How are the Kanta 3s working for you?
New Speakers $10K -$20K
Hi everyone. A few bullet points and thank you all for your advice! Sorry for the length just trying to help you to help me.
* A Florida family room untreated and large. 30’ x 30’ with 12’ cathedral ceiling.
* I sit basically on left half of the room, the right side of the room is billiards and wet bar.
* I just turned 65, so these are my forever speakers!
* I am 70% HT and watching TV, and 30% 2Ch, but with a little room improvement 2ch listening will go up. I want better sounding 2 ch but I’m in a very live room.
* The front wall “half width” of my room is a stacked-stone marble wall.
* to my rear is a 16’ opening to a large kitchen.
* to my immediate left is a window 40” and 12’ of sliders looking into pool.
* just sold Paradigm Persona 7F towers, (2) Persona subs and Persona center ch. Amazing speakers in a poor large room. But I do think the Be. mid-range became a bit fatiguing.
* I need a company that also makes a great center ch for HT., Legacy Audio does.
Based on WAF etc. some treatments will be done but not greatly. More pillows, a defuser or two, maybe a bit more.
My needs: warmth, no harshness at the top, not massive speakers, WAF!
I still love movies with the grandkids, big subwoofers won’t be approved. “Eye Candy” is what she likes beautiful cabinetry, Sonus Fabre, and custom finishes available from Bill D. at Legacy.
Current candidates are:
1. Sonus Fabre Amati Tradition in the red stained finish - “gorgeous”, her favorite!
2. Legacy Calibres in a custom veneer with 2+ subs that are not too big. I really love the Aeris with Wavelet processor but they are too tall for her! Remember this is a family room.m we use for everything.
3. Sonus Fabre Serafino Tradition in the same beautiful red stain wood veneer.
4. Spendor, not terribly familiar but they do make a center ch, and are respected and are considered warm. Really wish Harbeth made a center ch.
Now I am looking forward to your suggestions!
Related equipment:
Classe’ CAV 180 - 5 x 180W
Marantz 8805 Pre-pro
Oppo 203
Innuous streamer/DVD ripper
Kaleidescape movie server
Sonance DSP 8-130 MK2 for surrounds
Paradigm in ceiling (3pr) for surrounds
Thank you all!
Dave
* A Florida family room untreated and large. 30’ x 30’ with 12’ cathedral ceiling.
* I sit basically on left half of the room, the right side of the room is billiards and wet bar.
* I just turned 65, so these are my forever speakers!
* I am 70% HT and watching TV, and 30% 2Ch, but with a little room improvement 2ch listening will go up. I want better sounding 2 ch but I’m in a very live room.
* The front wall “half width” of my room is a stacked-stone marble wall.
* to my rear is a 16’ opening to a large kitchen.
* to my immediate left is a window 40” and 12’ of sliders looking into pool.
* just sold Paradigm Persona 7F towers, (2) Persona subs and Persona center ch. Amazing speakers in a poor large room. But I do think the Be. mid-range became a bit fatiguing.
* I need a company that also makes a great center ch for HT., Legacy Audio does.
Based on WAF etc. some treatments will be done but not greatly. More pillows, a defuser or two, maybe a bit more.
My needs: warmth, no harshness at the top, not massive speakers, WAF!
I still love movies with the grandkids, big subwoofers won’t be approved. “Eye Candy” is what she likes beautiful cabinetry, Sonus Fabre, and custom finishes available from Bill D. at Legacy.
Current candidates are:
1. Sonus Fabre Amati Tradition in the red stained finish - “gorgeous”, her favorite!
2. Legacy Calibres in a custom veneer with 2+ subs that are not too big. I really love the Aeris with Wavelet processor but they are too tall for her! Remember this is a family room.m we use for everything.
3. Sonus Fabre Serafino Tradition in the same beautiful red stain wood veneer.
4. Spendor, not terribly familiar but they do make a center ch, and are respected and are considered warm. Really wish Harbeth made a center ch.
Now I am looking forward to your suggestions!
Related equipment:
Classe’ CAV 180 - 5 x 180W
Marantz 8805 Pre-pro
Oppo 203
Innuous streamer/DVD ripper
Kaleidescape movie server
Sonance DSP 8-130 MK2 for surrounds
Paradigm in ceiling (3pr) for surrounds
Thank you all!
