So as we progress on our audiophile journey one of the greatest rewards is hearing something new in a recording that we've never heard before; at least it is for me.
I have heard Animals easily a hundred times since it's release.
This has to do with the Sheep track.
I placed a new to me preamp in the chain recently. In the last 20 seconds there is a ghost vocal that I had never heard. Originally it was 4 notes which were indistinguishable but clearly there.
Even more recently I upgraded my speakers from Von Schweikert VR4 Jrs to VS VR4 SRMKIII. Now those same notes, while still indistinguishable, have expanded to what seems to be a shepherd faintly directing the flock from a distance.
Has anyone else heard these? I know there are more resolving systems than mine by a wide margin so my question is does it become even more resolved to the point of being able to make out the words?
Oh, this song has special memories for me. Back in 1977, college days, Long Beach, CA, I was playing "Sheep" very loud a few days after I bought the LP. A neighbor went downstairs and turned off the circuits to my apt! Oh, the good ol' days.
I have that exact LP today and it sounds mighty clean, no ticks, no scratches. The Schroeder arm makes for pin-drop quiet backgrounds. All the way to the last second, the Sheep are clear but I hear no shepherd at all. Was this added in a remastered copy years later?
I tried streaming 24/192 both flac and MQA with a roon nucleus thru qobuz and tidal with a project pre box s2 digital, A mac c49, a pair of mc611’s to a pair of Kef Blades...There’s a bit of Wawa pedal shifting from channel to channel with the sheep before the sheep get louder, but I couldn’t hear a shepard, coarse if I have an edible (or 2)and listen with the lights dimmed in the evening I might be in a better head space to notice.
If you want to hear Pink Floyd as they do, get some ATC active SCM50A, or the larger brother SCM100As or if you can fit them, the SCM150As. They own them, use them in studio since the mid 80s or so? SCM 50s used on the last few new format remixes. You will hear a lot of details that are often missed on many playback systems- which explains why they use them.
I don't know them but I know several of their engineers over the years from the original DSOM to the latest ATMOS mix, and their mix engineers are all extremely fussy about sound and certainly ARE audiophiles. Fussing over what compressors, what EQ's, spending hours and hours to get a specific instrument's sound exactly right, get reverb to have the exact right decay, deciding where to "place" a background vocal because the artist thinks it was wrong in the original, its extremely difficult and can take a long time. A lot of comparison and A/Bing in the studio during the mix process to compare changes to an original or the raw track, or a different setting on a compressor. Some would call it painful - and it's why the band is generally not there, as it is truly like watching paint dry. Listening to one track within a song for hours is not easy. Ive seen it- a 8 bar section of a drum mix for two hours to get the kick right. Some of the engineers hear stuff most of us cannot hear, or zero in some detail we as listeners would not notice. A good example is comparing the dynamic range of a background [multiple] vocal mix vs just the lead vocal; deciding how loud the background vocals need to be vs the lead vocal and then letting the artist decide when they hear what engineer "thinks" could work. This is not a point a shoot process that is defined in the tracking process. Many extremely minor elements of a mix are the MOST important details to some artists (and therefore their engineers). Like the discussion above about sheep in the background, I;ll bet there was a LOT of discussion about that in the mix process by the band and the engineer. Opinions can be very different between artist and engineer but the artist is typically "the decider" so they must agree on a myriad number of decisions within a mix. It must satisfy both engineer and artist. The record company knows zero- there are no audio people there.
This is record making process is the same comparison process that audiophiles go through comparing cartridges, tonearms, turntables, preamps, cables etc. It is identical to a good equipment sales person recommending a specific [phono] cartridge to get the outcome a system owner wants ("the system is a tad too edgy or bright on piano on this specific record", and then a thoughtful sale person knowing the sound of the different cartridges they have and matching that to the system "sound" in a way that will achieve the change the owner wants, only to say "okay, try this cartridge" etc). The sales person can be the engineer and you as the system owner are the artist.
I streamed the original mix and the 2018 remix from Qobuz, put my ear up close to the right and left midrange cones for the last 30 seconds or so and I heard sheep, birds chirping and a sound like "wochk" in the right channel but no 4 note human voice.
@curiousjim, you sure got that right. At 80 yo, dementia may be creeping in, or not. Most everyone here know I am a huge Floyd fan, but I have lost all respect for Waters over the past few years. This goes back to when Waters kicked poor Richard Right out of the band during "The Wall" recordings. At that time, Richard was going through a divorce, and in rehab for cocaine addiction. Instead of showing empathy for one of the founding band mates, he vetoed the other two votes and kicked him out. From there, Waters got angrier and angrier over the years to the present when he wrote two back-to-back absolutely stinker albums. I find his latest political beliefs to be embarrassing. Rick Wright summed it up best when he said He knew Waters was a bully the first time Waters snatched a cigarette from him without asking. Just a little trivia.
