power cord directionality
Its called a circuit. The lines are hot and neutral, not positive and negative. Directional qualities are inherent in the materials not created by manufacturers. And the signals speaker cables and interconnects carry is AC not DC. Oh and you will hear it if you try. Or if not then why would it matter that others do? |
"Frequency is measured in the unit hertz (Hz), referring to a number of cycles per second." (Wikipedia) There was no differentiation between AC or ohms....just frequency. DC is a constant flow of power, with no fluctuation....unless you vary it....in a frequency. If your speaker cables, signal interconnects, or input/output cables betwixt your computer to your system were only DC 'power'....without modulation of some sort....(the DC acting as a 'carrier' for the 'signal', which gets 'interpreted' by circuitry)....the 'signal' being 'fluctuations', be it digital or analog.... Digital is still hz, khz, or mhz.....analog gets the same descriptions..... One ought to be able to extrapolate that cables of any variety are ambisexual as to 'direction'. The wires Have to be able to 'go both ways'. The whole issue of 'cable direction' imho is a farce....and a cruel and expensive one at that. And shields carry no frequency....hopefully... The claim that X manufacturer has a means of creating 'directional qualities' into wires without effecting the quality of the 'signal' or 'flow' of same is on the order of claiming one has received a directive from kenjit that will create Perfection in said wire quality. What are y'all smoking? Can I have some? |
Take a wire, let's call it an interconnect. Put a reasonable load on it, say 2K ohms resistor on one end, similar to the output impedance of a tolerable source. Now plug that into a headphone amp. Hang that interconnect 6" in front of a woofer (to eliminate magnetic coupling). Turn that speaker as loud as you want and see if you hear anything coming out of the headphone amp (or record and listen later). If you can't induce a signal 6" in front of the woofer on a sensitive interconnect, what do you think the odds are that vibration has any impact on an AC supply wire or speaker wire? Just make sure you connections are tight, as that would be by far the most likely thing to modulate with vibration .... if anything actually did. |
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Audiogon's self-proclaimed reigning theoretical physicist, explains how vibration affects the signal: Shirley you jest, mc. It’s the same for any cable or fuse or any wire. External vibration distorts the signal. Just like shaking a magnet. jea48 wonders, How, exactly, does that work? geoffkait: I was kind of hoping you could tell me. Just a gut feeling? Oh, well, that’s the way it goes sometimes. Then his specialty, the word salad: By the way Poynting angles are not (rpt not) incompatible with the idea of vibration distorting the signal in cables and wires. Captain Irrelevant strikes (out) again. |
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arrwax So let me understand. are you saying vibration can have a negative effect on how electrons flow? If you shake/vibrate any wire enough, it is possible to change the position of an electron? >>>>I’m certainly not saying that. Electrons don’t flow, for starters. Are you new in town? 😀 |
isochronism Now I wonder why was it even bothered to be labeled since it only connects one way..... (?) >>>>Good catch! |
So let me understand. are you saying vibration can have a negative effect on how electrons flow? If you shake/vibrate any wire enough, it is possible to change the position of an electron? In my opinion vibration can have an adverse effect on a connection point of a wire. example: if you have a low quality outlet the physical connection between the plug and outlet may not solid enough and you may have arcing. Also the more valuable precious metals used in the plating (gold/silver) may offer higher conductivity. |
....and fabricator of cable clarified how it was just labeled backwards.....as it has Neutrik terminations, testing would reveal, due to the grounding at the power supply end, if it was backwards......thanks to all for some helpful, some not-so-helpful, but always OPINIONATED, answers.....I must admit I have learned some things on this site, both about equipment AND about personalities.... |
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I was kind of hoping you could tell me. Just a gut feeling? Oh, well, that’s the way it goes sometimes. 🙄 By the way Poynting angles are not (rpt not) incompatible with the idea of vibration distorting the signal in cables and wires. Besides, if the signal didn’t travel in the conductor it would matter what metal or purity was employed for the conductor. |
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danvignau ... transformers are DC to keep from blasting everything with a 60 cps hum ...Sorry, but you don’t know what you’re talking about. A transformer will not pass pure DC. A transformer can’t work with DC - its primary coil would have a static, constant magnetic field, so it would not induce EMF on the secondary coil. ... Current for a 400 cps signal, for example, goes back and forth 400 times per second. It does not flow like water.Correct. The current driven magnetic force pushs the speaker out 400 times a second and pulls it in 400 times per second ...No, it doesn’t. You’ve just described an 800 hZ (or cps, or cycles per second) signal. A cycle includes both halves of the AC waveform. Directional wiring for alternating currents, such as for fuses, speaker, and interconnect wires, is pure witchcraft, i.e. fantasy.That’s not necessarily so. As Geoff pointed out, with a speaker cable, we really only care about the direction of the signal when it flows towards the speaker. A better question would be: Are cable direction differences audible? |
A picture is worth a thousand words. The signal travels in two directions 🔛 as it alternates at whatever frequency applies, as someone said. But you only care about the signal when it travels in the direction of the speakers. You can forget about the signal whenever it’s traveling in the opposite direction 🔙 because it doesn’t affect sound quality. The only signal that affects SQ is the one that is traveling toward the speakers. 🔜 |
When we talk about A.C. power or POWER Cords, there is no Physical science that specifies "polarity" Polarity on A.C. power is mainly for safety. In the off position the device can be safely serviced because there is zero power after the power switch. This is why the HOT side of the cord is directly connected to the power switch. As for a device not equip with a power switch be careful. U.L (underwriter labratories) is the largest testing facility in the U.S. tasked with safety testing things like power cords. I would venture to say that in this era, inorder to get the U.L. listing a device not equip with a power switch would require a polarizes power cord. |