Dave
64 responses Add your response
You have both the budget and the room for corner horns. If you remember going to the movies when you were a kid and the way movies sounded, the whole theater was filled, that's what they do not just a wall of sound but the whole room just sounds great. Tiny drivers moving very fast with the horn facilitating the diaphragm air interaction provide a completely different sound than conventional speakers. The other advantage is though they look big they don't take up actual living space except for the plant that keeps dropping leaves in corner. I have a big room and a 2 watt SET amp easily pushes the sound level to over 90db with amazing bass. I will need a sub for that bottom octave but they are going to be with me until they cart me of to the old folks home... (hopefully not soon) |
djones51. Thank you. Don Dunn on Audioholics is an old friend I have recently reunited with. My new speaker team is both Don and Matthew who will be in my Hm next Friday. Turns out Gene DellaSalla only lives about an hour away. I may be seeing Gebe’s new home soon. I hear from Don that Matt is amazing in his field. A very nice young man I am looking forward to meeting next week, thank you! Dave |
rhg88, thank you! I wish I could hear Salk but as this know I cannot as they are sold direct, but I could return! I find it very interesting you combined the two companies. I gave thought if doing that but many here call that speaker blasphemy! my mains need to be close to a stone wall, covered here already, so I’m looking at front ported or sealed speakers. I have Matthew Poe (sometimes on Audioholics) here next Friday to measure my room. Thank you for everyones I put, more to come. short list: legacy with Wavelet processor Focal, particularly Kanta 3 with front port Sonus Fabre, love the cabinetry and sound open to others that also sell a center ch. open to new Pre-pro with great room correction like lyngdorf or new McIntosh using Lyngdorf room correction Thank you all! Dave |
I have somewhat similar requirements as yours (80% AVR 20% 2-channel stereo) and close to your age (~66). I have the Marantz 8805 preamp, which I believe works very well for listening to movies and regular TV programs with surround sound and Atmos. I bought a pair of Magico A3s for the front left and right mains and a Salk Supercharged SongCenter for the center speaker (https://www.salksound.com/model.php?model=Supercharged%20SongCenter). I found that the Magico A3s and the Salk Supercharged SongCenter are nicely matched. I have not found the A3s to be fatiguing at all even thought they have a Beryllium tweeter. In fact, excessive high-frequency brashness was one of the reasons why I de-selected several candidates (including Paradigms) when I was listening to and picking speakers. I have found the Salk Supercharged SongCenter to be extremely clear as a center speaker and very musical. I recommend it highly. If you insist on matching the center with the front mains, you may want to consider some Salk left and right mains, as has already been suggested by other. |
Dude, these are your "forever" speakers. You've concluded that you, at 65, finally deserve some really good sound. Congrats. And, btw, you're correct, with the right system your music listening will go up. Don't let your wife accidentally derail this opportunity. She's very reasonably responding to photographs and what she imagines she'll like, but her criteria at this point are primarily visual. Everyone is surprised by great sound. Build the system that amazes sonically and visual acceptance will follow. Also, notice I said "system". What is the rest of yours? $100,000 speakers with mediocre gear sounds just as bad as $400 speakers with mediocre gear, worse actually. Not implying you gear is mediocre, just saying the consideration is far more extensive than just the speakers. Which means, and I'm sorry to say this, that you should be prepared to spend more on other parts. Everything needs to "match", "be at roughly the same level." What you're going for is your "forever system". Sorry, it's a nasty mission. I don't have them but given your room I wonder if KEF Blades or Blades 2 (used most likely) with their side firing woofers isn't something to consider. I'm sure others with experience with them can weigh in. I've been down this road, WAF, gear mismatch and all. She now loves the stereo, even though the speakers are out into the room, even though she has always looked somewhat askance at me replacing some component that seemed like it was in perfect working condition. When you finally get there, everyone will be happy. |
I thank everyone again. The cabinetmakers son in me still loves those Sonus Fabre Tradition cabinets in the red stain finish. Most of you know have forgotten more than I know on 2ch. I appreciate 2 ch, but my room is a task. So, the need for incredible sound is not there, great sound with the budget allowing some room acoustics yes, I want to rediscover 2 ch to an extinct! Fun nights with young grandkids watching Godzilla vs. King Kong is a plus. So given for now a handicapped room, a need for good HT, improved 2Ch. We are narrowing the list. Thank you to all for speaker companies I have never heard of, if I had to sell these speakers it needs to be a popular brand that resells quickly and retains good value. On a exciting note, Matthew Poe of YouTube and expertise in room acoustics will soon be in the room. Don Dunn that films on Audioholics with Gene is an old friend and came to see me last week. More to come, thank you all! Dave |