@curiousjim, waters did not write all the songs, the lyrics yes but all the music compositions, no it was a joint effort. It is the worst pile of s*** and even worse than his last POS "Is this the life we really want". Waters needs to put his pen away for good.
Yes, it is horrible!
And to answer your question, Roger Waters did the album on his own, without any of the remaining PF members, and because he wrote all the songs in the first place, the band didn’t need to approve.
Man, I don't know. I put my "regular" CD in, Couldnt find my SACD at the moment. Turned up my Focal Aria's and only heard some mumbling with the Birds and Sheep. Need to put the headphones on and hook up the Project PS2 amp..... will report back. LOL
I love a mystery ! I have only 2 LP copies of Animals a US and Japanese pressing from 1977 , so I'll take a listen today to both copies .
Reading curiousjim's review of DSOTM is disappointing but since I have 3 copies including the 30th anniversary pressing being the last all analog anniversary release I won't have to be tempted to purchase the 50th .
You all do yourselves a favor and Don’t get the Dark Side Of The Moon Redux! It’s beyond bad! I read a review calling it Blasphemy to the original DSOTM and I have to agree.
@jasonbourne52@stereo5@bojackdo you hear it or being facetious? I've recently upgraded to a far better streamer but now don't hear it anymore. I'd hate to think I was losing my mind. In a certain gear lineup I heard it three times. With a different preamp I didn't hear it. When I added a much better streamer that has definitely elevated everything I don't hear the human voice notes anymore. A definite conundrum.
I use 'Wish you was Here' the backing vocal of Roger W's, when heard on a very few systems the Vocal does substantially increase in Sound Level, to the point it is a Match for Gilmour's.
Not many Vinyl Sources > Phon's, from commercial presentations or visiting the homes of others, where I have received a demo' using this Track, has allowed for this backing to grow to the point the Sound Level is equal.
I have questioned my take on the moment, I don't feel Mr W's ego, would have let it been any other outcome.
It is very faint. @retroactiv Try listening for anything that isn't bleating sheep. I swear it's there. I confirmed I heard it when I switched back and forth between preamps.
i don't hear any human voice saying anything at all in the last 20 seconds. also asked several people with really high end gear to check and they don't hear it either. hmm...
preamp night and day better , the $20 Alps volume pot in the belles is a Big weak link ,having owned a audio store fore a decade and Audiophile 40+ years
under the hood I know what quality is ,the LTS preamp has a high quality resistive ladder volume attenuator, and parts quality ,if you use XLR even more so
for they use top notch Lundahl transformer, and Clsrity best CMR output capacitors
plus many other things, it’s the best preamp in theunder $6k range ,I would highly recommend and use the 6SN7 tube ,plus uses 12ax7, and 12at7 tubes .
if nothing out worth checking out , another Big Tip they also make Great best of class linear power supply vs anything at 2x the cost ,I have one 12 v on my
Motorola 8702 Modem-Router combo and night and day better streaming
sonics vs the junk wall wart ,most people overlook this ,and this LPS
comes with a Great DC power cord to the router most others charge $150 for
and use a decent Pangea power cord on it ,I even put a Hifi tuning supreme gold 5amp T fuse in it even better still.
What kind of dac do you have that’s the sourse the better the dac the more information , also quality of audio cables speakers , many people don’t realize Thst in your speakers , like the quads mentioned the internal parts in all butthe most expensive the Xover parts are not that good which is the ♥️ or 🧠 of all loudspeakers. I have been upgrading speakers for years look in your speaker pull a driver just to see the vast majority of people will be Very dissapointed.
I upgraded several speakers recently someone sent me the crites Xover ,
totally low grade quality , go to Humble homemade hifi capacitor test , most use $2 resistors , Path audio ,or Mundorf ultra are tops , capacitors foils are best ,but there are some verygood quality poly caps also , just check it out.
Are you certain you weren’t listening to the recently released version (2022) with significantly changed mixing? It’s fabulous, but make sure your changes weren’t from the source itself.
You don’t mention if you were listening to vinyl, CD, SACD (the version I have), or streaming. If you streamed it I can almost guarantee that’s the remix.
Can't say that I have been that in tune but will definitely give it a go the next time that I spinning Animals. Love that album. Perfect to put int the CD player of the car while on a long drive.
Can't say that I have been that in tune but will definitely give it a go the next time that I spinning Animals. Love that album. Perfect to put int the CD player of the car while on a long drive.
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