IE: ALTERNATING CURRENTThat is the key word! Current alternates direction. Yes, DC power does exist, and transformers are DC to keep from blasting everything with a 60 cps hum, but interconnects and speaker wire? NO! Think about it. Current for a 400 cps signal, for example, goes back and forth 400 times per second. It does not flow like water. The current driven magnetic force pushs the speaker out 400 times a second and pulls it in 400 times per second. It does not push and rest. Directional wiring for alternating currents, such as for fuses, speaker, and interconnect wires, is pure witchcraft, i.e. fantasy. If you do not grasp this, I have some magical, one direction, magiquark driven fuses for sale. Call 1-800 One Muon. |
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On some cables the ground wire is only connected on one terminated end. It helps to reduce ground noise or hum. On a power cable that is grounded or has a ground plug it should not matter that much as long as both ends are terminated and your equipment that is using the cable is utilizing the ground. If it not using the ground then we might run into some ground noise issues because the signal is still there. If your piece of equipment does not have a ground ( like on a receiver) then it can cause ground loop hum. In this case the wire is not terminated or only terminated on one end. Also I have heard if you have a very sensitive system then the way the copper is extruded determines the direction of the signal. |
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Further follow up for those interested....here is the explanation of how the umbilical is electrically tested, so it couldn’t be backwards, just accidentally labeled backwards... Three aspects establish the directionality of my designs. The aspect I refer to that is electrically testable is a bonding test, an in-process electrical test whereby electrical continuity is verified of the internal shielding within the outer conduit to the metal shell of the connector on the power supply end of the cable. In my designs the internal shield systems of the cable are drained (wired) only to the power supply end for reasons of increasing performance by enabling any electrical noise absorbed by the shields to be transferred harmlessly away from the music (away from the main preamp chassis). Secondly, and equally crucially, directionality is also established by paying regard to the directionality indicated by the manufacturer of the raw bare conductor. This directionality is stringently retained throughout the assembly process. Finally, the audiodharma Cable Cooker has a directionality of its output signal, and the connections on the Cooker are marked respectively. Thx for those that have been interested j |
That is the exact question I’ve been asking on many different threads here for a very long time for the last few years. No one seems to know, or if they do they’re not sharing. It’s similar to the question, why does the effect of vibration on cables and wire like tonearm wire change the sound? It has to do of course with what is the “audio signal” through wire and how does the signal become distorted? I have even offered prizes to the winner. Share, share! |
@geoffkait It is uncontroversial that the structure of wire is impacted during the extruding process to create the various gauges. What is not so clear is how this impact on the wire during the process of making its gauge can actually change the sound coming though the cable. Can you shed a little light on this? |
@ jw944ts It sounds like you don't trust the assembler of your cable to correct the mistake if you send it back, that they will try to "fool" you. Nevertheless, I think you should discuss it with them and send it to them if they agree. I am curious that you would mention your cable directionality may have been labeled wrong. Any cable with directionality indicators I have owned the directionality indicators were imprinted on the cable along with manufacturer, gauge, etc. How could it have been labeled wrong, was it just an arrow on piece of paper stuck onto the wire? |
optimize Yes, you can’t turn a power cord backwards. And you should never be able to do that (Imagen two male ends and one is in the wall and the other end is becoming deadly..) When you build a power cord then if it has a screen. You may connect the screen only in the wall side so all interface that the screen is getting is drained to earth at the wall side (you do not want to connect the screen to the ground in both of the ends like a conductor). But it is irellavat if you are not building your own cables when you can’t turn it around anyway as a user. But it is another story with RCA interconnects. There you CAN turn them around (because they are not deadly). And the screen is only attached at one of the ends of the cable. Usually the screen is attached at the source component end (that is one of the reasons it has the direction label). But what happens if your source do not use the ground in the power cord (no power cord on passive preamps for example going to power amplifier)? Should we flip the interconnects so that the screen drain is at the receiving end and that component use ground? >>>>>Dear Mr. Optimize, you’re missing the point of why it’s important to construct the cables and power cords from the start with directionality of wire in mind. The shield is a separate issue and should be considered along with directionality of wire during construction. For cables without shield the manufacturer only need honor the directionality of the wire during construction. It’s not rocket science. 🚀 |
roberjerman If wire has "directionality" why hasn’t somebody in the past two hundred years found a way to measure and quantify it? Instead all that can be said is "my golden ears tell me it is so". This is NOT a scientific method in the least! >>>>>Observation - also known as empirical data - is a cornerstone of the scientific method. |
Yes, you can't turn a power cord backwards. And you should never be able to do that (Imagen two male ends and one is in the wall and the other end is becoming deadly..) When you build a power cord then if it has a screen. You may connect the screen only in the wall side so all interface that the screen is getting is drained to earth at the wall side (you do not want to connect the screen to the ground in both of the ends like a conductor). But it is irellavat if you are not building your own cables when you can't turn it around anyway as a user. But it is another story with RCA interconnects. There you CAN turn them around (because they are not deadly). And the screen is only attached at one of the ends of the cable. Usually the screen is attached at the source component end (that is one of the reasons it has the direction label). But what happens if your source do not use the ground in the power cord (no power cord on passive preamps for example going to power amplifier)? Should we flip the interconnects so that the screen drain is at the receiving end and that component use ground? |