I just recently heard Martens Parker Trio speakers in a dealer system with Classe line stage and amp. The system sounded very good—clear, and smooth without sounding muddy or murky. The dealer sells Focal, Magico, and Rockport speakers. I like the Rockports too, but the Martens hold their own, particularly given the price. |
I suggest you divorce your wife, sell your home and find something more suitable for sound. Of course I am kidding, I like the Legacy idea. Also the Salk suggestion is a sound one. Jim builds beautiful cabinets. If you could find a good used pair of Daedalus, their cabinetry is second to none and all hardwood construction. What the heck, if it's your last pair then go big! I'm running a pair of Legacy Focus SE's and they are wonderful. Check the specs. They play down to 18K so you will never have to be concerned about bass response. ....and Bill is a great guy! |
nseymour, I think k your telling me for dynamics, movies etc. the Focals are great. However for softer music the SF’s are better. While we do watch movies, our music choice would be female vocalists like Diana Krall, acoustic rock like The Eagles, Poco, Little River Band, with some 70’s R&B thrown in. Do any SF offer front porting? nitrobob, we have the same problem with very Similar AV gear. Please let me know how that Lyngdorf MP40 works out in your live room. Thanks again to everyone! Dave |
I have no idea why nobody has mentioned Goldenear's Triton line. Maybe I'll be accused of being a neo-audiophile just for bringing it up. Their reference speaker is $10,000. So they're at the bottom of your price list, but damn I think they are wonderful speakers. I have the Triton 2+ which retails for $4,000 a pair. Other equipment: TNT VPI 3, Audio Research PH-7, Audio Research Reference 2 Mk. 2 Preamp, SMC Audio Amp (upgraded McCormack) and McCormack SACD player. The speakers are the new boys in the neighborhood and I love them. You should read the reviews. All amazing. The only ding was their looks, but they've changed that in their newer reference speakers. My 2+ speakers have the black sock cover. Looks-wise it doesn't bother me, and more importantly my wife thought they were a big improvement over my Apogee Slant 8's. |
If I would have 20K for speakers I wouldn`t think twice. Cube Audio Nenuphar or Mini Nenuphar with their Sub. I think you could make a deal. I have a pair of Nenuphar Minis and couldn`t be happier. If I would have larger space and a bit more money I would buy their bass units. Full range single driver - no crossover needed- goes down till 37-40Hz effortless. ACDC could have a bit more bass, but I think It`s more about the LP pressing I play, because the Robert Ludwig press ZZ Top knocks my head off and many more. I feel like it`s the best bang for the buck speakers in this range. You get exactly what is on the record, I never streamed but planning. It doesn`t make bad records play good, but good ones really shine. I auditioned many other speakers and never had a second thought after. It does not need much backspace. |
Will be reading up on all suggestions later today, thank you all! Question: would the $14k Lyngdorf Pre-pro with their Room Correction, now being used by McIntosh, compensate for speakers being too close to the wall? If that technology works I have many choices. If it won’t help I need to consider sealed or front ported speakers. As of now the Revel 228be and the Focal Kanta 3 are contenders. |
If you want to try something different as well as special Spatial Audio Labs make a Exceptional open baffle speaker with the excellent Custom Beyma AMT tweeter-midrange driver with Nothing in the Xover path , only 2 capacitors and a inductor for a very pure signal path. A 12 inch MidBass Driver and your choice a 12 or 15 inch Bass that is powered by a direct coupled 250:watt Hypex amplifier ,but the upgraded VH Audio Odam capacitors. The X3 and X5 Model and under $9 k .and 97 db efficient . |
Hello, My recommendation is the Revel 228 be due to these being front ported and the tweeter is so good you will not need to treat the walls. They have a great center channel speaker to match if you want to upgrade. If you can get them away from the wall I would say spring for the $16k Revel 328 be. They are rear ported so you need at least 2’ away from the front wall. If you get the $10k 228be you can spring for 2 JL Audio f110 subs for around $8k. I have not listened to the 328be but I have demoed the 228be I would also look into a two channel preamp with home theater pass through. Emotiva has one and it’s really great. This lets you use your two channel system with your home theater. The Emotiva has a built in crossover for the subs. This is what I am using now until I upgrade my system. I have the Marantz 7704 Pre/pro. I know what all of this sounds like even your Classe amp. I am using an Ayre VX-5 at the moment. Emotive lets you return stuff if it doesn’t sound good. |
I have those Legacy’s Focus/ Marquis Center with the Marantz 8805. I have mine about a foot from the walls as I have to. I currently have a Lyngforf on order (a 40) for the exact reasons you suggested,,, the room correction. I am told there is no comparison between X32 and Room Perfect, especially on ill handling rooms. But I’ll have to wait and see. Keep us posted ... |
