So it IS supplying DC. All power cords going into the wall sockets, all interconnects and speaker wires are carrying AC and the current is reversing at many frequencies all the time. Unless someone is playing tricks with sheilding (some only ground one end in special situations) the directionality of wire is a myth. |
Yes, you can't turn a power cord backwards. And you should never be able to do that (Imagen two male ends and one is in the wall and the other end is becoming deadly..) When you build a power cord then if it has a screen. You may connect the screen only in the wall side so all interface that the screen is getting is drained to earth at the wall side (you do not want to connect the screen to the ground in both of the ends like a conductor). But it is irellavat if you are not building your own cables when you can't turn it around anyway as a user. But it is another story with RCA interconnects. There you CAN turn them around (because they are not deadly). And the screen is only attached at one of the ends of the cable. Usually the screen is attached at the source component end (that is one of the reasons it has the direction label). But what happens if your source do not use the ground in the power cord (no power cord on passive preamps for example going to power amplifier)? Should we flip the interconnects so that the screen drain is at the receiving end and that component use ground? |
roberjerman If wire has "directionality" why hasn’t somebody in the past two hundred years found a way to measure and quantify it? Instead all that can be said is "my golden ears tell me it is so". This is NOT a scientific method in the least! >>>>>Observation - also known as empirical data - is a cornerstone of the scientific method. |
optimize Yes, you can’t turn a power cord backwards. And you should never be able to do that (Imagen two male ends and one is in the wall and the other end is becoming deadly..) When you build a power cord then if it has a screen. You may connect the screen only in the wall side so all interface that the screen is getting is drained to earth at the wall side (you do not want to connect the screen to the ground in both of the ends like a conductor). But it is irellavat if you are not building your own cables when you can’t turn it around anyway as a user. But it is another story with RCA interconnects. There you CAN turn them around (because they are not deadly). And the screen is only attached at one of the ends of the cable. Usually the screen is attached at the source component end (that is one of the reasons it has the direction label). But what happens if your source do not use the ground in the power cord (no power cord on passive preamps for example going to power amplifier)? Should we flip the interconnects so that the screen drain is at the receiving end and that component use ground? >>>>>Dear Mr. Optimize, you’re missing the point of why it’s important to construct the cables and power cords from the start with directionality of wire in mind. The shield is a separate issue and should be considered along with directionality of wire during construction. For cables without shield the manufacturer only need honor the directionality of the wire during construction. It’s not rocket science. 🚀 |
@ jw944ts It sounds like you don't trust the assembler of your cable to correct the mistake if you send it back, that they will try to "fool" you. Nevertheless, I think you should discuss it with them and send it to them if they agree. I am curious that you would mention your cable directionality may have been labeled wrong. Any cable with directionality indicators I have owned the directionality indicators were imprinted on the cable along with manufacturer, gauge, etc. How could it have been labeled wrong, was it just an arrow on piece of paper stuck onto the wire? |
@geoffkait It is uncontroversial that the structure of wire is impacted during the extruding process to create the various gauges. What is not so clear is how this impact on the wire during the process of making its gauge can actually change the sound coming though the cable. Can you shed a little light on this? |
That is the exact question I’ve been asking on many different threads here for a very long time for the last few years. No one seems to know, or if they do they’re not sharing. It’s similar to the question, why does the effect of vibration on cables and wire like tonearm wire change the sound? It has to do of course with what is the “audio signal” through wire and how does the signal become distorted? I have even offered prizes to the winner. Share, share! |
Further follow up for those interested....here is the explanation of how the umbilical is electrically tested, so it couldn’t be backwards, just accidentally labeled backwards... Three aspects establish the directionality of my designs. The aspect I refer to that is electrically testable is a bonding test, an in-process electrical test whereby electrical continuity is verified of the internal shielding within the outer conduit to the metal shell of the connector on the power supply end of the cable. In my designs the internal shield systems of the cable are drained (wired) only to the power supply end for reasons of increasing performance by enabling any electrical noise absorbed by the shields to be transferred harmlessly away from the music (away from the main preamp chassis). Secondly, and equally crucially, directionality is also established by paying regard to the directionality indicated by the manufacturer of the raw bare conductor. This directionality is stringently retained throughout the assembly process. Finally, the audiodharma Cable Cooker has a directionality of its output signal, and the connections on the Cooker are marked respectively. Thx for those that have been interested j |
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On some cables the ground wire is only connected on one terminated end. It helps to reduce ground noise or hum. On a power cable that is grounded or has a ground plug it should not matter that much as long as both ends are terminated and your equipment that is using the cable is utilizing the ground. If it not using the ground then we might run into some ground noise issues because the signal is still there. If your piece of equipment does not have a ground ( like on a receiver) then it can cause ground loop hum. In this case the wire is not terminated or only terminated on one end. Also I have heard if you have a very sensitive system then the way the copper is extruded determines the direction of the signal. |
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IE: ALTERNATING CURRENTThat is the key word! Current alternates direction. Yes, DC power does exist, and transformers are DC to keep from blasting everything with a 60 cps hum, but interconnects and speaker wire? NO! Think about it. Current for a 400 cps signal, for example, goes back and forth 400 times per second. It does not flow like water. The current driven magnetic force pushs the speaker out 400 times a second and pulls it in 400 times per second. It does not push and rest. Directional wiring for alternating currents, such as for fuses, speaker, and interconnect wires, is pure witchcraft, i.e. fantasy. If you do not grasp this, I have some magical, one direction, magiquark driven fuses for sale. Call 1-800 One Muon. |
When we talk about A.C. power or POWER Cords, there is no Physical science that specifies "polarity" Polarity on A.C. power is mainly for safety. In the off position the device can be safely serviced because there is zero power after the power switch. This is why the HOT side of the cord is directly connected to the power switch. As for a device not equip with a power switch be careful. U.L (underwriter labratories) is the largest testing facility in the U.S. tasked with safety testing things like power cords. I would venture to say that in this era, inorder to get the U.L. listing a device not equip with a power switch would require a polarizes power cord. |
A picture is worth a thousand words. The signal travels in two directions 🔛 as it alternates at whatever frequency applies, as someone said. But you only care about the signal when it travels in the direction of the speakers. You can forget about the signal whenever it’s traveling in the opposite direction 🔙 because it doesn’t affect sound quality. The only signal that affects SQ is the one that is traveling toward the speakers. 🔜 |
danvignau ... transformers are DC to keep from blasting everything with a 60 cps hum ...Sorry, but you don’t know what you’re talking about. A transformer will not pass pure DC. A transformer can’t work with DC - its primary coil would have a static, constant magnetic field, so it would not induce EMF on the secondary coil. ... Current for a 400 cps signal, for example, goes back and forth 400 times per second. It does not flow like water.Correct. The current driven magnetic force pushs the speaker out 400 times a second and pulls it in 400 times per second ...No, it doesn’t. You’ve just described an 800 hZ (or cps, or cycles per second) signal. A cycle includes both halves of the AC waveform. Directional wiring for alternating currents, such as for fuses, speaker, and interconnect wires, is pure witchcraft, i.e. fantasy.That’s not necessarily so. As Geoff pointed out, with a speaker cable, we really only care about the direction of the signal when it flows towards the speaker. A better question would be: Are cable direction differences audible? |
