Ranking (or even just judging) of drummers is often done using the yardstick of technical ability, especially but not limited to by drummers themselves. But you’ll notice songwriters, singers, and players of instruments other than drums sometimes use a different metric, that of musicality. Hard to define, easy to hear.
For instance, Ry Cooder would arrange his recordings around the availability of Jim Keltner (a drummer also favoured by Randy Newman and Bill Frisell). Lots of singers made the trip to Muscle Shoals specifically to record with Fame Studios house band Thw Swampers, whose drummer Roger Hawkins is a living legend (Keltner in a Modern Drummer interview stated he wished he played more like Roger). For a taste of Hawkins' drumming, listen to "Loan Me A Dime" by Boz Scaggs.(guitar by Duane Allman), and all the Jerry Wexler-produced Aretha Franklin albums on Atlantic Records.
One guitar virtuoso who didn’t like drummers who played "flashy" was the late, great Danny Gatton.
Gatton to his new drummer on the break after the first set of the drummer’s debut gig with Danny: "Hey, ya know all that fancy stuff you play?"
The drummer: "Yeah."
Gatton: "Don’t."
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BTW,
Bonham copied and was influenced by a lot of drummers. That is why and how he became great. The best drummer rankings are never to be taken seriously...no one cares what their fans think...what do we know anyway?
But I think the names that keep coming up by their drumming PEERS are for those who were/are truly fearless: Gadd, Elvin, Roach, Buddy, Bonham, Colaiuta etc...
Apologies for side tracking on the drummers stuff...
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Job: Industrial designer
Other hobby: Drummer (Sonor Delite: 3 up, 2 down)
Favorite Drummer: Steve Smith
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Kenjit - where posts go to die.
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OMG! Kenjit surfaced!
"Thar he blows! To the cannons!" *L*
Sorry I missed it, some things just 'come 'n go' too quick..;)
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You couldn’t keep your eyes off Keith Moon, regardless of where on stage he was. Clem Burke has obviously watched and listened to Keith a LOT. He is seen in the video of The Eurythmics "Would I Lie To You" (love it!), but not heard on the recording. Twenty years ago I was playing with John Wicks of The Records. I got the cheap gigs, Clem the one’s paying John enough for him to be able to afford the little rat bastard ;-) .
Let’s not forget Levon Helm, who sat to the right (stage left) of the rest of The Band. There is no conversation into which I cannot drag The Band ;-) .
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Musician or drummer. Pick one. LOL
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@steveindy - check out a live Blondie show. Clem Burke is generally in the middle towards the front, with spotlights on him as well as Debbie. Clem is a superb drummer who is a lot of fun to watch....
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What about neural plasticity, I've resembled many personality types and lived any number of lives within this life. I've lived fast and I've lived slow, moved in so many tangents.
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@oldrooney
Sorry for your loss, keep going brother.
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INTJ I was told 1%. My wife loved to lament that she had married such an ‘odd’ person; I was never able to convince her how lucky she was. She had someone that 99% of others were unable to experience. 🙂 She passed over 4 years ago; wish she was here now.
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I don't try to analyze any of you; do me the return favor if you could.
Two behaviorists meet at a street corner and one says to the other:
"You're fine, how am I?"
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@wolf_garcia: Amen, brother! Another cat I love is Roger Hawkins (of Muscle Shoals’ The Swampers fame). And Al Jackson (Booker T & The MG’s), Jim Gordon (Derek & The Dominos, All Things Must Pass), Keltner, of course. Kenny Buttrey (Nashville studios, Neil Young’s Harvest) and Harry Stinson (Nashville, Marty Stuart’s great band The Fabulous Superlatives). Jeff Porcaro was insanely great (I met him in L.A., and he was as nice as could be), as is Gadd, who may be the best all-around drummer working today..
And then there is the master, Earl Palmer (the inventor of Rock ’n’ Roll drumming. Bonham copped Palmer’s intro to Little Richard’s "Keep A Knockin’" for his identical intro to Zeppelin’s "Rock And Roll"). In his later years Palmer’s 3-pc Jazz combo played at Chadney’s Steak House in Burbank (now shuttered), directly across the street from the NBC studios. Drummers came from all over the world to sit at the feet of the master. I had only to walk the two blocks from my house to watch him work. A free master’s class!
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Hmmm... I thought it would be an interesting subject... guess not. Lesson learned about sharing any information not relative to a piece of audio hardware.