In the May/June issue of The Absolute Sound Alan Taffel talks about compact reference systems… which addresses, a little, the close to the wall speaker problem. He mentioned the Wilson Duette as about the only choice when up against the wall. You might read his section on speakers. My Sonus Faber Amati Traditional are six feet from the rear wall. |
Everyone here is very astute. Sopra 3’s on the shortlist. Wish here in Fl. I could demo the Larsens which require a back wall. while the room is big, about 30’ x 30’ we sit on the left side, actually 17’. Behind the stone covered wall we sit in front of is a small hallway leading to a pool bathroom. So where we sit is about 9-10’ from main speakers flanking our 85” Sony TV. Directly behind us is maybe 4-5’ of flooring then bar stools to a kitchen counter. Hence why speakers need to be near the wall we sit in front of, with the bathroom on the other side of the that stone wall. The right half of the room is truly 30’ deep with a bar at one end and a 9’ billiard table. |
If you can't bring them any farther out into the room, then either non-ported or front ported may be the only options. Focal Kanta 3 is front ported and a very good speaker. Magico A3 is non-ported and very good as well. Focal Sopra 2 and Sopra 3 are ported at the bottom of the speaker; I'm not sure how that would work out when placed that close to the front wall. |
For your listening needs, I'd say at least check out the Audio Solutions Figaro L at $10k. With it's silk dome tweeter, it should not assault your ears like your Persona apparently did. AS offers incredible bang for the buck. There is also a matching center channel speaker. If the L is too big, they also offer the smaller Figaro M at $7.5k. I heard their Virtuoso M at an audio show, and it was quite impressive. Actually, if your range is up to $20, the Virtuoso M may be an option. https://www.audiosolutions.lt/products/figaro/figaro-l https://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/audiosolutions-figaro-l-loudspeaker |
Thanks again to everyone! I know of the Larsens, very intriguing speakers. And yes they are purposely placed against the back wall. They sell a surround/center that is not a dedicated center ch. $15K for the 9’s about $2k for the dual purpose speaker. Not being able to audition in Fl. Is a problem. The new Perlistens should be showing up at B&M stores soon. Not inexpensive but very interesting articles and YouTube’s. Those towers and center hit the top of my budget. |
https://www.hawthornestereo.com/spendor-a1c-center-speaker.html https://www.ebay.com/itm/114847034883 <<---- older model but more volume capacity, i think, if that matters |
I would look at the Wilson Benesch Vector's and they will pair well with the WB Fulcrum as your center channel. I have the Vertexes here and they are one of the cleanest, most transparent speakers I have ever heard but without being bright. The WB cabinets are pretty special and simply allow more sound to travel forward. The Vectors are very similar to the Vertexes, just bigger as they are smallish floorstanders rather than standmounts. I have them siting next to Vivid Kaya 45s which are also phenomenal but the Kaya C35 center is not available yet. WB is neutral to maybe a hair forward which makes them radically warmer than the Paradigms that you just sold. If you are planning on listening to two channel audio, a good integrated amp will improve performance in your front channels. The Classe is a nice amp but what the Marantz will usually miss having optimal gain for two channel and it is not uncommon for a combo like that to sound a little thin in two channel. Especially in Direct and Pure Direct. Obviously, Legacy goes very well with legacy. If you opted for Wiloson Benesch, I would look at the AVM A 6.2ME integrated amp as the perfect Integrated to match with those speakers. |
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No point wasting money on expensive gear unless you can set the speaker and listening positions properly. There are not many speakers at any price that will give you your money's worth 6" - 12" from the front wall. Except one; Larsen. Designed to go right against the front wall. Don't let the small size fool you. I have 8.2s in a large, open family room/kitchen. Most folks start looking for subs; amazing low frequency response and power handling for speakers of this size. A friend has the TOTL Larsen 9s, also in a large room. Sold his big Sound Labs electrostatics after auditioning the Larsen speakers. |
I was going to recommend the white pair of Meridian dsp8000se speakers until you specified WAF. I have a pair of persona 7f and as much as the amaze meI could never recommend them for a lively room, Fire your dealer. I didn’t see the components you’re using but I suspect legacy will be easier to drive than SF so a safe buy if you need to stay on budget, tekton maybe? Klipsch will wear you out faster then the persona’s did. |
I should I am not opposed to buying used or demos. And yes I might consider adding a quality integrated for 2 ch.. i might raise my budget a bit to say $25k total. The Legacy Focus XD with Wavelet processor is being considered. With a active bottom section and no need to buy subs the budget and WAF seem acceptable. However those speakers (any speakers) will need to be close 6-12” from the stone wall and they are rear ported, any thoughts? Would a Lyngdorf MP60 be a big upgrade over the Marantz 8805 - it’s room correction technology is now being used by Mac. Last, any thoughts on a used warm integrated? I am leaning a bit towards Sonus Fabre but more research to be done. Thank you all again! Dave |