Not interested in analysis of myself or anyone else. I prefer self-awareness. I gave a few examples of myself to point out how one can tend to follow a path while oblivious to any personality rating, but once aware of such, can extrapolate those tendencies to a "type". Ouch! To add some context,I have yet to see a band set up on stage with the drummer on the front center of the stage with spotlights on him/her constantly. When watching videos of bands playing live, one is lucky to see the drummer for 45 seconds during a 4 -5 minute number. Not everyone wants to be a front man or a lead player. Are there extroverted drummers? Sure! Are there introverted front men? Sure! It would be like Charlie Watts, he just played and added more than he is generally given credit for. Took care of business and loved playing Jazz. Or maybe Eric Clapton who had to be pushed to taking more of a front position. But the original question without flying off on tangents was if the audiophiles that frequent here share some personality traits in a greater tendency than population as a whole.
Happy Listening!
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I've had many situations where drummers, keyboard players, or others didn't have the listening skills required to respond to the producer. Drummers hitting the accelerator (or anybody upping the intensity) by pounding on a ride cymbal during solos instead of locking into a supporting groove...very common among the less professional. The best, like Hal Blaine, Steve Gadd et al, know how to make things work in by simply having the talent to do so.
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Meeting me will either make or ruin your day....
...and back atcha'.
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...another episode of amateur psychology? 😏 I'll play... ;)
INFP, although prone to jump catagories at will.
Keeping in mind that self-analysis brings up the observation that one has a fool for a physician.
On the average day, one has to be many things...but as multi-tasking has been shown to be a farce in terms of overall success and effectiveness.
Better off trying to describe a rainbow to a blind person....or, in this forum, music to the profoundly deaf since birth.
I don't try to analyze any of you; do me the return favor if you could.
Thanks...
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Hmm @wolf_garcia, depends on what is meant by background. I had a session for one song for a movie soundtrack, and after the first take the engineer/producer asked me to play more like Keith Moon (of whom he was and remains a big fan). The singer (a grandson of one of The Lennon Sisters!) asked "Is that 60’s?" (the movie was set in that decade). The producer said "Oh yeah, The Who were in the 60’s."
So on the second take I played a little more aggressively, but not enough more to satisfy the producer. He suggested some fills in certain passages, and I said to him "That will walk all over the vocal." To my astonishment he then said "Oh, I don’t care about that." !!!!!
The next time I spoke with him he told me that after I left he had done a take with him doing his own drumming (he is a multi-instrumentalist), and submitted it to the movies soundtrack producer. That recording was rejected. He then submitted the take with my drumming, and it was accepted.
To me the focus of the song was the vocal, to the engineer/producer it was about playing in an extroverted style. I view it as a matter of musical appropriateness, and place musicality above all else. Keith Moon was musically perfect for The Who, but wouldn’t have lasted a week as a studio musician ;-) .
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I've been a musician for many years...guitar/singer, frontman...and any drummer who considers himself part of the "background" in a band likely isn't very good...I certainly wouldn't play with him (or her).
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INTP describes me -- Poet turned litigator. Seems to me that since few will discuss audio or audio exquipment with any degree of interest in my everday life, but members of this forum will, that INTP characteristics would be a natural quality found here and in many other technical obessions.
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To Steveindy
Wow! I'm an engineer and drummer! We are a match. What are you doing Saturday night?? 🤣
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The details of my life are quite inconsequential.
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A poll with the various types my be appropriate?
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Kinda, sorta, in a way....
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Simplifying to Left/Right brain approaches to music preferences may be helpful.
A shout out to @charles1dad for bringing this up during our conversations about two different power cable looms I’m evaluating.
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ENFJ-A shocking a protagonist…
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@roxy54
it has been 30 some years since my test, but my index finger still hurts from the needle prick for the blood draw! 🤣
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Exactly, that's the sort of qualities I am curious about. I like to dabble in quantum mechanics and am in awe of the seeming chaos around us. Seems that the pursuit of a unifying theory is humankind's quest for making sense of the universe? Then again....
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I don’t remember INTP… but looking it up__ sounds like me… fascinated with astronomy since five years old, a bachelor’s of science degree, practicing scientist for ten years, before deciding to turn around 180 degrees from reductionism to basics (as opposed to complexity… looking at a Monet is not explained by reducing it to the colors… it is the gestalt).
So, getting my Masters I wanted to look into complexity… later, Chaos theory. I love horribly complex ambiguous problems. My specialty professionally… and I have loved about pursuing high end audio. Really rewarding for someone like me.
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I also tested as an INTP!
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estj - though on all axes, iirc, the readings were pretty middling, near the midpoints, no axes extreme at all
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Mostly INTP, my system for my alone time, both in researching and listening.
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